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RE: Initiating sex - 12/12/2014 3:02:30 PM   
NookieNotes


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent
I'm struggling to grasp how anyone could feel rejected by someone else not wanting sex. That's life: one day we want cabbage and the next cauliflower.


Because it's not about sex, sometimes, it's about sex with you, in particular.


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RE: Initiating sex - 12/12/2014 3:16:57 PM   
NorthernGent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NookieNotes


quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent
I'm struggling to grasp how anyone could feel rejected by someone else not wanting sex. That's life: one day we want cabbage and the next cauliflower.


Because it's not about sex, sometimes, it's about sex with you, in particular.



Well, yes, I'd like to think that we're having sex because she likes me and it's an important part of our relationship.

Still, it is possible that one day you just don't fancy sex for whatever reason, and it's not a reason to feel rejected.

I think the importance here is that people set their stall out upfront in honest, open communication.




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RE: Initiating sex - 12/12/2014 3:21:02 PM   
sexyred1


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Status: offline 		Don't be dense. No matter how much you try and communicate, sex touches an emotional place for people.

Both men and women feel rejected and insecure if their partner turns down sex.

Should they feel that way?

Depends on the circumstances.

Is it logical if someone is too tired for sex that their partner feels bad, of course not.

But humans behave in a human way, so this should not shock you.

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/12/2014 3:28:35 PM   
NorthernGent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

Don't be dense. No matter how much you try and communicate, sex touches an emotional place for people.

Both men and women feel rejected and insecure if their partner turns down sex.

Should they feel that way?

Depends on the circumstances.

Is it logical if someone is too tired for sex that their partner feels bad, of course not.

But humans behave in a human way, so this should not shock you.





Shocked, SexyRed1?!

I can absolutely cast-iron guarantee that I would not feel rejected if a woman turned me down. As someone 40 years old I can assure you I've been turned down on many an occasion. I can think of at least one occasion where I've had a woman openly say in a club in front of my mates and a lot of other people: "sorry, mate, you're too short".

So what? You've got to be in it to win it and can't win 'em all.

Does this mean you wander around thinking you're always going to get what you want?





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RE: Initiating sex - 12/12/2014 3:33:46 PM   
sexyred1


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Status: offline 		I did not say that you or I would feel rejected or expect to always get what we want.

I just have experienced partners getting way too upset and angry if I was tired or sick (I once had a horrid migraine and said no to my ex. You would have thought someone shot him.)

And I know lots of women who think men never say no and feel rejected when they do.

People are emotional basket cases quite often, even if they are sensible most of the time.

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/12/2014 3:39:28 PM   
NorthernGent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

People are emotional basket cases quite often, even if they are sensible most of the time.



This is thing about communication I mentioned earlier.

Within reason I'm a patient person, but an 'emotional basket case' really should not be with me.

This won't go down well, but I would add that there may be something wrong, and underlying, with any relationship where one partner feels rejected in such a situation.



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RE: Initiating sex - 12/12/2014 3:46:58 PM   
sexyred1


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Status: offline 		I agree with you 100%

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/12/2014 4:04:51 PM   
NorthernGent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

I agree with you 100%



Grand.

Oh, and you probably should have shot him.


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Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/12/2014 5:50:44 PM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

I believe Michael is saying that all in all, simply getting a submissive is not as fulfilling as find a girl who is a partner as well as a submissive, and who understands her role as supportive partner as well as her role of submissive girl.

I'm sure he'll correct my observation if I'm incorrect in my take.

And incidentally, I agree with him.

I don't understand how the role as a supportive partner includes initiating sex. How does initiating sex offer support?
For me, I always feel like if I had to ask my partner for sex, it indicates that his sick of having sex with me, so sick of having sex with me that I actually got to ask for it. And after I ask for it, the thought would be in my head that his having sex with me out of obligation, so I would not be able to enjoy the experience anymore. I just cannot comprehend the idea of a man being sexually interested in a woman and then not wanting to take the lead.

But perhaps, it's about compatibility, I would definitely need to be with a man who wants and demands every single day, at the very least once a day. Otherwise, I will not be happy, and it will feel like a sexless relationship. I do relate to how much sexual attentions a man gives me, to how much he desires me.

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 12/12/2014 5:55:45 PM >

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/13/2014 2:14:30 AM   
NookieNotes


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

Well, yes, I'd like to think that we're having sex because she likes me and it's an important part of our relationship.

Still, it is possible that one day you just don't fancy sex for whatever reason, and it's not a reason to feel rejected.



I'm not debating with you. I agree with you. Here is a point, made perfectly for me, though:

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

For me, I always feel like if I had to ask my partner for sex, it indicates that his sick of having sex with me, so sick of having sex with me that I actually got to ask for it. And after I ask for it, the thought would be in my head that his having sex with me out of obligation, so I would not be able to enjoy the experience anymore.


See?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

But perhaps, it's about compatibility, I would definitely need to be with a man who wants and demands every single day, at the very least once a day. Otherwise, I will not be happy, and it will feel like a sexless relationship. I do relate to how much sexual attentions a man gives me, to how much he desires me.


Greta, you put a lot of expectations on this ideal man you've never met. I feel for anyone trying to fill those shoes.

People are human. They will want you to take your own actions sometimes. There will be days (sometimes weeks (gasp!) that they just don't want to have sex.

And, IT WILL HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU.

This is what I find interesting about your idealized interactions. You want him to have all the responsibility (ie: initiating sex), but it's not about him. It's about his desire for you, and showing it in exactly the way, and at least exactly the frequency that you require.

Is he dominant? Or is he just fitting a mold?

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/13/2014 3:42:37 AM   
NorthernGent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


But perhaps, it's about compatibility, I would definitely need to be with a man who wants and demands every single day, at the very least once a day. Otherwise, I will not be happy, and it will feel like a sexless relationship. I do relate to how much sexual attentions a man gives me, to how much he desires me.



Couldn't agree more: it certainly is about compatibility.

I think it's incumbent on any reasonable person to say what they are so that two people can come to an understanding.

Any man without a reasonable sex drive is not for you? Absolutely nothing wrong with that, and best to get these things out the way early rather than let them fester: you can either go your separate ways or stay together, and the earlier this is done the less damage done.

We all have things in our life that are very important to us, and in the event you're not getting what you need then understandably it isn't going to make for a great relationship.



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Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/13/2014 3:46:15 AM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NookieNotes
Greta, you put a lot of expectations on this ideal man you've never met. I feel for anyone trying to fill those shoes.

People are human. They will want you to take your own actions sometimes. There will be days (sometimes weeks (gasp!) that they just don't want to have sex.


If they don't want to have sex, then what's the point of me taking any action? Since I should not pressure him to have sex when he does not want to have sex? Right?
By taking any action to force him to have sex with me is pressuring him for sex. On top of that, male rape is possible precisely because you can force an errection out of him against his will, so if he doesn't initiate, how the hell would I know if he wants sex or not? I don't want to force him to have sex with me.


AS a submissive, my role is to have sex with my master whenever HE WANTS it, I would never say no to sex, even if I'm not in the mood or sick or bleeding or anything, I would NEVER say no to sex, unless I'm sick to the point of the doctor telling me it's life threatening if I had sex. But of course, due to this lifestyle I want, I am not gonna be happy with a master who doesn't have sex with me once a day. I want a dominant male because there is a good amount of them with huge sexual drive, that's why they are drawn to the idea of having a sex slave. Can't find them in the vanilla world as seriously, vanilla men in my experience have very low sex drive.

It took a dominant to match up to my drive, as it's the whole orientation. They loving having a live sex toy to play with 24/7 and I enjoy being available 24/7 for his use.

There are all these men out there who "self proclaim" they want daily sex and complaining women don't want enough sex, I just want one of those and hope they can live up to their "claims".

I am very upfront about my expectations on the sexual arena, so any man who doesn't think this is wonderful and dread the prospect of daily sex with me would ever be my dom anyway. A man who naturally has the sex drive to fit me, is gonna love the match.

There isn't any pressure. It's about compatibility. A man who doesn't like alot of sex shouldn't be with me, as simple as that, dom or vanilla.


< Message edited by Greta75 -- 12/13/2014 4:00:19 AM >

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/13/2014 4:03:08 AM   
Greta75


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Status: offline 		Also, if a man is not initiating sex, clearly his not in the mood. As I cannot even imagine a dominant in the mood for sex, but just sitting and waiting at the corner, wondering when the hell is his sub gonna start asking for sex, and if she does not ask, then he will deprive himself of sex for that day? Wow! That is not the kind of dominant I want. He owns my body, he takes it when it wants it. And you gotta force it to make it happen by tempting him, seducing him, getting him in the mood. It's manipulation. I just don't like that dynamic in my relationship. IF he doesn't want sex, I don't get sex, and I don't do anything about it, as simple as that. AFter all, if he naturally can't feel the desire to have as much sex as I like, then, clearly our sex drives differ, then I would just part with him. He deserves a woman who has the same sex drive as him. I just need someone who is like me, who dreams of having sex everyday, like me. I mean I've lived it, I've experienced it, I know doms like that exist. That MUST be another male dom out there who wants sex EVERYDAY! There MUST BE at least another one for me who wants what I want, so we fit and make each other happy.



< Message edited by Greta75 -- 12/13/2014 4:09:26 AM >

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/13/2014 5:55:17 AM   
smileforme50


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SweetForDaddy


Also, wasn't suggesting that doing something purely for someone else didn't give me some kind of satisfaction, but theres different kinds of satisfaction. Blow-jobs almost always go down well (boom boom), but initiating other types of play haven't been so well received in my experience.


I've been with a couple of guys like this and it's frustrating as hell. Sure.....they will never turn down a blow job....but to hope that maybe he might respond back to me?? MY GOD....THAT'S NOT BEING SUBMISSIVE!!!

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/13/2014 5:57:07 AM   
smileforme50


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

I wouldn't be with someone who didn't want me to initiAte or plan sometimes.

If I am hot for you, you are lucky, so appreciate it!



DAMN RIGHT!!!

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/13/2014 7:11:45 AM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: smileforme50
I've been with a couple of guys like this and it's frustrating as hell. Sure.....they will never turn down a blow job....but to hope that maybe he might respond back to me?? MY GOD....THAT'S NOT BEING SUBMISSIVE!!!

Okay, so maybe what those men are talking about is not that they want sex everyday. They just want a blowjob everyday. And I have no problems with blowjob as many times a day as they like as long as I am getting sex everyday!

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/13/2014 7:13:59 AM   
Greta75


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quote:

I wouldn't be with someone who didn't want me to initiAte or plan sometimes.

I differentiate between initiating and planning.

Planning is not initiating, because it's pre-discussed with your dominant what's ya gonna do, and preparations with all his approval. That I can do.

But initiating means, dominant does not want to touch me at all, all day, and I bug him for sex. That for me, is a no no.

Unless my dominant tells me, his like me, and he wants sex anytime, so I can ask for it whenever I want, and he loves it. Now, his ordered me to ask him for sex, and given permission, then I will do it.

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 12/13/2014 7:15:13 AM >

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/13/2014 7:57:35 AM   
Kaliko


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

I don't understand this part. If a submissive already made it clear to you that you are her sex god and she's dying for you sexually 24/7, why wouldn't you feel wanted?





Well, when someone already makes it clear that they are in love with you, do you only need to hear it once and never need to hear it again? Technically, maybe yes. But, is it nice to hear it again now and then? My answer is yes.

Same with feeling wanted, I think.

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/13/2014 8:26:45 AM   
InHisHeart


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

Planning is not initiating, because it's pre-discussed with your dominant what's ya gonna do, and preparations with all his approval. That I can do.

But initiating means, dominant does not want to touch me at all, all day, and I bug him for sex. That for me, is a no no.

Unless my dominant tells me, his like me, and he wants sex anytime, so I can ask for it whenever I want, and he loves it. Now, his ordered me to ask him for sex, and given permission, then I will do it.


Why do you think initiating sex equates to bug him for sex or it means he didn't want to touch you all day? I initiate but I don't bug him, I will physically or verbally initiate sex and if he doesn't want it, he can say no and that's that. I've also planned sex without his knowledge, again if he doesn't want to, he doesn't.

In reply to your other post. "Also, if a man is not initiating sex, clearly his not in the mood." Just because I initiate at times doesn't mean he's not in the mood for sex. He could have other things on his mind, he might be doing something else, he could be sleeping and I'm awake so I wake him up for sex, he could walk in the door and I initiate before he has his coat off, it could be.........

"As I cannot even imagine a dominant in the mood for sex, but just sitting and waiting at the corner, wondering when the hell is his sub gonna start asking for sex, and if she does not ask, then he will deprive himself of sex for that day? Wow! That is not the kind of dominant I want." My Dom never sat around waiting for me to initiate sex and if I don't initiate, he deprives himself. Whenever he wants it, he takes it. When I want it, I also don't sit around waiting for him, I'll initiate it and if he doesn't want it then I don't get it.

If he told me he never wants me to initiate then I wouldn't but he also wouldn't be the right Dom for me. He loves when I initiate, he thinks it's hot and sexy, he loves the thought that I crave him and want sex with him and I'm not just having sex with him because he's the Dom and takes it when he wants it.

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RE: Initiating sex - 12/13/2014 8:36:55 AM   
NookieNotes


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

By taking any action to force him to have sex with me is pressuring him for sex. On top of that, male rape is possible precisely because you can force an errection out of him against his will, so if he doesn't initiate, how the hell would I know if he wants sex or not? I don't want to force him to have sex with me.


Initiation is not forcing. No one here is talking about any sort of forcing except you.

in·i·ti·ate
verb
iˈniSHēˌāt/
1. cause (a process or action) to begin.

In other words, start it with a hug, or kiss, or body rub, or gentle caress to his uber-domly-stick. Not making him hard and riding him against his will.

And in any case, you missed my point.

quote:

ORIGINAL: NookieNotes
This is what I find interesting about your idealized interactions. You want him to have all the responsibility (ie: initiating sex), but it's not about him. It's about his desire for you, and showing it in exactly the way, and at least exactly the frequency that you require.

Is he dominant? Or is he just fitting a mold?


And to be clear, I know plenty of men who have sex regularly with people they do not really desire, because they are simply wired that way, maybe addicted, although I'm not sure where to draw that line.

I find it fascinating that YOUR determination of his desire for you is that he take sex from you X number of time per X days/months/years.

Seems like a dominant would just have sex when he wanted it, and your would therefore, by your own words:

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

I don't understand this part. If a submissive already made it clear to you that you are her sex god and she's dying for you sexually 24/7, why wouldn't you feel wanted?


I don't understand this part. If a dominant already made it clear to you that you are his sex toy and he's dying for you sexually 24/7, why wouldn't you feel wanted?

Why would you then need sex on your schedule?

Seems like that contradicts your statement:

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

I do relate to how much sexual attentions a man gives me, to how much he desires me.


Now, I'm not trying to attack or criticize you, and I'm sorry if it feels that way. To me, it seems like you are contradicting yourself and what you say you want.

I think it goes back to the other conversation about you being submissive but not seeming so to some on the boards.

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