njlauren
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Extravagasm
Nick cannot be excused for asking very provocative questions with the clarity of a poster stoned on weed.
Yet his intent is present and all the responders are evading it. I cannot excuse posters (or most of society) for not being able to instantly come up with a list of womens rights, that men lack. Because we live with them daily. To me, this alone demonstrates Nick's point.
I haven't time to debate these complex issues, but as I say, it is a crime that people don't walk around at least fully aware of them. I will use US examples for this post.
1) Women exempt from military draft registration. No this is not moot, simply b/c US is not presently drafting solders. All boys still must register. US has not abolished the prerogative to draft whenever necessary. It's also a libertarian issue, in disguise, for those who wish to be kept out of the government grid.
2) Women who commit sex crimes (especially against children) do not end up living under bridges and trash dumps after serving their sentences (if any sentence). You can trace backward the discrimination differences and reasons.
3) The decision whether to abort a potential child of a marriage has enormous financial consequences for males, yet they have no equivalent decision making legal power in the "family choice" at that point.
4) When everything else is equal, primary child custody goes to the female. Men do not have equal rights here, no matter how you squirm or deny.
5) A husband is legally held financially responsible for children incurred during his former marriage, including those provable not fathered by him. Converse not true for women. This is one of those situations where men lose rights by marrying, b/c non-married men never involuntarily acquire financial liability for children they provably did not father.
6) Flaunting of public nudity by women is generally brushed over, where for men it is considered a serious offense. In some jurisdictions, considered a registered sex crime for males.
7) The rape of adult women in prison, war, or external society, is today considered a problem of considerable outrage and efforts to ameliorate. Prison, homosexual, and war rape of adult males is considered more of a joking matter . . . with almost no movements to ameliorate.
Also I have yet to hear of a woman being arrested for taking advantage of a completely drunk man and having any type of sexual contact with him. Which happens often enough.
8) There are several hate crime statues based on animus against women. None based on animus against men. Even though clearly men are the population minority and the existence of many man-hating criminals is historically documented.
In fact it can be argued that our society considers males expendable, especially in emergencies and calamities.
9) The criminal justice system, from beginning to end, treats female defendants with kid gloves, even female child killers and psychopathic killers. The only exception being when they are sadly ugly.
10) Not even going to go into the insurance, medical research and treatment unbalance against males.
11) The list goes on and on until can't type anymore. Suffice it to say when Phyllis Schlafly almost single-handedly defeated the US Equal Rights Ammendment, her main tactic was to sponsor modifications, insuring the retention of female specific rights. These inconvenient modification attempts served to focus on the embarrassing truth THAT FEMALES HAVE SIGNIFICANT RIGHTS WHICH MALES LACK.
My answers (and yes, there is some truth in the picture, but a lot of misstatements)
1)That is true, but the irony is it is mostly men fighting it. It is only recently that the military started allowing women to serve in combat positions, and it is the staunch conservatives who fought it tooth and nail...I hate to tell you, women aren't keeping women out of the draft, men are.
2)First of all, women as a percentage commit a fraction of the sex crimes men so. Secondly, your contention is bogus, women who are convicted of having sex with minors are sent to jail the way men are when there is a complaint filed. One of the problems is when an older women has sex with an underage boy, a lot of the times it is not reported, probably because dad thinks son is being a stud, doing the older woman, while with a girl the father is outraged some older guy got her. I would love to see some proof of your claim, that female sex offenders get off better than men do, they are put on Megan's law lists and such the same as men, they have to report where they are living and so forth,and face the same problems.
3)There is some truth to this, but often what it boils down to is the father wants the woman to keep the baby, and then does a 23 skeedaddle when it comes to supporting the child, or the woman wants the baby and the father says no way. It is hard, because ultimately the mother ends up with the kid, the dad says don't abort it then walks away.
There is another side to this, too, I suggest you do some research on child support payments and what a crappy job the system does in collecting them, last I checked in something like 35 or 40% of cases where a father is ordered to pay child support payments, the mother never collects and the state basically does jack to try and collect it.
4)I agree about this one, the law is stacked with 19th century ideas that a kid is better with the mother, and in court unless the mother is a raving drug addict, judges won't give custody to the father. A woman I worked with for a while is a paralegal, and she told cases of women who cheated on hubby, filed for divorce, got the house, the kids, moved boyfriend in and the ex husband was paying for it, which is ridiculous, but she said it went on all the time. One note, a lot of the judges ruling this way are men, and the laws were written by men in the first place...
5)Child support depends on custody, if a husband gets full time custody of the kids the mother can be required to pay child support payments, child support goes to the custodial parent. It happens to be as the poster pointed out, that kids usually end up with the mom, and thus the payments, but I know for a fact that when dad's get custody, mom has to pay child support.
Actually, there is a bigger fundamental issue here, and it has to do with alimony and such. Divorce laws were written to protect women because of times past, when women would stay home with the kids and the dad would be the working parent, in these days where both parents work and the wife is making as much or more and more, more than the husband, the law still treats the wife like she was a stay at home mom who needs protection, they haven't updated the law to look at reality. I know one couple where the wife made more than the husband, yet he ended up paying alimony (not child support, alimony), though her salary was significantly larger than his....
6)And who are enforcing those laws, and passing sentence? Men! And gee, ya think they are all that upset about a woman flaunting her stuff, somehow I don't think so. Somewhere a while ago I read a piece that claimed that with public nudity complaints, they generally only arrested women who weren't particularly attractive, if a pretty young woman with no cellulite or stretch marks went topless, no problem....
Whereas men are disgusted looking at other men, so guess what, they enforce it....
7)Again, it is men who get up in arms about female rape, it is one of the reasons conservatives fought against having women in combat, for example, and it is men who get upset when their women folk get raped.....but with males getting sexually assaulted, men have this idea that if it happens to you it is because you are weak, not much of a man, hence the jokes about prison rape, if you are a bitch rather than the guys doing it, the guys doing it are 'men'.......as far as women assaulting men sexually, given that men are stronger then women, it is a lot harder for a woman to rape a man..and a drunk man isn't going to be very good, one drunk enough that she can have her way since if he is that drunk he probably can't get it up...
but it also leaves out something else, while there are female rapists, it is rare, because rape is a crime of anger and hate and power, and that tends to reside mostly in men (in terms of acting it out sexually). Also depends on the type of rape, a serial rapist is different than the guy who does date rape or who drugs a girl with a roofie. For the latter type, the difference is if a woman wants to get laid, it is very, very easy to find a guy to have sex with, if you are a man wanting to get laid, lot harder, a woman doesn't have to resort to roofies, they can simply go to a bar and I guarantee they find someone.
Plus there is the issue of reporting, if a male is raped by a male, they are ashamed to report it, afraid people will assume he is gay or something or a wuss, and if a woman forces a man to have sex, is able to do that,do you think a man is going to report that and get laughed at? I hate to tell you, but most of those laughing at prison rape of men or men getting raped at al are men.
8)Totally bogus. Hate crimes laws cover gender/sex, and it is both ways, the law doesn't say "if you hurt a woman because she is a woman, that is a hate crime, if a woman does it to a man, it isn't". If a woman, pissed off because her husband cheated on her, took a baseball bat and started beating up men on the street because they were men, it would be a hate crime. Several years ago the bouncer at a lesbian bar was sent to prison for 5-7 years for assaulting a man who tried to enter the bar, she had no right to bar him from access (if you have a liquor license, you cannot discriminate like that) and she assaulted him simply because he was a man trying to go into the bar. And your assertion is bogus, while men are slightly in the minority, the overwhelming majority of act of hate are a man beating up a woman, the other way is very few.
9)This is a supposition that for the most part is bogus. One of the reasons for disparate sentencing is that penalties for crimes that include violence tend to have harsher sentences, and men by far are more likely to commit acts of violence in a crime than women are,so the sentences are different. But I see murder cases in the news, and when they are sentenced for murder 1 I usually see them getting the same sentences as men; want proof, if you have the Investigation Discovery channel (my favorite program), the women who kill end up with life without parole or death in the cases they have, same as the men who kill.
10)I don't know what you mean by insurance, if you mean women pay less for things like car insurance or life insurance, that is based in actuarial science. For example, young male drivers pay a lot more than young female drivers (talking <25 years old), but guess what? Young male drivers are statistically some ridiculous percentage more likely to get into accidents then young women, even with all the young women out there gabbing with their friends, texting, etc, that is based on facts.
As far as medical care, a lot more is spent on diseases affecting men than women. Lupus is a disease that affects mostly women, and spending on it is dismal, yet a ton of money is spent on research into prostate cancer. Spending on heart disease, that affects men a lot more than women, is huge, yet until not all that long ago spending on uterine and breast cancer research was trifling compared to things like lung cancer, that again, tends to be more prevalent in men than women. Then, too, we had health insurance plans that would cover viagra and not birth control pills.
11)The ERA was killed because social conservatives like Phyliss Schafly (who is one of the most vile human beings I have ever read about, I mean despicable) spread a whole disinformation campaign, that it meant men and women would have to share same sex bathrooms, that it would mean men losing jobs to women because if this passed, every job would have to be equally male and female, it would mean that in school girls would have to play football, it was unreal (I am old enough to remember them trying to pass it), it was the best propaganda campaign since Joseph Goebels was around. They claimed, as idiots usually do , that it gave women 'special rights', which sounds just like the knuckle draggers when they talked about civil rights laws or protections for gays, it is 'special rights', which is nonsense.
And want proof of the rights women don't have? They don't even have the right to be represented by their own sex/gender in the halls of power.....of the fortune 500 companies, something like 10 of them are headed by women; The senate has 100 members, and I think 12 or 13 are women, a new record; in the house, a tiny percentage are women, yet women are close to 51% of the population...if they have all this power, how come men run most of the world?
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RE: A huge hypocrisy factor within gender argument - 
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