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RE: Obama Care - 3/24/2014 2:58:32 PM

papassion

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If we were told our car insurance companies will allow poor drivers in the high risk drivers pool, (analogy is pre-existing conditions pool) to pay the same rates as good drivers. Only a slow moron would believe that rates will then go DOWN.

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RE: Obama Care - 3/24/2014 4:07:34 PM

DesideriScuri

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quote:

ORIGINAL: papassion
If we were told our car insurance companies will allow poor drivers in the high risk drivers pool, (analogy is pre-existing conditions pool) to pay the same rates as good drivers. Only a slow moron would believe that rates will then go DOWN.

No, rates will go down when we subsidize those poor drivers premiums and group everyone into the same pool, dontchaknow?

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Post #: 142

RE: Obama Care - 3/24/2014 4:26:13 PM

DomKen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: papassion

If we were told our car insurance companies will allow poor drivers in the high risk drivers pool, (analogy is pre-existing conditions pool) to pay the same rates as good drivers. Only a slow moron would believe that rates will then go DOWN.

wrong analogy.

The correct analogy would be if there was a sizable fraction of the population driving without insurance, much larger than does now, because it was simply too expensive or the insurers refused to cover them for a variety of reasons and the rest of us paid very high premiums to cover the accidents caused by uninsured drivers. Then subsidizing insurance to get all those drivers insurance would serve to bring down everyone's rates by spreading the burden even if most of the newly insured were higher risks.

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RE: Obama Care - 3/25/2014 4:22:14 AM

Phydeaux

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Back a few months ago I said that Obamacare would likely mean that tens of millions of Americans would lose their health insurance.
Of course, to wide abuse by those that drink dimocratic coolaid.

But the news out today that, indeed I am right.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-kuttner/can-obamacare-catch-a-break_b_5019033.html

Now, however, comes one of the White House's own advisers who help craft the ACA -- saying not only won't many people get to keep their insurance but that Obamacare, over time, is likely to drive out employer-provided insurance altogether.

A democrat saying publicly what the CBO said back in July 2010.

The initial estimates when the employer mandated coverage kicks in is that some 80 million people will lose coverage.

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Post #: 144

RE: Obama Care - 3/25/2014 6:11:13 AM

mnottertail

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YAY!!!!! Its working!!!! We will have single payer national healthcare much sooner than I expected.

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Post #: 145

RE: Obama Care - 3/25/2014 6:54:28 AM

Owner59

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: papassion
If we were told our car insurance companies will allow poor drivers in the high risk drivers pool, (analogy is pre-existing conditions pool) to pay the same rates as good drivers. Only a slow moron would believe that rates will then go DOWN.

No, rates will go down when we subsidize those poor drivers premiums and group everyone into the same pool, dontchaknow?

Well,for the uniformed,some states do subsidize insurance pools for high risk, multi-accident drivers.

Whether the death panelists want to admit it or not,rates overall have been going down since the implementation of the ACA.We know these crack heads would be screaming in between hits that rates were going up.....

......if they were.....

While at the same time,millions and millions more Americans are now covered......many for the 1st time in there lives......

This is like a huge life-boat(literally) with 90% of the ship`s passengers high and dry and covered.

While 10% of the passengers are up to their necks in risk and trouble........often to their lives.

What the comfortable conservatives are doing is pointing to the people in the water and saying,"you swim or you sink........we`ll watch from here."

The newest gop tact is to ridicule the working poor,making it cool to dump them in the gutter and question their characters.

"A story too good to check: Paul Ryan and the tale of the brown paper bag"

This dim-wit gop leader not only made himself an ass for claiming parents who send their kid to school with a bagged lunch,love them more.......This cock-sucker republican leader made up a fake story to do it......

You can`t teach stupid like that......one must be born with it........

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2014/03/06/a-story-too-good-to-check-paul-ryan-and-the-story-of-the-brown-paper-bag/

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 3/25/2014 6:59:36 AM >

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Post #: 146

RE: Obama Care - 3/25/2014 7:09:50 AM

Owner59

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For my friends here like Mnottertail,Lucy,Butch,Musicalmystery and the other thinking,caring members......

Mitt Romney endorsing....full windedly, Israels socialized healthcare system.

Enjoy when mittens mentions that we pay 18% GDP on healthcare while Israel pays about 8%.......

.....and they are healthier....

.....or cry about it.....

"Whiplash-Mitt Romney Lavishes Praise On Israel's Socialist, Government Controlled Healthcare System"

"Speaking today to a small group of Israeli contributors to his campaign, the GOP presidential candidate—and supposed sworn enemy of government controlled healthcare—had kind words for the success of Israel’s healthcare system.

When our health care costs are completely out of control. Do you realize what health care spending is as a percentage of the GDP in Israel? 8 percent. You spend 8 percent of GDP on health care. And you’re a pretty healthy nation”

A healthy nation, indeed.

With a life-expectancy rate that is the 4th best in the world (the United States is 38th) and a reputation for delivering high-quality care to all of its citizens by utilizing the most advanced medical technology available in a hospital system we can only envy from afar, Governor Romney is right to be impressed with the Israelis’ ability to deliver excellent care while keeping spending down to 8 percent of GDP as compared to 18 percent here in the United States.

If only Romney’s appreciation of Israel’s success did not fly smack in the face of his constant, ideologically based rhetoric guaranteed to insure that only the wealthiest Americans get a taste of the healthcare Israelis receive as their birthright"

http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2012/07/30/whiplash-mitt-romney-lavishes-praise-on-israels-socialist-government-controlled-healthcare-system/

Though you won`t get an honest discussion here,this might help in the real world with your acquaintances and families.

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 3/25/2014 7:46:42 AM >

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RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 11:13:48 AM

Phydeaux

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And to counter the argument by joether that nasty republicans were the ones that compromised obamacare, here's Stenny Hoyer #2 democrat in the house saying, yes, indeed this is a Democrat bill.

http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/201654-hoyer-democrats-own-obamacare

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Post #: 148

RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 11:14:52 AM

thishereboi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

YAY!!!!! Its working!!!! We will have single payer national healthcare much sooner than I expected.

When you say single payer are you referring to a system like the VA or CMS or are you talking about something totally different?

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Post #: 149

RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 11:19:37 AM

mnottertail

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A system like Norway, Canada, UK and so on. But thats for you folks, I got the VA already for me. Now if I could get nutsackers out of there, it would work like it should.

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RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 11:35:38 AM

GoddessManko

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It would be great if they reintroduce the public option. Hopefully Hillary has the political capital and foresight to make it happen.

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RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 11:38:13 AM

mnottertail

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Well, its clear that what we got now aint gonna go, but it is not repealable outright. It needs fixing or replacement with real prescriptive solutions.

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Post #: 152

RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 11:46:19 AM

Phydeaux

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It has actually been clear from the very beginning that obama care was supposed to act as a "knife" driving a wedge into employer provided health care.

There is no question that it was designed to move people out of "employer" provided health care and into govt provided heath care. Regardless of how bad govt healthcare may be.

If your employer offers you insurance that doesn’t provide free ella, or anything else on the list of “preventive services”—as defined by Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius and ultimately by Obama—then it’s subject to a fine of $36,500 a year. But if your employer doesn’t offer you insurance at all, it’s subject to a fine of $2,000 a year. Actually, for now your employer’s choice is between a fine of $36,500 or $0, as Obama has extralegally decreed that fines for not providing insurance (but not fines for providing insurance that doesn’t cover all “preventive services”) will be waived until after we get to the other side of the midterm elections.

As Rep. Diane Black (R., Tenn.) put it after the oral arguments, “Only Obamacare could create a system that carries 18 times the fine for providing insurance coverage to employees than for not providing any coverage at all.”

With my apologies to Diane black - 36k vs 0 is more than 18 times. Its designed to push people into obamacare. Add in the provisions that mandate the obsolescence of grandfathered insurance and there really is *zero* doubt.

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RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 11:49:39 AM

Owner59

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That`s the lunatic fringe narrative......

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Post #: 154

RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 12:10:07 PM

papassion

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

A system like Norway, Canada, UK and so on. But thats for you folks, I got the VA already for me. Now if I could get nutsackers out of there, it would work like it should.

How in the hell do you qualify for VA benefits? I am a vet and when I tried to use the VA system, I was told I had too many assets. And the amount of assets you must fall under is not huge!

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Post #: 155

RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 12:23:22 PM

mnottertail

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I dunno, I am a vet and thats about it. Maybe there is some notch or something.

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RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 12:41:48 PM

papassion

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As for Obamacare cutting costs. Obamacare is basically a copy of Romneycare. Romney care has been working for 6 years, so we can make fairly accurate assumptions from Romneycare. Total per capita healthcare spending in Massachusetts is $9,278, the HIGHEST in the country and well above the $6,815 national average. That says it all. Money Magazine, June, 2013, Page 88. Also in the article is the wait times and how you will see Physician Assistants and advanced nurses instead of a Doctor. And Massachusetts is working on a plan to reward Doctors (with $$$) who cut costs. What could possibly go wrong for patients here!

Read the statistics on people who die because of Doctor errors. It is a huge number! Now imagine that number with Physician ASSISANTS and Registered Nurses handling a large part of the patient load.

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RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 1:02:13 PM

papassion

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Same Magazine reference. Baystate Mason Square Neighborhood Health Center, waits for appointments hit six MONTHS whe romneycare first started. In a state that has MORE Doctors per resident than any other. (wait times have decreased since using Assistants, nurses, etc.)

Another thing is shared appointments. People with the same chronic conditions such as diabetes, high blood pressure, etc, see a Doctor for a few MINUTES, then are herded into a room to hear about treatment plans, etc. I can see it now, guy says, "all the diabetics over here, All the high blood pressure people over there, and all you chicks with yeast infections and what else dripping out, go over to that group!" lol

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RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 1:05:20 PM

mnottertail

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We can't assume any of that Obamacare is basically not a copy of Romneycare, unless you think a trike is basically a copy of a ford f-150 cuz they have wheels and they are both conveyances.

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RE: Obama Care - 3/26/2014 1:08:06 PM

kalikshama

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quote:

How in the hell do you qualify for VA benefits? I am a vet and when I tried to use the VA system, I was told I had too many assets. And the amount of assets you must fall under is not huge!

Were you counting your primary residence and family vehicles? You're supposed to exclude them.

http://www.va.gov/healtheligibility/apps/enrollmentcalculator/Default.asp#result

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