Rally Question (Full Version)

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KenDckey -> Rally Question (3/20/2016 2:28:38 AM)

For my friends on the more progressive side

I believe we all know that the anti-Trump crowd blocked highways leading to Trumps speech in Phoenix and again in Tuscon this weekend. Others were escorted from the venue (one Trump supporter arrested for battery).

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_CAMPAIGN_2016?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

Arizona unlawful imprisonment law http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/13/01303.htm indicates restraining a person is a criminal violation. Yet no one was arrested for restraining Trump supporters, and possibly residents, from going about their lawful business.

I have no problem with protests. I do have a problem with road blockages as a form of protest because of the restraint of the other peoples rights on public access rights of way.

So to my questions:

a. How would respond to our less progressive public blocking Hilary’s supporters to their venue?

b. What is the appropriate police response to these acts?



JVoV -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 2:47:34 AM)

1) we'd probably think it was more Bundys coming out of the woodworks.

2) Water cannons aren't used nearly enough in this country.



MrRodgers -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 6:12:15 AM)

Again just as in the HRC lying videos, this has been done all throughout election history. Until the proletariat get off their ass and demand to attend political events, until those people demand a restoration of the right of free speech and to peaceably assemble, this will just get worse.



Lucylastic -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 7:08:32 AM)

Ken you know there are other protesters on the right protesting trump rallies? not just progressives.
I notice you make a fuss out of peaceful protest and gloss over that another trump supporter was arrested for assault...why is that?



KenDckey -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 10:54:05 AM)

Lucy

quote:

Ken you know there are other protesters on the right protesting trump rallies? not just progressives.


That is why I used tthe term "more progressive".

quote:

I notice you make a fuss out of peaceful protest and gloss over that another trump supporter was arrested for assault...why is that?


Personally, I think that anyone who deprivees anyone of their rights should be criminally prosecuted.



Lucylastic -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 11:01:10 AM)

LOL aaaaah I see, for same rights for everyone?when will that happen?
justice? when will that happen for everyone.
Ahuh, thats why you are making a fuss about a peaceful protest.(well so far) and ignoring the punching and kicking of a protester at another rally....







ThatDizzyChick -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 11:51:40 AM)

a) Couldn't care less if I were paid.
b) About what they did in Phoenix, just insure things don't get out of hand.



ThatDizzyChick -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 11:53:44 AM)

quote:

Yet no one was arrested for restraining Trump supporters, and possibly residents, from going about their lawful business.

That's because nobody was restrained. Delay is not restraint.



KenDckey -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 12:10:01 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick

quote:

Yet no one was arrested for restraining Trump supporters, and possibly residents, from going about their lawful business.

That's because nobody was restrained. Delay is not restraint.


depends on your reading of the definition

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/restraint

a way of limiting, controlling, or stopping something



thompsonx -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 12:19:33 PM)


ORIGINAL: KenDckey


ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick
Yet no one was arrested for restraining Trump supporters, and possibly residents, from going about their lawful business.
That's because nobody was restrained. Delay is not restraint.


depends on your reading of the definition

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/restraint

a way of limiting, controlling, or stopping something

Wow...just like the senate and the nomination for the supreme court.[8|]



kdsub -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 12:25:09 PM)

I find it typical of fanatics that one would demand their right to free speech and assembly...while in their very act of protesting they are denying someone else the same right. There should be no tolerance of illegal assembly and protest. Just as there should be no tolerance of denying one the right to legal free assembly and protest. Thank heavens our laws allow protest and free speech but they should not be abused without real consequences.

Each circumstance should be measured against the law of the land. Blocking traffic is wrong... punching someone for exercising their free speech is wrong... Lets just enforce the law that is there to guarantee... everyone's... rights and provide a safe environment to express our beliefs.

Butch



thompsonx -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 12:37:00 PM)


ORIGINAL: kdsub

I find it typical of fanatics that one would demand their right to free speech and assembly...while in their very act of protesting they are denying someone else the same right. There should be no tolerance of illegal assembly and protest. Just as there should be no tolerance of denying one the right to legal free assembly and protest. Thank heavens our laws allow protest and free speech but they should not be abused without real consequences.

Each circumstance should be measured against the law of the land. Blocking traffic is wrong... punching someone for exercising their free speech is wrong... Lets just enforce the law that is there to guarantee... everyone's... rights and provide a safe environment to express our beliefs.


This would mean that you feel the boston massacre was justified?
Would it have been justified to do the same to the black people who illegally sat down at segregate lunch counters?



ThatDizzyChick -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 12:42:39 PM)

quote:

a way of limiting, controlling, or stopping something

Nope, sorry, otherwise the Trump campaign is equally guilty because they limited, controlled, and stopped the protesters from getting into the rally.
All the protesters did was delay people for a while.



BamaD -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 12:46:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick

> a way of limiting, controlling, or stopping something
Nope, sorry, otherwise the Trump campaign is equally guilty because they limited, controlled, and stopped the protesters from getting into the rally.
All the protesters did was delay people for a while.

So you are saying that preventing someone from stopping your freedom of speach is denying them theirs? That people have a greater right to disrupt a political rally than they do to hold one?



ThatDizzyChick -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 12:48:16 PM)

quote:

So you are saying that preventing someone from stopping your freedom of speach is denying them theirs?

Go back and read what I wrote, and pay attention to the context.

quote:

That people have a greater right to disrupt a political rally than they do to hold one?

Go back and read what I wrote, and pay attention to the context.



kdsub -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 1:05:46 PM)

No to the first... yes to the second...Just as in the recent protests some actions are wrong some are not... I say just follow the law and administer it fairly.

Just as an opinion... the actions of some, such as blocking roads and denying free speech of protesters, will not change minds... and changing minds should be the purpose of protests and political speeches. The happenings around Trump's campaign are only strengthening the division between people not bringing us to a consensus on our political future.

Butch



ThatDizzyChick -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 1:27:34 PM)

The more they protest Trump, the more they help him.



PeonForHer -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 2:03:01 PM)

quote:

The happenings around Trump's campaign are only strengthening the division between people not bringing us to a consensus on our political future.


Do you really think that ship hasn't yet sailed? It's seemed to me that the USA has been working towards the present polarisation and fragmentation for at least a decade.



ThatDizzyChick -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 2:05:38 PM)

quote:

It's seemed to me that the USA has been working towards the present polarisation and fragmentation for at least a decade.

Longer than that.



kdsub -> RE: Rally Question (3/20/2016 2:25:59 PM)

Hello Peon

No more than any other democracy in the free world...certainly you are not going to say your country of origin is not polarized when it comes to politics.

I think the only real difference in America today, and much of the modern world as well, as opposed to 50 years ago is simply the advent of instant access and exchange of information, right or wrong. This allows opinion to spread almost instantaneously where in the past it may have taken weeks even months. This increases the apparent turmoil and the impression of a consensus that is not necessarily true. News media seem to pick the loudest voices and the most sensational stories giving credence and false impressions of community thought.

Butch



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