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ORIGINAL: wckdmnd

Using the old adage a submissive is born a slave is made. a dominant is born a Master is made. Why does it seem to be so much easier for most to accept someone who claims themselves to be slave than those that claim themselves to be Master?

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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Here ya go, Bita....

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ORIGINAL: wckdmnd

Actually bambiboi your response was really the kind of response I was hoping to illicit.

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ORIGINAL: wckdmnd
Using the old adage a submissive is born a slave is made. a dominant is born a Master is made. Why does it seem to be so much easier for most to accept someone who claims themselves to be slave than those that claim themselves to be Master?

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Dyfyrnt treats slave and sub almost the same, in that a person can be born as either. However, while he mentions a person can be born a dom, he does not deign to suggest one can be born a master.

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ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Personally, I don't claim either. I'm more in the "if you haven't lived it, you probably aren't" category.

Yesterday, there was a thread where somebody brought up the comment that the person on the s side of the slash had destroyed the relationship from their use of illegal drugs. Very quickly, the comments came about "if they were a slave, how could they have had that ability?" The implication being that, if they had been Mastered properly, that wouldn't have happened. It wasn't that person's behavior that was brought into question. Rather, it became the fault of the other.

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ORIGINAL: wckdmnd

Oh it's old to me because I first heard it 30 some odd years ago.

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Labels are an important step in that in my opinion. If somebody isn't a slave, they're not a slave, and if somebody doesn't fully own another human being, they're not a slave owner. Denying that reality while continuing to pretend that you're dealing with an owner or a slave respectively and continuing to expect behavior to be in line with a reality that doesn't exist is delusional, and does nothing to create any opportunity to get the relationship back on the right track.

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ORIGINAL: Dyfrynt

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Labels are an important step in that in my opinion. If somebody isn't a slave, they're not a slave, and if somebody doesn't fully own another human being, they're not a slave owner. Denying that reality while continuing to pretend that you're dealing with an owner or a slave respectively and continuing to expect behavior to be in line with a reality that doesn't exist is delusional, and does nothing to create any opportunity to get the relationship back on the right track.

The problem with this statement is that you are using only one variation of the definition of "slave" - yours. And while I am a big fan of definitions being critical to proper debate, there are simply too many people with too many different ideas of what that magic five letter word means.

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ORIGINAL: wckdmnd

yeah, I understand you don't respect anyone stef.

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ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar

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ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Personally, I don't claim either. I'm more in the "if you haven't lived it, you probably aren't" category.

Yesterday, there was a thread where somebody brought up the comment that the person on the s side of the slash had destroyed the relationship from their use of illegal drugs. Very quickly, the comments came about "if they were a slave, how could they have had that ability?" The implication being that, if they had been Mastered properly, that wouldn't have happened. It wasn't that person's behavior that was brought into question. Rather, it became the fault of the other.

Considering that the comment in question came from me, I will clarify that it wasn't at all a placement of blame on the other person. Rather it's a case of, when you're dealing with a slave you have control over, there are measures that you can take to prevent such a thing from happening, by for instance, cutting off their access to money, or free time in which they have the ability to go find drugs.

If you don't have the measure of control to do that, you're not dealing with person who is a slave to you. That doesn't excuse the person's behavior in getting addicted, nor does it imply that the cause of the addiction is in any way the D-type's fault, but it does imply that -if slavery was the goal- there where deeper problems at play than merely the s-type getting addicted -as serious as that is by itself.

Failing to control somebody who makes it impossible for you to control them again doesn't imply that the D-type is doing something wrong. But it does bring home the reality of the situation that what you're dealing with isn't a slave, in any way, shape or form of what I consider slavery to be.

A lot of times I see people going into a relationship on the premise of TPE slavery, and then somewhere along the line, it turns out that the TPE isn't happening at all. At that point, instead of realizing that what has happened means that there is no TPE, and both parties reevaluating if they want to remain together now that both parties autonomously are deciding what they do, people start playing a blame game. "You're not obeying like a slave!" "Oh yeah, well you're not being dominant enough!" Instead of just coming to the conclusion that -for whatever reason- there is no TPE dynamic between them, and dealing with that or using it as a cause to break up.

Labels are an important step in that in my opinion. If somebody isn't a slave, they're not a slave, and if somebody doesn't fully own another human being, they're not a slave owner. Denying that reality while continuing to pretend that you're dealing with an owner or a slave respectively and continuing to expect behavior to be in line with a reality that doesn't exist is delusional, and does nothing to create any opportunity to get the relationship back on the right track.

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ORIGINAL: ARIES83

I didn't catch that thread but just to weigh in... I find the idea of being able to control someone who is a drug addict laughable... Unless you control them with drugs... But trying to get them off the drugs... Errr can someone link me that thread actually! I am feeling the need to issue some reality checks.

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ORIGINAL: MasterCaneman

Aw, that hurts, man. That really hurts. Makes me wish I'd have proofread my profile a little better. Mister is only one stinkin' letter away from Master...

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ORIGINAL: littlewonder

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ORIGINAL: MasterCaneman

Aw, that hurts, man. That really hurts. Makes me wish I'd have proofread my profile a little better. Mister is only one stinkin' letter away from Master...

You're safe being that the word "Mister" comes from the word "Master" and have been used interchangeably throughout history and cultures.