RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (Full Version)

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Cinnamongirl67 -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/2/2016 2:18:18 AM)

In all reality, once the initial excitement wears off, long term couples (most) have sex 1-2 a week if that.

On the contrary, vanillas can convert to practice bdsm. Maybe at a minimum level but it does happen.

I didn't even read your profile and notice there was a culture difference.
Maybe your wife has had engrained in her, sex is dirty, or sex is an obligation.

I have a suggestion. You might not be interested at all but it's just a suggestion.
Although you are dominant, try making the experience about making her feel comfortable. Such as playful blind folding. Light restraints in the bed. Light candles. Apply lotion. Use a feather.
Make it romantic between just the two of you. It might open up a whole new world.
Maybe, and I do mean just maybe, if you make it precious and beautiful for her, it won't feel dirty and wrong. If by chance this is the way she feels, anxiety would play a major role in not being able to relax.
Just a thought before you give up.



NookieNotes -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/2/2016 2:47:33 AM)

I didn't read every reply, but if this has been suggested, I'd be surprised.

Stop your dominance games. Relax a bit. Take a few deep breaths. Focus on your love for your wife. Rebuild your relationship in love and connection.

THEN, learn how to do it RIGHT. Learn how to LEAD as a dominant, rather than pushing it on her. Pull her in with you, by providing her needs and understanding psychology.

I am part of a private forum online specifically geared toward such things, men who want amazing sex and incredible fulfillment who want to be dominant in the bedroom. I have seen men turn their marriages around after 20 years of sexual incompatibility. It can be done.

I'm happy to share the information and where to go if this is something you'd be willing to commit time, effort and money to (No, I don't get a kick back, but I DO know and like the guy who runs it, since I've met him as a result of my research, to be 100% forthright).

All in all, you're in a tough situation. And I'm sorry for that.



UllrsIshtar -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/2/2016 2:31:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: theDominantGent

What would you do if you were in our place?


I would sit down and have each of you write down a list of reasons why you're currently fulfilled in your marriage, and a list of things you're currently missing in your marriage and cannot do without.

Then go over both lists together, eventuating each point in depth.

If your wife has on her list of reasons to currently be fulfilled "finding freedom in love" and you have on your list for reasons to be unfulfilled "not being co-dependently in love" you have hit an irreconcilable issue that cannot be resolved unless one of you permanently gives something up that would otherwise fulfill you.

Figure out who is the one who will give up what fulfills them in order to stay together on each individual point.

Once you do this both go over the list of reasons you're fulfilled in the marriage again.

You'll either find that both lists have now become more balanced, and you both have far more reasons you're fulfilled in your marriage, than things that leave you unfulfilled, or you'll find that both, or one of you, has far more reasons to be unfulfilled in your marriage than fulfilled, in which case I consider the only sound option to be divorce.

You're both young. If you cannot both find more reasons to be together than to not be together, you shouldn't waste the next 20 years of each other's lives attempting to make something work that won't.
Sometimes relationships, no matter how good and loving they are on a number of fronts, are nothing more than a stepping stone which teaches you what you really should be looking for in the next person.

Do not have children until you have both committed that the reasons to be together FAR outweigh the reasons not to be together.
Until and unless you are both no longer longing for that which you cannot have with your current partner, children will only make things worse.




tj444 -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/2/2016 2:42:53 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

You may have to come to a decision of what you want as the higher priority. You say you are an honorable man, so cheating is not (and shouldn't be) an option. However, if you know the vanilla marriage is not going to make you happy, you may have to consider if you want to remain in the marriage. (And, let's face it, if the two of you are so incompatible about the kink thing, you're both cheating yourselves out of partners that better match you, which like it or not is about her happiness, too.) It might be time to talk about what's best for everyone involved.




^^ This^^

If your marriage has serious issues that cant be resolved, then better to know now and end it.. I wish I ended my marriage years sooner but I was stubborn and kept trying to make it work.. silly me.. Time is all we are given and it isnt replaceable.. jmo..



mousekabob -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/2/2016 4:12:31 PM)

Which is more important to you? Your relationship or bdsm?

Listen to LadyPact.



princessmika -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/3/2016 4:29:55 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: NookieNotes

I didn't read every reply, but if this has been suggested, I'd be surprised.

Stop your dominance games. Relax a bit. Take a few deep breaths. Focus on your love for your wife. Rebuild your relationship in love and connection.

THEN, learn how to do it RIGHT. Learn how to LEAD as a dominant, rather than pushing it on her. Pull her in with you, by providing her needs and understanding psychology.

I am part of a private forum online specifically geared toward such things, men who want amazing sex and incredible fulfillment who want to be dominant in the bedroom. I have seen men turn their marriages around after 20 years of sexual incompatibility. It can be done.

I'm happy to share the information and where to go if this is something you'd be willing to commit time, effort and money to (No, I don't get a kick back, but I DO know and like the guy who runs it, since I've met him as a result of my research, to be 100% forthright).

All in all, you're in a tough situation. And I'm sorry for that.


Absolutely agree with this! I love your posts, NookieNotes (in this thread and in others)! :)

As myself and others keep saying, what is more important? Your wife or your sexual desires? I think ideally you would have both and I think the first step in attempting to get both is to ensure your wife feels loved and more important and thus you can begin a healing process ^_^



UllrsIshtar -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/3/2016 1:16:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: princessmika

As myself and others keep saying, what is more important? Your wife or your sexual desires?


Not to criticize anybody for whom this question makes sense or anything, but I have to admit that I don't even understand how people can conceive of asking such a question.

For me, the top 3 reasons to enter into a marriage/domestic partnership relationship with somebody are (in random order).

- Love and emotional support
- Mutually working towards a joined plan for the future and the sharing of resources (time, money, and energy)
- Sexual fulfillment

Without those 3 reasons, there is no point in being in a relationship with somebody, and I can't really say that any of them are more important than the other ones. They're a package deal.

As such -me personally- I could never ask the question: "What's more important, sex or your husband?" Because sex is one of the primary reasons I have a husband to begin with.
Without sexual fulfillment, our relationship would be unbalanced, and simple not worth it to maintain, any more than it would be if he didn't love me (or I didn't love him) or if we had drastically different ideas of what we want our future to look like.

And because -me personally- for me sex = kink, and I can't find sexual fulfillment in a strictly vanilla sex life, deep-seeded kink incompatibility that could not be resolved by finding a middle ground would necessitate the end of our relationship. In fact, it's unlikely that even a middle ground would be enough to keep us together long term.

Without sex, we would be very close friends, who care about each other very very much. But that would be it.
We wouldn't be a couple anymore in any real meaning of the way -me personally- we define what it means to be a "couple".





OsideGirl -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/3/2016 1:48:14 PM)

Well, I have a couple of thoughts:

- Being kinky makes her unhappy. She shouldn't have to feel that she has to sacrifice her happiness for yours. Neither should you.

- Regardless of how much you love someone, that doesn't mean that they are the best partner for you.


quote:

ORIGINAL: theDominantGent

I had always been controlling and liked having my way
- This doesn't mean you're Dominant. It could also be used to describe someone that is domineering, abusive or insecure. You need to look further into yourself to see why you used those terms to describe how you feel.

I agree with Ish.....do not have children until this is resolved.

Lastly, I'm going to say: You're both young. Ending this now, you both have a lot of time to find someone more compatible, that will lead to happiness in the relationship. It's not life ending to end a relationship when you've tried save it and it doesn't work. Right now, you're both being martyrs.



Wayward5oul -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/3/2016 4:11:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar
Without sexual fulfillment, our relationship would be unbalanced, and simple not worth it to maintain, any more than it would be if he didn't love me (or I didn't love him) or if we had drastically different ideas of what we want our future to look like.

Seconded.



JanahX -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/3/2016 5:30:32 PM)

How are you going to make her happy if you're not happy yourself?
If the sex sucks, the marriage is already fucked. Youre just going to continue to be miserable. This shit doesn't go away. Ever.
That would like me going back to vanilla - Bwahahahahaha.... I'd rather be celebate and rub one off watching kinky porn.



princessmika -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/3/2016 9:46:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar

quote:

ORIGINAL: princessmika

As myself and others keep saying, what is more important? Your wife or your sexual desires?


Not to criticize anybody for whom this question makes sense or anything, but I have to admit that I don't even understand how people can conceive of asking such a question.

As such -me personally- I could never ask the question: "What's more important, sex or your husband?" Because sex is one of the primary reasons I have a husband to begin with.
Without sexual fulfillment, our relationship would be unbalanced, and simple not worth it to maintain, any more than it would be if he didn't love me (or I didn't love him) or if we had drastically different ideas of what we want our future to look like.



I do understand how both your SO and sex are a package deal. It's a given that they should come together. However, for many women, myself included (and probably many vanilla women?), feeling as though you're more important than sex is a pre-requisite to having great sex. Haha, strange but true for many of us.

Therefore, if this husband is able to separate the two enough to make a decision about which one is more important, I think that would really help his decision along. If it's his wife, and he communicates this clearly to her, I think the couple has a really good chance at healing their relationship and sex life. If, however, it's sex that is more important, it makes divorce the correct action to take. Not many women (perhaps vanilla women, specifically) want to feel second to sexual desires. It really creates a bad sex life, which in my opinion, is a big part of what is happening in the OP's dilemma.

Of course, this is just my opinion and interpretation of the situation. ^_^



OsideGirl -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/3/2016 9:54:01 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: princessmika


quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar

quote:

ORIGINAL: princessmika

As myself and others keep saying, what is more important? Your wife or your sexual desires?


Not to criticize anybody for whom this question makes sense or anything, but I have to admit that I don't even understand how people can conceive of asking such a question.

As such -me personally- I could never ask the question: "What's more important, sex or your husband?" Because sex is one of the primary reasons I have a husband to begin with.
Without sexual fulfillment, our relationship would be unbalanced, and simple not worth it to maintain, any more than it would be if he didn't love me (or I didn't love him) or if we had drastically different ideas of what we want our future to look like.



I do understand how both your SO and sex are a package deal. It's a given that they should come together. However, for many women, myself included (and probably many vanilla women?), feeling as though you're more important than sex is a pre-requisite to having great sex. Haha, strange but true for many of us.

Therefore, if this husband is able to separate the two enough to make a decision about which one is more important, I think that would really help his decision along. If it's his wife, and he communicates this clearly to her, I think the couple has a really good chance at healing their relationship and sex life. If, however, it's sex that is more important, it makes divorce the correct action to take. Not many women (perhaps vanilla women, specifically) want to feel second to sexual desires. It really creates a bad sex life, which in my opinion, is a big part of what is happening in the OP's dilemma.





As a counselor, I have to tell you that I disagree with this. You're asking this of him, when the same could be asked of her. It's essentially a guilt trip. "If you really loved me you would do ______" It puts one party in control of the relationship, it makes one party a sacrifice and breeds resentment. God forbid, children come into that atmosphere.

My honest advice to these two would be that even though they love each, they may not be the correct match for each other.



LadyPact -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/4/2016 3:01:56 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl
As a counselor, I have to tell you that I disagree with this. You're asking this of him, when the same could be asked of her. It's essentially a guilt trip. "If you really loved me you would do ______" It puts one party in control of the relationship, it makes one party a sacrifice and breeds resentment. God forbid, children come into that atmosphere.

My honest advice to these two would be that even though they love each, they may not be the correct match for each other.

It's a very good point being made about not having children until the people being discussed in the original know what they want to do. Definite kudos to those who have mentioned it.

Since you have the background, Oside, and put this so succinctly, I wanted to comment on it. In my opinion, there isn't a whole lot in the "if you love me, you'll do X" scenarios that doesn't boil down to emotional blackmail. It is using a person's emotional attachment to coerce the other person into something they really don't want to do. I see it differently than when we start talking about things related to a person's submission and bending that person's will to match the Dominant's own. We're talking about a wife referenced in the OP who is not a submissive, so we have to keep it in terms of egalitarian relationships, and I don't happen to find emotional blackmail to be a terribly healthy way to have a relationship. A person wanting to do something because they love someone is a lot different than a person feeling forced to do something because they love someone.

Most folks on the thread would feel very incompatible if their partner lost their urges for kink and/or power dynamics and decided they wanted a vanilla life. I know that sounds weird to a lot of people but I've seen cases where it's happened. Thinking about that hypothetical is about as close as most kinky people are going to get to what the spouse feels like when it comes to the "how do I get my spouse to be kinky" threads. All of those feelings about how you (general you) would be asked to be someone that you are not. That's how the vanilla person feels in these scenarios.




Greta75 -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/4/2016 3:54:34 AM)

quote:

for many women, myself included (and probably many vanilla women?), feeling as though you're more important than sex is a pre-requisite to having great sex. Haha, strange but true for many of us.

This is actually probably very true for many vanilla women who view sex as as penetration. And probably thinking like, by the time you are 90 yr old, the poor guy probably will have difficulty getting it up to penetrate then what?

Then I realise with my perfect sex, we are probably still gonna have freaking awesome sex till 90, because, majority of the things he enjoys involves toys. No hard dick required. Dildos are there, and he enjoys using them. I mean, he brushes my side boob and I cum. I am sure at 90, he can lift a finger to gently caress my side boob and make me cum continuously anyway! Like it never occur to me, sex is possible in my life at 90 yrs old until I met this dude. But I guess at that age, I'm only worried if he can feel attracted to a wrinkly body, but that's another issue. Can sex be enjoyable with someone you don't feel physical attraction to? Ha! I don't know yet.

It just seem like with kink, age is not gonna be a problem for sex ever! And it's clear as night and day to me now. So I've now changed my position on, sex is not of high importance. I wrongly married a man who wasn't sexually compatible with me, because I assume age will naturally come in the way, and I gotta find someone where I can be happy with without sexual interaction.

But now, I totally believe, I need the sexual element to always be there! I'm a sexual being. It's what I am! And I can't deny that part of me for the rest of my life.

To me, OP, you only got ONE LIFE! You love kink. Go forth and enjoy it. End this marriage! You can't make her happy! Do it for her happiness! She really deserves a man who thinks, she's his best sex in the world!



Cinnamongirl67 -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/4/2016 4:36:23 AM)

Greta you said when the guy can't get it up then what?
It's called Cialis.[:D] good stuff by the way.

I consider my marrIage more vanilla then anything. I've been married a long time. The most important thing we have is the partnership. The support mentally, emotionally, physically too if needed. Raising children, trying to compromise, etc.
Since I consider myself swaying more vanilla then anything, those things are more important then sex.
If those needs aren't being met there is no sex or bad sex!
Men seem to be different and almost a little daff to this? Sex is super important whether you are seeing eye to eye or not. (Generalizing here)
If a woman isn't wanting Tarzan sex, or having a lot of headaches, it's also a threat to their masculinity. Women are like "wake the hell up, get with the program!" If you want to get to point B, take care of point A first.



OsideGirl -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/4/2016 3:06:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Cinnamongirl67

Greta you said when the guy can't get it up then what?
It's called Cialis.[:D] good stuff by the way.

I consider my marrIage more vanilla then anything. I've been married a long time. The most important thing we have is the partnership. The support mentally, emotionally, physically too if needed. Raising children, trying to compromise, etc.
Since I consider myself swaying more vanilla then anything, those things are more important then sex.
If those needs aren't being met there is no sex or bad sex!
Men seem to be different and almost a little daff to this? Sex is super important whether you are seeing eye to eye or not. (Generalizing here)
If a woman isn't wanting Tarzan sex, or having a lot of headaches, it's also a threat to their masculinity. Women are like "wake the hell up, get with the program!" If you want to get to point B, take care of point A first.

Even without kink, our marriage wouldn't be vanilla. Our power dynamic exists in almost all areas of our lives. It's how we interact with each other. If one of us decided that we weren't Dominant or submissive, the relationship would fall apart.



princessmika -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/4/2016 5:00:27 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: princessmika


quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar

quote:

ORIGINAL: princessmika

As myself and others keep saying, what is more important? Your wife or your sexual desires?


Not to criticize anybody for whom this question makes sense or anything, but I have to admit that I don't even understand how people can conceive of asking such a question.

As such -me personally- I could never ask the question: "What's more important, sex or your husband?" Because sex is one of the primary reasons I have a husband to begin with.
Without sexual fulfillment, our relationship would be unbalanced, and simple not worth it to maintain, any more than it would be if he didn't love me (or I didn't love him) or if we had drastically different ideas of what we want our future to look like.



I do understand how both your SO and sex are a package deal. It's a given that they should come together. However, for many women, myself included (and probably many vanilla women?), feeling as though you're more important than sex is a pre-requisite to having great sex. Haha, strange but true for many of us.

Therefore, if this husband is able to separate the two enough to make a decision about which one is more important, I think that would really help his decision along. If it's his wife, and he communicates this clearly to her, I think the couple has a really good chance at healing their relationship and sex life. If, however, it's sex that is more important, it makes divorce the correct action to take. Not many women (perhaps vanilla women, specifically) want to feel second to sexual desires. It really creates a bad sex life, which in my opinion, is a big part of what is happening in the OP's dilemma.





As a counselor, I have to tell you that I disagree with this. You're asking this of him, when the same could be asked of her. It's essentially a guilt trip. "If you really loved me you would do ______" It puts one party in control of the relationship, it makes one party a sacrifice and breeds resentment. God forbid, children come into that atmosphere.

My honest advice to these two would be that even though they love each, they may not be the correct match for each other.


I disagree with your interpretation of my question. It's not "If you love me, you'll do __". It's literally, "What is your more important? Your wife or your sexual desire"? Based on this answer, a decision can and perhaps should be made.

I, too, believe that the wife should consider the question but, in my interpretation of the events, she already has by trying out the different kind of sex acts that he wanted (in other words, decided that she loved her husband more than her sexual desires/comforts). However, in many vanilla relationships, I feel as though the woman's sexual pleasure is a necessity for the sex to be considered "good" by both parties. I can only imagine she wasn't into it by the OP's comments. Therefore, without her having a genuine like for what is going on in the bedroom, neither of them will be enjoying sex. However, once she knows that she is more important than his sexual desires - it will create a more comfortable environment to more slowly warm up to these kinkier requests from the husband for it to be an all-around more genuine experience that both will enjoy.

Hopefully this makes sense but, of course, again, this is my interpretation from the limited knowledge we have from the OP.



Greta75 -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/4/2016 5:54:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Cinnamongirl67

Greta you said when the guy can't get it up then what?
It's called Cialis.[:D] good stuff by the way.

Does it work for 90 yr olds? And will he have the strength and stamina to bang at that age? haha! I don't know! I mean, I hate being on top too!

quote:

The support mentally, emotionally, physically too if needed.

I was just thinking mental and emotional support can be fulfilled by platonic friends you have. But it's the physical support that needs to be fulfilled by the spouse. That's why sex still ranks tops.
quote:

Raising children, trying to compromise, etc.

I've officially given up on children. I had 3 major men who wanted kids with me, and I've turned it all down, I've missed my boat. I mean the problem was, when they wanted it, I was not ready. I always felt like I needed to be much older and wiser before having the maturity for kids. But when older and wiser came, the right guy was not there. So I have no kids in the equation of my future man now. Unless he comes with kids. That would be perfect for me too!

I wish physical intimacy isn't like on the top of the list for me, but it really really is. I can get emotional support and mental support, as a single person, I get plenty of that from platonic people around me. Especially these days, everyone is just a text message or phone call away. It's the ability to have physical intimacy every single night and morning that I am missing.



OsideGirl -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/4/2016 7:53:32 PM)

[Quote]



I disagree with your interpretation of my question. It's not "If you love me, you'll do __". It's literally, "What is your more important? Your wife or your sexual desire"? Based on this answer, a decision can and perhaps should be made.

[/quote]
Okay, replace "Dominant" with "gay", would you ask him what's more important? Would you still suggest that if his wife is more important that giving up who he is would work?



JeffBC -> RE: What does an honorable man do if he is not sexually satisfied in marriage? (2/4/2016 11:05:35 PM)

quote:

What would you do if you were in our place?


That's an interesting question. Carol and I have been together for 20 years now (give or take). Quite predictably there's been ups and down... times of higher satisfaction and times of lesser. But we've never been in your situation. The reason we haven't is that when one of us zigs, the other tends to zig right along with them. When one zags, same thing. We have a built-in and very strong desire to want to be the complement for our partner. So how this would play out in our marriage is that Carol would work very hard to get more kinky and I'd consciously de-prioritize the kink... not suppress it... but really let it go. We would meet somewhere in the middle. If, for some reason, the middle wasn't possible for one partner then we'd meet wherever we had to. But what would be infinitely more important than whatever issue was at hand would be being on the same page.

A specific example from our marriage that is, perhaps, closest to what you experience. I really enjoy oral sex and would like to finish in her mouth. She also really enjoys blowing me, but for whatever reasons, cum in her mouth is gag-worthy... she says it's a texture thing. Between Carol and I, I have no doubts that because she understands how much I want this, if it was viable I'd already have it. Apparently it is not. So I let it go. We didn't meet in the middle on this one. We met on her position. There were lots of other options. I could demand to cum in her mouth and she'd obey. But how is that a win? Now I've taken a woman who enjoys blowing me and made it an unpleasant experience for her. I could harbor some secret resentment but why? I trust implicitly her good intent. As I said, if cum in her mouth was viable it'd already have happened without any problem. I could pine after some fantasy but again, why? I have a woman who loves the heck out of me and delivers on about 2 zillion other fantasies. It'd be hard to trade up. For Carol's part, she goes out of her way to accommodate me orally every other way. From her standpoint she has failed me and so works hard to "make up points" if you will, with willingness, gusto, technique, and whatever else she or I can dream up.

I think an interesting conversation to have between yourself and your wife is why isn't that happening? Why aren't you both naturally yearning to deliver on your partner's wants/dreams/hopes/wishes/fantasies? Instead of wondering how to get what each of you want for yourself, why aren't you both wondering how you can deliver for your partner and stretching your own self to make that happen?

In my mind, at least, there's an underlying issue here that transcends the failure to connect on a specific mode of sex. Over time, there's going to be lots and lots of places where you two don't connect. How do you intend to handle them?



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