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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 5:30:07 PM   
slvemike4u


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quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

as a small aside to the main thrust of the conversation...while im not against government helping people in principle, the libertarian/conservative part of me thinks this---apart from all the middle men created, the opportunity for fraud/abuse/waste and difficulties with accountability, etc---I cannot help but think the effect is that people no longer turn to family members, churches, neighbors, and local charities for the help they need, to the extent they would, if the government didn't step in to the extent it does.


I see it as the government allowing some of our poorest the ability to retain at least some semblance of dignity.


I see just the opposite. the government is impersonal (that is, it does not love the people) and that distance (both geographically and relationally) creates a system where people can get comfortable in their poverty, which is ultimately very degrading.

Always amusing when those most in favor of degrading regulations and restriction complain that accepting aid tends to,ultimately be,degrading to the recipient

Highly curious.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 6:28:58 PM   
DaddySatyr


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From: Pittston, Pennsyltucky
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

From the other thread, I posted (Post#55) a response to a post Lucy wrote with several links. One link, in particular I quoted. At that link, you'll find a listing of the restrictions the states place on the use of EBT cards. The table also lists the states that specifically restrict purchasing guns.

The link.




quote:

At least 23 states have passed laws placing restrictions or prohibitions on the use of EBT cards. The table below lists the states and their prohibitions by topic (not all states prohibit the same purchases or specify the same products or services). In addition, Massachusetts and Missouri require that the EBT card include the person’s photo.


A photo? OMG! That's unconstitutional! That's a violation of their rights! That's a poll tax!

I don't know exactly what it is but you can bet someone'll bitch about it, sooner or later. I wanted to be at the front of the line.

ETA: I guess being "forced" to get a photo ID is only a "hardship" when it's to vote as opposed to when it's a vehicle to get free cash.



Michael

< Message edited by DaddySatyr -- 4/19/2015 6:36:09 PM >

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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 6:47:11 PM   
JVoV


Posts: 3659
Joined: 3/9/2015
Status: online 		EBT cards are like debit cards, requiring a pin number. I see adding a photo as rather pointless.

Most stores no longer require the cashier to swipe the card at all. And the card is useless without a pin.

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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 6:51:19 PM   
bounty44


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

The problem of poverty and want is way to big for the charity of neighbors,family and NGO's to deal with effectively.

And you should know that,this conservative/libertarian view that if government stepped aside our fellow citizens innate sense of charity would burst forth is nothing more than a pipe dream....



you really cannot, and so don't, know either of those things.


well......yes,I can....and do .


But I'll play your silly game....you can't know what I know about either of those things....in addition to the fact that you can't know either of the things you suggest...unless of course you read it in the bible


it doesn't matter what I know about what you know about either of those things---you cant know it because its simply "unknowable"

by contrast, what I "suggested"---if you are referring to an impersonal government and people being comfortable in poverty---is both rational/reasonable, and verifiable, and has been over and over.




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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 6:56:32 PM   
bounty44


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

as a small aside to the main thrust of the conversation...while im not against government helping people in principle, the libertarian/conservative part of me thinks this---apart from all the middle men created, the opportunity for fraud/abuse/waste and difficulties with accountability, etc---I cannot help but think the effect is that people no longer turn to family members, churches, neighbors, and local charities for the help they need, to the extent they would, if the government didn't step in to the extent it does.


I see it as the government allowing some of our poorest the ability to retain at least some semblance of dignity.


I see just the opposite. the government is impersonal (that is, it does not love the people) and that distance (both geographically and relationally) creates a system where people can get comfortable in their poverty, which is ultimately very degrading.

Always amusing when those most in favor of degrading regulations and restriction complain that accepting aid tends to,ultimately be,degrading to the recipient

Highly curious.


you think the regulations are "degrading", I don't. and if you go back and read what I said carefully, as opposed to looking for "gotcha" moments, you will see that what I said is degrading is allowing people to be comfortable in their poverty. there is no grammatical way you can construe what ive said as meaning that just receiving help period is degrading.

that said however---it should be very humbling, and anything that's received should be received with a tremendous amount of gratitude. and if its not, theres something amiss in the character of the people receiving help and those who are defending them.

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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 6:58:58 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		I'll try this again,though I don't expect better results.


The sheer scope,the astounding numbers lead any reasonable person,not blinded by ideology,to realize NGO's could not fill the gap created should government shut down it's aid to the needy.

I'm comfortable stating that as fact,and don't really give a shit as to what you believe it's "unknowable "

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 7:03:24 PM   
JVoV


Posts: 3659
Joined: 3/9/2015
Status: online 		The US government doesn't usually stand in the way of NGO's. Our leaders encourage volunteerism and charity every chance they get.

If NGO's haven't been able to end poverty with the government's help, they sure as hell wouldn't be able to without it. (And vice versa)

< Message edited by JVoV -- 4/19/2015 7:05:05 PM >

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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 7:13:34 PM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

EBT cards are like debit cards, requiring a pin number. I see adding a photo as rather pointless.

Most stores no longer require the cashier to swipe the card at all. And the card is useless without a pin.

How about in those businesses that require a photo ID to use a credit card? Doesn't adding a photo help?

_____________________________

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Profile   Post #: 88
RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 7:22:45 PM   
JVoV


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Joined: 3/9/2015
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

EBT cards are like debit cards, requiring a pin number. I see adding a photo as rather pointless.

Most stores no longer require the cashier to swipe the card at all. And the card is useless without a pin.

How about in those businesses that require a photo ID to use a credit card? Doesn't adding a photo help?


Operative words being 'credit card', different than debit. I do see your point, but the pin number is evidence of ownership of or authorization to use the card.

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Profile   Post #: 89
RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 7:25:26 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

The US government doesn't usually stand in the way of NGO's. Our leaders encourage volunteerism and charity every chance they get.

If NGO's haven't been able to end poverty with the government's help, they sure as hell wouldn't be able to without it. (And vice versa)

That much should be pretty obvious to anyone....not blinded by ideology or accustomed to finding answers to todays issues by reading the bible.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to JVoV)
Profile   Post #: 90
RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 7:29:02 PM   
dcnovice


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Status: offline 		FR

Anyone know how widespread the problem of welfare fraud is in Kansas?

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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 7:41:29 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		Rampant......they say Brownback is giving away the kitchen sink to his corporate sponsors.....oh wait,you meant regular blue collar fraud.


Not so much of that...

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 7:45:17 PM   
Lucylastic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

FR

Anyone know how widespread the problem of welfare fraud is in Kansas?

I posted this in the other kansaas thread DC, hope it helps
http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=4798925

Freed said the agency has “not calculated how much fraud may exist in Kansas,” but that federal officials estimate it is between 1 percent and 4 percent within the food stamp program alone and that there is no reason to think the incidence is less here than occurs nationally. According to agency records, 318,988 Kansans — 176,417 adults and 142,571 children — were on the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP, formerly known as food stamps) last month. The average per-person benefit was $121. Also in June, 18,550 people received cash assistance that averaged about $111 per person per month. In addition, 8,163 families received child-care subsidies that averaged $353 per month. The federal government pays for most of the three programs, which together last fiscal year cost taxpayers more than $537 million. “They all have potential for fraud,” Freed said, noting that last year the department’s fraud unit won 240 civil judgments against beneficiaries for the return of $941,000 in wrongfully obtained welfare benefits. The fraud unit investigated 2,714 cases last year, up significantly from 1,213 the year before. - See more at: http://www.khi.org/news/article/kansas-doubles-down-welfare-fraud/#sthash.4vRi8fmU.dpuf

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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 8:02:45 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		Hi Lucy,how are you feeling ?

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


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Profile   Post #: 94
RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 8:14:52 PM   
Aylee


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Obviously a fake.
Shitty photoshop fake


It is a narwhale stuffie with a MONOCLE!

Only cephlopods are more awesome!

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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 8:55:48 PM   
JVoV


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Joined: 3/9/2015
Status: online 		Many of the people receiving food stamp assistance are disabled and/or elderly, and can't actually go to the store themselves. They rely on family members & friends or caretakers to do their shopping.

Requiring photo id, or a picture on the card would be an unintended hinderance to many people that need this help the most. Even if it does prevent giving your food stamp card to a drug dealer as payment.

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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 10:27:10 PM   
MercTech


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

Many of the people receiving food stamp assistance are disabled and/or elderly, and can't actually go to the store themselves. They rely on family members & friends or caretakers to do their shopping.

Requiring photo id, or a picture on the card would be an unintended hinderance to many people that need this help the most. Even if it does prevent giving your food stamp card to a drug dealer as payment.


And a good reason to do a limited power of attorney. With one of those in hand; the person designated in the power of attorney can use your accounts to make payments for you.

Another way to do this is pickup service. Walmart has even started doing this. You order groceries, or whatever, online and make your payment with your card. Then, you can have it picked up by a friend or relative. Make sure to designate the person running your errands when you check out your order.

Just mentioning some options I found useful when recovering from a severe back injury. I wasn't safe to drive myself for a while with the medication I was on and couldn't stand to be on my feet for long enough to do a grocery run anyway.

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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/19/2015 10:43:47 PM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MercTech


quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

Many of the people receiving food stamp assistance are disabled and/or elderly, and can't actually go to the store themselves. They rely on family members & friends or caretakers to do their shopping.

Requiring photo id, or a picture on the card would be an unintended hinderance to many people that need this help the most. Even if it does prevent giving your food stamp card to a drug dealer as payment.


And a good reason to do a limited power of attorney. With one of those in hand; the person designated in the power of attorney can use your accounts to make payments for you.

Another way to do this is pickup service. Walmart has even started doing this. You order groceries, or whatever, online and make your payment with your card. Then, you can have it picked up by a friend or relative. Make sure to designate the person running your errands when you check out your order.

Just mentioning some options I found useful when recovering from a severe back injury. I wasn't safe to drive myself for a while with the medication I was on and couldn't stand to be on my feet for long enough to do a grocery run anyway.

If someone has to do all of those things for you a limited power of attorney is a good idea, wish I had thought of that.

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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/20/2015 2:20:21 AM   
JVoV


Posts: 3659
Joined: 3/9/2015
Status: online 		You can't use Food stamp benefits online, aside from a handful of places. Schwann's is the only one I known of that offers delivery locally.

Of course, food stamps is a totally different beast than cash assistance, although both are under the umbrella of the EBT card. I believe Unemployment benefits are as well, in many states.

A power of attorney seems a bit excessive to me though.

< Message edited by JVoV -- 4/20/2015 2:27:08 AM >

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RE: Kansans can't spend cash assistance on bras or undies - 4/20/2015 6:15:03 AM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

You can't use Food stamp benefits online, aside from a handful of places. Schwann's is the only one I known of that offers delivery locally.

Of course, food stamps is a totally different beast than cash assistance, although both are under the umbrella of the EBT card. I believe Unemployment benefits are as well, in many states.

A power of attorney seems a bit excessive to me though.

How about just sending them an envelope with small unmarked bills?


_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to JVoV)
Profile   Post #: 100
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