RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program

RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (Full Version)

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MrRodgers -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/14/2015 5:38:50 PM)
The worse part about this deal is that Iranian oil will likely come out in buckets and further depress oil profits. Plus, when one speaks of the Iranians, there is little or no profit to be had to begin with. So it's lose, lose for the only people who really count...the investor class. Why ? Because they know full well already that Iran has just finished painting that big nuke target on their collective backs and have no intention of ever launching a nuke.

KenDckey -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/14/2015 5:49:10 PM)
I personally don't trust the Iranians. They are overly aggressive and antaganistic, especially toward the US and overly supportive of terrorism. And after Operation Eagle Claw invasion of Iran by Carter, they had less reason to trust us. I also think the issue will be resolved by Israel which will be another real problem in the Mid East for us to continue with. We have no official diplomatic relations with Iran.

DesideriScuri -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/14/2015 6:05:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: KenDckey I personally don't trust the Iranians. They are overly aggressive and antaganistic, especially toward the US and overly supportive of terrorism. And after Operation Eagle Claw invasion of Iran by Carter, they had less reason to trust us. I also think the issue will be resolved by Israel which will be another real problem in the Mid East for us to continue with. We have no official diplomatic relations with Iran. Not yet. Accepting them into the global community, warily, of course, just might lead to "official diplomatic relations." I don't know that they're doing the same type of thing as Libya, but there was a beginning of Libya gaining acceptance on the world stage, too.

KenDckey -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/14/2015 6:05:40 PM)
http://www.militarytimes.com/story/military/capitol-hill/2015/07/14/iran-linked-to-deaths-of-500-us-troops-in-iraq-afghanistan/30131097/ About 500 deaths directly attributed to Iran in Iraq and Afghanistan and many more suspected How do we explain to the families?

RemoteUser -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/14/2015 6:32:11 PM)
Negotiating for weapon disarmament isn't a bad thing, but it has no real effect either. All you're doing is telling people they are less likely to have a WMD on hand, which does nothing to affect the mentality of anyone wishing to start a fight. Negotiating with a finite resource doesn't have much effect, either. The resource is still finite. When it's gone, what else can you bargain with? Like most politics, this is mutual backscratching with short-term goals in mind. No harm. No foul. No real change.

BamaD -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/14/2015 6:44:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: KenDckey I personally don't trust the Iranians. They are overly aggressive and antaganistic, especially toward the US and overly supportive of terrorism. And after Operation Eagle Claw invasion of Iran by Carter, they had less reason to trust us. I also think the issue will be resolved by Israel which will be another real problem in the Mid East for us to continue with. We have no official diplomatic relations with Iran. They have made no bones about the fact that they feel it is just fine to lie to westerners.

tweakabelle -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 2:53:28 AM)
I am saddened to see a few pessimistic posts. I would have thought that anything that improves the acrimonious relations between Iran and the US ought to be welcomed. No one here has noted the impetus that this agreement has given to the reformist faction in Teheran. They are facing the same type of oppositon to negotiation and compromise with the West that Obama faces from the Right in the US. Anything that reduces the power and influence of the hardliners in Teheran is surely worth welcoming. This agreement will strengthen the gradual moves towards freedom and democracy in Iran. Does anyone want to ensure the survivial and strengthening of the Ayatollah's theocracy? This agreement has the potential to re-write the geo-politics of the region. It will reduce the influence of hardliners in Israel and Saudi Arablia too. Netanyahoo is going ballistic as he sees the prospect of war with Iran, a goal he has pursued assiduously for over a quarter of a century, vaporise. The hyperbolic reaction from the Israeli Right demonstrates the extent of their despair as their ability to set the agenda and control events is reduced. Any one who cherishes peace can only welcome this. It is significant that no one has proposed any kind of realistic alternative to this agreement. That is because the only realistic alternative to this agreement is war. Does anyone outside of the Israeli Right and the US looney right want this? The next step is serious consideration of the Iranian proposal to make the entire Middle East a nuclear weapon free zone. For the US it marks the first serious step in the creation of genuinely American policy towards the region, by which I mean a policy that puts US interests first and foremost and reduces Israel's interests to those of a client State, not the paramount goal of US policy, a position that Israel enjoys at the moment.

epiphiny43 -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 3:17:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: KenDckey I personally don't trust the Iranians. They are overly aggressive and antaganistic, especially toward the US and overly supportive of terrorism. And after Operation Eagle Claw invasion of Iran by Carter, they had less reason to trust us. I also think the issue will be resolved by Israel which will be another real problem in the Mid East for us to continue with. We have no official diplomatic relations with Iran. Given their history with the US from our installation of the Shah's almost US puppet regime (Anyone here actually pay attention to history?) their antagonism is fully comprehend able, and maybe mild given the past. The US also supplied the military equipment and trained the Shah's security and interrogation services, reputedly one of the most violent in a violent region. Who the CIA was under cover when they could have effective camouflage?? One of many black parts of the Cold War. As Churchill noted, the worst evil of dictatorships is that democracies feel forced to imitate them to survive. With all that, peace requires peoples and governments to engage, not snarl at each other and do the utmost to demonize each other domestically and internationally. I'm seeing the mass of Iranians looking hopefully to a period of peace and growth after a far more turbulent and violent period than any sane person could wish for their children and family. Hopefully this counterbalances the crazies willing to see cultural and mass obliteration as a price worth paying to oppose Israel. Those on the Right who are upset by Any negotiations of substance (Meaning the Iranians get anything besides humiliation.) have to remember peace is only arranged by the brave. Anger and hostility are the primary outward signs of fear. Be the change you want to see in the world. We have had enough centuries of fear determining the course of nations and peoples. Way past time to let the intramural disputes among humans have a rest while we try to save the only planet worth living on.

PeonForHer -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 4:45:39 AM)
All together now, music by John Lennon: "All I am saying, Is give war a chance"

Sanity -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 8:09:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: epiphiny43 Given their history with the US from our installation of the Shah's almost US puppet regime (Anyone here actually pay attention to history?) their antagonism is fully comprehend able, and maybe mild given the past. The US also supplied the military equipment and trained the Shah's security and interrogation services, reputedly one of the most violent in a violent region. Who the CIA was under cover when they could have effective camouflage?? One of many black parts of the Cold War. As Churchill noted, the worst evil of dictatorships is that democracies feel forced to imitate them to survive. With all that, peace requires peoples and governments to engage, not snarl at each other and do the utmost to demonize each other domestically and internationally. I'm seeing the mass of Iranians looking hopefully to a period of peace and growth after a far more turbulent and violent period than any sane person could wish for their children and family. Hopefully this counterbalances the crazies willing to see cultural and mass obliteration as a price worth paying to oppose Israel. Those on the Right who are upset by Any negotiations of substance (Meaning the Iranians get anything besides humiliation.) have to remember peace is only arranged by the brave. Anger and hostility are the primary outward signs of fear. Be the change you want to see in the world. We have had enough centuries of fear determining the course of nations and peoples. Way past time to let the intramural disputes among humans have a rest while we try to save the only planet worth living on. Weird how leftists keep going back to the Shah. "But the Shah! The Shah!" The Shah was a cream puff compared to the unelected monsters who Carter installed, and who leftists seem to worship. Would you like to be interrogated by the Iranian Revolutionary Guard? Iranian women under the Shah: [img]http://all-that-is-interesting.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/shah-iran-tehran-students-copy.jpg[/img] They could work, go to school, have a life. Iranian women now: quote: ...women lack the ability to choose their husbands, have no independent right to education after marriage, no right to divorce, no right to child custody, have no protection from violent treatment in public spaces, are restricted by quotas for women's admission at universities, and are arrested, beaten, and imprisoned for peacefully seeking change of such laws. [img]http://theblacksphere.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/iran-woman-violence1-300x225.jpg[/img] Iran - Women are number one enemies of mullahs The Revolutionary Guard represents "liberal" ideals in so many ways... Gay Iranians Forced to Surgically Change Gender And the Mullahs are openly laughing about how they won. [img]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CJ85oe1WoAABgUu.jpg[/img] The terms of this deal are terrible The American citizens who are being held in Iran arent mentioned, the centrifuges keep spinning, there are no clear terms about unannounced inspections... The list goes on and on.

mnottertail -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 8:24:53 AM)
Uh, they certainly were elected, in fact every 4 years. Last election in 2013. After that we can pretty much flush all else as rightwing propaganda.

KenDckey -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 8:32:59 AM)
And the Dems are as skeptical too http://www.politico.com/story/2015/07/key-democrats-skeptical-of-iran-deal-120123.html

tweakabelle -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 8:33:08 AM)
quote: Sanity Weird how leftists keep going back to the Shah. "But the Shah! The Shah!" The Shah was a cream puff compared to the unelected monsters who Carter installed, and who leftists seem to worship. Would you like to be interrogated by the Iranian Revolutionary Guard? As crazy as it sounds, the only interpretation of the above that makes sense is that you are actually alleging that "Carter ... installed" the Khomeini regime in Iran after the downfall of the US puppet the Shah. Crazy because this claim is at total variance to the historical record, which is that Khomeini came to power in Iran after a popular revolution threw out the despotic and hated Shah. Crazy because one the first acts of the new regime was to allow the storming of the US Embassy and taking hostage of the diplomats there, which in turn led to an international crisis lasting well over a year. Crazy because this crisis put paid to Carter's Presidency according to most commentators. Perhaps the only use this ridiculous claim has is that it is a salient indicator of the gap between the notions that occur in your head and the phenomenon that most of the rest of us experience as reality. In a single sentence you have destroyed whatever (limited) credibility you may have possessed ..... I hope someone in your immediate surrounds has phoned for those nice people in white coats to come and take you away to an Instititue for the Very Very Nervous and People Allergic to Reality. Best you up your meds until they arrive ......

Sanity -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 8:58:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: KenDckey And the Dems are as skeptical too http://www.politico.com/story/2015/07/key-democrats-skeptical-of-iran-deal-120123.html Our friends and allies in the region arent impressed much

mnottertail -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 9:02:00 AM)
I dont quite understand why they are friends or allies really.

PeonForHer -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 9:04:23 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Sanity quote: ORIGINAL: KenDckey And the Dems are as skeptical too http://www.politico.com/story/2015/07/key-democrats-skeptical-of-iran-deal-120123.html Our friends and allies in the region arent impressed much Good. They can fuck off. [:)]

Sanity -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 9:38:26 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: ORIGINAL: Sanity quote: ORIGINAL: KenDckey And the Dems are as skeptical too http://www.politico.com/story/2015/07/key-democrats-skeptical-of-iran-deal-120123.html Our friends and allies in the region arent impressed much Good. They can fuck off. [:)] They can, but theyre not going to.

mnottertail -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 9:46:30 AM)
Back To Reality: [image]local://upfiles/61037/9DC55009BE4F44E1A19499A2E96FDD34.jpg[/image]

Sanity -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 10:07:43 AM)
FR Video - even the far left loons at MSNBC are laughing at Hillarys "robotic answers" when asked to comment on this horrendously bad deal

Sanity -> RE: Agreement reached on Iran nuclear program (7/15/2015 10:36:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tweakabelle As crazy as it sounds, the only interpretation of the above that makes sense is that you are actually alleging that "Carter ... installed" the Khomeini regime in Iran after the downfall of the US puppet the Shah. Crazy because this claim is at total variance to the historical record, which is that Khomeini came to power in Iran after a popular revolution threw out the despotic and hated Shah. Crazy because one the first acts of the new regime was to allow the storming of the US Embassy and taking hostage of the diplomats there, which in turn led to an international crisis lasting well over a year. Crazy because this crisis put paid to Carter's Presidency according to most commentators. Perhaps the only use this ridiculous claim has is that it is a salient indicator of the gap between the notions that occur in your head and the phenomenon that most of the rest of us experience as reality. In a single sentence you have destroyed whatever (limited) credibility you may have possessed ..... I hope someone in your immediate surrounds has phoned for those nice people in white coats to come and take you away to an Instititue for the Very Very Nervous and People Allergic to Reality. Best you up your meds until they arrive ...... The thing that tells the tale that needs to be told here is how leftists routinely have to rely on ad homimens and other debate fallacies to defend their positions And even if Carter only handed Iran over to the mullahs on a silver platter due to sheer stupidity and incompetence, it is still he who installed the religious fanatics there into power

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