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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/19/2013 2:20:00 PM   
PeonForHer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Or they were just slapdash in writing the book. I've seen worse-written garbage in high school textbooks here.

Well it does seem slapdash enough. But their "summary" of the Second Amendment is on a par with listing Trayvon Washington as our first President.

K.


Well, it all seems a bit nutty to me, anyway. I've been reading about the demonstrations that the gun-fans in the USA are calling for about this particular translation/summary/interpretation/whogivesashit of the 2nd Amendment. I've never heard of an outcry here in the UK about any mistranslation of any historical document. Nobody cares. However, such arguments have never been about anything anywhere near as important as the matter of owning guns and the Christian warmth and love behind the desire to blow the living shit out of each other with bullets, admittedly.

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/19/2013 2:51:27 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Well, it all seems a bit nutty to me, anyway. I've been reading about the demonstrations that the gun-fans in the USA are calling for about this particular translation/summary/interpretation/whogivesashit of the 2nd Amendment. I've never heard of an outcry here in the UK about any mistranslation of any historical document. Nobody cares. However, such arguments have never been about anything anywhere near as important as the matter of owning guns and the Christian warmth and love behind the desire to blow the living shit out of each other with bullets, admittedly.

Not a day goes by that I don't mourn the cruel fate of not living in a Commonwealth realm. The shame associated with having to endure life in a country that doesn't rank near the top in rape, assault, and total crime is overwhelming. Pity me.

K.

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/19/2013 3:01:44 PM   
PeonForHer


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Status: offline 		I'm neither as gun-loving nor as spiritual as you are, K, which is probably why, no matter how hard I try, I just can't get how wise you are.

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/19/2013 3:04:09 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		But they correctly identified that ol Richie was buried in a parking lot. Anyone in America know where Nixon is buried without looking it up?

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/19/2013 3:08:09 PM   
hlen5


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Status: offline 		I will go look it up, but isn't he buried in Loma Linda, CA?

ETA: My bad, YORBA Linda, CA.

< Message edited by hlen5 -- 9/19/2013 3:09:42 PM >

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/19/2013 4:25:47 PM   
dcnovice


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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/19/2013 5:12:22 PM   
deathtothepixies


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Well, it all seems a bit nutty to me, anyway. I've been reading about the demonstrations that the gun-fans in the USA are calling for about this particular translation/summary/interpretation/whogivesashit of the 2nd Amendment. I've never heard of an outcry here in the UK about any mistranslation of any historical document. Nobody cares. However, such arguments have never been about anything anywhere near as important as the matter of owning guns and the Christian warmth and love behind the desire to blow the living shit out of each other with bullets, admittedly.

Not a day goes by that I don't mourn the cruel fate of not living in a Commonwealth realm. The shame associated with having to endure life in a country that doesn't rank near the top in rape, assault, and total crime is overwhelming. Pity me.

K.


Nationmaster.com seems like an accurate source for data.....

they claim...
top country, total rapes in France 10,277
total rapes in US 30.2 (not a typo)

Top country,total murders in Turkey 13,242
last on the list Malta 1
US would seem to be below Malta with less than 1

assaults(per100,000)
7th USA 786.7
Last Pakistan 0.1
UK apparently below that too

burglaries(per100,000)

USA 14th 714.4 way below those bastards in Denmark, Sweden and Austria
last in the list El Salvador with 0, or none, or zero.
UK not on the list

so as I said really accurate that Nationmaster stuff.

cherry pick away to your hearts content or get back on topic, your choice

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/19/2013 6:40:27 PM   
Kirata


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Your comment poses a problem for me. My post had links. Your post doesn't. What to do? Gee, that's a tough one. I'll have to think about it. Gimme some time?

K.

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/19/2013 7:46:30 PM   
dcnovice


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Given the many and varied challenges confronting education in the U.S., it's fascinating to see folks' priorities.

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it's never enough to keep up.

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/19/2013 8:29:11 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

Given the many and varied challenges confronting education in the U.S., it's fascinating to see folks' priorities.

Silly to bother with matters of truth and accuracy, I know, but I'm quirky like that.

K.





< Message edited by Kirata -- 9/19/2013 8:33:15 PM >

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/20/2013 5:59:38 AM   
dcnovice


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quote:

Silly to bother with matters of truth and accuracy, I know, but I'm quirky like that.

Of course. And I didn't mean to besmirch your quest for truth.

It's just that battles rage over how textbooks and teachers should cover evolution, Earth's origins, environmental issues (particularly the effects of fossil fuels), the beliefs of the Framers, sexuality (particularly orientation), and more.

Then there are the mammoth challenges of equipping kids to be literate, numerate, and adept at navigating an increasingly complex world.

Against that backdrop, zeroing in on a single sentence in a single study guide does seem a bit--well, let's just stick with "quirky."


_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/20/2013 8:13:53 AM   
Nosathro


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From: Orange County, California
Status: offline 		NationMaster.com is a right wing site that prints false claims including what has been reported here, talk about truth and honesty. If we are discussing the 2nd Amendment how about the real reason for it.

http://truth-out.org/news/item/13890-the-second-amendment-was-ratified-to-preserve-slavery

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/20/2013 8:23:16 AM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

It's just that battles rage over how textbooks and teachers should cover evolution, Earth's origins, environmental issues (particularly the effects of fossil fuels), the beliefs of the Framers, sexuality (particularly orientation), and more.

Then there are the mammoth challenges of equipping kids to be literate, numerate, and adept at navigating an increasingly complex world.

Against that backdrop, zeroing in on a single sentence in a single study guide does seem a bit--well, let's just stick with "quirky."

Well I'm not missing your point, and my occasional contemplations of the problems we face in education cover much the same ground as yours. But this surprised and shocked me. Granted we have a lot to do to improve education, it never occurred to me that we might need to start at the freaking bottom with something as basic and obvious as truthful and accurate textbooks. Granted different historians may lay weight on different elements of a historical record (my lecture notes in school went on for page after page). But as I mentioned here, this particular instance strikes me as nothing short of either gross incompetence or outright misrepresentation.

K.

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/20/2013 8:38:45 AM   
JeffBC


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gauge
So this is a government conspiracy of disinformation in order to dumb down our young people so they are subservient and ignorant of their rights? That is a bit of a reach.

Really? Given all the blatant propaganda and outright misinformation in US textbooks it's hard to see why this particular thing beggars your imagination.

On the overall point:

I agree the "summarization" is just flat out wrong rather than a "pared down summary"
I'm unclear on why you'd need to summarize something so short to start with.
At a bare minimum it's incompetent editing.

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/20/2013 10:40:14 AM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

NationMaster.com is a right wing site that prints false claims including what has been reported here, talk about truth and honesty. If we are discussing the 2nd Amendment how about the real reason for it.

http://truth-out.org/news/item/13890-the-second-amendment-was-ratified-to-preserve-slavery

Anti American site who's name has as much validity as Tass, for those who remember it.

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People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/20/2013 10:59:13 AM   
Phydeaux


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

NationMaster.com is a right wing site that prints false claims including what has been reported here, talk about truth and honesty. If we are discussing the 2nd Amendment how about the real reason for it.

http://truth-out.org/news/item/13890-the-second-amendment-was-ratified-to-preserve-slavery


Lets see - "nationmaster" - yeah there's a creditable site. Billing itself as a what.. oh yeah.. progressive website. Not a single scholarly quote as far as a quick read revealed.

You might as well have quoted the back of a Captain Crunch box.

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/20/2013 1:13:25 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffBC

Really? Given all the blatant propaganda and outright misinformation in US textbooks it's hard to see why this particular thing beggars your imagination.

It just happened to come to my attention. I don't spend my life reviewing high school textbooks for accuracy.

K.

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/20/2013 1:26:06 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

NationMaster.com is a right wing site that prints false claims including what has been reported here, talk about truth and honesty. If we are discussing the 2nd Amendment how about the real reason for it.

http://truth-out.org/news/item/13890-the-second-amendment-was-ratified-to-preserve-slavery

Anti American site who's name has as much validity as Tass, for those who remember it.

I especially liked the part about Nationmaster being a "right-wing" website that publishes "false claims". The source for the data was the United Nations Interregional Crime and Justice Research Institute. Another notorious right-wing front. Snick.

K.

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/20/2013 4:19:32 PM   
deathtothepixies


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


Your comment poses a problem for me. My post had links. Your post doesn't. What to do? Gee, that's a tough one. I'll have to think about it. Gimme some time?

K.


When I clicked on your links and had a look around I was as surprised as a man who had been slapped round the face by a wet fish, a red herring possibly.
So here are your links K, after all I wouldn't want anyone to accuse me of, what's the phrase? Oh yeah, making shit up.

this one is rapes per 100,000


http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rap-crime-rapes

Apparently more than 1 in 10 people in France were raped in 2009, 10,227 out of 100,000 The UK does not appear in this list, I guess because we were below Pakistan who had 0 out of 100,000 people raped

next total murders


http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur-crime-murders

According to nationmaster Turkey leads the way with a total number of murders of 13424, which is over 6 times higher than the next country.

and as for burglaries,


http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_bur-crime-burglaries

America has half the number of burglaries than that well known criminal hotbed Denmark, but then again you are 35 times more likely to be burgled in America than the safe haven of Mexico. It turns out that you are , amazingly, 66 times more likely to be burgled in Denmark than Mexico, who knew? The UK was not on this list as it only went down as far as Pakistan with a burglary rate of 0.1 per 100,000.


If you are going to allow yourself to be side tracked by a little snipe from a UK poster do you not think you could find a better source to refute him than this incomplete, bizarre and contradictory bag of shite?

So as you said, my comment does indeed pose a problem for you as it exposes yet again how you are prepared to use ridiculously inaccurate sources to make your point

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RE: Teaching Our Children - 9/20/2013 5:21:16 PM   
dcnovice


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Some interesting food for thought:

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/comment/2012/12/jeffrey-toobin-second-amendment.html


_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to deathtothepixies)
Profile   Post #: 60
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