quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

The father wasn't doing it for himself. He thought it was in the best interest of the patient. We absolutely, unequivocally agree that he was dead ass wrong. But, that isn't the issue, either. You can play the "what woulda happened" game all you want, too. We won't know "what woulda happened" since the hospital found it not to be an issue to meet the request.

The courts would not see it that way. There is no difference in education or ability, and certainly none in liability, between a black nurse and a white nurse. Both are equally qualified to care for the child.
As far as the "request", it was pulled the next day, but staffing didnt change. The liability for this issue is on the hospital.

quote:

Did the hospital have to change their staffing diversity because of this request? If not, then this guy didn't " determine staffing needs based upon his or her racial preference."

I suggest you read the case I provided earlier.

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quote:

You are welcome to disagree - however I stand by my assertion that you cannot litigate, or legislate away ignorance.

quote:

A neonate cannot self advocate

quote:

and if the nurse who found herself offended to the point of litigation had concerns she should have started by calling in Child Protective Services to begin an investigation into whether or not being a racist pig was reason enough to deny that father his right to advocate on behalf of his child as he saw fit.

quote:

As for the Hospital and Staffing needs, if there was no one else on staff this would be a non-issue - becasuse the choice would be: We are only staffed with African American RN's so we will see about moving your child to 1940's Germany or you must accept that your ignorance is putting your child in danger.

quote:

Also, given the litigious culture we live in, I would like to get the whole story - without the sensationalism... to see what all the facts were that dictated the hospital making the decision they did.

quote:

I am not a fan of anecdotes in debates but I think this is relevant: I live in a town outside of Atlanta where there are 31 churches and no bookstores - In the last couple of years as I dealt with a serious medical condition I have walked away from caregivers and others who have espoused ridiculous views about the evils of homosexuality, the power of prayer, the plague of Mexicans, our Muslim/Socialist/Atheist/Kenyan President, and the plot by Blacks to steal elections. In a sane reflection of the father in this case, I demanded that another nurse be assigned to me in the ICU after listening to the ignorant Xtian piece of garbage who was to take care of me spend the morning ranting about gay marriage and then allowed her pastor into my room to minister to me because I just seemed "too nice" to be an Atheist. Would you have suggested that I consider her qualifications as the only thing that mattered when it came to advocating for my own care?

quote:

Why? So you don't have to answer the question?

If there is no difference in education, ability or liability between a black nurse and a white nurse, and there was already black and white nurses staffing every shift, what difference does it make if this guy requests no black nurses attend to his child? Care isn't going to suffer. Jesus. I'm not even pretending this guy is right. Fuck. You aren't going to change his mind by having a black nurse care for his kid. If he already thinks that a black nurse isn't good enough to care for his kid, he'll most likely write off anything skillful a black nurse does as "luck." Let the bigot stew in his own filth and take care of the next patient.

And, so there is a second case that was from 2010. Hell, that's rampant occurrence, then, eh?

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

Why? So you don't have to answer the question?

If there is no difference in education, ability or liability between a black nurse and a white nurse, and there was already black and white nurses staffing every shift, what difference does it make if this guy requests no black nurses attend to his child? Care isn't going to suffer. Jesus. I'm not even pretending this guy is right. Fuck. You aren't going to change his mind by having a black nurse care for his kid. If he already thinks that a black nurse isn't good enough to care for his kid, he'll most likely write off anything skillful a black nurse does as "luck." Let the bigot stew in his own filth and take care of the next patient.

And, so there is a second case that was from 2010. Hell, that's rampant occurrence, then, eh?

http://www.healthcareemploymentcounsel.com/2012/01/27/settlement-highlights-importance-of-considering-state-law-in-assessing-employment-practices/

“It is now widely accepted that a company’s desire to cater to the perceived racial preferences of its customers is not a defense under Title VII for treating employees differently based on race.”

Brenda CHANEY, Plaintiff-Appellant,
v.
PLAINFIELD HEALTHCARE CENTER, Defendant-Appellee.

http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=12175147218935997244

quote:

ORIGINAL: TinkerHell

At the risk of being tedious:

Ignorance cannot be legislated, litigated or guidelined out of existence. On the plus side: These stories are covered because they are no longer the norm - thus worthy of the news cycle and sensationalism.

Clearing away the flotsam - we have a father with a child in the NICU. While I find his attitude and his request repulsive, as a former NICU Nurse I also know that I would have stepped aside, taken a moment to entertain the fantasy of bitch slapping him into a more enlightened state of mind then gone about my business. My identity is not threatened by the rampant stupidity of the people I have dealt with or deal with.

The Hospital has an obligation to the patient and by extension the family. If Asshat McBreeder was not comfortable having someone of another race care for his newborn and there was an equally qualified caregiver then the hospital was correct in making the note on the chart, not because they agree but because the first concern should be the patient. Take away the sensational and repugnant parts of the story and you are left with a parent with a child in distress - there are moments and places where we must draw a line in the sand, plant our flags and refuse to retreat - the NICU is not one of those places.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

Why? So you don't have to answer the question?
If there is no difference in education, ability or liability between a black nurse and a white nurse, and there was already black and white nurses staffing every shift, what difference does it make if this guy requests no black nurses attend to his child? Care isn't going to suffer. Jesus. I'm not even pretending this guy is right. Fuck. You aren't going to change his mind by having a black nurse care for his kid. If he already thinks that a black nurse isn't good enough to care for his kid, he'll most likely write off anything skillful a black nurse does as "luck." Let the bigot stew in his own filth and take care of the next patient.
And, so there is a second case that was from 2010. Hell, that's rampant occurrence, then, eh?

http://www.healthcareemploymentcounsel.com/2012/01/27/settlement-highlights-importance-of-considering-state-law-in-assessing-employment-practices/
“It is now widely accepted that a company’s desire to cater to the perceived racial preferences of its customers is not a defense under Title VII for treating employees differently based on race.”
Brenda CHANEY, Plaintiff-Appellant,
v.
PLAINFIELD HEALTHCARE CENTER, Defendant-Appellee.
http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=12175147218935997244

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

Why? So you don't have to answer the question?
If there is no difference in education, ability or liability between a black nurse and a white nurse, and there was already black and white nurses staffing every shift, what difference does it make if this guy requests no black nurses attend to his child? Care isn't going to suffer. Jesus. I'm not even pretending this guy is right. Fuck. You aren't going to change his mind by having a black nurse care for his kid. If he already thinks that a black nurse isn't good enough to care for his kid, he'll most likely write off anything skillful a black nurse does as "luck." Let the bigot stew in his own filth and take care of the next patient.
And, so there is a second case that was from 2010. Hell, that's rampant occurrence, then, eh?

http://www.healthcareemploymentcounsel.com/2012/01/27/settlement-highlights-importance-of-considering-state-law-in-assessing-employment-practices/
“It is now widely accepted that a company’s desire to cater to the perceived racial preferences of its customers is not a defense under Title VII for treating employees differently based on race.”
Brenda CHANEY, Plaintiff-Appellant,
v.
PLAINFIELD HEALTHCARE CENTER, Defendant-Appellee.
http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=12175147218935997244

"Perceived racial preference?" Perceived?!? Really?

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
"Perceived racial preference?" Perceived?!? Really?

Problems reading?

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

Not at all, tazzy. The MI Hospital case does not have a "perceived racial preference." It has a known preference.

quote:

Some women feel more comfortable going to a female OB/GYN. Does that make them sexist? A licensed and certified male OB/GYN would have the same training as a licensed and certified female OB/GYN, right?

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

Not at all, tazzy. The MI Hospital case does not have a "perceived racial preference." It has a known preference./quote]
And if the courts wont allow for a perceived one, you believe they will allow for a known one?

Which is a higher priority, a perceived threat, or a known threat, assuming, of course, the threat itself is the same?

quote:

quote:

Some women feel more comfortable going to a female OB/GYN. Does that make them sexist? A licensed and certified male OB/GYN would have the same training as a licensed and certified female OB/GYN, right?

Michigan Patient Bill of Rights....
To receive, from the appropriate individual within the health facility or agency, information about his or her medical condition, proposed course of treatment, and prospects for recovery, in terms that the patient or resident can understand, unless medically contradicted as documented by the attending physician in the medical record.
To refuse treatment to the extent provided by law and to be informed of the consequences of that refusal. If a refusal of treatment prevents a health facility or agency or its staff from providing appropriate care according to ethical and professional standards, the relationship with the patient or resident may be terminated upon reasonable notice.

The "health facility or agency or its staff" were capable of providing all necessary care, according to ethical (medical ethics in a medical facility, no?) and professional (there were qualified nurses present that met the request of the father) standards.

quote:

To exercise fully his or her civil and religious liberties, including the right to independent personal decisions and the right to knowledge of available choices. The health facility or agency shall encourage and assist in the fullest possible exercise of these rights.http://www.callsam.com/michigan-personal-injury-cases/medical-malpractice/medical-malpractice-and-negligence-overview/your-rights-as-a-patient-in-michigan
No where does the law say a patient can exclude a group from care based upon race.

Says it right there, tazzy. Independent personal decisions can include the decision to be a bigoted asshat, can't it?


_____________________________

What I support:

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• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

(in reply to tazzygirl)

quote:

including the right to independent personal decisions

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
To refuse treatment to the extent provided by law and to be informed of the consequences of that refusal. If a refusal of treatment prevents a health facility or agency or its staff from providing appropriate care according to ethical and professional standards, the relationship with the patient or resident may be terminated upon reasonable notice.
Yep.. law doesnt allow discrimination based upon skin color.

quote:

including the right to independent personal decisions

Yep.. independent.... This case was not an independent personal decision, but one that affected the staffing of a unit.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
To refuse treatment to the extent provided by law and to be informed of the consequences of that refusal. If a refusal of treatment prevents a health facility or agency or its staff from providing appropriate care according to ethical and professional standards, the relationship with the patient or resident may be terminated upon reasonable notice.
Yep.. law doesnt allow discrimination based upon skin color.

quote:

including the right to independent personal decisions

Yep.. independent.... This case was not an independent personal decision, but one that affected the staffing of a unit.

Independent personal decisions, of the legal guardian. And, there was no change in staffing. The hospital had the ability to meet the request. No staffing change had to be made.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
Wasn`t sure whether to post this here or on the whacky-ted thread.
"Ted Nugent Calls Obama Racist And Is Going On ‘Black Power Tour’"
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2013/02/22/ted-nugent-wants-african-americans-to-know-that-democrats-are-the-ones-who-are-destroying-them/

quote:

Stan Solomon, Host: “I believe they will put together a racial force to go against an opposite race resistance, basically a black force to go against a white resistance, and then they will claim anyone resisting the black force - they are doing it because they are racist.”

Conservative blogger Greg W. Howard, guest, agreed: “You may be right because he has been sowing the seeds of racial hatred; we were healing quite well as a nation on racial issues until Obama came along and now we have a lot of racial discord.”

Gun Owners of America president Larry Pratt: “I do agree that the Obama administration would definitely be capable of something as evil as you were suggesting.”