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RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 8:12:04 PM

RottenJohnny

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

fact is the left has NO PROBLEM inconviencing people so long as its regarding an ISSUE they LIKE!

Fact is, the left has no problem inconveniencing people so long as they're white, middle-aged men with a job and some ambition for independence.

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RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 8:23:27 PM

tammystarm

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FR.

If one need not prove who you say you are when voting then I suggest the voting process is not longer a credible governing process and we need to leave the country and find one that requires voter I.D.s.

That would be the European Union. Ironic that, eh?

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RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 8:31:06 PM

imogenempire

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Not an American so I don't vote there, but I lived in the States for the time and still visit. My American friends in the East Coast tell me they are required to present a driver's license and/or a voter registration card. I consider myself to have quite liberal politics but I don't see the problem in being required to prove you're a citizen and resident in a right that is only granted to citizens of the nation and residents of the state.

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Post #: 63

RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 8:31:12 PM

BamaD

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

quote:

ORIGINAL: rederik654

the goal is one person, one vote, and you should at least be alive and breathing.

Except, of course, in Chicago

Never has been there.

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Post #: 64

RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 8:33:47 PM

BamaD

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quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

quote:

oh and by the way, when Democrats fail to count military votes that get sent back slowly through military post or because ballots dont get sent out timely, or just because military tend to vote conservative, i suppose that's just ducky.

When thousands of write in ballots are found in Washington state, in closets, and garages, the trunks of cars, all democrat votes, they should apply to the election. Keep finding and counting until the Republicans are behind.

And when Acorn registers "voters" in multiple districts, and then busses them around so they can vote multiple times in places like Ohio, thats just great, lets send them some more money for their good service.

You are kidding yourself if you think that there is not vote fraud in most states.

Two questions:

(a) Got any sources for all of this, or are we meant to take your word for it?

(b) Anyone missing a sock?

The first time I got to vote the wall behind the poll workers looked like it was Democratic headquarters. That was in Missouri.

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Post #: 65

RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 8:35:06 PM

BamaD

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

quote:

ORIGINAL: rederik654

the goal is one person, one vote, and you should at least be alive and breathing.

Except, of course, in Chicago

And Miami. http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/06/20/3462110/state-investigators-never-interviewed.html

OOPS, I'm sorry, We're not supposed to report Republicans engaging in fraud are we?

Fraud is fraud.

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Post #: 66

RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 8:36:04 PM

Hillwilliam

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

quote:

ORIGINAL: rederik654

the goal is one person, one vote, and you should at least be alive and breathing.

Except, of course, in Chicago

And Miami. http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/06/20/3462110/state-investigators-never-interviewed.html

OOPS, I'm sorry, We're not supposed to report Republicans engaging in fraud are we?

Fraud is fraud.

I know, I was just digging at Yachtie.

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Post #: 67

RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 8:40:28 PM

BamaD

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffBC

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin
since voter fraud is by percentage so LOW, its NO BIG DEAL
but if a tiny percentage of people are INCONVIENIENCED, that IS a BIG DEAL...

I might almost agree with you... almost... had I not seen so many cases of one or the other party using "voter fraud" as a method for disenfranchising voters. And yes, it is my perception in this case that the Republicans do this more than the democrats. I still maintain the whole thing PALES in comparison to gerrymandering which both parties do without regret.

Republicans hold down the vote with voter id the Dems pack elections with illegals, why do you think they are so fired up about voter I D
I have to show more ID to get a six-pack than to vote.

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RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 8:42:56 PM

BamaD

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

quote:

ORIGINAL: rederik654

the goal is one person, one vote, and you should at least be alive and breathing.

Except, of course, in Chicago

And Miami. http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/06/20/3462110/state-investigators-never-interviewed.html

OOPS, I'm sorry, We're not supposed to report Republicans engaging in fraud are we?

Fraud is fraud.

I know, I was just digging at Yachtie.

In that case never mind.

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Post #: 69

RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 10:05:14 PM

DomKen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: imogenempire

Not an American so I don't vote there, but I lived in the States for the time and still visit. My American friends in the East Coast tell me they are required to present a driver's license and/or a voter registration card. I consider myself to have quite liberal politics but I don't see the problem in being required to prove you're a citizen and resident in a right that is only granted to citizens of the nation and residents of the state.

We have a very effective system for establishing that a person registering to vote is a citizen. Having to show an ID from a very short list when arriving at the polling place, after having successfully registered, is simply an attempt to prevent citizens that have a hard time acquiring an ID on that short list from voting.

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Post #: 70

RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 10:12:54 PM

BamaD

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: imogenempire

Not an American so I don't vote there, but I lived in the States for the time and still visit. My American friends in the East Coast tell me they are required to present a driver's license and/or a voter registration card. I consider myself to have quite liberal politics but I don't see the problem in being required to prove you're a citizen and resident in a right that is only granted to citizens of the nation and residents of the state.

We have a very effective system for establishing that a person registering to vote is a citizen. Having to show an ID from a very short list when arriving at the polling place, after having successfully registered, is simply an attempt to prevent citizens that have a hard time acquiring an ID on that short list from voting.

Like illegals and people who have voted in three other districts

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RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 10:13:59 PM

graceadieu

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From: Maryland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

quote:

EVERYONE can get a picture id with no problem.

I'd love a source for that too. Last time I got a government-issued ID, it took several hours of waiting. I was lucky that the DMV wasn't too far from home. I'm not sure that's the case for "EVERYONE."

Yeah, I remember going to get a state ID card before I learned to drive. It was a 3-hour round trip by public transit, plus a couple hours waiting around at the MVA. Which of course is only open 9-5, M-F, so that meant taking a day off work while also having to pay like $30. When you make not much over minimum wage, that's a big hardship.

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Post #: 72

RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/13/2013 10:21:07 PM

graceadieu

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quote:

ORIGINAL: imogenempire

Not an American so I don't vote there, but I lived in the States for the time and still visit. My American friends in the East Coast tell me they are required to present a driver's license and/or a voter registration card. I consider myself to have quite liberal politics but I don't see the problem in being required to prove you're a citizen and resident in a right that is only granted to citizens of the nation and residents of the state.

A voter registration card is free and sent you in the mail after you register to vote. The whole point of the voter ID laws is that your registration card isn't enough - they require you to also buy a driver's license or ID from the state and present it every time you vote.

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RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/14/2013 12:15:52 AM

joether

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I guess I look at this on a very different sub-topic of this threat than most of you. I see it as a way to 'get around' my 4th Amendment Rights. In every election, I've stated (for the record) who I am and where I live. Not a single problem from anyone in so many years. Why should I have to prove to the Government who I am and where I live? They already have that information!

If someone walked up and stated they wish to challenge me, that's their choice. The burden of proof is on them, NOT ME, to prove that 1) I am not who I say I am, 2) I do not live where I say I do, or 3) I am neither who I say I am nor live where I stated I lived. Last I checked, in the United States of America, one accused of a crime does NOT have to prove their innocence beyond a shadow of doubt but quite the opposite.

On the topic of the United States of America, its where I live! Not Nazi Germany nor Stalin-ist USSR! Both of those places and times should conjure up the very essence of being against freedom. This law in North Carolina goes against the second most important idea in America, just after the US Constitution: The Ability to Vote Freely! Only those wishing tyranny would limit both HOW and WHO can vote in an election. That way, they can 'rig' the election and hence, remove the concept of freedom from the individual citizen.

I have not seen nor heard of an peer reviewed study that shows Voter Fraud taking place on the scale conservatives and Republicans alike fear. The opening thread provided a link to one such study that showed quite the opposite; that voter fraud was so extremely limited as to not be even a minor consideration on the final voting outcome. An like DOMA and the state versions of that law, this one will be over turned by the US Supreme Court in the future. Its not a waste of money when Republicans push bad laws right?

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Post #: 74

RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/14/2013 12:22:36 AM

joether

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin
yes yes we certianly can't have NC doing what MOST states ALREADY DO!
]

Most states have not gone to this extreme yet. That's why North Carolina is 'first' in the nation to do this....

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin
More than three-fifths of states currently have some kind of Voter ID law, and even more have no same-day registration. Not all states allow in-person early voting.

Please give the source.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin
While there is significant resistance to Voter ID laws on the left, polls generally show the American people support them by large margins. Recent North Carolina polls and a Washington Post poll last year showed nearly three-quarters support requiring voters to show photo ID.

And the source this is one is where?

By not giving sources to back up where you got your information, allows anyone to discredit the information as 'B.S.'.

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RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/14/2013 12:32:59 AM

tazzygirl

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quote:

Like illegals and people who have voted in three other districts

I cant seem to find anything about illegal immigrants actually voting. Got something on that?

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RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/14/2013 6:17:34 AM

DesideriScuri

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quote:

ORIGINAL: joether
If someone walked up and stated they wish to challenge me, that's their choice. The burden of proof is on them, NOT ME, to prove that 1) I am not who I say I am, 2) I do not live where I say I do, or 3) I am neither who I say I am nor live where I stated I lived. Last I checked, in the United States of America, one accused of a crime does NOT have to prove their innocence beyond a shadow of doubt but quite the opposite.

Follow this made up story and let me know who if Mr. E gets to vote or not.

Mr. E. goes to the polling place and states a name and address. The poll workers, who don't actually know Mr. E. verify the name and address. Now, I walk up and challenge Mr. E. I would have to prove that Mr. E. is not the person he named, does not live at the address stated, or both, right? Let's say I am the next-door neighbor to the address given by Mr. E. and, thus, the neighbor of the name given. I know for a fact that Mr. E. is not my neighbor.

How am I to prove that Mr. E. isn't my neighbor?

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RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/14/2013 6:26:15 AM

mnottertail

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We don't know. How do we know you are indeed mrnext2E? We don't. You both get provisional ballots. That's how it works now.

So, blacklisting ain't working any better in the polling places than it is here.

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RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/14/2013 6:31:37 AM

Hillwilliam

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether
If someone walked up and stated they wish to challenge me, that's their choice. The burden of proof is on them, NOT ME, to prove that 1) I am not who I say I am, 2) I do not live where I say I do, or 3) I am neither who I say I am nor live where I stated I lived. Last I checked, in the United States of America, one accused of a crime does NOT have to prove their innocence beyond a shadow of doubt but quite the opposite.

Follow this made up story and let me know who if Mr. E gets to vote or not.

Mr. E. goes to the polling place and states a name and address. The poll workers, who don't actually know Mr. E. verify the name and address. Now, I walk up and challenge Mr. E. I would have to prove that Mr. E. is not the person he named, does not live at the address stated, or both, right? Let's say I am the next-door neighbor to the address given by Mr. E. and, thus, the neighbor of the name given. I know for a fact that Mr. E. is not my neighbor.

How am I to prove that Mr. E. isn't my neighbor?

How about this one that is true.
Ms W from a rural area has lived in the same house for 50+ years. She is so elderly that she has no birth certificate nor has she ever driven. She gets by on her ex husband's pension. She never worked off the farm so she has no SS.
Her son drives her to the polling place and literally every person there knows her.

Does she get to vote?

True story, Western TN, She was denied.
It was the first election of any kind she had missed since Roosevelt was president.

As for your question, you write the election commission in your county.
They will investigate and if Mr E was shown to have voted fraudulently, he would be arrested by the county Sherriff.

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RE: Republicans Limiting The Vote - 8/14/2013 6:35:02 AM

DesideriScuri

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail
We don't know. How do we know you are indeed mrnext2E? We don't. You both get provisional ballots. That's how it works now.
So, blacklisting ain't working any better in the polling places than it is here.

I can show my ID with my address being close to the given address, if not the next number. But, that is still not proof that Mr. E. isn't who he said he is. Requiring photo ID to vote, though, would solve that, and prevent challenges, no?

Full Disclosure: My County requires photo ID to get a ballot, so this hypothetical isn't likely to happen. Mr. E. would get a provisional ballot if he didn't produce a valid photo ID. I have never voted in this County (first election since I became resident of this County was 1992) without there being a requirement for valid photo ID. To my knowledge, there haven't been any local protests of that requirement in the 20+ years I've been here.

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