RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen?

RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (Full Version)

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slvemike4u -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/5/2013 10:40:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TheRyan7 Would you take a recovering alchoholic to a bar? Given the pro gun lobby mantra that "more guns = greater safety from gun violence" taking an alcoholic to a bar seems perfectly reasonable.

PeonForHer -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/5/2013 10:47:00 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Given the pro gun lobby mantra that "more guns = greater safety from gun violence" taking an alcoholic to a bar seems perfectly reasonable. . . . Only so long as everyone else in the bar is drunk as well, though. And there are drunk security guards on hand to keep disorder.

BamaD -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/5/2013 11:05:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Given the pro gun lobby mantra that "more guns = greater safety from gun violence" taking an alcoholic to a bar seems perfectly reasonable. . . . Only so long as everyone else in the bar is drunk as well, though. And there are drunk security guards on hand to keep disorder. Really did the guy have a history of going berserk when he was around guns? If not the comparison is totaly without basis.

PeonForHer -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/5/2013 11:39:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD Really did the guy have a history of going berserk when he was around guns? If not the comparison is totaly without basis. I've no idea. I was being jocular.

Hillwilliam -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/5/2013 11:43:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u quote: ORIGINAL: TheRyan7 Would you take a recovering alchoholic to a bar? Given the pro gun lobby mantra that "more guns = greater safety from gun violence" taking an alcoholic to a bar seems perfectly reasonable. You're making the assumption that firearms has anything to do with his PTSD.

slvemike4u -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/5/2013 12:00:40 PM)
No,I'm making no such assumption....the ryan guy did,I just riffed off of his post [:D]

mnottertail -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/5/2013 12:02:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD Really did the guy have a history of going berserk when he was around guns? If not the comparison is totaly without basis. I've no idea. I was being jocular. We got a berserker and a jocular.......it is just raining vikings in here today!!!!!

slvemike4u -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/5/2013 12:03:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Given the pro gun lobby mantra that "more guns = greater safety from gun violence" taking an alcoholic to a bar seems perfectly reasonable. . . . Only so long as everyone else in the bar is drunk as well, though. And there are drunk security guards on hand to keep disorder. Really did the guy have a history of going berserk when he was around guns? If not the comparison is totaly without basis. The basis is there......your ability to see it just might be impaired [:)]

Nosathro -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/5/2013 12:32:11 PM)
There was an article that the accused Routh had problems with alcohol and suffered from PTSD. Routh mother contacted Chris Kyle to obtain help after Routh and his father got into an altercation, guns were said to be involved, it what extent was not mentioned. Routh also had an altercation his first night in jail and had to be restrained, it was violent enough that a stun gun had to be used. In any case treating some one with PTSD or any mental illness, it not a good idea to have guns around. Apparently Chris Kyle had a "shooting therapy" he believed it helped those Vet with PTSD, Chris also had no training in counselling or treating mental illness... Not knowing the case but it is possible that guns could have triggered an episode.

Nosathro -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/5/2013 12:34:43 PM)
When you're at a range, the only one with a gun in their hand is the person on the line shooting. When you're not shooting, your gun should be unloaded, cleared, and on the bench/shelf, and you should be back a few feet away from the shooter. Now if you're standing there, with no weapon, several feet away, and the shooter decides to turn and kill you, there's not a whole lot you can do. Well something happened what I do not know however it does appear that safety protcols were not in effect...

slvemike4u -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/5/2013 12:52:56 PM)
I am not aware of,nor can I think of,any "safety measures" that could be expected to work if it is your intention to hand a loaded gun to one going thru the issues this man was going thru. Seems apparent,and not just in hind sight,that taking this young man to a gun range and handing him a loaded weapon was asinine to the extreme. It would seem that there are some idiots hiding among all of those "responsible gun owners". Two less when you take into account Mrs.Lanza and now Kyle.

BamaD -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/5/2013 4:47:56 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Given the pro gun lobby mantra that "more guns = greater safety from gun violence" taking an alcoholic to a bar seems perfectly reasonable. . . . Only so long as everyone else in the bar is drunk as well, though. And there are drunk security guards on hand to keep disorder. Really did the guy have a history of going berserk when he was around guns? If not the comparison is totaly without basis. The basis is there......your ability to see it just might be impaired [:)] This would compare better with taking an agoraphobic to a bar.

imdoingitagain -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/6/2013 3:21:09 AM)
I love how the "compassionate" gun control crowd took a big-time Second Amendment supporters death and twisted it for their own agenda before his body was even cold. [image]local://upfiles/1189639/6762A742F55B43C6A82C91112D079235.jpg[/image]

Nosathro -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/6/2013 7:56:24 AM)
I am going to assume you are talking figuratively about the body being cold. The body after death loose 1.5 degree of heat per hour, the body will never reach zero degrees, the body tempture will only go to the temperature of the enviroment. It is true all have died under circustances that have yet to be explained. As to the poster, well the pro gun people are guilty of the same thing, so what else is new?

imdoingitagain -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/6/2013 10:03:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro I am going to assume you are talking figuratively about the body being cold. The body after death loose 1.5 degree of heat per hour, the body will never reach zero degrees, the body tempture will only go to the temperature of the enviroment. It is true all have died under circustances that have yet to be explained. As to the poster, well the pro gun people are guilty of the same thing, so what else is new? What an amazingly bold assumption... Ah, so we are just jumping straight to the "Well, they do it too" portion? That was fast. Although, it doesn't really hold when one of the the ideas behind gun control advocates is that they do it because they "Care so much about other people"... Also, one of the points I was making was the person being used to try to push that agenda really really hated said agenda. It would be like using the death of a gay rights activist as an excuse for why gays shouldn't be allowed to marry...

Nosathro -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/6/2013 10:31:02 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: imdoingitagain quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro I am going to assume you are talking figuratively about the body being cold. The body after death loose 1.5 degree of heat per hour, the body will never reach zero degrees, the body tempture will only go to the temperature of the enviroment. It is true all have died under circustances that have yet to be explained. As to the poster, well the pro gun people are guilty of the same thing, so what else is new? What an amazingly bold assumption... Ah, so we are just jumping straight to the "Well, they do it too" portion? That was fast. Although, it doesn't really hold when one of the the ideas behind gun control advocates is that they do it because they "Care so much about other people"... Also, one of the points I was making was the person being used to try to push that agenda really really hated said agenda. It would be like using the death of a gay rights activist as an excuse for why gays shouldn't be allowed to marry... One of the main points of pro gun is that guns keep you safe. Well for two of these people it didn't. Chris Kyle and Keith Radcliff both were surround by firearms, yet in both cases someone at point blank range killed them. John Novske was killed in a single car accident. NRA VP Wayne LaPerre right after the Sandy Hook killing went public stating that if the school had armed guards it would not have happened and is now advocating armed police at schools. Talk about the bodies not being cold. It appears Chris Kyle thought that going to a range to fire guns was good therapy for those Vets with PSTD, he had no training in counseling or psychology...and it appears he got into something way over his head. And not to forget you here is a little something. [mod edit to remove picture with a child in it] The US has over 200 million firearms in the public domain, yet we are 10th in the world for high crime rate.

BamaD -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/6/2013 12:53:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro quote: ORIGINAL: imdoingitagain quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro I am going to assume you are talking figuratively about the body being cold. The body after death loose 1.5 degree of heat per hour, the body will never reach zero degrees, the body tempture will only go to the temperature of the enviroment. It is true all have died under circustances that have yet to be explained. As to the poster, well the pro gun people are guilty of the same thing, so what else is new? What an amazingly bold assumption... Ah, so we are just jumping straight to the "Well, they do it too" portion? That was fast. Although, it doesn't really hold when one of the the ideas behind gun control advocates is that they do it because they "Care so much about other people"... Also, one of the points I was making was the person being used to try to push that agenda really really hated said agenda. It would be like using the death of a gay rights activist as an excuse for why gays shouldn't be allowed to marry... One of the main points of pro gun is that guns keep you safe. Well for two of these people it didn't. Chris Kyle and Keith Radcliff both were surround by firearms, yet in both cases someone at point blank range killed them. John Novske was killed in a single car accident. NRA VP Wayne LaPerre right after the Sandy Hook killing went public stating that if the school had armed guards it would not have happened and is now advocating armed police at schools. Talk about the bodies not being cold. It appears Chris Kyle thought that going to a range to fire guns was good therapy for those Vets with PSTD, he had no training in counseling or psychology...and it appears he got into something way over his head. And not to forget you here is a little something. [mod edit to remove picture with a child in it] The US has over 200 million firearms in the public domain, yet we are 10th in the world for high crime rate. If gun bans made you safe then D C and Chigago would be the safest cities in the country.

Nosathro -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/6/2013 1:21:14 PM)
If gun bans made you safe then D C and Chigago would be the safest cities in the country. [/quote] DC gun laws were over turned in a court action by gun owner groups. Chicago has a major problem as pointed out with weapons being purchase outside the city and brought in.

BamaD -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/6/2013 2:17:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro If gun bans made you safe then D C and Chigago would be the safest cities in the country. DC gun laws were over turned in a court action by gun owner groups. Chicago has a major problem as pointed out with weapons being purchase outside the city and brought in. Niether one holds water. The D C crime rate jumped well before the gun ban was overturned. And they bring them in from other places has a logic hole you could drag an oil tanker through. Namely Why aren't the places those guns come from overrun with crime if anyone (even honest citizens ) can get them.

Nosathro -> RE: Chris Kyle, Navy Seal and sniper. Why did this have to happen? (2/6/2013 2:30:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro If gun bans made you safe then D C and Chigago would be the safest cities in the country. DC gun laws were over turned in a court action by gun owner groups. Chicago has a major problem as pointed out with weapons being purchase outside the city and brought in. Niether one holds water. The D C crime rate jumped well before the gun ban was overturned. And they bring them in from other places has a logic hole you could drag an oil tanker through. Namely Why aren't the places those guns come from overrun with crime if anyone (even honest citizens ) can get them. Because they take them to Chicago...you know there is a pill for those with water retention.

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