quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/07/17/shooting-reported-at-chattanooga-army-recruiting-center-college-on-lockdown/

Just a damn shame. Probably a terrorist act, but it seems the media is being careful not to say so just yet.

At least the gunman is dead.

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin

It was a terrorist attack, in a freakin 'nother gun fuckin free zone. Then to top that off what does Obama say about it ? Nothing about the dead marines but he didn't forget to mention the celebration of the Muslim holiday of Eid-ul-Fitr. Fuckin jerk.......smooth move Exlax.

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin

It was a terrorist attack, in a freakin 'nother gun fuckin free zone. Then to top that off what does Obama say about it ? Nothing about the dead marines but he didn't forget to mention the celebration of the Muslim holiday of Eid-ul-Fitr. Fuckin jerk.......smooth move Exlax.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

As a military spouse, my condolences to those who lost their lives and to their families.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin

It was a terrorist attack, in a freakin 'nother gun fuckin free zone. Then to top that off what does Obama say about it ? Nothing about the dead marines but he didn't forget to mention the celebration of the Muslim holiday of Eid-ul-Fitr. Fuckin jerk.......smooth move Exlax.

The gun free zone worked this time, the terrorist stayed outside to do his shooting. But to be more serious can anyone argue (rationally) that servicemen shouldn't be armed?

quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin

It was a terrorist attack, in a freakin 'nother gun fuckin free zone. Then to top that off what does Obama say about it ? Nothing about the dead marines but he didn't forget to mention the celebration of the Muslim holiday of Eid-ul-Fitr. Fuckin jerk.......smooth move Exlax.

The gun free zone worked this time, the terrorist stayed outside to do his shooting. But to be more serious can anyone argue (rationally) that servicemen shouldn't be armed?

bill o'reilly was arguing for their being armed in his coverage of the story...

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
Amen.
They volunteered to serve the nation and protect the rest of us.
They accepted risks involved in combat.
That does nothing to lessen the tragedy of them being murdered in a cowardly attack like this. My post was not to politicize this incident but sparked by my anger at them not being allowed to defend themselves.
This coward would not have taken on an office full of armed marines, and it is time we realized that even in a recruiting office the enemy considers them fair game. This isn't about guns it is about the fact that these brave men deserve the chance to fight back.
(I know. I let my outrage get the best of me again)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
Amen.
They volunteered to serve the nation and protect the rest of us.
They accepted risks involved in combat.
That does nothing to lessen the tragedy of them being murdered in a cowardly attack like this. My post was not to politicize this incident but sparked by my anger at them not being allowed to defend themselves.
This coward would not have taken on an office full of armed marines, and it is time we realized that even in a recruiting office the enemy considers them fair game. This isn't about guns it is about the fact that these brave men deserve the chance to fight back.
(I know. I let my outrage get the best of me again)

I definitely agree with you that it was cowardly. I also agree with the other poster who used the word terrorism because that's kind of the definition of the word. The use of violence and intimidation.

The question goes to should all members of the armed services have a side arm at all times? I'd like to jump up and say yes. At the same time, I completely get why this could be a huge PITA. I can imagine the headache for every person working the armory trying to keep everything accountable.

Then, there's the thing that I'm inclined to think some people wouldn't necessarily know or account for. When I was looking into the concealed carry permit a couple of years back, (I think there's a thread here somewhere when I discussed it) most people would be surprised just how many places on post I wouldn't be able to take a firearm. The commissary, the PX, and just about every building on post that a military dependent would use, with the exception of housing, I would not be able to carry a gun for my personal protection. Did that make me feel like I was safer in the civilian world than the military one? You bet.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
I can see the point about not arming everyone.
At the end of my AF career I was in a shop with about 100 computer programmers. Most of them I wouldn't want to have a firearm. But if just the senior NCO's were armed you would have a deterrent. In this recruiting station one or two armed marines could have changed things a lot.

Yes I feel safer in Walmart than I would in that situation.

I would say that particularly in these small, isolated, exposed places like recruiting stations, in today's situation it should be obvious that these people should be able to defend themselves. They have no fences, no gate guards, no military police. Those uniforms were not designed for target practice.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
I can see the point about not arming everyone.
At the end of my AF career I was in a shop with about 100 computer programmers. Most of them I wouldn't want to have a firearm. But if just the senior NCO's were armed you would have a deterrent. In this recruiting station one or two armed marines could have changed things a lot.

Yes I feel safer in Walmart than I would in that situation.

I would say that particularly in these small, isolated, exposed places like recruiting stations, in today's situation it should be obvious that these people should be able to defend themselves. They have no fences, no gate guards, no military police. Those uniforms were not designed for target practice.

We're probably on the same page on this, especially when it comes to senior NCO's, rather than everybody. Anybody who has ever been military (or listens to such stories when the military person comes home) knows the Person X did incredibly stupid thing Y tales. I respect most people who serve (and thank you for yours) but some of those stories can really make a person's head spin. I won't recount in the interest of being nice but I think you know what I'm saying.

Recruiting stations and such? I'd have to say yes. As you know, most of those places are just in some kind of strip mall anyway and it's just not a situation where they are going to be running to the commissary, PX, or post hospital during lunch breaks. (Removes that whole thing from the equation.) It's nothing like when the (what I call them) Wrong Way Bandits took the wrong turn onto the NSA complex. Might not have been the dumbest van thief that was ever on the planet but I'd say it was ranked up there.

(For any person reading this thread who is a civilian or not familiar with military installations, here is some advice. If the people in the nice uniforms tell you to stop or halt? Do that! They will shoot you and they are completely within their rights to do so. Those signs that they post warning you that they will shoot you aren't just for looks.)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
I can see the point about not arming everyone.
At the end of my AF career I was in a shop with about 100 computer programmers. Most of them I wouldn't want to have a firearm. But if just the senior NCO's were armed you would have a deterrent. In this recruiting station one or two armed marines could have changed things a lot.

Yes I feel safer in Walmart than I would in that situation.

I would say that particularly in these small, isolated, exposed places like recruiting stations, in today's situation it should be obvious that these people should be able to defend themselves. They have no fences, no gate guards, no military police. Those uniforms were not designed for target practice.

We're probably on the same page on this, especially when it comes to senior NCO's, rather than everybody. Anybody who has ever been military (or listens to such stories when the military person comes home) knows the Person X did incredibly stupid thing Y tales. I respect most people who serve (and thank you for yours) but some of those stories can really make a person's head spin. I won't recount in the interest of being nice but I think you know what I'm saying.

Recruiting stations and such? I'd have to say yes. As you know, most of those places are just in some kind of strip mall anyway and it's just not a situation where they are going to be running to the commissary, PX, or post hospital during lunch breaks. (Removes that whole thing from the equation.) It's nothing like when the (what I call them) Wrong Way Bandits took the wrong turn onto the NSA complex. Might not have been the dumbest van thief that was ever on the planet but I'd say it was ranked up there.

(For any person reading this thread who is a civilian or not familiar with military installations, here is some advice. If the people in the nice uniforms tell you to stop or halt? Do that! They will shoot you and they are completely within their rights to do so. Those signs that they post warning you that they will shoot you aren't just for looks.)

quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
I can see the point about not arming everyone.
At the end of my AF career I was in a shop with about 100 computer programmers. Most of them I wouldn't want to have a firearm. But if just the senior NCO's were armed you would have a deterrent. In this recruiting station one or two armed marines could have changed things a lot.

Yes I feel safer in Walmart than I would in that situation.

I would say that particularly in these small, isolated, exposed places like recruiting stations, in today's situation it should be obvious that these people should be able to defend themselves. They have no fences, no gate guards, no military police. Those uniforms were not designed for target practice.

We're probably on the same page on this, especially when it comes to senior NCO's, rather than everybody. Anybody who has ever been military (or listens to such stories when the military person comes home) knows the Person X did incredibly stupid thing Y tales. I respect most people who serve (and thank you for yours) but some of those stories can really make a person's head spin. I won't recount in the interest of being nice but I think you know what I'm saying.

Recruiting stations and such? I'd have to say yes. As you know, most of those places are just in some kind of strip mall anyway and it's just not a situation where they are going to be running to the commissary, PX, or post hospital during lunch breaks. (Removes that whole thing from the equation.) It's nothing like when the (what I call them) Wrong Way Bandits took the wrong turn onto the NSA complex. Might not have been the dumbest van thief that was ever on the planet but I'd say it was ranked up there.

(For any person reading this thread who is a civilian or not familiar with military installations, here is some advice. If the people in the nice uniforms tell you to stop or halt? Do that! They will shoot you and they are completely within their rights to do so. Those signs that they post warning you that they will shoot you aren't just for looks.)

LadyPact Thank you for your service. Being a spouse of a soldier/airman/sailor/marine isn't an easy job. As such you are reqiured to follow both military and civilian law and orders and balance your obligation to support both your spouse and the ideals he serves under, whether you agree or not. I am retired from the Army myself. And yes, your note to civilians is correct for sure. Area 51 isn't the only place that they shoot first and ask questions later for people just being there.

I agree that there are outposts where people need to be armed. Recruiters are the most common but there are other sites as well.

During the 67 mid-east war, our detachment was dislocated from any support in less than 12 air hours. There happened to be a military wife (and retired 1st Sgt in a time when women weren't given combat training) in town and living at the hotel across the street. We gave her one of our rooms shuffling our people, an M1 Carbine w/1000 rounds of ammo, steel pot and horseshoe roll pack. Put signs on the latrine and protected her as one of our own. Our little town of 30,000 muslims grew to 250,000 during that period. Fortunately no one messed with us. But it would have been nice for her to be armed for self defense all the time. Her hubby was in a seperate command and we were in a hardship tour (No dependents period). We made her a honorary member of our unit by giving her one of our unit crests. lol we even tried to get authorization for her reactivation so she could be paid for her service. LOL The Army just looked at us like we were funny LOL

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
I can see the point about not arming everyone.
At the end of my AF career I was in a shop with about 100 computer programmers. Most of them I wouldn't want to have a firearm. But if just the senior NCO's were armed you would have a deterrent. In this recruiting station one or two armed marines could have changed things a lot.

Yes I feel safer in Walmart than I would in that situation.

I would say that particularly in these small, isolated, exposed places like recruiting stations, in today's situation it should be obvious that these people should be able to defend themselves. They have no fences, no gate guards, no military police. Those uniforms were not designed for target practice.

We're probably on the same page on this, especially when it comes to senior NCO's, rather than everybody. Anybody who has ever been military (or listens to such stories when the military person comes home) knows the Person X did incredibly stupid thing Y tales. I respect most people who serve (and thank you for yours) but some of those stories can really make a person's head spin. I won't recount in the interest of being nice but I think you know what I'm saying.

Recruiting stations and such? I'd have to say yes. As you know, most of those places are just in some kind of strip mall anyway and it's just not a situation where they are going to be running to the commissary, PX, or post hospital during lunch breaks. (Removes that whole thing from the equation.) It's nothing like when the (what I call them) Wrong Way Bandits took the wrong turn onto the NSA complex. Might not have been the dumbest van thief that was ever on the planet but I'd say it was ranked up there.

(For any person reading this thread who is a civilian or not familiar with military installations, here is some advice. If the people in the nice uniforms tell you to stop or halt? Do that! They will shoot you and they are completely within their rights to do so. Those signs that they post warning you that they will shoot you aren't just for looks.)

LadyPact Thank you for your service. Being a spouse of a soldier/airman/sailor/marine isn't an easy job. As such you are reqiured to follow both military and civilian law and orders and balance your obligation to support both your spouse and the ideals he serves under, whether you agree or not. I am retired from the Army myself. And yes, your note to civilians is correct for sure. Area 51 isn't the only place that they shoot first and ask questions later for people just being there.

I agree that there are outposts where people need to be armed. Recruiters are the most common but there are other sites as well.

During the 67 mid-east war, our detachment was dislocated from any support in less than 12 air hours. There happened to be a military wife (and retired 1st Sgt in a time when women weren't given combat training) in town and living at the hotel across the street. We gave her one of our rooms shuffling our people, an M1 Carbine w/1000 rounds of ammo, steel pot and horseshoe roll pack. Put signs on the latrine and protected her as one of our own. Our little town of 30,000 muslims grew to 250,000 during that period. Fortunately no one messed with us. But it would have been nice for her to be armed for self defense all the time. Her hubby was in a seperate command and we were in a hardship tour (No dependents period). We made her a honorary member of our unit by giving her one of our unit crests. lol we even tried to get authorization for her reactivation so she could be paid for her service. LOL The Army just looked at us like we were funny LOL

I can only add to this that "dependents" are part of the military just like the active duty member, they just don't get recognized or paid for their contributions.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Thank you, both of you. Comments like that really do mean a lot to me. I do think I have it so much better these days than say, for example, a spouse of 20-30 years ago. My contribution (such as it is) does get recognized a lot more than I think it used to be. It's a lot different now when they used to say 'the military didn't issue you a spouse so you don't need one,' to 'thank you for part you play in this'.

I won't try to kid anyone. We're five weeks away from that magical twenty year mark. I'm looking forward to the last time we'll do a major move across the country. I've probably bored MP to tears about how I'm never going to want to see another moving box after that. Four major moves (the retirement one will make five) in just around ten years? Yeah, I'm done. LOL.

When the NSA thing happened? I got called something like twenty minutes after it hit the news. They don't mess around with that stuff anymore.

But, for active duty folks, I've somewhat resigned myself to that being the world we live in. I really don't think we're ever going back to pre 9/11 days. Maybe I'm just a pessimist but I just don't see it.