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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 11:37:02 AM   
Lynnxz


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kanedesade

The Swastika doesn't have to mean Nazi, they took a Pagan symbol and corrupted it.

Actually, did you know, in Japan, it's a symbol of good luck?



Everyone brings up that ridiculous argument.

This is not Japan, and thanks to the Nazis, no one thinks of its original meaning anymore. HERE and NOW, it is a symbol most used by white supremacists, and has no positive implications.

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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 11:43:00 AM   
kanedesade


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From: Florence, SC
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz


quote:

ORIGINAL: kanedesade

The Swastika doesn't have to mean Nazi, they took a Pagan symbol and corrupted it.

Actually, did you know, in Japan, it's a symbol of good luck?



Everyone brings up that ridiculous argument.

This is not Japan, and thanks to the Nazis, no one thinks of its original meaning anymore. HERE and NOW, it is a symbol most used by white supremacists, and has no positive implications.


It's sad that it's gone to that, to be quite honest. Then again, most things are corruptible.

(in reply to Lynnxz)
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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 11:47:28 AM   
Switcheroo1983


Posts: 238
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz


quote:

ORIGINAL: kanedesade

The Swastika doesn't have to mean Nazi, they took a Pagan symbol and corrupted it.

Actually, did you know, in Japan, it's a symbol of good luck?



Everyone brings up that ridiculous argument.

This is not Japan, and thanks to the Nazis, no one thinks of its original meaning anymore. HERE and NOW, it is a symbol most used by white supremacists, and has no positive implications.


Yes to both of you. The Swastika (Svasticka in Indo-European) is an ancient symbol. It has been found in places from Japan to Mesoamerica (it's meaning is unknown at times, especially in places where it would not thought to be found). Normally, it's good luck. The Sauvastika, the backwards swastika, is bad luck.

Hitler stole the idea of the swastika from other German thinkers. He did not concoct it himself. Also, the Nazis never said "swastika", they used "hakenkreuz" or "twisted-cross".

In the US, and most of the Western World, it is a symbol of hate. I have never met person one who uses it for anything but (other than shock value, as in the case of Outlaw Bikers, who see it as a "fuck you" to society).

Outside of the "West", yes, it is used for many other purposes that have nothing to do with White Nationalism/National Socialism.

As to the OP, my heart goes out to you and your brother.

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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 11:47:31 AM   
DarkSteven


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Status: offline 		Six million Jews were killed, and an even larger number of Christians, and you're concerned that the swastika's image was ruined?

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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 11:50:27 AM   
kanedesade


Posts: 20
Joined: 3/13/2010
From: Florence, SC
Status: offline 		Woah, hold on there. I never endorsed the Nazis, nor do I agree with any of their thinking. Slow down a bit there.

The sad part is, if you look at what they did, 90% of it was stolen from America, pre-1920s (eugenics, ect.)

Anyone in their right mind would NEVER agree with Nazism, nor should they.

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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 11:53:24 AM   
kalikshama


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quote:

The Swastika doesn't have to mean Nazi, they took a Pagan symbol and corrupted it.

Actually, did you know, in Japan, it's a symbol of good luck?


I am aware that lots of cultures use it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika
My brother is Irish and not religious - not Pagan, or Japanese or Hindu.

Additionally, Mom said she saw a copy of "Mein Kampf" in his apartment. That may answer this:

quote:

Is it possible that he has some of those beliefs and feelings and being off his meds just led him to do something like that?




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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 11:55:17 AM   
kalikshama


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quote:

As to the OP, my heart goes out to you and your brother.


Thanks...now please take that pancake off your head.

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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 11:57:58 AM   
kanedesade


Posts: 20
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From: Florence, SC
Status: offline 		I am sorry for what you are going through.

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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 12:11:54 PM   
kalikshama


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quote:

Are you two close?


Our friendship waxes and wanes. He hasn't been much fun the last fun years. A lot of his talk is around how his town sucks and our state sucks. One thing that frustrates me about him is that he acts very differently depending on the situation. Like when we were at an Iron Maiden concert - he was completely appropriate. But often around just me and Mom he becomes like an annoying five year old.

He's never been especially close to our sister, who BTW is married to a Jewish man. She didn't convert but they are raising my nephews Jewish and they go to a Jewish school. There's no enmity between my siblings; just no closeness.

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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 12:16:52 PM   
Darkfeather


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kanedesade


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz


quote:

ORIGINAL: kanedesade

The Swastika doesn't have to mean Nazi, they took a Pagan symbol and corrupted it.

Actually, did you know, in Japan, it's a symbol of good luck?



Everyone brings up that ridiculous argument.

This is not Japan, and thanks to the Nazis, no one thinks of its original meaning anymore. HERE and NOW, it is a symbol most used by white supremacists, and has no positive implications.


It's sad that it's gone to that, to be quite honest. Then again, most things are corruptible.



Just to clear up some things, the swastika originates from Asia. In Hinduism it is a religious symbol, though it also has a dot in each of the open boxes. In China, it is actually reversed and is associated with eternity. Japan did not start using the symbol until it took it from the chinese writing

(in reply to kanedesade)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 1:00:33 PM   
jlf1961


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kanedesade


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz


quote:

ORIGINAL: kanedesade

The Swastika doesn't have to mean Nazi, they took a Pagan symbol and corrupted it.

Actually, did you know, in Japan, it's a symbol of good luck?



Everyone brings up that ridiculous argument.

This is not Japan, and thanks to the Nazis, no one thinks of its original meaning anymore. HERE and NOW, it is a symbol most used by white supremacists, and has no positive implications.


It's sad that it's gone to that, to be quite honest. Then again, most things are corruptible.




For the record, the swastika was used in Nepal, Tibet, Japan and other Asian countries as religious symbols. It was even used by native American cultures to symbolize the thunder bird.

Yes it was corrupted by a mad man.

Just like the confederate battle flag.

That does not change what it means now.

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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 1:07:49 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		I'm guessing your brother really is a skinhead. Sorry but his saying "I don't know" was his way of saying he doesn't want to tell you because he knows it would start an argument with you.

You said his mom found a copy of mein kampf. I'm betting if you talk to him further, look at his other tats, really pay attention to him, you will find out what you want to know.

I know this is not what you wanted to hear and I'm sorry. Not meaning to hurt you. Even with his thought and mood disorder, I don't think this excuses his views on this issue and I don't think those are the reasons he is a skinhead. He's a skinhead because that's what he believes, unfortunately.

I wish there was something soothing to say to you except to tell your brother you love him and you wish you could help him and that he would see things differently. That's really all you can do, unless your family really feels he is a danger to himself or others. At that point he needs someone to be appointed his guardian.

I wish you the best of luck.


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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 1:19:34 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		From all of the reading from you that I've done these past couple of years, I know this has got to really suck for you. The only thing that I can say is that I am so sorry that your brother has done something that must be bothering you a great deal.

I have no advice. Just empathy.


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Profile   Post #: 33
RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 2:41:50 PM   
TNDommeK


Posts: 7153
Joined: 3/13/2010
Status: offline 		How about a cover up tattoo? There are extremely talented tattoo artists that specialize in that. Take him now! And...if he is against it, well then I would say it isn't his meds,I would say its what he wanted.



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Profile   Post #: 34
RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 5:19:46 PM   
kalikshama


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Joined: 8/8/2010
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quote:

I'm guessing your brother really is a skinhead. Sorry but his saying "I don't know" was his way of saying he doesn't want to tell you because he knows it would start an argument with you.

You said his mom found a copy of mein kampf. I'm betting if you talk to him further, look at his other tats, really pay attention to him, you will find out what you want to know.

I know this is not what you wanted to hear and I'm sorry. Not meaning to hurt you. Even with his thought and mood disorder, I don't think this excuses his views on this issue and I don't think those are the reasons he is a skinhead. He's a skinhead because that's what he believes, unfortunately.


Judging from the voice mail full of hate speech he just left me, you're right. He was hateful towards black people though, which took me completely by surprise, as he's never given any indication of feeling this way. (We'd previously argued about the blood libel thing, about which he got his information from youtube "documentaries.")

But his message was also bizarre, paranoid, and jumbled. Like a skin head mad lib. You could substitute aliens in there too, for which I would have compassion and not judgment.

Power flickering, going to post now without really completing this thought.

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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 6:17:11 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		My sympathies. I know how it feels. It's always hard when someone you love does something you know will hurt them and everyone around them. All you can do though is tell them you love them and you will be there for them when they decide they want it.



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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 6:18:13 PM   
LookieNoNookie


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Joined: 8/9/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

Apparently, when my 37 year old mentally ill brother's meds were off recently, which I write about here, he got a swastika tattooed on the top of his head.

I called him to ask him about it just now and he volunteered that he would wear hats but would not get it removed. (This was not the point of my call.) I asked him a couple times why he had done it and he kept saying "I don't know."

I don't know what to think or do because he is mentally ill and was under-medicated at the time, but I am sick at the thought of a family member doing this.




I presume you have a question?

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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 6:33:16 PM   
DomMeinCT


Posts: 2355
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline 		First of all, I hope your power stays on, and that you wake up to a warm home.

I truly feel for you. I know what it's like to have a sibling do and believe something that is the antithesis of your values. It's painful.

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RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 7:40:33 PM   
dcnovice


Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
Status: offline 		FR

That sounds awful all around. Big hugs, my dear!

I wonder if there's a way to add to the tattoo in order to camouflage the revolting design (assuming your brorther's willing to do that).

http://newcovenantinktattoo.net/steven_neills_cover_ups

http://www.tattooartists.org/Gal75051_Swastika_Cover-Up.asp

http://www.memecenter.com/fun/91384/swastika-cover-up-tattoo

http://www.tumblr.com/tagged/swastika%20tattoo

I'm not sure how helpful these are, but perhaps they'll spark some better ideas!

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Profile   Post #: 39
RE: My brother got a swastika tattoo; I feel sick - 2/8/2013 8:03:33 PM   
dcnovice


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quote:

I take meds every day, and this is my take:

When I miss a medication, even if I do not realize it right away, pretty soon my body does. So there is no way I could accidentally go off meds or not be aware that I had gone off meds. Stopping meds, other than the occasional "oops I fell asleep on the couch and missed it" is a conscious choice.

I take meds every day too. But knowing the astonishing variety of minds and medications in our world, I'd be wary of generalizing from a single person's experience.

For a long time, I was a very conscientious (and mildly, secretly self-righteous) taker of my meds. It puzzled me that friends failed to be as diligent as I was. Of course, my dutiful dosing was helped enormously by the fact that I took my meds just after rising and before retiring. So taking the pills swiftly became a part of my routine.

Recently, though, I've begun on some pills that need to be pocketed and taken later in the day, with food. I'm chagrined to say that, more often than I care to count, I've opened my pillbox at day's end or the next morning, only to find it full of medications that, in the mayhem of the workday, I'd totally blanked on taking.

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