RE: Why can't I reconcile these things??

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ExiledTyrant -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 3:24:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: YouName quote: ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant quote: ORIGINAL: HeartAndSoul31 I suspect it depends on the hobo, the bag and the stick he is toting. I mean that could trigger me listening to a hobo. He probably knows things I don't know. The hobo might be wiser then the therapist. As I said really depends on the hobo. Maybe he can fix a car too. That's a talented hobo. Naturally. Of course if said hobo is your friend he, by logical deduction, should be a clinical psychologist as well... or dentist, or zoologist, the uses of hobo's are unlimited. I think they get a bad wrap. Maybe you need to take off those glasses, Heart never mentioned anything about the hobo being his or her friend. Are you sure you want to play this particular game with me?

smileforme50 -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 4:56:38 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bhruic quote: ORIGINAL: DesFIP And you are totally incorrect about how easy it is to scam a top quality clinical psychiatrist. Hell, even the social workers I know would see through you after just a couple of years in business. Very few people are seeing top quality clinical psychiatrists. Most are seeing analytical psychotherapists. And fewer still will stick with any kind of therapy for a prolonged period of time. I have some experience with both psychiatrists and psychotherapists... and my sister was a psychotherapist and then a psychiatrist. It is not as hard as you think. Sure... they will see your superficial issues, or the symptoms of them... but they are not mind readers, or omniscient... and if you are not honest with them, the underlying basis for your issues will remain your secret... and your issues will remain unresolved, or will be worsened by the experience. Which basically means you would just be shooting yourself in the foot. Which brings us back to the fact that it DOES work if the patient wants it to work and puts some effort into it. I shake my head at people like YouName because they just don't want it to work. They would rather try to get pity and attention from family and friends That's their problem and their fault. If they want to shoot themselves in the foot, be my guest.....just don't ask for attention or pity from people.

smileforme50 -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 5:03:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant quote: ORIGINAL: YouName quote: ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant quote: ORIGINAL: HeartAndSoul31 I suspect it depends on the hobo, the bag and the stick he is toting. I mean that could trigger me listening to a hobo. He probably knows things I don't know. The hobo might be wiser then the therapist. As I said really depends on the hobo. Maybe he can fix a car too. That's a talented hobo. Naturally. Of course if said hobo is your friend he, by logical deduction, should be a clinical psychologist as well... or dentist, or zoologist, the uses of hobo's are unlimited. I think they get a bad wrap. Maybe you need to take off those glasses, Heart never mentioned anything about the hobo being his or her friend. Are you sure you want to play this particular game with me? [sm=poke.gif] [sm=rofl.gif] I had a feeling that was going to be ET's response. My money is on ET....and I wanna sell tickets!! [sm=pompom.gif]

shiftyw -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 9:14:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: smileforme50 quote: ORIGINAL: Bhruic quote: ORIGINAL: DesFIP And you are totally incorrect about how easy it is to scam a top quality clinical psychiatrist. Hell, even the social workers I know would see through you after just a couple of years in business. Very few people are seeing top quality clinical psychiatrists. Most are seeing analytical psychotherapists. And fewer still will stick with any kind of therapy for a prolonged period of time. I have some experience with both psychiatrists and psychotherapists... and my sister was a psychotherapist and then a psychiatrist. It is not as hard as you think. Sure... they will see your superficial issues, or the symptoms of them... but they are not mind readers, or omniscient... and if you are not honest with them, the underlying basis for your issues will remain your secret... and your issues will remain unresolved, or will be worsened by the experience. Which basically means you would just be shooting yourself in the foot. Which brings us back to the fact that it DOES work if the patient wants it to work and puts some effort into it. I shake my head at people like YouName because they just don't want it to work. They would rather try to get pity and attention from family and friends That's their problem and their fault. If they want to shoot themselves in the foot, be my guest.....just don't ask for attention or pity from people. bingo bango. as someone who has been in Therapy now for....6 yearsish pretty steadily (short breaks because of moves or financials) I can really say- when I put forth real effort- I get real results. I see a psychiatrist (now)- and a therapist- I'd actually like to find myself in group therapy again- because that is where I really thrived. But scheduling right now isn't really allowing that.

RedMagic1 -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 11:10:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: smileforme50 As of late, I've been reading a bit of kinky fiction. Right now I'm reading something called "The Reluctant Dom". It's about a man whose best friend informs him that he is terminally ill. This friend then also tells him that since he won't be around much longer, he is looking for someone to take care of his wife after he is gone.......and he wants it to be him. THEN he finds out that this couple is M/s....and what they really want is for him to take over as her Master. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Anyway ..... The particular story isn't important to my question, but it did make me conscious of this issue that I want to ask about. Now..... I'm discovering that I am pretty damned submissive. Toy shock I may even be happy as a slave. I'm discovering that I have very little resistance to a Dominant once I feel I can trust him. I'm finding myself very easily doing things that, if you would have asked me 5 years ago I would have said "FUCK NO!!! ". ~~~~~~ BUT.... I've noticed that when I read about these things....when I read about other women being submissive to men .... When I read about them kneeling and calling them "Sir" or "Master"......and ESPECIALLY when I hear about them doing something......hmmmm.... Maybe not necessarily in " punishment" but maybe in terms of further training or "maintenance"...... I find myself getting irritated.....almost angry. "WTF is she doing and why is she doing it for that jerk? Why doesn't she just tell him to fuck off?!?!?!?!?!!! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Yet at the same time it's usually something I would probably do if a Dom I liked and trusted wanted me to do. Does this make any damned sense to anybody????? Maybe it's as simple as you not trusting the male characters in the fiction you're reading. Hell, Edward in Twilight is a creeping fuckhead. It's a much healthier response to not-trust someone like that, than it is to say that he's so dreamy get the mop.

YouName -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 3:51:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant quote: ORIGINAL: YouName quote: ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant quote: ORIGINAL: HeartAndSoul31 I suspect it depends on the hobo, the bag and the stick he is toting. I mean that could trigger me listening to a hobo. He probably knows things I don't know. The hobo might be wiser then the therapist. As I said really depends on the hobo. Maybe he can fix a car too. That's a talented hobo. Naturally. Of course if said hobo is your friend he, by logical deduction, should be a clinical psychologist as well... or dentist, or zoologist, the uses of hobo's are unlimited. I think they get a bad wrap. Maybe you need to take off those glasses, Heart never mentioned anything about the hobo being his or her friend. Are you sure you want to play this particular game with me? Your petty argument that the hobo doesn't have a degree but the psychologist does misses the whole point that Bhruic has so kindly explained to you. But no, Im not interested in even continuing this discussion as Im not learning anything and possibly making some people a bit upset. So lets leave it.

ExiledTyrant -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 4:16:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: YouName Your petty argument that the hobo doesn't have a degree but the psychologist does misses the whole point that Bhruic has so kindly explained to you. But no, Im not interested in even continuing this discussion as Im not learning anything and possibly making some people a bit upset. So lets leave it. Very wise decision.

YouName -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 4:25:44 PM)
I enjoy the sport though last time we played didn't lead anywhere but to a wall of boredom and hollowness. It's a bit of an anti-climax to learn that we never even agreed to begin with, your point was just that people need to open themselves (surrender?) for it to work while I thought you dwelled a bit deeper into at first. PS If I got you wrong feel free to correct me, it's just what I deduct from your comments on the rest of my posts.

ExiledTyrant -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 4:30:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: YouName I enjoy the sport though last time we played didn't lead anywhere but to a wall of boredom and hollowness. It's a bit of an anti-climax to learn that never even agreed to begin with, your point was just that people need to open themselves (surrender?) for it to work while I thought you dwelled a bit deeper into at first. That's because you do not understand what it means. That's okay though, I understand your disdain and contempt of psychology, but you are not an island. The placebo market booms in pharmacology because it works.

YouName -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 4:36:37 PM)
I don't take lightly to people actually trying to insult my intelligence and I really haven't found much worthwhile in your posts up until that one and the one that followed. So if you would be so kind ,explain to me what it is that you think I do not understand. You see, the later part of this post above points me into the direction that I thought you were hinting at first. But your disdain for my criticism of the profession makes me question your intelligence.

YouName -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 4:52:31 PM)
Alright let me put it this way~ You don't care if they sell holy water tapped from the kitchen as long as it helps people feel blessed even though they wouldn't need the holy water nor blessing if the church was a kinder place?

ExiledTyrant -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 4:56:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: YouName Alright let me put it this way~ You don't care if they sell holy water tapped from the kitchen as long as it helps people feel blessed even though they wouldn't need the holy water nor blessing if the church was a kinder place? How long have you been a student of the English language?

YouName -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 5:04:24 PM)
So insulting my intelligence is not enough, you have to aim for my language skills? Sigh. Ive never studied it at any serious level. Meh,this leads nowhere. Bon Voyage.

ExiledTyrant -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 5:15:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: YouName So insulting my intelligence is not enough, you have to aim for my language skills? Sigh. Ive never studied it at any serious level. I'm not insulting your intelligence in any way. I am denying its existence. You are mired in solipsism for some peculiar reason... mommy loved you too much, not enough, dad was gone all the time, or home all the time. What ever event that occurred in your life to give you such bitter contempt for psychology, we will never know. Your solipsistic identity will never allow you to reconcile all the issues you are carrying around and WIITWD may quell the demon screaming in your head, but it will never purge it. You are fairly transparent, and as much as I wanted to avoid doing this to you, you never learned not to touch the stove, did ya? Now, you have a choice. You can leave it be, or I can continue to drag your demons out here and put them on parade.

YouName -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 5:26:17 PM)
Projection is a nasty quality. Try to avoid it. My contempt for it is born out of pity first and empathy second. For your sake I have to add that this is the opposite of solipsism, you petty narcissist. All your posts here point to the direction of a man obsessed with having the attention of others and the subject of other things turned towards him. Each topic is invaded by you with a smirk and some playful wit in hopes of eliciting a response that acknowledges you. How ironic that you are to even present a critique of my persona in light of your wretched self.

Moderator3 -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 5:35:48 PM)
I would like you all to take a look at what section you're in. This is not feisty and I am not moving it to feisty. Shall we take a step back? Please. If you are unaware, I do one warning at the most, unless I repost my warning on another page so that it is seen. Thank you

Gauge -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 6:12:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: YouName I don't trust the concept of modern psychology or at least that it is worth anything more than what you or especially you and a good friend can achieve on your own. As someone who had problems with mental illness, and someone who has been in a lot of talk therapy, I can tell you that my friends or family didn't have a clue how to help me resolve the serious problems I have had. Professionals serve a purpose for some people, that they do not serve your purpose is irrelevant to that fact. quote: I believe it at best the psychological profession is a product of a failed society where even true friendship has become commercialised and at worst a scam. This is a ridiculous belief. People who seek answers can benefit from psychotherapy, and can also benefit from the advice of friends, but those people are seeking answers. Interestingly enough, even if society had all the answers, there would still be people who have to learn to deal with problems. Pointing to a failed society as the causality of the need for psychotherapy is a bit ambiguous. quote: Also, I do not want the objectivity of a non-acquaintance to offer me advice as per their occupation. In that case I'd rather take the advice of several strangers on the street. Sometimes it takes someone who doesn't know you to see right through you. Your friends and family will not always tell you what you need to hear. A professional can, and will. Whether or not you choose to hear it and act upon the advice is up to you. Again, it works for those that truly seek answers to problems. quote: I'd surely take the Hobos advice over the psychologists. Answers to problems can come from a myriad of places. To discount one over the other is pure hubris. quote: But most therapies aren't really bad...they are just missing the point. So, you are hedging your initial stance that it is all garbage? Some people go to a therapist to be listened to, they use it to placate themselves or they seek validation. Others actually commit to finding out the truth and working hard to make changes in their lives. And still others don't know why they are there at all. quote: I would say that going to a councillor is somewhat comforting and helpful, going to a psychiatrist may be necessary and going to a psychologist is probably neither in comparison .but that's from my perspective, if it helps you, great. If it helps someone, doesn't that defeat your position even further? Whether or not it works for you is irrelevant to the system as a whole is it not? If people can benefit from it, then why does it matter where they get help? You are welcome to your opinions about psychotherapy, and psychiatry. Just as some have had opinions as to whether or not an airplane can fly, it does not invalidate the fact that airplanes, in fact, do fly. How someone gets answers that help them deal with their daily life is less important than the fact that they get answers that help them.

DesFIP -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 6:17:34 PM)
Hell, if you go to the doctor because you have pains in your chest but deliberately don't tell the doctor about them, you aren't going to be helped. No difference between this and working a therapeutic program. If the doctor gives you a scrip for hypertension meds and you don't fill it, or fill it but don't take them daily according to the instructions, it's no good saying that all doctors are fakes when you have that heart attack or stroke. In illnesses of the body or the brain, compliance and the will of the patient to do their best is essential.

YouName -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 6:18:34 PM)
Gauge> No, because the issue I have with it is not whether or not it can help someone at some time. I decline trying to explain this any further. I could give you blatant analogies but they are probably not worth anything.

Gauge -> RE: Why can't I reconcile these things?? (11/20/2014 6:23:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: YouName No, because the issue I have with it is not whether or not it can help someone at some time. Sounded like that to me. quote: I decline trying to explain this any further. I could give you blatant analogies but they are probably not worth anything. I would tend to agree with you.

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