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church is it a building - 1/9/2014 2:56:23 AM   
bubbabarrett31


Posts: 24
Joined: 1/4/2014
Status: offline 		i comsider my self a christian. but every one tells me i need to go to church well my reply is i dont bilievein the actual "church" does this mean i am strayed from god?
wont god burden my heartif i am wrong about something?
please helpand giive me some advice on what you think i should do?
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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 3:21:33 AM   
TNDommeK


Posts: 7153
Joined: 3/13/2010
Status: offline 		No it doesn't. IMO having a relationship with God can happen anywhere. The bible tells us to congregate and fellowship in his name. But I feel being a Christian doesn't mean you HAVE TO go to church. Sometimes church is good for the soul, sometimes the pastor might talk about something that God wanted you to hear, or that your soul needed to hear.
But just bc you don't go doesn't mean you've strayed from God.

Pray, have a relationship with Him, and understand you aren't perfect. Everyone sins.

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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 3:47:40 AM   
eulero83


Posts: 1470
Joined: 11/4/2005
Status: offline 		depends on what kind of christian you are, if you are catholic it's mandatory for sure, if you are protetant I'm sure you can find a sentence in the bible that fits your needs.

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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 3:53:49 AM   
TieMeInKnottss


Posts: 1944
Joined: 9/6/2012
Status: offline 		I think a lot has to do with what religion you are and what you believe.

Some Religions a "church" is little more than an auditorium...in those I would say the religion is agreeing that God is everywhere and anywhere can be a house of God.

I am Catholic so I speak from that end... Church is a sacred building that contains the Eucharistic vault... God is everywhere BUT his Body is in His house and that is the church. Also, going to church is not about being in His presence but being present for the gathering of celebrating Him.

Now, understand I am not a GOOD Catholic... I miss church most weekends, BUT because of what I believe, I am committing a more "serious" sin by ignoring what I believe God expects of me

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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 3:54:05 AM   
Zonie63


Posts: 2826
Joined: 4/25/2011
From: The Old Pueblo
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bubbabarrett31

i comsider my self a christian. but every one tells me i need to go to church well my reply is i dont bilievein the actual "church" does this mean i am strayed from god?
wont god burden my heartif i am wrong about something?
please helpand giive me some advice on what you think i should do?


I would suggest that the best course of action is to not listen to or believe what other people say about "god." What do they know? How can anyone on this Earth possibly know whether there even is a "God," let alone know what "He" thinks or who has strayed from the "True Path"?

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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 4:19:56 AM   
kiwisub12


Posts: 4742
Joined: 1/11/2006
Status: offline 		The way I feel about God and religion is that God is up there, and the church is what man constructed to try to get a grip on HIM/HER. Obviously I don't believe god is a man - or a woman for that matter. I think he is more than gender.

I also think that humans minimize anything they don't understand, and god isn't exempt from that process - which is why I don't believe that god can love us as a parent, and still condemn us to hell. Heck, as unmaternal as I am, I wouldn't do that to one of my kids. I would still love them no matter what, and while I wouldn't condone some things, I would have an out from hell card for them.

Being Catholic means I go to church every Sunday - but I don't believe the church has the final word on what god wants. I honestly don't see why god would give a flying flip about wheither or not I go to church regularly. I think that the bible and most of what we do in the name of god is filtered through the society and the times of when the rules were enacted and enforced. For example when the bible says that women can't be priests, you have to look at the time when it was written - as in, women were only valued as possessions. Is it even possible for someone in that sort of time consider that women would have value more than that in the future?

I joke that as a catholic woman, that my place in the church, while the priest and deacon are on the alter doing their thing, is on the floor of the church- scrubbing it. Do I think that is what I'm worth? Obviously not = but any church that teaches that isn't getting my full hearted support. I go because I hear things and get support from the congregation and priest, but I use intelligent listening, I don't take anything for granted. And I don't assume that just because someone has a penis makes them superior to me.

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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 5:26:54 AM   
GotSteel


Posts: 5871
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Status: offline 		Wait, didn't you just start a thread askking if religion was designed as a tool to control knowledge?

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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 5:55:33 AM   
Zonie63


Posts: 2826
Joined: 4/25/2011
From: The Old Pueblo
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kiwisub12
Being Catholic means I go to church every Sunday - but I don't believe the church has the final word on what god wants. I honestly don't see why god would give a flying flip about wheither or not I go to church regularly. I think that the bible and most of what we do in the name of god is filtered through the society and the times of when the rules were enacted and enforced. For example when the bible says that women can't be priests, you have to look at the time when it was written - as in, women were only valued as possessions. Is it even possible for someone in that sort of time consider that women would have value more than that in the future?


I used to be Catholic myself. I sometimes jokingly refer to myself as a "Recovering Catholic." I started having my doubts even as a little kid when I asked where holy water comes from. I also wondered about the taste and nutritional content of the "Body of Christ." They thought I was being a smartass, although that wasn't really true. I really wanted to know the "Great Mystery" - but nobody really seemed to have any real answers. At the end of the day when the light is off and the door is shut, nobody really knows.

I identify as agnostic these days, but it's not necessarily an automatic thing for me. It's something I still think about and wonder about. Even if I did believe in some sort of supernatural higher power, there's also the matter of which religion to go along with. It was kind of weird for me personally, since there were a lot of people in my extended family who were Protestants, and a few of them didn't seem to like Catholics so much. I felt like if I chose one or the other religion, I might be viewed as picking the "wrong" religion. It almost feels like Russian Roulette: "If you pick our religion, you'll go to Heaven, but if you pick their religion, you'll go to Hell." That kind of choice was just too much pressure; I couldn't take it, so I just chucked the whole thing. I think my early Catholic upbringing might have ingrained that in me; I'm not sure.

Some churches might be okay, although I always tend to be guarded and wary of those who tell others that they should go to church or make claims that they know something that no human being could possibly know. The religionists can't make any claims to special knowledge, since they can't seem to agree on even the simplest things. They split off and form their own religions, saying that theirs is the "true" faith and all the others are heretics. History has recorded numerous wars caused by these kind of disagreements.

If there ever was any "Great Truth" revealed to humanity, the Church probably would have buried it or burned it centuries ago.

(in reply to kiwisub12)
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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 6:16:29 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bubbabarrett31
i comsider my self a christian. but every one tells me i need to go to church well my reply is i dont bilievein the actual "church" does this mean i am strayed from god?
wont god burden my heartif i am wrong about something?
please helpand giive me some advice on what you think i should do?


Here's the way I look at it:

Being in a Christian church doesn't make you a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes you a car.

There are enough people that actually do attend church that don't live by their religion outside of church.

Personally, isn't it better to demonstrate your belief system to those who don't believe than to those who do?


_____________________________

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  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
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  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 6:25:25 AM   
SlipSlidingAway


Posts: 223
Joined: 11/24/2006
Status: offline 		Christianity has mostly evolved to include a church building, a hierarchy, and the belief that a relationship with God comes about from communal worship.

However, there were people in the earliest movements of Christianity, the gnostics, who believed that what really mattered was having a personal relationship with God. There were even Gnostic Gospels to spread this message.

However, gnosticism was dangerous to the organized church and most of those gospels were kept from the masses. Some date back just as far as the gospels in the Bible.


_____________________________

"...ethical behavior should be based...on sympathy, education, and social ties; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death. " —Albert Einstein

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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 6:25:29 AM   
MsMJAY


Posts: 515
Joined: 3/17/2013
Status: offline 		The actual church is every person who believes. You don't have to go to a building to connect with God and God will not burden your heart if you are wrong about something. You are only burdened by something you already know in your own heart is wrong. If you do not believe it is wrong it won't bother you and God will not bother you about it.

All that being said, you don't have to go to church, but its still not a bad idea to do so. If you want to go- go. If you don't want to- don't.



quote:

ORIGINAL: bubbabarrett31

i comsider my self a christian. but every one tells me i need to go to church well my reply is i dont bilievein the actual "church" does this mean i am strayed from god?
wont god burden my heartif i am wrong about something?
please helpand giive me some advice on what you think i should do?



(in reply to bubbabarrett31)
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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 9:02:44 AM   
EdBowie


Posts: 875
Joined: 8/11/2013
Status: offline 		Read George Fox.



quote:

ORIGINAL: bubbabarrett31

i comsider my self a christian. but every one tells me i need to go to church well my reply is i dont bilievein the actual "church" does this mean i am strayed from god?
wont god burden my heartif i am wrong about something?
please helpand giive me some advice on what you think i should do?




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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 9:06:59 AM   
MasterCaneman


Posts: 3842
Joined: 3/21/2013
Status: offline 		I just don't like getting up on Sunday mornings.

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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 9:27:20 AM   
Phoenixpower


Posts: 8098
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Being in a Christian church doesn't make you a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes you a car.

There are enough people that actually do attend church that don't live by their religion outside of church.

Personally, isn't it better to demonstrate your belief system to those who don't believe than to those who do?


This!!!

Funnily I was actually asked the same question at an interview in Hamburg on Monday...and I was never asked it in the way this guy did...

Now...down south, where I am living now, being part of a church is a big thing in my working field (unfortunately...cause I am keen on changing from catholic to protestant but buy doing so I can shut a shit load of employment doors, annoyingly...)

up north...it doesnt matter so much...

His organisation is not church based, because of which his question irritated me a bit as I simply did not expect it from him....all I can guess, is, that he asked, as the work was about working with minor asylum seekers and maybe (just a maybe) some faith can set bad behaviour off from some of them...depending on their background...

So I told him the truth, that I am catholic on paper but am not a church goer....therefore I do believe in God, but I do that my way and not the way how church want me to do it...

Now...down south I would not quite say i that way...lol...but in his case I could dare to do so...and thats my true opinion...

I am a lot against the catholic church and hate paying church taxes towards them (dont mind the taxes, hence why I would swap to the protestant one and not leave the church completely) but nevertheless I do believe in God, but IMO that does not mean, that I have to attend their exaggarated buildings...




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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 9:39:29 AM   
kalikshama


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quote:

i comsider my self a christian. but every one tells me i need to go to church well my reply is i dont bilievein the actual "church" does this mean i am strayed from god?


How do you express your Christianity outside of church?

(in reply to bubbabarrett31)
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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 11:44:08 AM   
sloguy02246


Posts: 534
Joined: 11/5/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

Here's the way I look at it:

Personally, isn't it better to demonstrate your belief system to those who don't believe than to those who do?




Agreed - and thus the oft-quoted phrase, "Preaching to the choir."

And attending any specific church does not necessarily mean you adhere to all the tenets of that faith.
E.g.: How many Roman Catholics attend Mass each week and also practice birth control?
More important to have a relationship with God first, then decide whether you need to attend a church to demonstrate your acceptance of Him to others.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 1:13:46 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bubbabarrett31

i comsider my self a christian. but every one tells me i need to go to church well my reply is i dont bilievein the actual "church" does this mean i am strayed from god?
wont god burden my heartif i am wrong about something?
please helpand giive me some advice on what you think i should do?



Fuck 'em.

My (then) wife and I attended a very nice, small baptist church in our town for years. The singing was atrocious, the attendance was small (maybe 80 people), but they were "real"....no Super Churches for JJ....and whenever there was a need, I wrote a check because very few people in this church had much more than enough to pay for gas.

We attended nearly every Sunday, sat in the front, knew everyone, socialized with a few of them, I was personal friends with the Pastor and he was over at the house one day after about 4 or so years and said "So, how come you haven't signed on as 'church members'?" to which I said "I already am a church member"....he then explained to me I wasn't until I signed a document affirming same and that if I sign (some silly document that essentially said "you are now a church member" and attend some equally silly "commitment ceremony" and have it witnessed by several "members") that we could have our photo in the church directory, along with our phone number.

I explained to him that a) Nowhere in the Bible does it mandate that I sign anything to prove my beliefs or desires to anyone other than God, have the signing process witnessed, or be written down in a directory, b) Since everyone had a fairly good idea of what my wife and I looked like, I didn't see any value in having our photos published in a directory and c) If anyone needed my phone number, they could ask me or....several others in the church hierarchy that had it in their files and finally d) if I needed to do any or all of the above to be considered a "member", then I was just fine being known as an attendee.

This went on and on during various indiscriminate occasions (bake sales, painting projects etc.)....someone from within the upper church would sidle up to me and try a different angle on the thing, whereupon I gave my standard speech, and one day about 7 or so years in to our attendance, the Pastor came up to me after church one day and asked if I could stop by later that afternoon for a meeting about this and that....I said "sure", knowing that the subject matter they were going to discuss I happened to have some expertise in and...at the allotted time I arrived, sat down in the front....about 8 of us including the Pastor....I just sat there quietly while they discussed what they needed to discuss, got asked a few opinions on the subject at hand, took it all in and then they said "okay...let's put it to a vote".

They all voted and then said "so....what's your opinion JJ?"....I said "I'm not a member...my vote doesn't count"....the Pastor stood up and said..."as far as anyone here is concerned, you are a member".

So....even in churches, eventually people can think logically and drop silly pretense that is at best, meaningless.

That was the long way around of answering your question Bubba.

Here's the answer: Fuck 'em.

Stand by what you believe in.

There's only one person who has to live your life....and it ain't any of them.

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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 1:50:00 PM   
FelineRanger


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

There are enough people that actually do attend church that don't live by their religion outside of church.


This is the discovery that I made at about 14 or 15 that began my departure from the church and synagogue. Church is presented as home to God's love and is supposed to be led by an individual who is the representation of that love in human form. But even at that young age, I knew people were far from perfect and not everybody was going to get along. What I didn't expect to see was that everyone involved in running that church was more concerned about their own personal political power and gain. The priest himself used one of the vestry members as a hatchet man and, much like NJ governor Chris Christie did today, claimed to be "shocked and appalled" by the actions taken by that vestryman. Debates in that church and every one I have seen since had nothing to do with serving the surrounding community and everything to do with one person aggrandizing themselves at the expense of another. I decided then that I wanted nothing to do with God or His house if these were his representatives. I'm much happier as an atheist.

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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 2:03:58 PM   
Phydeaux


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Joined: 1/4/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bubbabarrett31

i comsider my self a christian. but every one tells me i need to go to church well my reply is i dont bilievein the actual "church" does this mean i am strayed from god?
wont god burden my heartif i am wrong about something?
please helpand giive me some advice on what you think i should do?



In more than thirty years I can count the number of times I have not gone to church.
Church is not a building.

The catholic church teaches that you go to church weekly and it has reasons for the teaching.

First, because it is a requirement from god to honor the Sabbath. Going to church is a start at fulfilling that - and a reminder that we are to.

Second - there is a saying that our thoughts become our words, our words become our actions, our actions become our habits, our habits become our character. By attending church you are inculcating a habit of discipline and obedience to god. You are also affording yourself the opportunity to become more involved in the message of Christ, and the various ministries of the church.

You can't hear the message - if you're not listening. And you can't hear about the needs and projects of the community if you don't know about them. There is a world of Christianity far beyond merely attending.

The bible says it well - "we die alone for on its own each ember loses fire, yet joined as one the flame lives on to give warmth and light and to inspire."

(in reply to bubbabarrett31)
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RE: church is it a building - 1/9/2014 2:08:52 PM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

Being in a Christian church doesn't make you a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes you a car.

There are enough people that actually do attend church that don't live by their religion outside of church.

Personally, isn't it better to demonstrate your belief system to those who don't believe than to those who do?


I agree with all three of your points and have some followup questions - what does make one a Christian and what is the (or your) Christian belief system?

Here's a fun quiz which accurately identified my beliefs as Unitarian Universalist:

Which Christian belief system do you belong in?
http://www.selectsmart.com/plus/select.php?url=beliefsystem

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 20
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