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RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 4:01:01 PM

darchChylde

Posts: 5279
Joined: 9/28/2006
From: Warm Springs, GA but i live in San Francisco.
Status: offline

*putting his name on the sign up list for drone work, hoping that if he does well enough he will be considered for breeding purposes*

-darchChylde, who thinks he'd make a really good mother

_____________________________

I'm the man your mother warned you about...
if only to keep me to herself.

I'm a male dominant switch whose experienced as a poly sub to a dominant woman
.
Where the fuck do I post?

Proud Owner and Protector of chyldeschylde.

(in reply to gooddogbenji)

Post #: 161

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 4:07:18 PM

aidan

Posts: 904
Joined: 5/28/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama

Even if those words are only part of the sentence "I'm sorry that things are bad now, and have been worse in the past, but I personally hope I can make them better in the future."

What if I think them really, really, really hard?

...Ow. I think my nose is bleeding.

Threads like this are one of the numerous reasons I am a depressed and angry individual.

I'm deeply saddened that the attrocities that Lashra rages against are realities, and that they fuel such rage.
I'm disappointed that the OP was met with seemingly unironic support by some, and admonishment for legitimate anger and frustration by others.
I'm furious that some men are arguing, against all rational evidence, that the problem is overblown, or doesn't exist, or should just be ignored because it's too damn depressing.
I'm hurt that my brother, my uncles, my cousins, my friends, me, are all considered wicked and evil and abominable by some because of our genetics.
I'm hurt that my sister, my aunts, my cousins, my friends, my mother and grandmother, are all considered inferior and uncapable and subhuman by the same token.

There are few beacons of light and sanity in this thread...you folk know who you are...but the rest has been an exercise in emotional exhaustion.

That's all.

"I'm only interested in one thing: the future. And believe me, the only way to get there is together."

_____________________________

Do what now?

"I aim to misbehave."
-Mal Reynolds

(in reply to ShaktiSama)

Post #: 162

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 4:27:13 PM

Aswad

Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama

You've done wonders to invalidate any doubts we might have about the humanity of the opposite gender.

Err... no... he's saying that he'd expect women, of all people, to see why what the OP says is wrong...

Certainly, men have been inflicting it on women for long enough, haven't they?

quote:

Just an observation: for a person who so often tries SO desperately to get attention on these forums as an "intelligent and well-educated" type, you reveal an inordinate wealth of ignorance of what life is like for the majority of women on planet Earth.

And putting men in cages, or bashing in their heads, improves this exactly how?

(As opposed to the oppression and violence that only men do, of course.)

quote:

You perhaps need to read something other than a thesaurus once in a while, kiddo. And perhaps you need to get the hell away from the Wank Machine and experience something of the real world before you speak. Perhaps when you have, your incredibly unattractive and unearned white male persecution complex will clear up, like a case of repulsive teenage acne, and your posts will read a bit more like something written by a knowledgable, humane adult.

Was that as good for you as it was for the verbal abuse crowd?

You're a good looking woman on the outside; feel free to show that it's more than skin deep, because this ad hominem ... falls short.

quote:

hey, once in a while women get tired of their gender being raped, murdered, beaten, persecuted, belittled and impoverished...

Understandably so... my only question is: when will a lesson be learned by either gender?

Oh, and men get tired of being presumed guilty, being blamed for the infidelity women they meet, beaten (no, domestic violence is not a men-only club), persecuted, belittled and deprived of their children. And they certainly would get so if the OP's thoughts were given substance. Can you imagine the backlash if that happened, and men managed to reverse it?

quote:

and feel like speaking a few harmless words of complaint.

If those words were directed at Jews, this site would have been sued to hell and back by the Jewish Anti-Defamation League.

quote:

I find it ironic that one thread in the Mistress forum, which had to be disinterred after two years lying fallow, is being called a "constant pattern of male bashing" on a forum where there is a new "there's no such thing as a domme" or "women are such whores" thread every other fucking day.

I find it equally ironic that the ethic of "do unto others as they've done to you" finds so fertile soil here.

quote:

Much less that one little thread on a board where there is an entire sub-forum devoted to an insanely misogynistic Male Supremacy fantasy known as Gor (because the real world just isn't sickeningly violent and patriarchal enough, for some people!).

Actually, there's a lot of misogynists who call themselves Gorean in order to somehow "justify" their weakness to themselves.
As a Gorean man, I have nothing but contempt for men who don't even have the balls to spew their own crap.
But neither do I have respect for the sort of woman who would provide that justification.

I've clocked no few hours trying to get the point across to people that Gor is not about male supremacy, and most seem to get the point well enough. But many look no deeper than you have. I can fault them, as I have looked deeper. How can you fault them for doing the exact same thing as you have done, though? Double standards? Blindness? Hypocrisy?

Seriously, being willfully ignorant does not make you qualified to insult that segment of the board (in violation of TOS, I might add).

quote:

Whatever, please don't let the real suffering that women endure in the real world intrude on your fantasy world where you're the victims.

Nobody is denying that there are women suffering out there. Tons of them.

But neither is it exactly brilliant to ignore that there are also areas where the pendulum swings the other way.

quote:

And we're terribly sorry that one of us had a moment of weakness, on one bad day, and dared to do a silly thing like equate patriarchy with the people who perpetuate it and benefit most from it.

Apology accepted.

After all, what's a little suggesion of enslaving a gender, or eradicating it, or whatever, between friends?
Or dumping all responsibility for the world's ills at their feet, shouldering none yourself?

quote:

We're also overcome with remorse that any other woman here would dare to express sympathy with that pain, that frustration and anger.

One can hope.

quote:

We will be sure to more politely swallow any sense of rage and helplessness we feel when we realize that in the time it took me to type this post, several female human beings, some as young as two or as old as 82, have just been brutally raped somewhere on this planet by a thing with a cock and a sense of entitlement only a SHADE less revolting than yours.

On behalf of a lot of people who have been raped, I'd like to say thank you for devaluating the experiences of rape victims around the world by equating them to something as trivial as objecting to a suggestion that enslavement of a gender, etc... Since it's so trivial (or so you suggest), one guesses then that rape is "no biggie?"

quote:

And of course, we all know that the two words that NO MALE ORGANISM can ever speak with any sincerity are "I'm sorry."

Speak for yourself.

This makes as much sense as saying that no female organism can ever sincerely say "No."

quote:

"I'm sorry that things are bad now, and have been worse in the past, but I personally hope I can make them better in the future."

My sincere condolences on that.
But I will apologize only for what I have done.
I am not my gender, regardless of whatever you may think.

Health,
al-Aswad.

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to ShaktiSama)

Post #: 163

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 4:31:13 PM

Aswad

Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: aidan

I'm hurt that my sister, my aunts, my cousins, my friends, my mother and grandmother, are all considered inferior and uncapable and subhuman by the same token.

Thank you! I'm glad to see that someone realizes the implications of feminazi misandrism.
And my compliments on the rest of the post, which was very well put.

By the way, anger and depression isn't the answer.
PM if you want to talk about that.
I fell. I saw. I won.

Health,
al-Aswad.

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to aidan)

Post #: 164

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 4:48:34 PM

darchChylde

Posts: 5279
Joined: 9/28/2006
From: Warm Springs, GA but i live in San Francisco.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lashra
Do you ever get sick and tired of hearing how women are supposed to be submissive to men and to let them rule things, when most of them cannot even rule a pet hamster?

A woman is no more, or less qualified in any capacity than a man just because of an accident of birth. What is frustrated is when women are often simply passed over for positions and responsibilities that a particular woman is more qualified for than her male counterparts..

Do you ever want to scream stop raping and killing us (and our children) because you believe that it is your God given right to do so, or just because your physically stronger/bigger (not always) that you can get away with it?

Yes, absolutely yes. Though the reasoning attributed to such acts in this post seems to be overly-simplistic in my opinion. But as was stated, the original post was a rant and in the spirit of "bitching"; so i'll bypass the fact.

Do you ever want to physically bash some guy who has beaten and or abused his wife/girlfriend in some fashion, then justifies it by saying that the bible (or whatever religion/philosophy) says its ok?

Yes; but, on the other, i would also like to beat women who go back to these guys a third, fourth time or even more.

Do you ever feel the urge to choke the life out of a proven child molester when you see them on the news?

Choking is too quick and death is too good.

Do you seethe when you hear that women do not need equal rights or control of their own bodies IE abortion?

Absolutely and without reservation.

Do you ever get angry with other women who seemingly blindly follow anything the patriarchal system instructs her too?

I get angry with anyone who blindly follows anything.

Do you ever feel that all the men should be gathered up and put into cages and only let out for breeding purposes and drone work?

I've already signed up.

~Lashra

_____________________________

I'm the man your mother warned you about...
if only to keep me to herself.

I'm a male dominant switch whose experienced as a poly sub to a dominant woman
.
Where the fuck do I post?

Proud Owner and Protector of chyldeschylde.

(in reply to Lashra)

Post #: 165

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 4:50:28 PM

Jeffff

Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
Status: offline

Skipping all the dogma and vitriol.the short answer is...YES...:)

Jeff

(in reply to Lashra)

Post #: 166

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 5:32:06 PM

SweetDommes

Posts: 3313
Joined: 10/5/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: aidan

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama

Even if those words are only part of the sentence "I'm sorry that things are bad now, and have been worse in the past, but I personally hope I can make them better in the future."

What if I think them really, really, really hard?

...Ow. I think my nose is bleeding.

Threads like this are one of the numerous reasons I am a depressed and angry individual.

I'm deeply saddened that the attrocities that Lashra rages against are realities, and that they fuel such rage.
I'm disappointed that the OP was met with seemingly unironic support by some, and admonishment for legitimate anger and frustration by others.
I'm furious that some men are arguing, against all rational evidence, that the problem is overblown, or doesn't exist, or should just be ignored because it's too damn depressing.
I'm hurt that my brother, my uncles, my cousins, my friends, me, are all considered wicked and evil and abominable by some because of our genetics.
I'm hurt that my sister, my aunts, my cousins, my friends, my mother and grandmother, are all considered inferior and uncapable and subhuman by the same token.

There are few beacons of light and sanity in this thread...you folk know who you are...but the rest has been an exercise in emotional exhaustion.

That's all.

"I'm only interested in one thing: the future. And believe me, the only way to get there is together."

I just wanted to say - aidan, you are a wonderful young man and your post shows it. Aswad is right that anger and depression aren't the answer. If you want/need to talk, you know how to get hold of me on the other side as well ... and if you think we can convince Holly that you are 25, you can just move in and forget e-mail LOL

_____________________________

Miss Karen and Miss Holly

Earth is the insane asylum for the universe.

Friends are God's apology for relatives

(in reply to aidan)

Post #: 167

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 6:34:48 PM

ShaktiSama

Posts: 1674
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad

Nobody is denying that there are women suffering out there. Tons of them.

But neither is it exactly brilliant to ignore that there are also areas where the pendulum swings the other way.

Actually, quite a few people are denying that there are women suffering, by refusing to acknowledge that this suffering and the anger it engenders were the subject and inspiration for this thread. In fact, the men here who have tried to divorce the OP's post from that context of human suffering are being deliberately hateful--it's an attitude analogous to Holocaust denial in its way.

When it comes to the male suffering caused by patriarchy? I haven't ignored that, and if you read my first response to this thread you would see that clearly.

As for the rest of your baiting--sorry, but I am not going to argue with you, or any of the other male dominants who have rushed to this thread to stir things up. Nor am I going to tolerate your feeble attempt to appropriate the suffering of rape victims as your property, and accuse me of belittling it to further your weak arguments. Nor am I going to acknowledge the truly grotesque sense of entitlement it requires to enter a discussion of serious issues with a woman and then have the gall to judge her appearance in mid-post! I will point out the fact that the only people you can offer courtesy, respect, or compassion to are other men, though--seriously, could you behave MORE like a sexist cliche?

The other thing I will address, since it was echoed in other posts, is this truly ridiculous notion you seem to hold that human males generally--and white males in particular--are a subaltern population that can ever be compared legitimately to Jews, blacks or women.

I acknowledge this suggestion by...laughing. Heartily.

Yes, indeed. You ARE the victims. Poor, poor, poor you! It is the worst thing in the world to be white, male, and inclined to dominance; you are not exactly the human being that almost every social, political, economic and spiritual apparatus on the planet is designed to serve and affirm!

Thank you. A little more Gorean input is just what we need to put things in perspective.

_____________________________

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea."
-- Robert A. Heinlein

(in reply to Aswad)

Post #: 168

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 6:48:44 PM

darchChylde

Posts: 5279
Joined: 9/28/2006
From: Warm Springs, GA but i live in San Francisco.
Status: offline

ShaktiSama,

You do know, that nomatter the validity of your post; your deliberate antagonism undermines the credibility of your views. People react to anger with anger; if you practice a little more tact and little less condescention, you will find that your opinions will be generally better recieved.

_____________________________

I'm the man your mother warned you about...
if only to keep me to herself.

I'm a male dominant switch whose experienced as a poly sub to a dominant woman
.
Where the fuck do I post?

Proud Owner and Protector of chyldeschylde.

(in reply to ShaktiSama)

Post #: 169

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 7:18:31 PM

christine1

Posts: 6155
Joined: 12/15/2007
From: i'm headed to HIM...
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tigerstyle

In some moods, I see men as analogous to the first stage of a Saturn V rocket. Powerful, stupid, explosive and uni-directional, good only for lifting the payload of culture out of the gravity well.

It's amusing to think about which would be a happier culture: all-female or all-male.

an interesting read is a book called, "The White Plague". it is about a virus that kills women and what men go through because of it. i'm not man or or woman bashing in the least, i'm just saying that i think men need women as much as women need men.

_____________________________

i am woman! er, godzilla! hear me roar!

http://wavcentral.com/cgi-bin/log/log.cgi?id=2856&sound=/sounds/movies/godzilla/roar.mp3

He's the "boom" overwhelming...

He is my Master, my lover, my best friend my everything.

(in reply to tigerstyle)

Post #: 170

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 8:09:24 PM

AtlantaMistress

Posts: 276
Joined: 6/14/2007
Status: offline

To answer the question heading this post - YES, otherwise, I would not have the best thing in my life, my children. I also love to have a man to worship me, and not being bisexual or having that kind of natural connection with another woman, sometimes I need a man, the men in MY life certainly serve a purpose.

That said, although I do believe that a woman with confidence, intelligence, and strength of character can be much better than most men who rule our world today because of the ability to think rationally, with a combination of head and heart. I also believe however that many women do not understand their own power do act in such a way that they do not command the respect that they deserve.

Overall, however, I do not think it is what is between our legs but between our ears that we should look at when deciding who is superior. All men...all women - there is no such thing. There are good and bad in any gender, race, religion, etc. Unfortunately, it is always the "bad eggs" that get the attention far easier than the good ones get applause

_____________________________

Mistress Sandy

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I'd rather be hated for something I am than loved for something I am not.

(in reply to gooddogbenji)

Post #: 171

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 8:36:44 PM

Aswad

Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama

Actually, quite a few people are denying that there are women suffering, by refusing to acknowledge that this suffering and the anger it engenders were the subject and inspiration for this thread. In fact, the men here who have tried to divorce the OP's post from that context of human suffering are being deliberately hateful--it's an attitude analogous to Holocaust denial in its way.

In my case, I'm just trying to stick to the universal points here, i.e. that she's saying "don't you just want to fuck over the men?"
As long as that's the initial response, we're all going to just keep fucking each other over in an endless cycle.
6.5 billion sadistic, non-masochistic switches pulling the Long Train of Ages is going nowhere.

I nixed the rest of the post, as you've done a better job of refuting your own position than I can.

I've fought for women's right to equitable treatment, and to eliminate prejudices about them in my predominantly male profession. Your personal attacks and refusal to engage me with substance are stereotypical of virtually every negative cliche about women and their intellect in the history of misogyny. For me to argue with it would require you to be open to debate. For me to merely express my opinions on it, would violate the Terms of Service. So I'll leave it at the above until such time as you elaborate, if you do, except one question:

Complementing you on your appearance takes a grotesque sense of entitlement ?

Damn... care to explain that one to me?

Health,
al-Aswad.

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to ShaktiSama)

Post #: 172

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 8:43:33 PM

Aswad

Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: AtlantaMistress

That said, although I do believe that a woman with confidence, intelligence, and strength of character can be much better than most men who rule our world today because of the ability to think rationally, with a combination of head and heart.

I quite agree. We've had such women in government, including as the head of state, up here in Norway.

That said, I believe a human with confidence, intelligence and strength of character can be better than most people who rule the world today.

quote:

I also believe however that many women do not understand their own power do act in such a way that they do not command the respect that they deserve.

We've had such women in government, too. Over the years, they've been steadily drowning out the other kind. Substituting pettiness, vengefulness and overcompensating hostility for actual merit. Along with quota measures, that has done a lot to start the backswing of the pendulum.

quote:

Overall, however, I do not think it is what is between our legs but between our ears that we should look at when deciding who is superior.

Amen.

Health,
al-Aswad.

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to AtlantaMistress)

Post #: 173

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 9:18:31 PM

SixFootMaster

Posts: 829
Joined: 9/27/2007
Status: offline

I'd like to take a moment, to add my own thoughts to this thread.

Blame throwing is a popular past-time, and even more so on the Internet, where one is free of social and pyschological repercussions of having to take a person seriously. It's easy to vent and rage, and not have to worry in the slighest that your statements have exceeded sanity levels.

My older sister was raped at least once that I know about. My younger sister endured a heavily abusive relationship that saw her move halfway across the country to get away from him in the end. It wasn't physically abusive - mental and emotional abuse are much worse in my own opinion. I want to be clear therefore, in that I am speaking from the position of a man who has seen these things happen to people he deeply loves and cares about, and their enduring effects over the years.

From my voluminous 32 years life experience, I have come to the conclusion that the majority of people are trash. Men and women alike. We have women sexual abusers, just as we have male sexual abusers. Men get raped, women get raped. Men get murdered by women, women get murdered by men. Men steal, women steal. Ever truly wicked and distasteful trait that has ever manifested in the human condition has manifested in both genders. My brother's first wife drowned his puppy in the bathtub the day she left. Unlike myself, he was not dominant enough to stand up to her. If you doubt it, watch Jerry Springer and tell me who is worse - the white male trash, the white female trash, the white transgender trash, the black transgender trash, the black male trash, the black female trash, fathers lusting after daughters, daughters lusting after fathers, mothers for sons, sons for sisters. It's all there. Every last undesirable trait existing in both sexes.

Gor isn't mysoginistic. It isn't even about gender enslavement. There are male slaves and female slaves in Gor. There are male owners and female owners in Gor. Gor isn't even about slavery. It's about freedom, personal responsibility, consequences, strength, integrity and honor and all the other noble attributes that are founded upon them. Do not equate the setting with the content. Or rather, that wise old adage "Do not judge a book by it's cover".

ShaktiSama, anger begets suffering begets anger. There is no such thing as legitimate acceptable rage, only understandable rage. Rage is the utter suspension of rationality, subjecting the mind to overwhelming bouts of emotional instability, giving rise to thoughts, feelings, and beliefs that have no factual basis, or that are so badly extrapolated from the facts that they bear little more than passing resembelance to them.

As Tarl Cabot himself found, submitting to rage is just another form of slavery - one you entered willingly.

Aesop SixFoot

< Message edited by SixFootMaster -- 1/30/2008 9:25:18 PM >

_____________________________

How-so oft fresh injurious deed
Doth turn Janus' petulant gaze
'pon the rocks and storm rift sea
And littered wood of broken days
disregard for toil shown
no ground broken, no seed sewn.

(in reply to Aswad)

Post #: 174

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 9:26:16 PM

petdave

Posts: 2479
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama
Yes, indeed. You ARE the victims. Poor, poor, poor you! It is the worst thing in the world to be white, male, and inclined to dominance; you are not exactly the human being that almost every social, political, economic and spiritual apparatus on the planet is designed to serve and affirm!

To quote the philosopher Fat Mike:

quote:

I ain't part of no conspiracy- I'm just your average Joe!
...
So go ahead, and label me
an asshole 'cause I can
accept responsibility, for what I've done
but not for who I am!

(in reply to ShaktiSama)

Post #: 175

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 9:31:15 PM

ShaktiSama

Posts: 1674
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: darchChylde
You do know, that nomatter the validity of your post; your deliberate antagonism undermines the credibility of your views. People react to anger with anger; if you practice a little more tact and little less condescention, you will find that your opinions will be generally better recieved.

Sorrry, handsome, but it is not always a "woman's place" to back down. And there are several men whose posts in this thread precede and far exceed anything I have written in terms of offensive content. The person reacting to anger and rudeness here is me--not them.

Why don't you try telling THEM not to "react to anger with anger", or question the validity of THEIR posts? Their antagonism, tactlessness and condescenscion is beyond question and far exceeds anything I have said--unless you consider it acceptable for a spoiled, snotty teenager to call a Lady as impeccably refined as Ellen "stupid"? Or to refer to all the female posters to this thread and me in particular as "swine"?

_____________________________

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea."
-- Robert A. Heinlein

(in reply to darchChylde)

Post #: 176

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 9:43:35 PM

SixFootMaster

Posts: 829
Joined: 9/27/2007
Status: offline

I'd also like to add one further comment, directed at ShaktiSama:

quote:

Even if those words are only part of the sentence "I'm sorry that things are bad now, and have been worse in the past, but I personally hope I can make them better in the future."

Almost every male living on this planet lives by those words, but substitute for "aim to" for "hope I can". I would hope that nearly every human being would.

How thoroughly out of touch with the male identity you are.

_____________________________

How-so oft fresh injurious deed
Doth turn Janus' petulant gaze
'pon the rocks and storm rift sea
And littered wood of broken days
disregard for toil shown
no ground broken, no seed sewn.

(in reply to Aswad)

Post #: 177

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 10:08:09 PM

ShaktiSama

Posts: 1674
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad
Complementing you on your appearance takes a grotesque sense of entitlement ?

I am a human being. And a dominant. And your equal at minimum, given where you are choosing to post.

Stopping in mid-post during a discussion of a serious issue to objectify me, and use your unsolicited opinion of my appearance as an opportunity tell me how to properly behave? Is rude, obnoxious, sexist behavior.

I'm going to ignore the rest of your petty, vindictive insults and sniping. I've done and said nothing to justify your misogyny; it is a pre-existing condition. And I have no interest in having the terms of Proper Feminism or womanhood in general dictated to me by a male supremacist. If this is how you "fought" for equality in your workplace, small wonder it remains male-dominated; with friends like Goreans, women don't need enemies.

_____________________________

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea."
-- Robert A. Heinlein

(in reply to Aswad)

Post #: 178

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 10:12:12 PM

darchChylde

Posts: 5279
Joined: 9/28/2006
From: Warm Springs, GA but i live in San Francisco.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama
Sorrry, handsome,

Somehow; i have the feeling that you would be upset if after you made a statement on an issue, i (or any other man), started of their statement with "sorry, cutie". It's dismissive and rude, and you know it.

but it is not always a "woman's place" to back down.

Reread my post and tell me where i said anything about backing down. I don't tolerate anyone, even my dominant, putting words in my mouth; but then i know that She wouldn't do so, why do you think you have the right?

And there are several men whose posts in this thread precede and far exceed anything I have written in terms of offensive content. The person reacting to anger and rudeness here is me--not them.

You see, i am not talking about them but about you; and just because "they started it" doesn't mean you're not reacting in anger as well. i'm surprised you're allowing yourself to sink to the level of your opponents in this debate.

Why don't you try telling THEM not to "react to anger with anger",

Because you have offended my sensibilities more. When an asshole makes an ass out of themselves, no one pays any attention. But when someone who is generally level headed does the same, people tend to perk up

or question the validity of THEIR posts?

There you go again, point out to me where i am questioning the validity of anyone's points; what; read my post again, i am telling you that you are hurting your own credibility and thus your argument.

Their antagonism, tactlessness and condescenscion is beyond question and far exceeds anything I have said--unless you consider it acceptable for a spoiled, snotty teenager to call a Lady as impeccably refined as Ellen "stupid"? Or to refer to all the female posters to this thread and me in particular as "swine"?

i haven't condemned or condoned anyone, and most of those posts i wouldn't validate with a response. Ellen is a big girl and she can take care of herself, so are pretty much all of the women that have posted here. What i was saying is that your argument would be better served if you were to use a modicum of tact and reason. Hopping into the mud with the pigs you're arguing against only gets you dirty.

-darchChylde, who knows that the problem with assholes is that it makes you indistinguishable from your opponent.

_____________________________

I'm the man your mother warned you about...
if only to keep me to herself.

I'm a male dominant switch whose experienced as a poly sub to a dominant woman
.
Where the fuck do I post?

Proud Owner and Protector of chyldeschylde.

(in reply to ShaktiSama)

Post #: 179

RE: Do we really need men? - 1/30/2008 10:21:02 PM

ShaktiSama

Posts: 1674
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SixFootMaster
Almost every male living on this planet lives by those words, but substitute for "aim to" for "hope I can".

*shakes her head* Hon, I am touched if you feel that way yourself, but you truly need to open your eyes and look around you. If the majority of men felt this way--or even a sizable minority of them--the world would not be what it is.

You need to ask yourself what the lives of women in sub-Saharan Africa are like right now, what the lives of womeen in the Islamic world are like, what the lives of women in China and Korea are like, or what women are going through in Latin America. You need to review the statistics--because there is a tsunami of numbers that do not lie, and every one of them is attached to a woman who is suffering and often dying.

Combine that with the closer-to-home experience that goes with working at the shelters for victims of rape and domestic violence, or trying to defend a woman's right to choose in the USA, and you might have a far less optimistic view of "male identity"--at least as expressed in the current social framework.

You still would not really know what it is like to be a woman. But you would at least be free of the delusion that all men are friendly to positive change--much less committed to making it happen. Men like you are the exception, not the rule. That is why you should push to make the rules--not the exceptions. ;)

_____________________________

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax and get used to the idea."
-- Robert A. Heinlein

(in reply to SixFootMaster)

Post #: 180

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