DesideriScuri
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Joined: 1/18/2012
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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
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LMFAO!!! So, you're telling me that someone will die the same time if he/she doesn't get health care, but eat, or doesn't eat but get health care? Gimme a fucking break, tazzy.
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What do you need more, tazzy, food or health care?
No, someone will die without healthcare the same way someone will die without eating.
Both are required for a long life. Unless you are trying to insist that someone never needs any contact with health care at any point in their lives, ever.
Priorities, tazzy. Which do you need more, food or health care? Don't tell me both, equally. You can live an awful lot longer without healthcare than you can live without food. You know that's the truth, too. At least argue valid points.
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But, we aren't talking about monopoly's, unless you're talking about the monopoly the AMA has been given, or the oligopoly the insurance company-owned hospital systems are given.
Arent we speaking of monopolies? How many physicians have bought into labs and radiology centers? Its not just insurance owned hospitals. HCA is massive... in my area.. Mercy is huge... these arent insurance based hospital systems.. or didnt start out that way. Yet they have grown to encompass almost all community based hospitals, becoming the Ma Bell of health care.
I would go with oligopolies more than monopolies. Promedica and Mercy are basically the two in my area. There used to be one lone holdout hospital that has recently been bought up by Promedica (though there were rumblings of government not allowing it due to reduction in competition; The hospital argued that without being bought, they would likely have to close because of funding). And, as I've said many times before, I'm all for separating the insurance companies from the care providers.
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Um, huh? So, for an EMT to respond to a rescue, there will be a fee paid. The emergency responders are paid via taxes. There was a shit storm in Lucas County when the County wanted to levy an extra fee on suburbs to pay for regular patrols. Sure, they'd still respond to a 9-1-1 call, but when it takes half an hour to get there, wtf?!? Yet, tax money is still siphoned to pay for them.
How does that relate to a "defendant on probation or the cost of court fees?"
What you responded with was this....
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Accident response fee sparks debate
The article was about someone who broke the law then was in an accident as a result of breaking that law, who was charged with a fee from the fire department. Not much different that someone burning trash in the south on a no burn day and getting a huge bill when the FD has to come put out the flames.
As for the "crash tax" the article you gave cited....
Many communities are assessing that fee upon non-residents.. which sort of makes sense, until you realize the FD shows up for less than 10 minutes and leaves, in most cases, without giving any assitance, then bills the insurance company for the amount of the "visit". The insurance companies arent paying it, so the cities go after the drivers in "collection cases".
"Like a lot of cities, we're really struggling here," says John Brown, the city manager of Petaluma, Calif. "All my departments have been trying to find new revenues or cut costs."
The question, then, is why not pull in an extra $100,000 a year for doing something the city already does anyway? Residents shouldn't mind because only out-of-towners get hit with the crash tax, and then only if they're at fault. Although how much drivers are charged, Brown explains, depends on the kind of accident.
"We have a basic engine response, which totals about $435; there is also a $60 per incident environmental cleanup charge," Brown says as he lists the different expenses. The tax can go as high as $2,500, though he says the average charge is between $400 and $500.
For Petaluma, the total revenue last fiscal year was only $14,000, and it expects about $20,000 this year — far less than the $100,000 the city had hoped for.
Brown explains that the crash tax is administered by a contractor, who sends the bills to the driver's insurance company. This has become a problem in some instances because some insurance companies have refused to pay.
Recently, another Northern California city, Roseville, repealed its crash tax. City Manager Ray Kerridge says it just wasn't worth the bother. "We were expecting something like $200,000 and we actually got about $40,000," he says.
And it wasn't only a matter of money, says Kerridge; the fire department was complaining about the program. "It was keeping rigs out on the scene a lot longer. Why? Because they were collecting a lot of information for insurance; it took them out of service for fires and other emergencies."
http://www.npr.org/2011/03/08/134265786/crash-tax-more-bust-than-boom-for-many-cities
If people dont pay, they dont get the money. They have to go after it, which costs even more money. Cities are repealing it. 10 states have made such taxes illegal according to NPR.
A suburbanite that travels into Toledo to work (Wood County is within a 20 minute drive up I-75 into Toledo, so it's not just a County thing, either) pays the taxes that funds the Fire Dept, Police Dept., etc. That person gets in an accident in Toledo, and, since he's not a resident, he gets nailed, even though it's not property taxes that pay those salaries as much as it's income taxes and sales taxes. Where is the protection he's paid for with his taxes? What happens when a person is the victim of a hit-and-run and gets hit with fees? Can you not see the inanity in this practice?
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It is damn good that there are options available for the provision of health care. If nothing else, it is humane.
What "options"?
You tell me, tazzy. You brought it up.
There are only three for Medicare. Does everyone have Medicare? If not, then you will have to explain those "humane" options for provisional health care for the rest of the population.
Actually, we didn't connect on this one. I asked about physicians not accepting Medicare. You stated they had three options. I put my response that mentioned "humane" in the wrong area of my reply. That should have gone after your comment about physicians having 3 options with Medicare. Completely my fault for the lack of connection.
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I didn't say they were only in it for the money, and did acknowledge that they wouldn't leave en masse over ridiculous pay cuts. And, that is why I started my response, "Agreed." Are you going to answer the question, though, or still dance around it?
I did answer it.
Retiring to where? Most of them are so heavily into student debt they cant afford to retire. Defaulting on student loans is no longer a joke. It is hard to write them off in bankruptcy (40% success rate), so they are going to be around for a long time.
In the mean time, you have the government bringing in out of country physicians who want to come here to work because, even with a "salary", for some its better than what they have back home. They will simply open up more visas. And, since denial rates for those visas have increased over the years, I dont forsee an immediate problem getting the now "vacant" positions filled. US physicians know this as well.
I expect the reaction by the AMA and Medicare to be swift in opening up more residency programs and getting more physicians trained on the GP level.
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Hey, thanks for responding without answering any questions posed. That's fantastic back 'n' forth there and will definitely help move the dialog along.
Sometimes you actually should read the whole thread before assuming you know what you are talking about. As evidenced by your subsequent post, you were once again proven wrong.
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Valid options. But, if all the older physicians - the ones who have their student loans paid off - all decided they can do something else, then what?
In the mean time, you have the government bringing in out of country physicians who want to come here to work because, even with a "salary", for some its better than what they have back home. They will simply open up more visas. And, since denial rates for those visas have increased over the years, I dont forsee an immediate problem getting the now "vacant" positions filled. US physicians know this as well.
I expect the reaction by the AMA and Medicare to be swift in opening up more residency programs and getting more physicians trained on the GP level.
How long is that going to take, though? A month, two, three, six, a year?
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What if hospitals decided to close down because of the inability to meet the financial obligations of staying open?
They would be closed due to the lack of profit, not because of an inability to meet financial obligations. They would revert back to community run hospitals, like they were long before the greed machine came along.
Really? What do you consider the "financial obligations" of a hospital? I would say, paying their bills, paying their employees and making sure they have all the materials they feel they'll need to handle the estimated patient load. All that has to be paid before they turn a profit. If they can't turn a profit, it's likely because they aren't able to meet their financial obligations, no?
If Promedica own's 4 hospitals in the area, how will the hospital be turned into a community run hospital? Wouldn't that require Promedica to sell the buildings? Oh, but you might be thinking "eminent domain" there. How long would that take before the community could gain the hospital and set up the operations? What happens in the meantime?
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Where are the foreigners being visa'ed in or the new residents going to practice?
Where they are now. Demand will always win out... just not in favor of those seeking a huge profit margin.
Unless there aren't facilities that remain open...
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What I support:
- A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
- Personal Responsibility
- Help for the truly needy
- Limited Government
- Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
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