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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 2:46:21 PM   
BamaD


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To deny that the overwhelming majority of white on black crime in the past 100 years has been racially motivated?


What happened 100 years ago is irrelevant
Todays figures turn it around

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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 3:33:07 PM   
tazzygirl


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No it doesnt.

In 1996, the FBI received reports of 10,706 hate crimes from State and local law enforcement agencies, involving 11,039 victims, and 10,021 known perpetrators. The crimes included 12 murders, 10 forcible rapes, 1,444 aggravated assaults, 1,762 simple assaults, and 4,130 acts of intimidation.


Among the known perpetrators, 66 percent were white, and 20 percent were black. Some perpetrators commit hate crimes with their peers as a "thrill" or while under the influence of drugs or alcohol; some as a reaction against a perceived threat or to preserve their "turf'; and some who out of resentment over the growing economic power of a particular racial or ethnic group engage in scapegoating.


http://www.justice.gov/crs/pubs/htecrm.htm

Is this something you really want to be proud of? Something to crow about? The disproportionate amount of white people who commit crimes against another race?

Trying to say because the population of whites is so large compared to blacks that it "makes sense" that there are more perps among whites is ridiculous on face value... even more so when digging deeper.

Not everyone commits a hate crime. Trying to say only x amount of the white population commits them is laughable.

Hard numbers are... more whites commit them... more blacks are victims.

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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 5:18:04 PM   
Yachtie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

And again, you are trying to extrapolate across the population the numbers from the VICTIM count. How many attackers to the victim are there? Some are one on one. Some are three on one. Some are 6 on one. Until you can find the actual numbers of those committing the crimes we are only speaking about the VICTIMS themselves.

Blacks are less than 20% of the population. Yet they are subjected to 71% of the hate crimes.

Twist that in the wind... its the only thing that might make sense of the ramblings against this issue.



71% (hate crimes) of 20% (population) is 14.2 So one could say that 14.2% of the black population has experienced some form of a hate crime. That's obscene.No doubt about it.

This leaves whites as 80% of the population, four times that of blacks, experiencing only 29% of the hate crimes. 29% (hate crimes) of 80% (population) is 23.2 So one could say that 23.2% of the white population has experienced some form of a hate crime.

Do the math.








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“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 5:29:12 PM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie
71% (hate crimes) of 20% (population) is 14.2 So one could say that 14.2% of the black population has experienced some form of a hate crime. That's obscene.No doubt about it.

This leaves whites as 80% of the population, four times that of blacks, experiencing only 29% of the hate crimes. 29% (hate crimes) of 80% (population) is 23.2 So one could say that 23.2% of the white population has experienced some form of a hate crime.

Do the math.



Your maths are as convoluted as your posts.

"Do the math" indeed.

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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 5:32:29 PM   
tazzygirl


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It doesnt matter what portion of the population is doing it. The attempts to water it down by saying "Well, we have so many whites compared to so many blacks, so its not as bad" isnt working... isnt every going to work....

There are a certain amount of people who are in nursing homes who cannot commit hate crimes. There are a certain number who are blind who do not commit hate crimes. There are a certain number who are mentally challenged who do not commit hate crimes.

Take the dilution bullshit somewhere else. Your stats are not working.

The attackers in hate crimes are predominantly white, the victims are predominantly black.

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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 5:44:33 PM   
Yachtie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie
71% (hate crimes) of 20% (population) is 14.2 So one could say that 14.2% of the black population has experienced some form of a hate crime. That's obscene.No doubt about it.

This leaves whites as 80% of the population, four times that of blacks, experiencing only 29% of the hate crimes. 29% (hate crimes) of 80% (population) is 23.2 So one could say that 23.2% of the white population has experienced some form of a hate crime.

Do the math.



Your maths are as convoluted as your posts.

"Do the math" indeed.




Given that the number of hate crimes committed by a group four times as large holds a lower ratio position than the much smaller group, what does that say? Put another way, it's interesting that a group, being 4x larger, commits nearly half as many hate crimes as the smaller.



_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 6:13:31 PM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

It doesnt matter what portion of the population is doing it. The attempts to water it down by saying "Well, we have so many whites compared to so many blacks, so its not as bad" isnt working... isnt every going to work....

There are a certain amount of people who are in nursing homes who cannot commit hate crimes. There are a certain number who are blind who do not commit hate crimes. There are a certain number who are mentally challenged who do not commit hate crimes.

Take the dilution bullshit somewhere else. Your stats are not working.

The attackers in hate crimes are predominantly white, the victims are predominantly black.

All of those people who cannot commit crimes are equally represented in the black community so that doesn't count.
Hate crimes committed by black are also often 2,3, or 6-1 so that too is a non factor.
I never said that it's ok because there are more whites, one is too many.

Can you not comprehend that a black person selected at random has twice the chance of having committee a hate crime that a white person selected at random.

Does this mean there are more total numbers of hate crimes by blacks no
Does this mean that the hate crimes committed by white people are any less disgusting no
Does it mean that a black INDIVIDUAL is more likely to commit a hate crime than a white INDIVIDUAL afraid so
Does this constitute a condemnation of the black race of course not

But just as the 98.6% of blacks who don't commit hate crimes are not responsible for the 1.4% who do the 99.3% of white people who don't commit them aren't responsible for the .7% who do.
We are not responsible for what happened to Mr. Bird , we are not responsible for what happened to Emmett Tills , and we are not responsible for anyone the Klan lynched.


_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 6:15:16 PM   
Yachtie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

It doesnt matter what portion of the population is doing it. The attempts to water it down by saying "Well, we have so many whites compared to so many blacks, so its not as bad" isnt working... isnt every going to work....

There are a certain amount of people who are in nursing homes who cannot commit hate crimes. There are a certain number who are blind who do not commit hate crimes. There are a certain number who are mentally challenged who do not commit hate crimes.

Take the dilution bullshit somewhere else. Your stats are not working.

The attackers in hate crimes are predominantly white, the victims are predominantly black.


Come on Tazzy! Which is larger, 71% of 100 or 29% of 400? This really escapes you, unless, of course, 71 is actually greater than 116.

So 71 whites committed hate crimes while 116 blacks did. It's irrelevant how many people are in nursing homes, or blind, etc. It's just a statistic. Hell, it's possible just one white did all 71 while one black did all 116. That too is irrelevant. All this shows is that on average a black has a higher %age of incidence to commit a hate crime than a white. Now, when you factor in that whites are 4x as numerous as blacks, what are the odds of a black being subject to a hate crime by a white?

Tangentially, Jesse Jackson understood.



< Message edited by Yachtie -- 9/4/2013 6:19:22 PM >


_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 7:17:21 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

But just as the 98.6% of blacks who don't commit hate crimes are not responsible for the 1.4% who do the 99.3% of white people who don't commit them aren't responsible for the .7% who do.
We are not responsible for what happened to Mr. Bird , we are not responsible for what happened to Emmett Tills , and we are not responsible for anyone the Klan lynched.


I never said the "white population" at large was responsible for anything.

I said according to the FBI stats

"Among the known perpetrators, 66 percent were white, and 20 percent were black."

Dont like how the FBI puts it, take it up with them.

WHO COMMITS HATE CRIMES?

Most perpetrators of hate crimes are white, male, aged 16–25, and are NOT members of any organized hate group.


http://antiochgroup.com/resources/articles/hateCrimes.html

Or that christian group...

But raw numbers dont lie. Nor does it get watered down by two men who are so afraid that someone is saying ALL WHITE PEOPLE COMMIT HATE CRIMES.

Cus, fellas, no one said that. What I did say was, out of all the hate crimes committed in the US, white people commit the most.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Profile   Post #: 269
RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 7:40:34 PM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

But just as the 98.6% of blacks who don't commit hate crimes are not responsible for the 1.4% who do the 99.3% of white people who don't commit them aren't responsible for the .7% who do.
We are not responsible for what happened to Mr. Bird , we are not responsible for what happened to Emmett Tills , and we are not responsible for anyone the Klan lynched.


I never said the "white population" at large was responsible for anything.

I said according to the FBI stats

"Among the known perpetrators, 66 percent were white, and 20 percent were black."

Dont like how the FBI puts it, take it up with them.

WHO COMMITS HATE CRIMES?

Most perpetrators of hate crimes are white, male, aged 16–25, and are NOT members of any organized hate group.


http://antiochgroup.com/resources/articles/hateCrimes.html

Or that christian group...

But raw numbers dont lie. Nor does it get watered down by two men who are so afraid that someone is saying ALL WHITE PEOPLE COMMIT HATE CRIMES.

Cus, fellas, no one said that. What I did say was, out of all the hate crimes committed in the US, white people commit the most.

You remember how this started?

The issue here is that some think that all crime that is black on white is racially motivated. The facts are that some are and some are not. To try to ascribe the former to the latter is asanine and decietful. To deny that the overwhelming majority of white on black crime in the past 100 years has been racially motivatd is to ignore the facts and is asanine and decietful.
Thomsonx post 218


You like to ascribe weakness to anyone proving you wrong the FBI stats that you keep referring to do that
is 66 a greater % of 63 than 20 is of 12
of course not

is 66 more than 20 well duh

I say hate crimes are disgusting no matter who does them you say black hate crimes aren't as bad because they only commit them at twice the rate of white people when they would have to commit them at five time the rate as whites to catch up on gross numbers.
You would also find more whites helping blacks get ahead for the same reason.
Are you too blind to see this?
Do you realize that at first you said that whites and Hispanics committed 58% of hate crimes and now you say that whites alone commit 66% do Hispanics commit negative hate crimes or are you pulling numbers out of you hat

< Message edited by BamaD -- 9/4/2013 8:09:37 PM >


_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 270
RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 7:47:47 PM   
Yachtie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

I said according to the FBI stats

"Among the known perpetrators, 66 percent were white, and 20 percent were black."

Dont like how the FBI puts it, take it up with them.



FBI puts it just fine. It's how you are using it that's problematic.

_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 271
RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 9:27:26 PM   
tazzygirl


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LOL... and the FBI said more whites are the perpetrators. Numbers dont lie.... twisting them into some warped statistical analysis does.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Yachtie)
Profile   Post #: 272
RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 9:39:50 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

The issue here is that some think that all crime that is black on white is racially motivated.


I disagree. All black on white crime isnt racially motivated. Just like all white on black crime isnt racially motivated.

quote:

To deny that the overwhelming majority of white on black crime in the past 100 years has been racially motivatd is to ignore the facts and is asanine and decietful.


Past 100 years? I dont think I can say that isnt true. History is a bitch, and the 60's were not exactly a nice time for many black people.

quote:

I say hate crimes are disgusting no matter who does them you say black hate crimes aren't as bad because they only commit them at twice the rate of white people when they would have to commit them at five time the rate as whites to catch up on gross numbers.


You are reading something into my posts that simply is not there, was never even remotely implied, nor even tried to encourage anyone else to see. I said, based upon numbers, whites commit more racially motivated crimes, and blacks are more often the victims of those crimes. No where did I say either committed lesser crimes in terms of them being less evil or sinister.

quote:

You would also find more whites helping blacks get ahead for the same reason.
Are you too blind to see this?


A topic that was never once addressed, and has no place in the discussion of hate crimes. A good deed negates a bad one? Really? 20 white people can help 20 black people, and only 1 white person kills a black person because of his skin color, and the death is negated because of the good deeds of others? Really?

quote:

Do you realize that at first you said that whites and Hispanics committed 58% of hate crimes and now you say that whites alone commit 66% do Hispanics commit negative hate crimes or are you pulling numbers out of you hat


According to the Federal Bureau of Investigation Uniform Crime Report database, in 2010 58% of hate crime offenders were latino or white, 18% of offenders were black, 8.9% were of individuals of multiple races and 1% of offenders were Native Americans.[38] The report also reveals that 48% of all hate crime offenders were motivated by the victim's race, while 18% were based on the victim's religion, and another 18% were based on the victim's sexual orientation.[39] The report states that among hate crime offenses motivated by race, 70% were composed of anti-black bias, while 17.7% were of anti-white bias, and 5% were of anti-Asian or Pacific Islander bias.[39]


Wiki source, 2010 - Victims and Attackers

Racial bias
In 2009, law enforcement agencies reported that 3,816 single-bias hate crime offenses were racially motivated. Of these offenses:

71.4 percent were motivated by anti-black bias.
17.1 percent resulted from anti-white bias.
5.5 percent occurred because of biases against groups of individuals consisting of more than one race (anti-multiple races, group).
3.9 percent resulted from anti-Asian/Pacific Islander bias.
2.2 percent were motivated by anti-American Indian/Alaskan Native bias

http://www2.fbi.gov/ucr/hc2009/incidents.html


FBI souce, 2009 - Victims

In 1996, the FBI received reports of 10,706 hate crimes from State and local law enforcement agencies, involving 11,039 victims, and 10,021 known perpetrators. The crimes included 12 murders, 10 forcible rapes, 1,444 aggravated assaults, 1,762 simple assaults, and 4,130 acts of intimidation.


Among the known perpetrators, 66 percent were white, and 20 percent were black. Some perpetrators commit hate crimes with their peers as a "thrill" or while under the influence of drugs or alcohol; some as a reaction against a perceived threat or to preserve their "turf'; and some who out of resentment over the growing economic power of a particular racial or ethnic group engage in scapegoating.

http://www.justice.gov/crs/pubs/htecrm.htm


Justice Department source, 1996 - Victims and Attackers

Do you not read the sources? Or do you just pull your complaints out of your.. hat.

< Message edited by tazzygirl -- 9/4/2013 9:40:38 PM >


_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 9:46:01 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

WHO COMMITS HATE CRIMES?

out of all the hate crimes committed in the US, white people commit the most.

If a man with 8 white rabbits and 2 brown rabbits, all of which produce the same amount of waste, repeatedly insists that "white rabbits make the most shit," we might be inclined to suspect that he harbors some ill feeling toward white rabbits, because the reason there is more white-rabbit shit is because there are more white rabbits, not because "white rabbits make the most shit".

K.


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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 9:47:47 PM   
tazzygirl


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In your scenario, white rabbits would make the most shit because there are more. But all rabbits shit. Do all white people, or all black people, commit hate crimes? The answer is no. So you have to find another analogy.

And your selective editing isnt for shit. Try keeping it in context.

WHO COMMITS HATE CRIMES?

Most perpetrators of hate crimes are white, male, aged 16–25, and are NOT members of any organized hate group.


http://antiochgroup.com/resources/articles/hateCrimes.html

A quote from a christian group... not mine.

But raw numbers dont lie. Nor does it get watered down by two men who are so afraid that someone is saying ALL WHITE PEOPLE COMMIT HATE CRIMES.

Cus, fellas, no one said that. What I did say was, out of all the hate crimes committed in the US, white people commit the most.


Lame attempt at twisting what I said.

< Message edited by tazzygirl -- 9/4/2013 9:50:02 PM >


_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 275
RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 10:11:58 PM   
Kirata


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If two groups are equally disposed toward violence and hate, we would expect to see them represented among criminal offenders at rates reflecting their percentage of the population. In other words, given a population that is 72.4% white and 12.6% black, we would expect to find that criminal offenders are about 72.4% white and 12.6% black.

What point is there to be made by insisting that whites commit more crimes in such a context? And most especially, what point is there to be made by insisting that whites commit more crimes when in fact white offenders are under-represented in virtually every crime category except drunkeness.

Take your 'eeeevil white people' shit and shove it.

K.





< Message edited by Kirata -- 9/4/2013 10:28:23 PM >

(in reply to tazzygirl)
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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 10:51:14 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

If two groups are equally disposed toward violence and hate


Do we know they are?

You seem to insist that because they are not equally represented based upon total population, that white hate crimes arent "really as bad" as black hate crimes in numbers. I find that laughable.


Now, if you and your buddies dont see an alarming trend here, its because you wish to wear a blind fold and ignore the reality.

There ARE more black victims that white.

There ARE more white attackers than black.

No amount of twisting the numbers into a general population is going to change that hard core fact. No amount of complaining that because there are less blacks in society means there are, naturally less hate crimes being committed by blacks, is ever going to stick. Trying to extrapolate that a larger poll would mean a proportionate rise in crime isnt provable. The fact that blacks commit more crimes almost across the board than whites would indicate that, if what you are asserting is true, they should also be committing more hate crimes than they are. The facts and reporting are not proving your point at all.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 277
RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 10:52:41 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

Take your 'eeeevil white people' shit and shove it.

K.


Laughs... I musta hit a nerve there, darlin

Sorry, its not being shoved anywhere. You keep trying to paint me as racist.. and it simply isnt working.

But thank you for the laugh.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 278
RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/4/2013 11:42:40 PM   
Rule


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FR

It is obviously racist to say that there are black people, for to say that there are black people and non-black people is to discriminate between people.

Therefore, since there are no black people, obviously no hate crimes can be committed against black people. Q.E.D.

_____________________________

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"You are sweet, kind, and ever so smart, Rule. You ALWAYS stretch my mind and make me think further than I might have on my own" - Duskypearls

Si vis pacem, para bellum.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
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RE: Bored in Oklahoma - 9/5/2013 12:39:06 AM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

The issue here is that some think that all crime that is black on white is racially motivated.


I disagree. All black on white crime isnt racially motivated. Just like all white on black crime isnt racially motivated.

You are arguing with Thompsox not me



_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 280
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