RE: Reasonable Expectations

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littleladybug -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/22/2014 12:29:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant Because I don't need or want anyone that needs me. I want her to want me, not need me. Jus sayin Well, that pretty much echoes my sentiments. I don't need a man, but I sure as hell want one. For me, it's just as simple (and difficult) as finding someone who is complimentary to me. Even if we both have our shit together, there are certain things that we would both be very happy to relinquish control of. That's just life. And, if those things compliment each other...he's a keeper. s I find DesFIP's comment about the air masks interesting. To me, if I am the "person in charge", it makes sense. What the hell good would I be to someone else if I can't breathe myself? However, thankfully, I have the use of my limbs and faculties, so this wouldn't be an issue. I wonder when I hear about people who feel they wouldn't be able to do this on their own. Breathe, or not breathe...the most essential of human functions that you are WILLINGLY giving to someone else?? That, to me, is the eptiome of neediness, and is the foundation of a relationship where the other person simply HAS to think about you every waking second. 12 minutes, 12 months, 12 years...fact of the matter is that this works for some and not others. And, I'm not quite sure that this should be something that slaves, subs, whatever the nomenclature, should aspire to. But, that's what makes relationships....if everyone liked the same thing, life wouldn't be nearly as fun.

mnottertail -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/22/2014 12:32:57 PM)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJs_L7yq5qE Thats a real cheap trick.

NorthernGent -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/22/2014 12:50:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant where some churlish knacker Hugely off topic, Exiled, but the word 'knacker': is this a colloquialism somewhere in the US? and where?

FieryOpal -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/22/2014 1:49:23 PM)
~ FR ~ I guess I'll go on record then, as a non-submissive, that I know I need my Significant Other. Not just want, not just desire, but need--and emotionally, I need for him to need me. It's one of those things you try to fight perhaps at different times in your life (especially when I was younger). You want to think of yourself as independent, as if being loved and loving others is an option. It isn't. At least not with me. I need it as much as I need air to breathe, food and water for physical sustenance. When you're married, you might not be as aware of your more vulnerable needs. You are, but you aren't as much with the ones that are getting filled or met. I have kids, I have pets, I have close friends. They can only fill a portion of my psychological needs. Being in a non-D/s relationship dynamic with a partner would also not fill many of my needs. I recognize them as needs and not merely as elective wants that I could take or leave. And in large part, it is because I do recognize and acknowledge this about myself that I can value my Significant Other all the more.[sm=2cents.gif]

littleladybug -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/22/2014 1:52:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: FieryOpal I have kids, I have pets, I have close friends. They can only fill a portion of my psychological needs. Being in a non-D/s relationship dynamic with a partner would also not fill many of my needs. I recognize them as needs and not merely as elective wants that I could take or leave. And in large part, it is because I do recognize and acknowledge this about myself that I can value my Significant Other all the more.[sm=2cents.gif] Are you SURE you don't have a Y chromosome? LOL Amen...and totally agreed.

ExiledTyrant -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/22/2014 1:55:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NorthernGent quote: ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant where some churlish knacker Hugely off topic, Exiled, but the word 'knacker': is this a colloquialism somewhere in the US? and where? No.

FieryOpal -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/22/2014 2:04:10 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: littleladybug Are you SURE you don't have a Y chromosome? LOL Amen...and totally agreed. [sm=ugh.gif] TOTALLY and UNEQUIVOCALLY SURE! (Sh-sh, don't let the secret get out that we gals know these guys tend to need us more than we might need them. [;)] ) ----- @NorthernGent "A knacker is a person in the trade of rendering animals that have died on farms or are unfit for human consumption, such as horses that can no longer work." "1 British : a buyer of worn-out domestic animals or their carcasses for use especially as animal food or fertilizer." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knacker http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/knacker This is more of a British English or Irish English term, and rarely used in American vernacular. So no, it isn't usually a colloquialism of ours. It may be commonly used within certain family in-groups, however, of English or Irish origin. [ETA emoticons]

ExiledTyrant -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 6:26:13 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: FieryOpal ~ FR ~ I guess I'll go on record then, as a non-submissive, that I know I need my Significant Other. Not just want, not just desire, but need--and emotionally, I need for him to need me. It's one of those things you try to fight perhaps at different times in your life (especially when I was younger). You want to think of yourself as independent, as if being loved and loving others is an option. It isn't. At least not with me. I need it as much as I need air to breathe, food and water for physical sustenance. When you're married, you might not be as aware of your more vulnerable needs. You are, but you aren't as much with the ones that are getting filled or met. I have kids, I have pets, I have close friends. They can only fill a portion of my psychological needs. Being in a non-D/s relationship dynamic with a partner would also not fill many of my needs. I recognize them as needs and not merely as elective wants that I could take or leave. And in large part, it is because I do recognize and acknowledge this about myself that I can value my Significant Other all the more.[sm=2cents.gif] Well babe, it was bound to happen, but we are finally of different minds on a topic. I'm in control of every aspect of my life. I've always been anti-social, we'll go with anti-social, it's not entirely accurate, but we'll go that way because an anomaly would beg too much explanation. There is no aspect of my life that I do not control, financial, domestic, health, entertainment, blah blah blah. I cook better than most, clean more thoroughly than most, and do not need anyone to take on or over any aspect of my life. My life has been structured to cater to my needs, and I cater to my needs. I make the entire bed, but the idea of making half of it is kind of exciting. There is nothing, no part of my life that I need a /s for. I do want her, and knowing that she is with me because I want her, have no dependence on her, that it is simply the pleasure of her in my life that keeps her in my life should be a profound statement of her value to me. Me knowing that she is with me because she wants me and doesn't need me, would be quite profound to me. I want to be the prize, not life support, I want to be a partner, not an appendage, and I want the same of her, her to be my prize and partner. For not one moment that she is in my life will she ever be able to question my want of her. I have a "girl time" rule, I get 20 minutes a day that she is exclusive to me, sans distraction, she's in my lap and I will shower her in my want for her. I'm not needy and that comes with some assurances in itself (bear in mind I am poly and "her" infers them): Fidelity: I don't need to bolster my ego by poking my doink in anyone but her. Honesty: Not needing her precludes fear of loosing her, and I will not compromise my values by lying... about anything. It will always be what it is, how it is, and not manipulated, distorted, or omitted... names will not be changed to protect the innocent. Loyalty: It sounds suspiciously like the above, but I am loyal to the bone once that loyalty is earned. I will stand with her, right or wrong, to the end. However, if she's wrong, she'll hear about it, but I'll still stand with her. Some people have wondered where an /s fits within my selfish, self centered, my way or highway plan. She stands with me, beside me, not behind, beneath, or ahead. I have a life for her to join, I'm not joining her in her life. As most of you know, I am on the mainland waiting... my parents are on palliative care and I've been burying family member, 13 of them, for the last three years. It has been a rough go and I've been doing it alone. It hasn't been 13 people wasting away in a hospital... what brought me back here was my aunt was murdered three years ago, and the other 12 have been a mixture of sudden death and expiration dates, mostly sudden, shocking, and out of the blue. I do have a pretty fucked up life, right now, but I will go home at some point, and want a girl that I want to go with me. All things considered, the time for me to "need" someone has been the last three years. I'm at a point now where I am past grief and need of comfort. After my brother was killed I got pretty numb, now I just accept death and ask who I make the check out to. Jus sayin

Domnotlooking -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 9:44:52 AM)
You have been through hell. Your service to others is the foundation of a growing and great joy in your life up the road. In my deal, I put it all out there and she went with it. It happens, and hopefully to you.

IrishMist -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 9:56:59 AM)
Even though I DID read the whole thread, I am going to try and only answer the original posted, assumed? question lol. Expectations. I really hate that word in this context. Throughout my life, I have found that having expectations usually leads to disappointments. However, I am aware that, generally, most do have certain expectations that they want to have to met. I have always stated that I have no expectations of how someone else should 'present' themselves. Myself, on the other hand...I have some very high standards that I adhere to. Honesty; first and foremost, to myself. If I can't be honest with myself, I will not be honest with another. Loyalty. I support my family and friends...those who have earned the right to be called a friend...totally. I may disagree with them in private, but publicly, I will stand at their side in support. Honor. This one is more tricky because the word itself means different things to different people. For myself, it simply means that my behavior and my actions are of 'honorable' intentions, meant to harm no one. Trust. I trust myself; I trust that my instincts are good, that my intentions are good. I have rarely been disappointed. Because I hold these 4 things very high up in my life, they are also things that I look for in other people. Finding them, is a pleasant surprise; but not expected. Because you posted this in a 'relationship quest' kind of way, I can admit that I do not look for these things in a partner. Most, when you first meet them, whether online or in person, will hold parts of themselves back. Most would call this being dishonest; I call it being smart. Most have no issues with talking 'down' about past relationships. It's a defense mechanism; one used to make themselves both look and feel better. I see it as a lack of loyalty. I don't care if you and your ex parted on bad terms. The fact that they are an ex means at one time, you saw something in them that called to you ( you being a generalized term ) This lack of loyalty, for me, ties in with honorable behavior. And trust. Well, while most would claim that they trust their partner totally and completely, without reservations...I find myself not trusting those statements. So, while these are high on my list of my own requirements; they are not something I would impose on another. Relationships are hard enough. I, myself personally, see no reason to impose 'expectations' on someone. Let the relationship develop naturally, without any added restrictions. Just my opinion though.

ResidentSadist -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 10:14:23 AM)
To this day you still see people say, "no drugs, no kids, no criminal acts etc". To give a perspective on this, it is a left over because leather has it's roots in the gay community. They gay community was persecuted, prosecuted and even killed. The BDSMers, like homosexuals, were outcasts and what we did was illegal and/or immoral. So we when we did socialize, it was on the fringe of society where there was a strong criminal element, prostitution and drugs. The norm for expectations when meeting strangers was rather low. Things changed over time and like the homosexuality, laws and perspectives changed for the leather and BDSM world. Leather became more of a kink than a criminal sexual practice for the mentally ill. It gained a foothold and BDSM became a hetro interest. Community efforts brought education, workshops, decent books and soon expectations were high. There was and still is an effort to create a standard code of conduct and SSC banner was adopted. I think perspectives or perceptions of reasonable expectation and standards within the BDSM community depends on what era that person joined the lifestyle.

Kaliko -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 6:30:32 PM)
quote: There is nothing, no part of my life that I need a /s for. I do want her, and knowing that she is with me because I want her, have no dependence on her, that it is simply the pleasure of her in my life that keeps her in my life should be a profound statement of her value to me. Me knowing that she is with me because she wants me and doesn't need me, would be quite profound to me. I want to be the prize, not life support, I want to be a partner, not an appendage, and I want the same of her, her to be my prize and partner. For not one moment that she is in my life will she ever be able to question my want of her. I have a "girl time" rule, I get 20 minutes a day that she is exclusive to me, sans distraction, she's in my lap and I will shower her in my want for her. Well, that's a bit hyperbolic, don't you think? Needing someone now and then is vastly different than needing life support. I dealt with something tonight that put me very on edge. I was alone and had to deal with it and I did. It took a few hours, I muddled through it, everyone is happy and hopefully healthy, and I was a responsible adult and community member through the whole thing. But I won't say that I didn't let my mind spin out now and then and go into a dozen different "What if's?" I would have given just about anything to be in front of him for just five minutes for him to put his hands on my shoulders and give me some reassurance. Is that life support? Or is that just simply...loving somebody? Is it your expectation that your partners will never need reassurance or comfort from you? Never benefit from your strength?

Kaliko -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 6:35:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: IrishMist Relationships are hard enough. I, myself personally, see no reason to impose 'expectations' on someone. Let the relationship develop naturally, without any added restrictions. I fully agree. I don't always achieve my own desired state of not having expectations, but it's something I'm always working on. It gives me pause to consider that usually when I'm upset with somebody, it's because they didn't act the way that I expected them to act. Not because how they acted was necessarily wrong.

RockaRolla -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 6:45:06 PM)
My interpretation re: expectations was more in line with an individual's wants and needs in a relationship, to determine compatibility. Those seem pretty important. Example: I expect my partners to be honest and transparent with me. This is a "need" for me. I find it difficult to function well in a relationship if I'm constantly second guessing whether my partner is really OK with me, happy in the relationship, and there are no conflicts. If I find out later that there is a conflict and the partner's bringing it up months later, I'm going to get upset not least because I expected them to bring it up from the start. It isn't inherently wrong to expect things of your partners, especially if you plan for them to be long term. Granted, not having expectations means you're less likely to be disappointed, but you're also not likely to have your needs met.

ExiledTyrant -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 6:51:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kaliko Is it your expectation that your partners will never need reassurance or comfort from you? Never benefit from your strength? Nope. Are you assuming that since I am looking for an /s that I am only going to find weakness? That a Domme is going to be an independent tower of strength because that is who they are and /s's are miserable puddles of weakness? Because I do not "need" her, my life, happiness and well being doesn't revolve around her as the earth to the sun that I am incapable of praise, reassurance, gratitude, passion, and loving her with every fiber of my being, that's the theme, right? The only power I need over her is what she gives me. Given from a place of strength, not weakness, and definitely not because she is overwhelmed by the number of pasta's available for purchase and too fear stricken to buy one cuz it might be the wrong one, and needs my leadership and guidance to cope with the beastly supermarket. I am not interested in being the "fix" to someone's fucked up life. Naturally, I must be incapable of providing emotional support because I lack the humanity to seek a head-case disaster of a /s.

Domnotlooking -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 6:54:36 PM)
Getting a woman to: Be Poly Move to Hawaii Have babys is the mother of all request lists. I like your nerve. I ended up in a supposedly impossible relationship against some long odds so I say go for it.

GoddessManko -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 6:59:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant Because I do not "need" her, my life, happiness and well being doesn't revolve around her as the earth to the sun that I am incapable of praise, reassurance, gratitude, passion, and loving her with every fiber of my being, that's the theme, right? I am confused as well to some degree to be honest. I loved someone once with every fiber of my being. Well what I believe to be love because it was the most intense feeling I have ever felt in my life by far. It was unusual for me and I completely succumbed to it. I have loved before, I love my family immensely, but if we are talking "every fiber of one's being" that was it and being in a vacuum of said feelings and relationship is hard to describe. Imagine one day the sky is suddenly green, the trees are blue. It was that level of difference I felt in the way I saw the world. It was bizarre and I allowed myself to be vulnerable for the first time. How then is there not a need for such feeling to be requited. Of course it might end, and things go awry as things do but in that vacuum and state, isn't there an actual feeling of need?

Domnotlooking -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 7:03:54 PM)
On the other hand, this man is going through a lot of stress and is naturally inclined to be very self sufficient given his various houses on fire. I get it. Faced with a loving partner, he'd likely segue into a healthy interdependence.

GoddessManko -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 7:12:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Domnotlooking On the other hand, this man is going through a lot of stress and is naturally inclined to be very self sufficient given his various houses on fire. I get it. Faced with a loving partner, he'd likely segue into a healthy interdependence. Ah, so more thought, less irrationality. That is the quintessential I suppose. Got it. Yes, that fellow today is still convinced we're soulmates and I'm not entirely sure he's incorrect but we can never be together because he lacks what I require. So I am seeking about the same as Exiled at the moment. Something less intense, more compatibility based.

Domnotlooking -> RE: Reasonable Expectations (9/23/2014 7:22:05 PM)
Be grateful you both have the emotional strength not to leap at a every piece of bait like a deranged carp. Been there, done that.

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