RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master.

RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 2:32:03 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: hrxxx quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: my experience tells me that you may well experience TPE and no limits with a slave you've never met before Never met.. and they are willing to say to you "Do what you want?" Have you ever had a BDSM relationship with strangers? I never had a BDSM relationship. I dont do strictly play. I have had Master - slave relationships. And I never submitted completely on the first day.

searching4mysir -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 7:27:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: hrxxx What you're saying is that it is not possible to be a master on a playdate? my experience tells me that you may well experience TPE and no limits with a slave you've never met before, and whether it's playdate or 24/7 do you agree on the conditions underlying the relationship, so you can be master from the first night. What happens in a slave's head, a master plants seeds in his slave's head, a slave has many thoughts and fantasy about what has happened, and what is going to happen if you google slave diary or blog, I am sure you can learn all about it Then you've met a "slave" with a death wish. EVERYONE has limits unless they want to die.

chatterbox24 -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 7:30:04 AM)
I haven't the foggiest idea. Dom, Alpha, Master, Sir. All semantics to me.

JeffBC -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 7:32:19 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: hrxxx But whatever is the slave need to give themselves to you first. Really? More accurately you're not thinking of the same D/s that she (and I) do. You are thinking of what I call "D/s by agreement". Loosely speaking that's where two people come together and they are roughly equal in terms of dominance. By agreement they separate into two roles and then go about their merry way. Ishtar is saying this isn't slavery. I disagree since I'm the practical sort and I'm more interested in results than mental states. The other option is D/s by native personality. A more manipulative/charismatic/dominant personality contacts a more malleable/susceptible/submissive personality and... well... manipulates them. That's how I see D/s and it doesn't require any agreements and it's not limited to my intimate family relationships. In the end, what is and is not <insert BDSM label X> here is just one of those things that is unanswerable. Everyone defines it differently enough that the labels are utterly meaningless. What's more interesting is the paragraph or two you get AFTER they introduce themselves with their label. I don't really care whether someone I meet somewhere is a "true master". I care whether they are fun to hang around. I care whether they have a partner or not. IF they do have one, I care about the vibes that relationship gives off. Beyond that, I'm interested in the dynamic they have but I recognize that each will be unique. They can hang whatever label they want onto it and I don't care because I'm more interested in the terrain than the map.

JeffBC -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 7:35:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: searching4mysir Then you've met a "slave" with a death wish. EVERYONE has limits unless they want to die. Wow. Now THERE is an interesting leap in logic. Let's just be clear here. I would die for Carol in a heart beat and I would also trust her if she told me I had to do so. I'm pretty sure I love life and I have no death wish. Heck, I'm not even what you'd call particularly submissive. I'm just wildly in love and I trust her a great deal. That's a positive spin on "being commanded to suicide". A much less positive spin is Jonestown... none of whom had a death wish. People have died for their leaders throughout history in a wide variety of circumstances (think military) without having a death wish -- almost always without having a clear idea whey they are dying. I just think it takes an appropriately charismatic leader not necessarily a suicidal slave.

hrxxx -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 7:58:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: searching4mysir quote: ORIGINAL: hrxxx What you're saying is that it is not possible to be a master on a playdate? my experience tells me that you may well experience TPE and no limits with a slave you've never met before, and whether it's playdate or 24/7 do you agree on the conditions underlying the relationship, so you can be master from the first night. What happens in a slave's head, a master plants seeds in his slave's head, a slave has many thoughts and fantasy about what has happened, and what is going to happen if you google slave diary or blog, I am sure you can learn all about it Then you've met a "slave" with a death wish. EVERYONE has limits unless they want to die. Now I speak only from my own experience, and can not say how others are doing or not doing. You will find the slaves limits within my limits, there are certain things I will not do, and the limits I go through with the slave, so when she comes she has no limits because her limits to exceed my limits.

hrxxx -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 8:20:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JeffBC quote: ORIGINAL: hrxxx But whatever is the slave need to give themselves to you first. Really? More accurately you're not thinking of the same D/s that she (and I) do. You are thinking of what I call "D/s by agreement". Loosely speaking that's where two people come together and they are roughly equal in terms of dominance. By agreement they separate into two roles and then go about their merry way. Ishtar is saying this isn't slavery. I disagree since I'm the practical sort and I'm more interested in results than mental states. The other option is D/s by native personality. A more manipulative/charismatic/dominant personality contacts a more malleable/susceptible/submissive personality and... well... manipulates them. That's how I see D/s and it doesn't require any agreements and it's not limited to my intimate family relationships. In the end, what is and is not <insert BDSM label X> here is just one of those things that is unanswerable. Everyone defines it differently enough that the labels are utterly meaningless. What's more interesting is the paragraph or two you get AFTER they introduce themselves with their label. I don't really care whether someone I meet somewhere is a "true master". I care whether they are fun to hang around. I care whether they have a partner or not. IF they do have one, I care about the vibes that relationship gives off. Beyond that, I'm interested in the dynamic they have but I recognize that each will be unique. They can hang whatever label they want onto it and I don't care because I'm more interested in the terrain than the map. I disagree even if a dominant manipulate you to become a slave, you do so of your own free will, and it is a gift you give to the dominant. That after you have given yourself to the dominant, things can change.

searching4mysir -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 9:06:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JeffBC quote: ORIGINAL: searching4mysir Then you've met a "slave" with a death wish. EVERYONE has limits unless they want to die. Wow. Now THERE is an interesting leap in logic. Let's just be clear here. I would die for Carol in a heart beat and I would also trust her if she told me I had to do so. I'm pretty sure I love life and I have no death wish. Heck, I'm not even what you'd call particularly submissive. I'm just wildly in love and I trust her a great deal. That's a positive spin on "being commanded to suicide". A much less positive spin is Jonestown... none of whom had a death wish. People have died for their leaders throughout history in a wide variety of circumstances (think military) without having a death wish -- almost always without having a clear idea whey they are dying. I just think it takes an appropriately charismatic leader not necessarily a suicidal slave. Carol is your wife. He was talking about a playing with a stranger who had "no limits". Were you willing to die for Carol the day you met her?

JeffBC -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 9:14:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: hrxxx I disagree even if a dominant manipulate you to become a slave, you do so of your own free will, and it is a gift you give to the dominant. That after you have given yourself to the dominant, things can change. nods And that is the viewpoint of someone who, in my own words, does not believe in dominance and submission. I happen to think those words have real meanings at the core personality level. What's going on here is an entirely different conceptual model. There will never be "agreement". I do agree with a part of what you said. A slave mentality enslaves itself "of it's own free will"... because it has no choice because a fish can be none other than a fish.

tazzygirl -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 10:31:11 AM)
quote: I disagree even if a dominant manipulate you to become a slave, you do so of your own free will, and it is a gift you give to the dominant. That after you have given yourself to the dominant, things can change. Manipulation tends to take the "free will" out of the equation.

UllrsIshtar -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 10:32:37 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JeffBC Ishtar is saying this isn't slavery. Nah I didn't. I said is't not mastery. Whether or not she is a slave depends on the girl's headspace. However, mastery is certainly is not. And even if she is a slave, what she definitively is not is his slave. Getting a gift bestowed upon you makes you a subject to the relationship dynamic, not the agent. It makes the gift giver the agent, and therefore also the one in complete control. Claiming that receiving a gift from somebody else makes you a master over anything is ludicrous.

JeffBC -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 10:51:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar Nah I didn't. I said is't not mastery. Uppity free women! :)

tazzygirl -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 12:22:29 PM)
quote: Getting a gift bestowed upon you makes you a subject to the relationship dynamic, not the agent. It makes the gift giver the agent, and therefore also the one in complete control. Claiming that receiving a gift from somebody else makes you a master over anything is ludicrous. I never got any of that either. The men in my life have always said mastering me was hard work, and well worth the work.

ChatteParfaitt -> RE: What the difference between Dominant and Master. (6/14/2013 1:07:28 PM)
quote: What you're saying is that it is not possible to be a master on a playdate? my experience tells me that you may well experience TPE and no limits with a slave you've never met before, and whether it's playdate or 24/7 do you agree on the conditions underlying the relationship, so you can be master from the first night. Sorry, if it's a playdate, you're the top, not the master. That someone agrees, after negotiation, to be obedient to someone for a proscribed amount of time does not make that person a master. It does not make the person agreeing a slave, tpe slave or any other kind. It makes the two top and bottom. That's it. To be someone's dominant means taking a certain amount of actual responsibility for them. Not for five minutes or a few hours, but for the long haul. It doesn't mean the two can't break up, but if they do, the dominant is still required, in my mind, to do everything they can to ensure the well being of the sub until said sub is happy and healthy, both emotionally and physically, on their own. If that's not possible, and sometimes it's not, then the dom has to acknowledge that they made a bad choice in submissive, b/c they didn't choose someone who was whole to begin with. Again, this is my opinion, YMMV.

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