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Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 3:38:01 PM

Charles6682

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I am curious about this.I consider myself to be a lifelong submissive.I've had submissive feelings towards dominant women since I was in grade school.Now of course I didn't realize the way I felt towards women had a name until I was 17 and the wonderful invention of the internet.I have always identified myself as a submissive.The idea of being a slave has certainly crossed my mind many of times.Now,I'm not looking for a debate about the difference bewteen a slave and a submissive.In many ways,there are too many things that are the same.Perhaps its just the wording that is different.However,with the minor differences that there are,is there really a difference bewteen being a slave or sub,or is slavery really just the main goal of a submissive?To find the right Domme/Master/Owner and to be Her slave?What about the unowned slaves?Perhaps that why I haven't fully identfied myself as a full slave.If a submissive/slave is single,then they are still "free",so to speak.What would be the main goal of a uncollared submissive?Keep trying to find the right owner to be a slave to?Or are their other goals for a single submissive/slave?

< Message edited by Charles6682 -- 2/17/2013 3:39:30 PM >

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 3:41:04 PM

littlewonder

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It wasn't my goal. It's just who I am when I'm in a relationship with someone, however I am a submissive personality and overall, I'm pretty submissive towards most people in life in general simply because that's how I'm wired. I feel uncomfortable any other way.

My ultimate goal was/is to be in a loving, long term, committed relationship with a dominant personality man.

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 3:45:24 PM

Missokyst

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Not for me. I was a slave before I was sub, and NOT going back there again. I guess one could say it is my ultimate goal in life to avoid it.

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 3:49:30 PM

DarkSteven

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No more than being President of the United States is for every Senator, Congressperson, and Governor. Or that being the CEO is to every professional in a Fortune 500. Some aspire to some places, others to waystations along the way.

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 4:23:25 PM

ResidentSadist

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In my view of the world, slavery and submission are two separate paths and completely different relationship roles. Neither are connected other than the fact they are types of relationship roles. In my world, your question is like asking if vanilla leads to BDSM or if BDSM is the ultimate goal of vanilla.

< Message edited by ResidentSadist -- 2/17/2013 4:28:02 PM >

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 5:09:06 PM

LadyPact

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Before I even start, I'm going to say right up front that this is My opinion and the way that *I* view the subject.

There's a lot of debate around this joint about the difference between submissive and slave. There's never going to be a universal acceptance of what these terms mean except to the individual and the relationship context between the two (or more) people. I think each person has their own definition of the difference and that is how it should be.

With this in mind, I can say emphatically that there *is* a difference between the two and that difference is how much authority, control, and ownership that I have over a particular human being. There are areas of a person's life that I may not have influence in in the person is submitting to Me. You can be damn sure that I have influence in every area of the person's life if they are My slave. I also tend to avoid the word 'ownership' if I am discussing a submissive. I also avoid using the word property. If I am D/s with somebody, which by the way is the only term I will use if I am not in the position of ownership is that of Dominant, I also stay away from the terms Owner or use the phrase that I have Mastered that person.

From another angle, I don't believe in the premise of a slave that has never been owned. If you haven't been owned or lived the life of a slave, how can you know that you are capable of being a slave? I tend to agree with the term of a person having a slave's heart. That would be the person who yearns to be a slave, wants to dedicate their life to slavery, but have not found that person who is the Owner that suits them and can bring them along that path. Even the Gorean folks don't accept the concept of slavery when a person is not owned. (Any Gorean folks can feel free to correct Me on that if they have a different view.) There is Free and there is slave. An unowned slave is most certainly free, are they not? They may feel within their core pulled a certain way (i.e., the slave's heart thing) but until they have given themselves to someone, turned over their will to another, it hasn't happened yet.

For what it's worth, My views are the same on the other side of the kneel. From a relationship standpoint, you're not a Master if nobody besides yourself is calling you that. You're not an Owner if there is nobody that you own. Dominant is a thing that anyone with a Dominant personality can be, but if nobody is submitting to you, there's not much difference in saying you are a responsible human being who prefers to be in charge and likes things their own way. It's only when there is a person allowing you to lead them that it matters as a relationship role.

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 5:20:13 PM

Charles6682

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I always felt that submission was just a stepping stone to slavery.If theres no connection and the 2 really are seperate,then how does one know if they are either a submissive or a slave?

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 5:29:02 PM

Missokyst

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It is a mindset more than anything. I began as a slave without question. I had no say in our relationship until the opportunity presented itself for me to call it quits. As soon as that door presented itself I kicked our relationship to the curb. Were it not for that I might still be married and very unhappy. For me it was a mindset. I chose to commit completely regardless of the hardship, I would have remained loyal if he had not presented me the out. Since then I learned things are not all or nothing and have found a balance I can live with easily. I have put the brakes on allowing myself to walk in those shoes again and in 30 yrs have kept that promise I made to me.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682

I always felt that submission was just a stepping stone to slavery.If theres no connection and the 2 really are seperate,then how does one know if they are either a submissive or a slave?

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pain is the breaking of the shell that encloses your understanding ~Gibran, Kahlil

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 5:29:03 PM

HarryVanWinkle

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Some people consider them to be the same thing. Some people don't. Some people think there's some sort of ranking thing, that a "slave" is more "real" than a "sub." Some people think that's horseshit.

I think it doesn't matter what label you stick to yourself. If what you've got works for you, then what difference does it make whether you call yourself a "sub" or a "slave"? And, again if it works for you, what difference does it makes what anybody else, other than the person or persons you're involved with, label you?

(in reply to Charles6682)

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 5:29:45 PM

Charles6682

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From: Saint Pete,FL
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I have found the slave lifestyle very appealing.I do believe deep down that I do have a "slaves heart".But theres also a clear difference bewteen fantasy and reality.I have been "owned" before.My then Domme would always refer to me as Her slave and I just accepted the title.But in the process,I found that I took pride in being Her slave and I felt complete.She moved away and we decided to just be friends,which we still are.But I guess perhaps at this point that 24/7 would be more ideal for me,which I haven't done.

Is it true to some degree that some Dommes consider someone if they refer to themselves as slave,as opposed to calling themselves slave.Is there such a thing as a "24/7 submissive"?If I was seeking a 24/7 relationship,does it just make sense to say that perhaps slavery is my final goal

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 6:20:23 PM

littlewonder

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682

I always felt that submission was just a stepping stone to slavery.If theres no connection and the 2 really are seperate,then how does one know if they are either a submissive or a slave?

I'm a slave because he owns me. I don't get to pick and choose. I don't get to say "no". I get no say...end of story. I'm a submissive personality because I don't like to lead. I like being the one who sits in the back hoping no one chooses me. I don't like conflict and most times it makes me happy to just defer to someone else. I have no desire whatsoever to control someone or anything whatsoever.

That's how you tell.

ETA: Yes there is 24/7 submissive. That person chooses to do something or not in their relationship, that's all. Personally I don't consider anyone a slave or sub or Master or Dom until they are in a relationship but I do consider people either submissive or dominant in personality all the time.

< Message edited by littlewonder -- 2/17/2013 6:25:52 PM >

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 6:29:27 PM

Rule

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I cannot acertain what type of person you are: slave or submissive or something else, as there is insufficient information in your profile. So for now I would go with submissive.

It is interesting that you have dozens of friends, as well as that one of them is yourself.

But I am unwilling to speculate from those data.

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 6:50:50 PM

OsideGirl

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Since I don't believe in consensual slavery, for me the answer is no.

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 7:18:14 PM

stef

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quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder

I'm a slave because he owns me. I don't get to pick and choose. I don't get to say "no". I get no say...end of story.

Good grief. Of course you have a say. You can say "no" and walk away whenever you please.

These people are slaves.

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 7:25:48 PM

littlewonder

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Well that depends....yeah, I can say "no"...doesn't mean I can walk out the door, at least not right away. But that's the way our relationship works. YMMV.

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 7:43:00 PM

xssve

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Cant resist: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwkOdv443_o

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 8:57:20 PM

Marini

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quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

Good grief. Of course you have a say. You can say "no" and walk away whenever you please.

These people are slaves.

--thanks for the chuckle stef.
From your lips to GOD's ears, those people really were slaves.
I tend to take many things literally, and THAT is my idea of slavery, also.
lol

< Message edited by Marini -- 2/17/2013 8:59:48 PM >

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 9:27:20 PM

Missokyst

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IDK...
If I didn't pay attention I was treated to a few hours of his yelling at me to make sure I got it. Sometimes slavery is not so literal as history presents it. And before anyone chimes in with that is not dominance, it is possible to be an asshole and still pull the puppet strings.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marini

quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

Good grief. Of course you have a say. You can say "no" and walk away whenever you please.

These people are slaves.

--thanks for the chuckle stef.
From your lips to GOD's ears, those people really were slaves.
I tend to take many things literally, and THAT is my idea of slavery, also.
lol

_____________________________

pain is the breaking of the shell that encloses your understanding ~Gibran, Kahlil

“The truth is, everyone is going to hurt you. You just got to find the ones worth suffering for.”
― Bob Marley

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 9:36:03 PM

Rule

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marini

quote:

ORIGINAL: stef
These people are slaves.

From your lips to GOD's ears, those people really were slaves.
I tend to take many things literally, and THAT is my idea of slavery, also.
lol

Those are forced labourers.

_____________________________

"I tend to pay attention when Rule speaks" - Aswad

"You are sweet, kind, and ever so smart, Rule. You ALWAYS stretch my mind and make me think further than I might have on my own" - Duskypearls

Si vis pacem, para bellum.

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RE: Is slavery the final goal of submission? - 2/17/2013 9:42:14 PM

Marini

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quote:

Those are forced labourers.

ROFLMAO, forced labourers????

Thank you for the laughs.

lol

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"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
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NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

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