RE: Unreasonable? (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion



Message


thompsonx -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/25/2015 10:59:23 AM)


ORIGINAL: Kirata

Or in his most recent post, Ta-Nehisi Coates' ass.

If you have found some factual error in the cite I have referenced please show us...or...will you be content with your racist ignorance?




Kirata -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/25/2015 11:56:27 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

ORIGINAL: Kirata

Or in his most recent post, Ta-Nehisi Coates' ass.

If you have found some factual error in the cite I have referenced please show us...or...will you be content with your racist ignorance?

Your continual attempts to foment racial animosities with lies of commission and omission are cut from the same cloth as Coates, and I cordially invite you both to shove your racial politics up your ass.

Merry Christmas.

K.




thompsonx -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/25/2015 2:01:55 PM)

ORIGINAL: Kirata

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

If you have found some factual error in the cite I have referenced please show us...or...will you be content with your racist ignorance?

Your continual attempts to foment racial animosities with lies of commission and omission are cut from the same cloth as Coates, and I cordially invite you both to shove your racial politics up your ass.

It would appear that they are lodged firmly in yours and that is the source of your discomfort.
When you can supply some factual evidence of any misrepresentation of mine please feel free to post it.
In the meantime I hope you have enjoyed my christmas present which is lodged in your tailpipe.[:D]







thishereboi -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/26/2015 5:08:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

good point and I suppose it really doesn't matter. He will come back with his usual "you are wrong" like he does with any comments made

Since you continue to post from a point of ignorance I will continue to point it out.


and I will continue to think

Something anyone has seldom you do.

most of the shit he posts comes straight out of his ass. SSDD


If you could refute the shit I post you would...you can't so you don't[8|]




refute what? You never said what it was that you had a problem with. It was just another of your mindless accusations without any thing substantial to respond to. And when asked to be specific you fall back on your usual lame ass bullshit. Now if you want to tell me exactly what was wrong in my post, I might take the time to explain, but I won't hold my breath.




thompsonx -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/26/2015 6:19:51 PM)


ORIGINAL: thishereboi

refute what? You never said what it was that you had a problem with.

The issue is reparations for blacks. ...the decendents of slaves. You and others have claimed that since you did not own slaves you don't owe anyone anything. The cites posted posit that the labor of slaves was used to build the infrastructure of this country. That blacks were denied the value of their labor to pass on to their hiers because it was used by their owners and eventually the state and federal governments in the form of taxes on the product of that labor.
The question is how is it that you come to a discussion about reparations with no knowledge of why it is being sought? How is it that you have an opinion about something of which you claim ignorance?
How is it that you failed to read the cites I posted explaining it?
Is it because you are just a loudmouth twit with nothing to say so you just bray to see your name in print?






Termyn8or -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/27/2015 6:18:44 PM)

I'll go farther than that thompson.

THEY OWE US !

Where the fuck would they be if they had been left there in Africa. YOU want to go to Africa and worry about getting eaten alive ? Worry about a neighboring tribe selling you into slavery ? (and I do not meant to Whites, they enslaved each other)

And eaten alive doesn't just mean by the animals and bugs, I mean by the other homosapiens. Cannibals. And then if you do survive and have a daughter they will rape her to cure their AIDS. And no food, you get this fucking white mush from charities that could not sustain a fucking lab rat. (lab rats are the best fed animals in the world BTW)

And if you survive all that you live in a huit that the wind might blow down, got no heat or AC, cars or electricity, make Gilliogan's Island look like an industrial and technological paradise.

And now you are here and get welfare and free primary education (such that is is, that is your unruly offspring have made it and made us lower our standards) and Black only scholarships, and a Black only congressional caucus and a Black only Miss America, and it is illegal for US, WHO BUILT THE PLACE, to have anything White only.

I got a fucking 9 mm. reparation for anyone who thinks we owe them. Fuck them, they owe us. Big. Didn't know what electricity or a screwdriver is back then and now are doctors and engineers. We helped them quite a bit. Just because some hicks whipped them in the past, fukum. Too bad. To bad for the Indians, too based for them too. Don't like it, I say we al chip in and get any one of them a one way ticket to Zimbabwe. the p;lace is in great shape after being turned over to Black rule. From the breadbasket of Africa to a basketcase in a matter of a few years.

Go, go and be free of our oppression. Learn to dance with the alligators or whatever the fuck you find in the jungle. Catch diseases from all kinds of insects. Eat monkeys ! Eat each other ! Do as thou wilt.

And you know what ? That holocaust industry can go take and fuck itself as well. They got enough.

Taking from us is like taking from the German people before WW2. you know what happened then and do not even think it cannot happen again. Don't use the Nword, but when you get home, among friends, friends who have arsenals in their basement, you use whatever words you want.

And one day it comes time to come outside with more lead than every piece of water pipe ever made, but in smaller doses. Administered subcutaneously at great speed.

WE built this motherfucker. And WE might just be the ones to take it down.

T^T




dcnovice -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/27/2015 7:06:08 PM)

Oh, dear God.




Termyn8or -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/28/2015 1:04:26 AM)

What, don't like politically incorrect truth ?

Where would they be ? You tell me.

Nobody wants to answer that, just like a few other questions I have.

T^T




thompsonx -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/28/2015 6:57:14 AM)


ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

I'll go farther than that thompson.

THEY OWE US !

That would be your ignorant,peurile unsubstantiated opinion and nothing more.

Where the fuck would they be if they had been left there in Africa.

In africa of course.[8|]


YOU want to go to Africa and worry about getting eaten alive ? Worry about a neighboring tribe selling you into slavery ? (and I do not meant to Whites, they enslaved each other)

Is it your contention that white people never enslaved white people?

And eaten alive doesn't just mean by the animals and bugs, I mean by the other homosapiens. Cannibals.

You have been watching old t.v programs haven't you?


And then if you do survive and have a daughter they will rape her to cure their AIDS.

Aids is a 20th century disease.


And no food, you get this fucking white mush from charities that could not sustain a fucking lab rat.

Only a moron would believe that africans all live on the charity of whites?


(lab rats are the best fed animals in the world BTW)

Something you know from a personal dietary regimine?

And if you survive all that you live in a huit that the wind might blow down, got no heat or AC, cars or electricity, make Gilliogan's Island look like an industrial and technological paradise.

Sounds like detroit to me.

And now you are here and get welfare and free primary education (such that is is, that is your unruly offspring have made it and made us lower our standards) and Black only scholarships, and a Black only congressional caucus and a Black only Miss America, and it is illegal for US, WHO BUILT THE PLACE, to have anything White only.


Why do you think white people built anything? It was white people who were too lazy to work that owned slaves to do the labor that they were too lazy to do themselves and too stingy to pay other white people to do for them.

I got a fucking 9 mm.

It would figure that you would own a little girls gun.

reparation for anyone who thinks we owe them. Fuck them, they owe us. Big. Didn't know what electricity or a screwdriver is back then and now are doctors and engineers.

The oldest library in the world is in africa.

We helped them quite a bit. Just because some hicks whipped them in the past, fukum. Too bad.

You seem to really miss that white priviledge quite a bit.


To bad for the Indians, too based for them too.


Well of course your white priviledge would extend to those who made your existance possible when your white trash ancestors first got off the boat with no food and needed some chow.

Don't like it, I say we al chip in and get any one of them a one way ticket to Zimbabwe. the p;lace is in great shape after being turned over to Black rule. From the breadbasket of Africa to a basketcase in a matter of a few years.


Why don't you tell us about your last trip to zimbabwe and what you found there?

Go, go and be free of our oppression. Learn to dance with the alligators or whatever the fuck you find in the jungle. Catch diseases from all kinds of insects. Eat monkeys ! Eat each other ! Do as thou wilt.

Who would you hate then?

And you know what ? That holocaust industry can go take and fuck itself as well. They got enough.

Well of course they did...who will be the next group you will use your little girls gun on?[8|]

Taking from us is like taking from the German people before WW2. you know what happened then and do not even think it cannot happen again. Don't use the Nword, but when you get home, among friends, friends who have arsenals in their basement, you use whatever words you want.

And one day it comes time to come outside with more lead than every piece of water pipe ever made, but in smaller doses. Administered subcutaneously at great speed.

Are you going to stomp your foot and hold your breath too?


WE built this motherfucker. And WE might just be the ones to take it down.

Really? what did you build, and on whose land did you build it?




thompsonx -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/28/2015 7:03:19 AM)


ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

What, don't like politically incorrect truth ?

Just incorrect...political has nothing to do with it.

Where would they be ? You tell me.

There is a whole family of them living in the white house as we speak. They most likely have a white maid and a white butler.

Nobody wants to answer that, just like a few other questions I have.

Once they were allowed to compete in the sports arena they seem to dominate it. Are you afraid that when alowed to compeat in other areas you would have to work for a non white?




mnottertail -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/28/2015 8:38:25 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail


quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Having repeatedly demonstrated delusions, and shown no ability here on the forum, people are familiar with them.


Oh good, like you're the one who should be talking about delusions and ability with your "nutsucker" delusions and vocabulary. People are familiar with them.


My vocabulary not only exceeds yours, but shames yours. As does my knowledge and command of fact.

Oh great one, your nutsuckerizms knowledge and fact command the universe.

you on the other hand shit your pants and howl the stupidest shit over hoaxes and hallucinations.

Good one trash mouth.


The study is in, people who swear have highly above average vocabularies.

Great then, keep up the trash mouth so everyone will think you have an above average vocabulary.. LMAO

Therefore, old whomo (who still isn't near good at its usage), then why isn't yours any more that shamelessly sub-par?

You a whomo too. Tell us about your most recent experience in an airport bathroom.








My recent experience in the airport bathrooms was, I needed to piss but there was a nutsucker nominating caucus going on in there, so I went elsewhere.





CreativeDominant -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/28/2015 9:42:36 PM)

excerpted from: Alfred L. Brophy, The Cultural War over Reparations for Slavery , 53 DePaul Law Review 1201-1211 (Spring 2004) (116 footnotes)

The most famous statement of the arguments against reparations comes from David Horowitz, who took out a series of advertisements in college newspapers in the spring of 2001. His advertisement, entitled, "Ten Reasons Why Reparations for Slavery are a Bad Idea and Racist, Too," established the basis for the arguments against reparations. Horowitz' ten points are:
1. There Is No Single Group Clearly Responsible For The Crime Of Slavery
2. There Is No One Group That Benefitted Exclusively From Its Fruits
3. Only A Tiny Minority Of White Americans Ever Owned Slaves, And Others Gave Their Lives To Free Them
4. America Today Is A Multi-Ethnic Nation and Most Americans Have No Connection (Direct Or Indirect) To Slavery
5. The Historical Precedents Used To Justify The Reparations Claim Do Not Apply, And The Claim Itself Is Based On Race Not Injury
6. The Reparations Argument Is Based On The Unfounded Claim That All African-American Descendants of Slaves Suffer From The Economic Consequences Of Slavery And Discrimination
7. The Reparations Claim Is One More Attempt To Turn African-Americans Into Victims. It Sends A Damaging Message To The African-American Community.
8. Reparations To African Americans Have Already Been Paid
9. What About The Debt Blacks Owe To America?
10. The Reparations Claim Is A Separatist Idea That Sets African-Americans Against The Nation That Gave Them Freedom.

(for David Horowitz's full article, see here: http://archive.frontpagemag.com/readArticle.aspx?ARTID=24317 )

Others have made more modest, though perhaps more persuasive, cases against reparations. Probably the best way to address the multitude of arguments against reparations is to classify them according to broad categories, then explore the nuances of each category. The arguments may be broken down into five main categories:
(1) Those asked to pay have no liability;
(2) Compensation has been made;
(3) Compensation is immoral or compensation was never due;
(4) Compensation is impracticable or politically unworkable; and
(5) Reparations are divisive and focus attention on the past rather than the future.
A. No Moral (or Legal) Liability
It appears that the type of argument that has gained the most attention--and is advanced most seriously against reparations--is that the people currently asked to pay had nothing to do with the injustices of the past. This argument draws on a popular thought in the United States, and western culture more generally, that liability should attach to fault, that people should receive punishment (or rewards) based on their personal culpability. Carried to an extreme, as many reparations skeptics do, that implies that one should be liable only for the harms one causes, that there is no general societal culpability.
Of course, we see legislatures, even courts, acting on ideas of general culpability in many places. There are many crimes committed by government officials that lead the entire community to be liable for the actions of those officials. After Rodney King obtained a damages verdict, that verdict was satisfied by the taxpayers of Los Angeles. Very few taxpayers were actually responsible for the crime, but they had to pay for the crime. Perhaps many antireparationists will object to that example. Corporations, which are really a collection of individual shareholders, are liable for the acts of their employees. In cases of environmental pollution, companies (meaning their shareholders) are frequently held liable for decades following the pollution. For example, in 1994, Mobile Oil Company was held liable for polluting the waters of the little town of Cyril, Oklahoma, as early as the 1940s. It is likely that none of Mobile's shareholders had any direct culpability for the actions of the company's officers who decided to pollute in the 1940s. Yet the shareholders had to pay.
Corporate liability is premised on the idea that shareholders, even those who had no direct influence on the decisions, have to pay. In the United States, culpability attaches even without fault in many instances. It is natural to expect that corporations, or government bodies, will have liability for the decisions they made, sometimes decades ago.
But antireparationists will say that even though in some cases there is continuing liability, the taxpayers are the people who will have to pay. And many of those individual taxpayers have no culpability. Where is the fairness in asking people whose ancestors were not even in the United States during the period of slavery (or maybe even the period of Jim Crow) to pay reparations for crimes occurring in that time? Moreover, other entities besides the United States government have culpability for slavery, such as African nations themselves. Closely allied to the argument of innocence is the argument that there is no benefit that has been retained.
Reparationists have two responses. First, that governmental bodies, like corporations, have a continuing existence. Governments are liable for the judgments issued against them and, unfortunately, they have to satisfy those judgments using taxpayer money. The new immigrants take their new government subject to the liability existing at the time. We all take America with the good and the bad at the same time. There are a lot of opportunities here; there are also some disadvantages. Reparationists' second response is more general. It denies that the people who are claiming innocence actually are innocent. As Professor Ogletree has recently phrased it, "while black folks were sitting at the back of the bus; generations of white immigrants got to go straight to the front." It is debatable how much privilege some immigrants, particularly those from southern Europe, Asia, and the Spanish Americas, received. But the point is important and worthy of significantly more study. For if currently living whites are the beneficiaries of past discrimination against blacks, then the claims of innocence are harder to make convincingly.
It is at this point that the debate runs up against strong emotions: Americans believe they are where they are today because of their own hard work and innate talent, rather than the good fortune of their birth. That is an issue for which we need further debate, but at the present it appears that the truth is somewhere in the middle: undercompensated black labor and lack of opportunities made it possible for whites, even those whose ancestors came to the United States after the era of slavery ended, to advance more quickly than they otherwise would have. It is likely--indeed hard to dispute--that some privilege is retained.
There is yet another way that antireparationists argue that there is no liability: there is no (or little) continuing effect of slavery. Reparationists commonly argue that reparations are for the continuing effects of slavery and Jim Crow. Adjoa Aiyetoro, for instance, has said: "We're not raising claims that you should pay us because you did something to us 150 years ago. We are saying tphat we are injured today by the vestiges of slavery, which took away income and property that was rightfully ours." Yet antireparationists frequently maintain that the current inequality in wealth is due to black culture, not the legacy of slavery. Journalist Walter Williams, like many antireparationists, places blame on single-parent black households:
Illegitimacy among blacks today is [seventy] percent. Only [forty-one] percent of black males [fifteen] years and older are married, and only [thirty-six] percent of black children live in two-parent families. These and other indicators of family instability and its accompanying socioeconomic factors such as high crime, welfare dependency and poor educational achievement is claimed to be the legacy and vestiges of slavery, for which black Americans are due reparations.
Yet Williams points out that the incidence of single-parent families is relatively recent. In 1940, for instance, less than twenty percent of black children were born into single-parent families. Williams refers to Herbert Gutman's book, The Black Family in Slavery and Freedom, which found that in Harlem between 1905 and 1925, eighty-five percent of black children lived in two-parent families. As Williams says:
The question raised by these historical facts is: If what we see today in many black neighborhoods, as claimed by reparation advocates, are the vestiges and legacies of slavery, how come that social pathology wasn't much worse when blacks were just two or three generations out of slavery? Might it be that slavery's legacy and vestiges have a way . . . of skipping generations? In other words . . . that devastating seventy percent rate of black illegitimacy simply skipped six generations--it's a delayed effect of slavery?


That is a central argument among reparations opponents and critics of the Great Society programs of the 1960s more generally.
It is important to try to distinguish the effects of slavery and Jim Crow discrimination from other causes in determining the current wealth gap between blacks and whites. Obviously, that is central to the case for reparations. For if slavery has no lingering effect, then there is no reason to try to repair it! But we do not need to think about generation-skipping effects to link the current sad condition of the black family to slavery. The family structure is only the latest manifestation of a social policy, borne in the years after the Civil War, that did not seek to help blacks move into the mainstream of the American economy and education system. Even though the current United States social welfare policy has good intentions--which we cannot say of the policy in the years before World War II--it is designed to discourage two-parent families. It makes sense to consider the current policy as a vestige of the Jim Crow era, which was necessary because of the limited economic opportunities of that era. It is reasonable to consider the problems with single-parent black families as yet another legacy of slavery and the neglect during the Jim Crow era and as the result of lack of job opportunities.
B. Compensation Has Been Made
The next most popular argument is that reparations have been paid in the form of Great Society programs, like the war on poverty and affirmative action, as well as welfare. And are not reparations being paid right now through welfare? Why is that not enough? Those are important and reasonable questions. As Journalist Walter Williams has said:
[T]oday's blacks benefitted immensely from the horrors suffered by our ancestors. . . . In fact, if we totaled the income black Americans earned each year, and thought of ourselves as a separate nation, we'd be the 14th or 15th richest nation. Even the [thirty-four] percent of blacks considered to be poor are fairly well off by world standards. Had there not been slavery, and today's blacks were born in Africa instead of the United States, we'd be living in the same poverty that today's Africans live in and under the same brutal regimes.
There are some important questions about how much the United States owes to descendants of slaves.
To answer that, one needs to ask: What is the basis for reparations claims? If the claim is against the United States government for unpaid labor--and only unpaid labor--then it is natural to ask, how much have the slaves and their descendants received from the United States government in the form of welfare payments? It is possible that the compensation that has been paid will, on average, compensate for the unpaid labor. But one must remember that welfare is not a race-based program; everyone who meets the eligibility requirements receives assistance, regardless of race. Why should we consider welfare payments as paying down the debt? Perhaps because we lump all debts and all payments together. When reparationists argue what is owed, based on undercompensation for labor, as Richard America argues, then it is important to talk about the compensation that has already been paid. Perhaps it is right to add in welfare payments or costs spent on affirmative action as ways of off-setting the debt. This is an area in which we need substantial additional work, to explore the value that slaves contributed to the American economy and how much of that value is still retained, as well as how much value has been returned. At this point, it is impossible to make even rough guesses about how the balance sheet stands--and that is due to failure of either side to seriously address this issue. The only person who has even attempted to compute the value of the slave labor to the United States, Richard America, has made no effort to provide for an offset. Those who argue that welfare has paid the debt, conversely, make no effort to identify the size of the welfare payments that should be counted as offset, or to compare that value to the amount blacks contributed without compensation in the eras of slavery and Jim Crow, to say nothing of whether those benefits have been retained. Reparationists, by their frequent reference to ideas of "unjust enrichment," have brought on the comparison of how much has been contributed and how much has been paid. However, most reparationists compute what is owed based not on uncompensated labor alone. The huge gap between black and white economic and educational achievement stands as testimony to the legacy of slavery and Jim Crow discrimination. That gap testifies to the continued harm, which, tragically, as happens so often, is greater than the value retained. If we view the amount owed as not only the amount of value contributed, but as also including the harm imposed by slavery and Jim Crow, then full reparations have likely not been paid. For the gap in wealth between blacks and whites testifies to the lack of full reparations.
There is, moreover, the question of equal treatment. One of the great principles of American law is the equal protection principle, which requires that similarly situated people be treated alike. Have people who are making reparations claims been treated differently and worse than others? If there has been unequal treatment, then that may be a separate basis for reparations. The issue ought not to be how people would be living if their ancestors had not been brought to the United States or freely immigrated but how they are treated relative to other people here. While David Horowitz is fond of pointing out that the average annual income of residents in Benin is less than one thousand dollars, that has little relevance to how people are treated in the United States. Life is better than it would be in another country, but the relevant comparison group is other citizens of the United States. The fact that voting rights are denied to serfs in Russia does not mean that people of Russian descent in the United States are not entitled to vote, or do not have a claim if they are denied the right to vote.
There are other ways of paying the debt, though, besides cash payments. Part of the argument that reparations have been paid is the assertion that the Civil War paid that debt. Lincoln scholars are particularly active in advancing the argument that the Civil War was part of abolishing the debt to African Americans. David Horowitz' formulation is that white Christians began the antislavery movement, which ended more than two millennia of slavery. That interpretation leaves a great deal out of the historical record, of course. The Christian nations of Western Europe and North America contributed to the market for slaves; they provided an incentive for African nations to enslave Africans and then those western countries participated in "one of the greatest crimes in history." To credit the United States with abolishing slavery does not quite wipe the slate clean. For there would have been no need for abolition of slavery in the United States unless it had been imposed by law here. Even if we say that the United States fought a war to free slaves, which only begins to describe the process of the Civil War, we cannot ignore the reasons why that war was necessary.
C. Reparations Are Divisive
Despite the marked socioeconomic progress black Americans have made in this country over the past half century, the reparations movement, at bottom, encourages minorities to believe that they are really lost souls. The leaders of this movement do not talk about how such a distant crime has led to specific damages in present lives of most minorities. For them, feelings of victimization in general, not damages in the specific, are the point. So they fervently maintain that all full-grown, capable minorities ought to blame the missed opportunities of their lives on the slavery that transpired centuries ago as though their pains were interchangeable with those endured by slaves.
The final group of arguments are at the center of the culture war. They revolve around a consideration that reparations talk divides the country along racial lines. By talking about the past and by focusing on past injustices, blacks alienate themselves from the rest of the country. Reparations talk leads blacks to see themselves as victims who deserve government payments. Within the genre of "reparations are divisive," there are several subcategories. First, that blacks have a cult of victimhood. Perhaps the best-known proponent of that cult of victimhood is Professor John McWhorter of the University of California at Berkeley. Even talk of reparations or the sins of the past causes African Americans to focus improperly on the task at hand: gaining an education and rising economically.
The second subcategory is that focusing on the injustices of the past alienates blacks from American society, at a time when they should be focusing on the benefits that American society has to offer. This is central to the culture war; we have heard versions of this same argument since at least the Vietnam War era, when those who criticized the United States were told they were being un-American. The argument is, in essence, that it is more productive to spend time focusing on the benefits that blacks have by virtue of United States citizenship than the injustices they have suffered.
The third subcategory is that reparations talk divides people along racial lines. It makes blacks think that whites as a group are their oppressors; it makes whites who have no responsibility for the sins of the past feel like oppressors and plays on feelings of guilt. That division falsely (in the minds of reparations opponents) continues the harmful focus on race. At a time when the government and everyone else should be moving toward a colorblind society, reparations talk reemphasizes race. It reestablishes racial divisions that we are eliminating (or at least ought to be eliminating).
All of this leads up to the cultural war at stake over reparations. Reparations are not just about redistribution of wealth, though they certainly are controversial for that reason alone. Reparations, and the apologies that surely precede them, are about a microcosm of how we view United States history. Do we see the United States as a place of plentiful opportunity, where people can go as far as their ability and energy will take them, or as a haunted landscape full of oppression? Do we view the chasm between black and white wealth in this country as the fault of blacks and the Great Society, which intervened in the mid-1960s, to destroy the black families and the economic progress they were about to make? Or do we view it as a legacy of past state-sponsored discrimination and racial crimes? That self-image, and the accompanying narratives we tell ourselves about how we view our own accomplishments carry powerful weight: I'm wealthy and well-educated because of my merit, not because of the fortunate circumstances of my birth, or I'm poor and poorly educated because of a racist society, not because of my lack of ability or motivation.
D. Are Reparations the Best Way of Overcoming the Past?
There is one question that is rarely discussed in antireparations literature, but is nevertheless critical: are reparations the best way to spend society's limited resources? For there may be better uses for the money. Part of the decision about whether to advocate reparations turns on how much they will benefit us--and how much benefit we could get by spending our efforts elsewhere. Perhaps reparations should focus most on the people who are most in need right now and in that formulation, it looks less like reparations and more like a Great Society program to lift everyone.

https://academic.udayton.edu/race/02rights/repara29c.htm




Phydeaux -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/28/2015 10:30:59 PM)

Nice post CD.

The case for reparations suffers some other glaring difficulties.
1. The total number of slaves imported into the united states over its entire history was approximately 400k. The average price paid per slave over this time was roughly $500 per slave. Call it $200,000,000 unadjusted for the entire period over 150 years - and you get a value of about 2 million a year. Compare this to the cost of just the revolutionary war of $66 million dollars that the continental congresses allocated - which in itself represented a tiny fraction of the money spent by the states and an even tinier percentage of the value of all goods and services and you can see that any claim that the country was formed on the back of negro labor is entirely specious.



2. In 1860 the national debt was $60 million. In 1865 it was 2.7 billion dollars. An 1879 report put he total cost of the civil war at 8.3 billion dollars. Pension costs to soldiers were roughly 300 million dollars per year. There were approximately 4 million slaves at that time. But in addition to capital costs, there were more than 15 million acres of land given to soldiers and slaves after the civil war. More than 91 million rations were handed out in the 15 months after the war to slaves. 4,300 schools were built.

So, focusing on debt alone and ignoring hundreds of millions of dollars of taxing authority spent in furtherance of the civil war, you can see that the cost the government spent on fighting the civil war - leaving out the human costs, exceeded the price per slave more than 400%. When you consider that almost a million americans died in this fight to free four million slaves one has to wonder - does that not hold weight?







DaddySatyr -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/28/2015 11:48:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

So, focusing on debt alone and ignoring hundreds of millions of dollars of taxing authority spent in furtherance of the civil war, you can see that the cost the government spent on fighting the civil war - leaving out the human costs, exceeded the price per slave more than 400%. When you consider that almost a million americans died in this fight to free four million slaves one has to wonder - does that not hold weight?



BLACK lives matter; not so much with the white lives (If we go by today's political climate).

Welcome back, Phydeaux!



Michael




Termyn8or -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/29/2015 3:06:31 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

What, don't like politically incorrect truth ?

Just incorrect...political has nothing to do with it.

Where would they be ? You tell me.

There is a whole family of them living in the white house as we speak. They most likely have a white maid and a white butler.

Nobody wants to answer that, just like a few other questions I have.

Once they were allowed to compete in the sports arena they seem to dominate it. Are you afraid that when alowed to compeat in other areas you would have to work for a non white?



God damn, you really are detached. You purposely tried to twist my words so much that now I am not interested in responding to you.

How does that grab you ?

Happy now ?

T^T




Termyn8or -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/29/2015 3:12:35 AM)

"excerpted fr..."

In many places in the US, they will NOT, and I mean absolutely NOT give you any welfare money if there is a male of legal age living in the domicile. There might be an exception if he is completely disabled, but I wouldn't bank on it.

T^T




thishereboi -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/29/2015 3:20:23 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: thishereboi

refute what? You never said what it was that you had a problem with.

The issue is reparations for blacks. ...the decendents of slaves. You and others have claimed that since you did not own slaves you don't owe anyone anything. The cites posted posit that the labor of slaves was used to build the infrastructure of this country. That blacks were denied the value of their labor to pass on to their hiers because it was used by their owners and eventually the state and federal governments in the form of taxes on the product of that labor.
The question is how is it that you come to a discussion about reparations with no knowledge of why it is being sought? How is it that you have an opinion about something of which you claim ignorance?
How is it that you failed to read the cites I posted explaining it?
Is it because you are just a loudmouth twit with nothing to say so you just bray to see your name in print?





Oh you poor little boy. You do get all worked up about this site don't you. But you are correct that I don't think I owe anyone reparation even if you have no fucking clue why I feel that way. As to why someone might not read everything you post...I think that part is pretty self explanatory even for someone like you.




thompsonx -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/29/2015 3:58:04 AM)


ORIGINAL: thishereboi


ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: thishereboi

refute what? You never said what it was that you had a problem with.

The issue is reparations for blacks. ...the decendents of slaves. You and others have claimed that since you did not own slaves you don't owe anyone anything. The cites posted posit that the labor of slaves was used to build the infrastructure of this country. That blacks were denied the value of their labor to pass on to their hiers because it was used by their owners and eventually the state and federal governments in the form of taxes on the product of that labor.
The question is how is it that you come to a discussion about reparations with no knowledge of why it is being sought? How is it that you have an opinion about something of which you claim ignorance?
How is it that you failed to read the cites I posted explaining it?
Is it because you are just a loudmouth twit with nothing to say so you just bray to see your name in print?





Oh you poor little boy. You do get all worked up about this site don't you.


Hardly. I simply post facts that you snear at in ignorance.


But you are correct that I don't think I owe anyone reparation even if you have no fucking clue why I feel that way.

Perhaps because you have been unable to articulate your thoughts. This might be because you have no thoughts or you are too stupid to think at all. In either case your vacuous post reflect your knowledge base of the subject at hand.


As to why someone might not read everything you post...I think that part is pretty self explanatory even for someone like you.

What is abundantly clear is that you do read my post but are unable to reply with anything other than vituperous verbage...rational thought seems to be beyond your pall.




thompsonx -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/29/2015 3:59:49 AM)

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or


In many places in the US, they will NOT, and I mean absolutely NOT give you any welfare money if there is a male of legal age living in the domicile. There might be an exception if he is completely disabled, but I wouldn't bank on it.


If you don't qualify for welfare then perhaps you should get a job.[8|]




thompsonx -> RE: Unreasonable? (12/29/2015 4:04:17 AM)


ORIGINAL: Termyn8or


ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

What, don't like politically incorrect truth ?

Just incorrect...political has nothing to do with it.

Where would they be ? You tell me.

There is a whole family of them living in the white house as we speak. They most likely have a white maid and a white butler.

Nobody wants to answer that, just like a few other questions I have.

Once they were allowed to compete in the sports arena they seem to dominate it. Are you afraid that when alowed to compeat in other areas you would have to work for a non white?



God damn, you really are detached. You purposely tried to twist my words so much that now I am not interested in responding to you.

Whenever you feel intellectually incapable of carrying on your end of a discussion it is always a wise move to shut up and let people think you an ignorant fool than to continue babbling and convince them.

How does that grab you ?

I always get a smile on my face when fools shut up and stop wasting bandwidth.

Happy now ?

I would be marginally happier if you would learn to read and then apply that new found knowledge to your post.





Page: <<   < prev  3 4 [5] 6 7   next >   >>

Valid CSS!




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy
0.0625