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MrRodgers - the unfortunate reality is that your post did not extol the virtues of a Democrat

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One of the reasons I want to see a third party become mainstream is that a "Dems are bad" or "Reps are bad"

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ORIGINAL: DsBound

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: DsBound

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: DOM68005

People in power just don't want to remember history. Lincoln's Republicans were breakaway Democrats.
Nixon as a Republican like the Democrats before him believed the Government could do no wrong.
In that era, the Democrats held such power, they had to have runoff elections to see whose name to put on the primary and runoff ballots. Some Democrats became so unhappy, just broke away and took over the Republican party in the Dixie south and Texas after Kennedy was elected.
Regan ... A lifelong Democrat and union leader jumped ship when some spineless Republicans were so determined to brand the White House with the big R, they put his face forward. Regan was a paid actor and not much use.
The Bush family may have been Texas Republicans, but many of the acts blamed on them were foisted on the country by the Democrats in Congress with their help.

My point is simple, you can't blame one side for the SNAFU way this country is operating when the powers that be are spending all their resources shining a bad light on their opponents rather than working on the country's needs.
Both sides from the long term perspective are so concerned about buying votes, so called conservatives are just trying to preserve standards of the Democrats of the mid-1900s.

When I see a ballot, most of the possible candidates are standing on Democrat principles Finding a valid Republican is like trying to find a brand new Hudson. They don't make them any more.

Oh yes I can blame one side when it obvious after their policies and numbers what those policies produced vis-a-vis debt and the economy. Funny how dems could 'foist' things on Bush but now the repubs aren't 'foisting' things on Obama.

Dems did whatever they did and Bush I signed on, with votes but the repubs now can't get the votes so refuse to raise the debt limit as they have 23 time in 33 years to date since Reagan and need to resort to extortion and shutting down the govt.

I'll say again, in so many words...I haven't the slightest idea why anyone would vote repub.

Wow. I don't see how it fits into extortion... anymore than mandating citizens to purchase goods or services. With that said, they werent asking for it to be gone, just equality. You know like the mandate pushed out for one year, like Obamas big business donators get???

The repubs don't have the votes period. So if they are a patriot American, patriots don't use the extortion of default and shut down the govt, like the petty little power barons the repubs are, to get your way...without those votes.

The mandate if one has been paying attention, was upheld by the courts. That ends any battle over it being law. They are sworn to uphold the laws of the country. Now it is time to raise the debt limit as I've said like they did when it suited them 23 times since 81 and come back and try to get the votes.

So you're saying, condoning perhaps, Obama's investors are above the law?

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ORIGINAL: DsBound

You see what I'm saying right? Insurance companies, unions, donators... they all got a waiver for a year (if not more) reprieve. We, the tax payers deserve the same thing!

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: BitYakin

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

Here's another image floating around out there. GOP "Conservatism" and the myth that the GOP is great for the economy and business is a lie. The numbers don't lie and no...no links to any sources because most partisans the just go after the messenger.

• Under Reagan and Bush Sr.: $3.4 Trillion increase in the debt.

• Under George W. Bush: $6.1 Trillion

• Total: $9.5 Trillion. (not counting interest)

• Interest on Reagan-Bush debt under Clinton: $2.2 trillion.

• Interest on $11.7 trillion after G. W. Bush: $3 trillion

• Grand Total Reagan/Bush/Bush Debt: $12 trillion (as of Sept. 30, 2010).

Reagan/Bush/Bush all deficit spent during good years, which has now made it unpalatable to deficit spend in a period when it is appropriate for governments to deficit spend. The Republican Presidents' reckless deficit spending condemned us to an extended Great Recession.

The GOP leaders know exactly what would happen to the economy if we all of a sudden "balanced the budget." The US would go into a tailspin we could never pull out of. Obama is damned by the GOP regardless of the path he takes.

This is all on the GOP. Here's more image:

Personal disposable income has grown nearly 6 times more under Democratic presidents.

Gross Domestic Product (GDP) has grown 7 times more under Democratic presidents

Corporate profits have grown over 16% more per year under Democratic presidents (they actually declined under Republicans by an average of 4.53%/year)

Average annual compound return on the stock market has been 18 times greater under Democratic presidents (If you invested $100k for 40 years of Republican administrations you had $126k at the end, if you invested $100k for 40 years of Democrat administrations you had $3.9M at the end)

Republican presidents added 2.5 times more to the national debt than Democratic presidents.

The two times the economy steered into the ditch (Great Depression and Great Recession) were during Republican, laissez faire administrations

yeah lets ignore this lil detail, the fact that every single pres except ONE since the beginning of the country has run deficits...

now have the numbers gone crazy, yes of course they have but then once upon a time a loaf of bread was a nickel too!


09/30/2008 10,024,724,896,912.49
09/30/2000 5,674,178,209,886.86
4.350,xxx,xxx,xxx.xx


http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/pd/histdebt/histdebt_histo5.htm

not sure where you got 9.5 trillion, but acording to the treasury dept bush2's debt was 4.35 trillion

go ahead and shoot the messanger its the treasury dept!

09/30/2009 11,909,829,003,511.75
09/30/1999 5,656,270,901,615.43
6,253,xxx,xxx,xxx.xx

even if we start in 1999 and go threw 2009 it still doesn't come to 9.5

The $9.5 trillion you speak of is the total debt of Reagan and Bush I so that was before Clinton's first year of 1993.

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: BitYakin

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

Here's another image floating around out there. GOP "Conservatism" and the myth that the GOP is great for the economy and business is a lie. The numbers don't lie and no...no links to any sources because most partisans the just go after the messenger.

• Under Reagan and Bush Sr.: $3.4 Trillion increase in the debt.

• Under George W. Bush: $6.1 Trillion

• Total: $9.5 Trillion. (not counting interest)

• Interest on Reagan-Bush debt under Clinton: $2.2 trillion.

• Interest on $11.7 trillion after G. W. Bush: $3 trillion

• Grand Total Reagan/Bush/Bush Debt: $12 trillion (as of Sept. 30, 2010).

Reagan/Bush/Bush all deficit spent during good years, which has now made it unpalatable to deficit spend in a period when it is appropriate for governments to deficit spend. The Republican Presidents' reckless deficit spending condemned us to an extended Great Recession.

The GOP leaders know exactly what would happen to the economy if we all of a sudden "balanced the budget." The US would go into a tailspin we could never pull out of. Obama is damned by the GOP regardless of the path he takes.

This is all on the GOP. Here's more image:

Personal disposable income has grown nearly 6 times more under Democratic presidents.

Gross Domestic Product (GDP) has grown 7 times more under Democratic presidents

Corporate profits have grown over 16% more per year under Democratic presidents (they actually declined under Republicans by an average of 4.53%/year)

Average annual compound return on the stock market has been 18 times greater under Democratic presidents (If you invested $100k for 40 years of Republican administrations you had $126k at the end, if you invested $100k for 40 years of Democrat administrations you had $3.9M at the end)

Republican presidents added 2.5 times more to the national debt than Democratic presidents.

The two times the economy steered into the ditch (Great Depression and Great Recession) were during Republican, laissez faire administrations

yeah lets ignore this lil detail, the fact that every single pres except ONE since the beginning of the country has run deficits...

now have the numbers gone crazy, yes of course they have but then once upon a time a loaf of bread was a nickel too!


09/30/2008 10,024,724,896,912.49
09/30/2000 5,674,178,209,886.86
4.350,xxx,xxx,xxx.xx


http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/pd/histdebt/histdebt_histo5.htm

not sure where you got 9.5 trillion, but acording to the treasury dept bush2's debt was 4.35 trillion

go ahead and shoot the messanger its the treasury dept!

09/30/2009 11,909,829,003,511.75
09/30/1999 5,656,270,901,615.43
6,253,xxx,xxx,xxx.xx

even if we start in 1999 and go threw 2009 it still doesn't come to 9.5

The $9.5 trillion you speak of is the total debt of Reagan and Bush I so that was before Clinton's first year of 1993.

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ORIGINAL: ropeknotgag

the reps just shut it down because its not paid for, the same rules apply to us so why not the govt ?

I would vote dem like I did in my youth but I just cant afford the taxes and failed social programs anymore

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ORIGINAL: DsBound

MrR...
When discussing stuff like this with a party loyalist, like yourself, its difficult. You are blind to the facr that its BOTH parties. You talk about how much debt previous presidents have... Obama has doubled that! LOL!!! Between him and Boner, they think its skies the limit. I know its difficult for you to grasp... but your views represent party above principle. Its insane!

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ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Why voting for democrats is *insane*:

1. The country is going broke. And at leasta the repubs have given lipservice to the idea of a balanced budget, and pushed the idea of sequestration. You don't like it. I love it.
2. Nationalization. Dems think government programs are the answer to everything - whether its the new consumer credit agency, taking over educational loans from private vendors, nationalizing home mortgage lending, obamacare. Dept of Homeland security: you know where they took ununionized airport screeners and made them unionized govt employees - contributing to.. you guessed it: democrats.
3. Obamacare.
4. Illegal immegration. Dems want to ensure political hegemony by allowing illegal immigration.
5. Illegal voting. We don't like it when Dem's let illegals vote. We don't like it when dead people vote.
6. Cronyism. Terry Macauliffe was clintons ax man. Now running for governor. Anthony wiener. Funded by clinton supporters. ..Aren't you tired of dynasties? AT GM: Bailing out the union's pension while bankrupting management's pension.
7. Labor laws. Teachers unions in education are producing higher wages for teachers - and terrible teaching results. Education is dumbed down 4 grade levels since the 50s.
8. Higher taxes. Half the country pays no fed taxes. Idiotic. And 50% (where it soon will go) is too much taxes. JFK (democrat) said the same in his state of the union speech.
9. Gun Control. Its a constitution right. Keep your hands off our guns.
10. Pigford v. Glickman.
11. Community redevelopment act of 1993.
12. EPA regs shutting down coal as a power source.
13. Benghazi. Where Obama lied for political advantage.
14. Use of the IRS as a political tool.
15. NSA bugging of all american voice traffic. 10,000's of cases of abuse.
16. Tapping of journalists.
17. Unconstitutional appointments



I could continue forever, but whats the point...

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Why voting for democrats is *insane*:

1. The country is going broke. And at leasta the repubs have given lipservice to the idea of a balanced budget, and pushed the idea of sequestration. You don't like it. I love it.
2. Nationalization. Dems think government programs are the answer to everything - whether its the new consumer credit agency, taking over educational loans from private vendors, nationalizing home mortgage lending, obamacare. Dept of Homeland security: you know where they took ununionized airport screeners and made them unionized govt employees - contributing to.. you guessed it: democrats.
3. Obamacare.
4. Illegal immegration. Dems want to ensure political hegemony by allowing illegal immigration.
5. Illegal voting. We don't like it when Dem's let illegals vote. We don't like it when dead people vote.
6. Cronyism. Terry Macauliffe was clintons ax man. Now running for governor. Anthony wiener. Funded by clinton supporters. ..Aren't you tired of dynasties? AT GM: Bailing out the union's pension while bankrupting management's pension.
7. Labor laws. Teachers unions in education are producing higher wages for teachers - and terrible teaching results. Education is dumbed down 4 grade levels since the 50s.
8. Higher taxes. Half the country pays no fed taxes. Idiotic. And 50% (where it soon will go) is too much taxes. JFK (democrat) said the same in his state of the union speech.
9. Gun Control. Its a constitution right. Keep your hands off our guns.
10. Pigford v. Glickman.
11. Community redevelopment act of 1993.
12. EPA regs shutting down coal as a power source.
13. Benghazi. Where Obama lied for political advantage.
14. Use of the IRS as a political tool.
15. NSA bugging of all american voice traffic. 10,000's of cases of abuse.
16. Tapping of journalists.
17. Unconstitutional appointments



I could continue forever, but whats the point...

This is such unmitigated bullshit, it also ranks as a non-sequitur.

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ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Why voting for democrats is *insane*:

6. Cronyism. Terry Macauliffe was clintons ax man. Now running for governor. Anthony wiener. Funded by clinton supporters. ..Aren't you tired of dynasties? AT GM: Bailing out the union's pension while bankrupting management's pension.

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Why would anybody vote republican ?

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: DsBound

MrR...
When discussing stuff like this with a party loyalist, like yourself, its difficult. You are blind to the facr that its BOTH parties. You talk about how much debt previous presidents have... Obama has doubled that! LOL!!! Between him and Boner, they think its skies the limit. I know its difficult for you to grasp... but your views represent party above principle. Its insane!

I am an independent conservative, something you couldn't find in Wash., with a magnifying glass.

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ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

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ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Why voting for democrats is *insane*:

6. Cronyism. Terry Macauliffe was clintons ax man. Now running for governor. Anthony wiener. Funded by clinton supporters. ..Aren't you tired of dynasties? AT GM: Bailing out the union's pension while bankrupting management's pension.

Yep. I imagine US voters are somewhat tired of political dynasties. The Bush family political dynasty in particular. The rest of the world was so glad to be rid of that particular dynasty that Obama was awarded the Nobel Prize simply for not being Bush.

As for the rest of your reasons for not voting D, they are equally inane. I'm not a big fan of the Ds, but any political party anywhere that is so irresponsible that it is prepared to plunge the entire world into recession over reforms to a primitive healthcare system doesn't deserve any office of Govt other than the janitor's office.

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ORIGINAL: Phydeaux
Look, republicans offered a clean extension to the debt ceiling (What the democrats have been asking for all along.) The democrats turned it down.

So lets hear a little outrage about the democrats being irresponsible yadayadayada...