RE: Another "successful" carry story

RE: Another "successful" carry story (Full Version)

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BamaD -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 6:59:06 PM)
FD I saw on as the collar turns that someone thought he would have just waited for the police if not for his ego. So he is supposed to either sit there and watch the woman be beaten or actually display ego and assume that if he asks the guy to stop he will. PS The police said he handled things properly.

CreativeDominant -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 7:25:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery All of which was handled without a firearm, except for ego-boy standing his ground with a gun, instead of just backing off and waiting for the police. All too often, people with guns look for reasons to use them. Do you honestly think...given the hostility the "beater" was showing the man...that the "beater" just would have stopped if the man had NOT had a gun? Nice how you...instead of complimenting the gun owner's calm manner and capable handling of the situation...find a way to demean other gun owners.

BamaD -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 7:28:57 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery All of which was handled without a firearm, except for ego-boy standing his ground with a gun, instead of just backing off and waiting for the police. All too often, people with guns look for reasons to use them. Do you honestly think...given the hostility the "beater" was showing the man...that the "beater" just would have stopped if the man had NOT had a gun? Nice how you...instead of complimenting the gun owner's calm manner and capable handling of the situation...find a way to demean other gun owners. Looking for a reason to use them equates to shooting someone. He used his to stop violence. Maybe he figures that being beaten for another 10-15 minutes would be no big deal for the victim.

slvemike4u -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 8:05:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic Im waiting for a mother taking a swimming pool to walmart and drown cos her kid pushed her in Aylee,that's your cue ....

thishereboi -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 8:10:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery All of which was handled without a firearm, except for ego-boy standing his ground with a gun, instead of just backing off and waiting for the police. All too often, people with guns look for reasons to use them. He said "When the beater became hostile toward the husband he used his firearm to "persuade" the beater to cease and wait for the police." so enlighten us, how do you use a firearm to persuade someone without using the firearm?

Musicmystery -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 8:16:31 PM)
Exactly--he wasn't still beating anyone. He was hostile toward the husband. Meanwhile, the police are on the way. It's handled. Except for the Rambo wannabes.

BamaD -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 8:36:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Exactly--he wasn't still beating anyone. He was hostile toward the husband. Meanwhile, the police are on the way. It's handled. Except for the Rambo wannabes. And threatening to beat up the husband. The husband leaves he goes back to beating the woman he doesn't leave the guy proceeds to beat the husband. Are you saying he should have taken his beating, or engaged in a fistfight with his wife's safety at stake? BTW the cops said he handled it correctly, but I guess you think you know more about these things than the cops at the scene.

Kirata -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 8:58:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery the police are on the way. It's handled. It isn't "handled" until they arrive. K.

ThirdWheelWanted -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 9:09:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery quote: ORIGINAL: Sanity quote: ORIGINAL: tj444 I wonder how the surviving parent/family will deal with the fact that the baby killed his mother.. will they ever tell the kid when he gets older? How do you that? How will he feel when he is old enough to grasp what he did? You treat it just like you would with any other accident Unless you really believe that this particular accident is heinous on the babys part because a gun was involved I believe this particular heinous accident was entirely preventable by responsible gun ownership. Well except that your definition of "responsible gun ownership" seems to be that no one but police should carry, ever. (Which is odd, since you're also one of the folks always telling us that the police are constantly abusing their authority.) This was a stupid accident. A child reached into a purse, and pulled out the mother's gun. Maybe the mother could have been more attentive. Maybe she should have found a better way to carry with a toddler around. Maybe she shouldn't have carried at all with a toddler around. Hard to say, since we don't know why she chose to carry in the first place.

ThirdWheelWanted -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 9:14:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery All of which was handled without a firearm, except for ego-boy standing his ground with a gun, instead of just backing off and waiting for the police. All too often, people with guns look for reasons to use them. Wow, so in your world they should have just stood there and watched as the man continued beating the woman till the police arrived? Cause they'd have gotten there eventually. What's another few minutes of getting beaten? What's your problem with the way this was handled? No one was killed. The man was stopped from beating a woman. She's alive. He's in jail. You can call people ego-boy all you'd like, but he may have saved that woman's life, and I don't see a problem with that. If you do, then I really have to ask what's wrong with the way you see the world. quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Except for the Rambo wannabes. No bullets fired. No one shot. Beating averted. Oh yeah, very Ramboesque. Bet they'll be making that into an action movie any day now.

DaddySatyr -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 9:23:10 PM)
In his world, the husband should have taken the beating until the cops got there. Michael

BamaD -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 9:32:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThirdWheelWanted quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery quote: ORIGINAL: Sanity quote: ORIGINAL: tj444 I wonder how the surviving parent/family will deal with the fact that the baby killed his mother.. will they ever tell the kid when he gets older? How do you that? How will he feel when he is old enough to grasp what he did? You treat it just like you would with any other accident Unless you really believe that this particular accident is heinous on the babys part because a gun was involved I believe this particular heinous accident was entirely preventable by responsible gun ownership. Well except that your definition of "responsible gun ownership" seems to be that no one but police should carry, ever. (Which is odd, since you're also one of the folks always telling us that the police are constantly abusing their authority.) This was a stupid accident. A child reached into a purse, and pulled out the mother's gun. Maybe the mother could have been more attentive. Maybe she should have found a better way to carry with a toddler around. Maybe she shouldn't have carried at all with a toddler around. Hard to say, since we don't know why she chose to carry in the first place. Personally I believe that if you carry the firearm should always be in your direct control. If she was going to keep it in her purse she should have kept the purse on her.

ThirdWheelWanted -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/18/2015 10:02:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD Personally I believe that if you carry the firearm should always be in your direct control. If she was going to keep it in her purse she should have kept the purse on her. Had she put the purse down? I was looking, and couldn't find any source that said whether she still had it on her shoulder, or if it wasn't.

tweakabelle -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/19/2015 2:12:47 AM)
Has the question of whether the gun's safety was on or off been clarified? It seems so obvious to insist that the safety mechanism should have been on, though it seems just as obvious that (a) the gun was fired; and (b) an infant wouldn't be able to release the safety before firing the weapon, both of which suggest that the mechanism wasn't in position. If the safety wasn't in position, then it would appear that this woman's errors were twofold - leaving the gun in a position where a child could access it and failing to ensure that the safety was on. While I personally feel that these errors are deplorable, the second is the kind of thing that a stressed busy mother with an infant could so easily overlook. No amount of training or education will guarantee prevention of the first of these errors, while anyone who fails to ensure that loaded guns have their safety mechanisms deployed, (especially when there are children around) is clearly not a person responsible enough to be handling firearms. Eliminating these levels of incompetence and/or negligence seems impossible so tightening gun laws seems the only viable option if we wish to stop repetitions of this tragedy occurring.

ThirdWheelWanted -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/19/2015 3:23:46 AM)
The problem with this question is, there's no guarantee that it even had a safety. Some do, some don't. I prefer SIGs, they don't have safeties. For me, this simplifies things. If the gun is in the holster I know that it's loaded and there's no safety to worry about. But then I don't drop mine into a purse. I checked on the S&W M&P Shield that she was carrying, they have two basic variants within each model, one with and one without a thumb-safety. So unless pictures of the actual gun she had are released, I doubt we'll ever know. A few things though. You said that the child was an infant, but most accounts state it was a toddler. That's two very different things. Depending on the gun, some toddlers could easily work the safety. It's just a switch that clicks up and down. Most don't require that much pressure, since they want them to be easy to operate in an emergency. (The M&P looks trickier, but it's still just a switch.) Hell, the way they click, they even sound like some children's toys. The way kids will grab something and start poking and prodding at them, I can see this happening. No offense, but there's no way to guarantee that children won't get hurt ever. That's called life. I realize that we want to pretend we can wrap children up in batting and make them perfectly safe, but that's just not the case. No matter what, your go to solution is more and stricter gun laws. It doesn't matter what happened, you're happy to use any incident with a gun as an excuse to make guns harder to get. Because you just don't like people having them.

Musicmystery -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/19/2015 4:24:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThirdWheelWanted Well except that your definition of "responsible gun ownership" seems to be that no one but police should carry, ever. Nope. quote: (Which is odd, since you're also one of the folks always telling us that the police are constantly abusing their authority.) Nope. quote: This was a stupid accident. A child reached into a purse, and pulled out the mother's gun. Maybe the mother could have been more attentive. Maybe she should have found a better way to carry with a toddler around. Maybe she shouldn't have carried at all with a toddler around. Hard to say, since we don't know why she chose to carry in the first place. This is where knee-jerk gun-nuttery defense rolls in. It's a toddler. A toddler! With no safety provisions but a toddler can just reach in and fire. Rambo ready gun.

PeonForHer -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/19/2015 5:25:02 AM)
quote: This is where knee-jerk gun-nuttery defense rolls in. It's a toddler. A toddler! With no safety provisions but a toddler can just reach in and fire. Rambo ready gun . I've got to say - as someone who finds this kind of tragedy utterly alien to him and his non-gun-culture - if they can make cheap plastic bottles with caps that toddlers can't get off, how come something similar can't be done effectively and economically with the safety catches of much more expensive firearms?

thishereboi -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/19/2015 5:44:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Exactly--he wasn't still beating anyone. He was hostile toward the husband. Meanwhile, the police are on the way. It's handled. Except for the Rambo wannabes. No he wasn't beating anyone because some guy was holding a gun on him, which begs the question, why did you start your post with "All of which was handeled without a firearm" when the gun was clearly there?

Musicmystery -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/19/2015 5:51:44 AM)
Because what people posted indicated the beating had already stopped, the cops were on their way, and the issue was that the guy became irate toward the husband. So just back off and let him rant. The gun is just "Oh yeah! I've got a gun! Finally, I get to draw it on someone! Awesome!" Could have been just as easily handled without a gun and less ego. It's a coincidental carry story, not a "success" because someone had a gun.

Musicmystery -> RE: Another "successful" carry story (1/19/2015 5:55:47 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: This is where knee-jerk gun-nuttery defense rolls in. It's a toddler. A toddler! With no safety provisions but a toddler can just reach in and fire. Rambo ready gun . I've got to say - as someone who finds this kind of tragedy utterly alien to him and his non-gun-culture - if they can make cheap plastic bottles with caps that toddlers can't get off, how come something similar can't be done effectively and economically with the safety catches of much more expensive firearms? They can, and do. But (1) the gun nuts don't like to use them and (2) the NRA opposes them. These are not issues that come up for responsible gun-owners, vs. the knee-jerk defend-guns-at-all-costs crowd here. But just as traffic laws exist largely for the irresponsible, and hate speech for those unable to use free speech wisely, so too sensible safeguards help make society safer from those who handle such dead force irresponsibly.

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