quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

well its actually kind a the other way around, cause if you and others like you made a compelling argument, they'd change the laws, but OH LOOOKKK they did NOT!

And why haven't they??
Because far too many Americans get their panties in a twist over individual rights with a "how dare you" when it comes to the 2nd.
You seem to forget, those laws were 'borrowed' from the British constitution in the first instance.
We've since learned that some of those ancient laws are outdated and prohibitive to a safe society, so we changed them.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

fact is people in American accept the fact that there will be some rainy days along with the sunny ones...

There are waay too many 'rainy days' in the US when it comes to gun deaths...
That is a fact that many pro-gun Americans don't want to acknowledge even though the stats are staggering compared to elsewhere.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

we love our cars so we have a lot of car deaths, we love our guns so we have more gun deaths than other countries etc. etc. etc...

Even when compared on a 'per capita' comparison, your stats are waay worse than anywhere else.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

but the fact is the ratio of cars to deaths and guns to deaths is a TINY TINY percentage...

True.
That is also true of many other countries that have cars and infrastructure.
But.... when it comes to gun deaths, you out-rank most civilized countries by a whole order of magnitude and more.
Surely that mus tell you that something is radically wrong (or at least it should).
No, you carry on with your head in the sand while someone else shoots you in the butt; because you don't want any change to your so-called "freedoms".
Maybe when there are enough people that want the freedom NOT to get killed or shot with a gun, maybe the laws will change.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

and anyone who doesn't like those odds is free to LEAVE!

And I did!!

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin
point is, if there are 100,000,000 guns in the USA and 30,000 gun deaths that's .03% if there are 10,000 guns in the UK and 30 gun deaths its .3% or 100 times HIGHER

quote:

ORIGINAL: subrosaDom
http://news.yahoo.com/woman-uses-her-gun-ward-off-abduction-190207403.html

So all those who say you don't need guns, why don't you tell us EXACTLY what would have gone down if this woman had not had a gun? Just how many bones in her body would have been broken? Would her skull be in 2 pieces, 3 or 4?

But, no, guns don't work. No, it's not possible to draw guns in time. No, it's dangerous to carry guns.

Then why is this woman still alive and uninjured?

How would you like to defend yourself bare-handed against 2 thugs with a baseball bat?

quote:

Because far too many Americans get their panties in a twist over individual rights

quote:

ORIGINAL: DaNewAgeViking

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

She needs a bigger dog.

Armed with a baseball bat.

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether
I'm not surprised all the gun nuts on here are quick to defend her story, without an ounce of question. That's not defending, that's being a fanatic to the cause! Throwing out reality for the gun fantasy.

And I am not a bit surprised to see that the anti-gun nuts are so quick to claim it's a lie. After all it doesn't fit with their talking points so it must be false.

I didn't say it was a lie. Try re-reading the third sentence:

"It could have happened and it may not have happened."

Cant handle logical questions being asked? Never heard the phrase "If it sounds to good to be true, it probably isn't?" That you have never heard of someone making a false police report to advance a political agenda? How exactly do you vet information to determine if its true and correct?

Bama translates "true and correct" to meaning "fits my ideals and PoV".
Anything else is a lie according to him.
He couldn't win the gun argument so he opens up no less than two other threads pointing out something else in order to make people believe him.
More than 32,000 gun deaths in the US and he has to pull up one (yeah, just ONE) story to substantiate his claim that more guns stop deaths than cause them.

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

well its actually kind a the other way around, cause if you and others like you made a compelling argument, they'd change the laws, but OH LOOOKKK they did NOT!

And why haven't they??
Because far too many Americans get their panties in a twist over individual rights with a "how dare you" when it comes to the 2nd.
You seem to forget, those laws were 'borrowed' from the British constitution in the first instance.
We've since learned that some of those ancient laws are outdated and prohibitive to a safe society, so we changed them.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

fact is people in American accept the fact that there will be some rainy days along with the sunny ones...

There are waay too many 'rainy days' in the US when it comes to gun deaths...
That is a fact that many pro-gun Americans don't want to acknowledge even though the stats are staggering compared to elsewhere.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

we love our cars so we have a lot of car deaths, we love our guns so we have more gun deaths than other countries etc. etc. etc...

Even when compared on a 'per capita' comparison, your stats are waay worse than anywhere else.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

but the fact is the ratio of cars to deaths and guns to deaths is a TINY TINY percentage...

True.
That is also true of many other countries that have cars and infrastructure.
But.... when it comes to gun deaths, you out-rank most civilized countries by a whole order of magnitude and more.
Surely that mus tell you that something is radically wrong (or at least it should).
No, you carry on with your head in the sand while someone else shoots you in the butt; because you don't want any change to your so-called "freedoms".
Maybe when there are enough people that want the freedom NOT to get killed or shot with a gun, maybe the laws will change.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

and anyone who doesn't like those odds is free to LEAVE!

And I did!!

quote:

ORIGINAL: eulero83

FR

is it common for criminals to have this up front attitude around there or are these extreme examples?

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

quote:

ORIGINAL: subrosaDom
http://news.yahoo.com/woman-uses-her-gun-ward-off-abduction-190207403.html

So all those who say you don't need guns, why don't you tell us EXACTLY what would have gone down if this woman had not had a gun? Just how many bones in her body would have been broken? Would her skull be in 2 pieces, 3 or 4?

But, no, guns don't work. No, it's not possible to draw guns in time. No, it's dangerous to carry guns.

Then why is this woman still alive and uninjured?

How would you like to defend yourself bare-handed against 2 thugs with a baseball bat?

Sounds like a gun fantasy. We only have one witness who states all those events happened so perfectly. It could have happened and it may not have happened. You are taking the point that...."It had to have happened....cus....". An I'm pointing out that there is no evidence in that article of those two men. What did they look like? How tall were they? Were they overweight? How did she know they wanted to abduct her? Why would two guys be walking around her neighborhood with a baseball bat intent on doing harm on someone?

But of course, do 'fly off the handle' and assume a HUGE amount of things with very little if any evidence or facts. Like how if she didn't have a gun, should would have been (insert fear here). Your assuming material that isn't even in the article. Where was the gun on her person? How close where they to her, when the exchange took place? Did they walk within a few feet masquerading as one thing, but surprised her? Or call out from thirty feet away "hey, we're going to (insert fear here)"?

I'm not surprised all the gun nuts on here are quick to defend her story, without an ounce of question. That's not defending, that's being a fanatic to the cause! Throwing out reality for the gun fantasy.

What if she made it up? Wouldn't be the first time someone faked a police report to push a political agenda.....

You don't like it so your "wisdom" tells you it is a lie.

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

quote:

ORIGINAL: subrosaDom
http://news.yahoo.com/woman-uses-her-gun-ward-off-abduction-190207403.html

So all those who say you don't need guns, why don't you tell us EXACTLY what would have gone down if this woman had not had a gun? Just how many bones in her body would have been broken? Would her skull be in 2 pieces, 3 or 4?

But, no, guns don't work. No, it's not possible to draw guns in time. No, it's dangerous to carry guns.

Then why is this woman still alive and uninjured?

How would you like to defend yourself bare-handed against 2 thugs with a baseball bat?

Sounds like a gun fantasy. We only have one witness who states all those events happened so perfectly. It could have happened and it may not have happened. You are taking the point that...."It had to have happened....cus....". An I'm pointing out that there is no evidence in that article of those two men. What did they look like? How tall were they? Were they overweight? How did she know they wanted to abduct her? Why would two guys be walking around her neighborhood with a baseball bat intent on doing harm on someone?

But of course, do 'fly off the handle' and assume a HUGE amount of things with very little if any evidence or facts. Like how if she didn't have a gun, should would have been (insert fear here). Your assuming material that isn't even in the article. Where was the gun on her person? How close where they to her, when the exchange took place? Did they walk within a few feet masquerading as one thing, but surprised her? Or call out from thirty feet away "hey, we're going to (insert fear here)"?

I'm not surprised all the gun nuts on here are quick to defend her story, without an ounce of question. That's not defending, that's being a fanatic to the cause! Throwing out reality for the gun fantasy.

What if she made it up? Wouldn't be the first time someone faked a police report to push a political agenda.....

You don't like it so your "wisdom" tells you it is a lie.

No, I am asking reasonable questions that do not have answers that support the events in a decent manner. That I question what I read in the media sets me different from someone like you. All the questions in that post are very valid. I state that all the events could have happened that way, and they could equally not have happened at all. And pointed out that people have made false claims to garner support/respect from others in the past; could this be one of them?

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

quote:

ORIGINAL: subrosaDom
http://news.yahoo.com/woman-uses-her-gun-ward-off-abduction-190207403.html

So all those who say you don't need guns, why don't you tell us EXACTLY what would have gone down if this woman had not had a gun? Just how many bones in her body would have been broken? Would her skull be in 2 pieces, 3 or 4?

But, no, guns don't work. No, it's not possible to draw guns in time. No, it's dangerous to carry guns.

Then why is this woman still alive and uninjured?

How would you like to defend yourself bare-handed against 2 thugs with a baseball bat?

Sounds like a gun fantasy. We only have one witness who states all those events happened so perfectly. It could have happened and it may not have happened. You are taking the point that...."It had to have happened....cus....". An I'm pointing out that there is no evidence in that article of those two men. What did they look like? How tall were they? Were they overweight? How did she know they wanted to abduct her? Why would two guys be walking around her neighborhood with a baseball bat intent on doing harm on someone?

But of course, do 'fly off the handle' and assume a HUGE amount of things with very little if any evidence or facts. Like how if she didn't have a gun, should would have been (insert fear here). Your assuming material that isn't even in the article. Where was the gun on her person? How close where they to her, when the exchange took place? Did they walk within a few feet masquerading as one thing, but surprised her? Or call out from thirty feet away "hey, we're going to (insert fear here)"?

I'm not surprised all the gun nuts on here are quick to defend her story, without an ounce of question. That's not defending, that's being a fanatic to the cause! Throwing out reality for the gun fantasy.

What if she made it up? Wouldn't be the first time someone faked a police report to push a political agenda.....

You don't like it so your "wisdom" tells you it is a lie.

No, I am asking reasonable questions that do not have answers that support the events in a decent manner. That I question what I read in the media sets me different from someone like you. All the questions in that post are very valid. I state that all the events could have happened that way, and they could equally not have happened at all. And pointed out that people have made false claims to garner support/respect from others in the past; could this be one of them?

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
In order to be taken even marginally seriously you need to stop calling everyone who disagrees with you on any detail to be a "gun nut" and by extension an idiot. And why should anyone with any brains at all not support a woman defending herself? Of course self defense is a privilege and she didn't check in with the cops before committing self defense. How dare she take responsibility or her own well being. Prove she was lying.

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
In order to be taken even marginally seriously you need to stop calling everyone who disagrees with you on any detail to be a "gun nut" and by extension an idiot. And why should anyone with any brains at all not support a woman defending herself? Of course self defense is a privilege and she didn't check in with the cops before committing self defense. How dare she take responsibility or her own well being. Prove she was lying.

I've been...VERY CLEAR....on what a gun nut is and what a gun owner is. That they share similar things while at the same time many differences. You can look it up on the forums. If you do, you'll find your argument is full of shit here. No, honestly....do the research. In fact on one of these threads in the past, I explained to you. Yes YOU, BamaD, the four groups of Americans as I see on the greater subject matter of 'The 2nd Amendment and Everything Within' (that's not the name of the thread, btw).

When I've explained the four groups, it usually takes about 15-20 minutes. Its pretty in-depth look at who they are, how they operate, how they operate in relationship to the other three groups, their viewpoints, and examples/concepts that might help someone in identifying who I'm talking about. Over time, I've made minor corrections and adjustments as I've thought on the concept. You think of this as a 'tug of war' or 'a football game'. Its really 'zero sum' in that one side has to totally lose for another side to totally win. And you have hinted if not stated what you would do if your 'side' loses totally. And you wonder why people have problems with your material on this forum?

You want an example of a Gun Nut?

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
In order to be taken even marginally seriously you need to stop calling everyone who disagrees with you on any detail to be a "gun nut" and by extension an idiot. And why should anyone with any brains at all not support a woman defending herself? Of course self defense is a privilege and she didn't check in with the cops before committing self defense. How dare she take responsibility or her own well being. Prove she was lying.

I've been...VERY CLEAR....on what a gun nut is and what a gun owner is. That they share similar things while at the same time many differences. You can look it up on the forums. If you do, you'll find your argument is full of shit here. No, honestly....do the research. In fact on one of these threads in the past, I explained to you. Yes YOU, BamaD, the four groups of Americans as I see on the greater subject matter of 'The 2nd Amendment and Everything Within' (that's not the name of the thread, btw).

When I've explained the four groups, it usually takes about 15-20 minutes. Its pretty in-depth look at who they are, how they operate, how they operate in relationship to the other three groups, their viewpoints, and examples/concepts that might help someone in identifying who I'm talking about. Over time, I've made minor corrections and adjustments as I've thought on the concept. You think of this as a 'tug of war' or 'a football game'. Its really 'zero sum' in that one side has to totally lose for another side to totally win. And you have hinted if not stated what you would do if your 'side' loses totally. And you wonder why people have problems with your material on this forum?

You want an example of a Gun Nut?