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ORIGINAL: dcnovice

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You pay your tuition you get an student Id.
You need a background check to get a permit.

Are you now arguing that a background check should be a voting requirement?

Otherwise, what does it matter so long as each type of ID does the job of establishing the person's identity?

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With a student ID they do not.

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ORIGINAL: dcnovice

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With a student ID they do not.

How do we know that, especially given the number and variety of U.S. colleges?

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Then you will agree ...

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How can you argue with anyone who makes firm conclusions contrary to the hard evidence?

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ORIGINAL: dcnovice

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If the folks against this idea had put the same energy and time into getting everyone in the country an ID card that they put into crying about how unfair it is, the problem would be solved.

A few thoughts:

(a) This has nothing to do with the point I made.
Nope, it was just a thought I had.


(b) Why should the burden of providing IDs fall on those who oppose voter-disenfranchisement efforts? Isn't it up to those agitating for ID requirements to find a way to provide them without effectively creating poll taxes?
If people are honestly concerned with making sure everyone can vote and not just trying to score points off the other side it wouldn't matter who should be responsible for getting id's to every voter. People need id's to do all kinds of things, not just for voting. What is so terrible about trying to make sure they have one?

(c) Were MLK & co. "crying about how unfair it is" when they opposed discrimination?
No they were not but that has nothing to do with the topic or my post so I am not sure why you even brought it up.

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(a) This has nothing to do with the point I made.
Nope, it was just a thought I had.

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(b) Why should the burden of providing IDs fall on those who oppose voter-disenfranchisement efforts? Isn't it up to those agitating for ID requirements to find a way to provide them without effectively creating poll taxes?
If people are honestly concerned with making sure everyone can vote and not just trying to score points off the other side it wouldn't matter who should be responsible for getting id's to every voter. People need id's to do all kinds of things, not just for voting. What is so terrible about trying to make sure they have one?

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(c) Were MLK & co. "crying about how unfair it is" when they opposed discrimination?
No they were not but that has nothing to do with the topic or my post so I am not sure why you even brought it up.

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ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Gee when I registered to vote, I had forgotten my wallet, but they registered me. Now when I go vote, I have to show my ID so I can vote. That law is pretty new, 1965 I think.

You cant register for any kind of assistance without valid ID, and that law goes back to the 70's.

Under the law passed by Bush, you have to have three forms of ID, one a photo ID, to get a driver's license or state ID.

So would someone please explain to me what the fuck is wrong with requiring a valid ID to register to vote? You need an ID to get a job (federal law for god knows how long, I know I needed a valid ID to get a job as a teenager,) get state and federal assistance, and god knows how many other programs.

It dont have to be a driver's license, but state or federally issued ID.

First the GOP screams voter fraud, then the Dems scream voter fraud, and god knows that both parties have pulled some really neat tricks with elections over the years, and now someone is having a shit fit over something that would prevent voter fraud?

Now I dare you people tell me that humanity is not getting more fucking stupid with each generation.

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ORIGINAL: dcnovice

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(a) This has nothing to do with the point I made.
Nope, it was just a thought I had.

Then why did you quote my post in your reply?

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(b) Why should the burden of providing IDs fall on those who oppose voter-disenfranchisement efforts? Isn't it up to those agitating for ID requirements to find a way to provide them without effectively creating poll taxes?
If people are honestly concerned with making sure everyone can vote and not just trying to score points off the other side it wouldn't matter who should be responsible for getting id's to every voter. People need id's to do all kinds of things, not just for voting. What is so terrible about trying to make sure they have one?

There's nothing "terrible" about helping folks get IDs, and if that had been the GOP's goal, I'd have supported it. But it does strike me as terrible to manipulate voting laws for partisan advantage. Ymmv, I realize.

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(c) Were MLK & co. "crying about how unfair it is" when they opposed discrimination?
No they were not but that has nothing to do with the topic or my post so I am not sure why you even brought it up.

I was curious about whether your dismissive words applied to other efforts to gain/maintain civil rights or just this one.

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ORIGINAL: BamaD

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ORIGINAL: dcnovice

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You pay your tuition you get an student Id.
You need a background check to get a permit.

Are you now arguing that a background check should be a voting requirement?

Otherwise, what does it matter so long as each type of ID does the job of establishing the person's identity?

No I was explaining that with a concealed carry permit they verify who you are before you get it.
With a student ID they do not.
This was in response to someone whining that in Texas a permit counts as voter ID and a student ID does not.
Basically we are saying the same thing but the student ID only verifies that you go to the school.
For example foreign students get the same ID as citizens.

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It struck me this morning that the "crisis" of voter fraud, requiring a wave of GOP-driven ID laws, is an article of faith, not reason. This thread is the voting-rights equivalent of debating a creationist.

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ORIGINAL: cloudboy


If you can't win the educated / student vote then.....

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ORIGINAL: DomKen

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ORIGINAL: BamaD

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ORIGINAL: dcnovice

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You pay your tuition you get an student Id.
You need a background check to get a permit.

Are you now arguing that a background check should be a voting requirement?

Otherwise, what does it matter so long as each type of ID does the job of establishing the person's identity?

No I was explaining that with a concealed carry permit they verify who you are before you get it.
With a student ID they do not.
This was in response to someone whining that in Texas a permit counts as voter ID and a student ID does not.
Basically we are saying the same thing but the student ID only verifies that you go to the school.
For example foreign students get the same ID as citizens.

When did you go to college? When I went I had to verify my identity just like I did when I got my driver's license. Anyone going to a public university and getting the in state resident tuition rate has to verify their residency status so their college ID should be good enough to let them vote.

Furthermore why not simply require whatever verification makes righties happy of at least public university ID's? How come that is not in any of these ID laws? Because these laws aren't about the integrity of the elections but disenfranchising people who don't vote Republican.

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ORIGINAL: BamaD

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ORIGINAL: DomKen

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ORIGINAL: BamaD

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ORIGINAL: dcnovice

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You pay your tuition you get an student Id.
You need a background check to get a permit.

Are you now arguing that a background check should be a voting requirement?

Otherwise, what does it matter so long as each type of ID does the job of establishing the person's identity?

No I was explaining that with a concealed carry permit they verify who you are before you get it.
With a student ID they do not.
This was in response to someone whining that in Texas a permit counts as voter ID and a student ID does not.
Basically we are saying the same thing but the student ID only verifies that you go to the school.
For example foreign students get the same ID as citizens.

When did you go to college? When I went I had to verify my identity just like I did when I got my driver's license. Anyone going to a public university and getting the in state resident tuition rate has to verify their residency status so their college ID should be good enough to let them vote.

Furthermore why not simply require whatever verification makes righties happy of at least public university ID's? How come that is not in any of these ID laws? Because these laws aren't about the integrity of the elections but disenfranchising people who don't vote Republican.

In the 70s and then again from 01-03
What designator did your college put on IDs for foreign students?

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ORIGINAL: dcnovice

FR

The student ID discussion raises a question I'm curious about. Are gun permits limited to U.S. citizens? How about drivers' licenses?