Termyn8or
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ORIGINAL: Edwurde
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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
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ORIGINAL: Kirata
Thanks for the link. That one went into my Education folder.
K.
The Europeans in general are more innovative. In Germany, I read where as of entering the 10th grade, you are tested and with a counselor, a firm decision is made that either a student has the aptitude to go into the professional ranks, i.e., Doctor, layer, engineer or technical side, services, repair, trouble shooting technicians, nursing, etc. The last three years in HS are for prep. in that direction.
That way, once entering college, or any form of higher ed., the major or work path is known and a career path is set. Students are free to pursue what they wish after HS but getting admitted to through college, is much more difficult.
From what my German (Deutsche Sprache) teacher from Nuremberg (Nürnberg) told us, the track of educational course is actually determined after the fifth grade. From thereon, it's off to either the Hauptschule ("main school" or "general school"), the Fachschule (trade school) or the Gymnasium (college prep). (Schule {school}is pronounced like "Sheila" but with a u for the middle vowel.)
If it's the trade school, some of them are already done by the end of tenth grade. Or they might go to fourteen years if the concentration is, e.g., electronic or computer technician. Graduates of the Gymnasium, which takes thirteen years all total (from first grade), must still pass the Abitur test before being admitted into a university (Hochschule, literal translation- "high school," but effective translation is "college"). Which is extremely low cost, just a nominal tuition to keep out the lifers.
Aside from all that "pre-determination," anyone from whatever educational 'track' can later take night school classes and take the Abitur and get into a college if they pass.
I think that (Ich bin der Meinung dass) this is a more cost effective way of going about it. Why cost taxpayers twelve years for brick layers and plumbers? And on the other side of it, Germans, and Europeans generally, are not nearly so dismissive of those in the "lower trades" as we are in the US. In the first place, they pay them better. They might not be held in the same regard as, say, teachers, but neither are 'common workers' spat upon and used as experiment for how much can be got away with in low pay, either.
Heck, more than half the brick layers have taken two years of English, and most of the waitstaff have health insurance and pay high enough where tips aren't even expected.
It's just a different mindset.
In the US, higher education is, bizarrely, thought of as a "privilege," rather than a means to be nationally more competitive in the world. The Germans don't miss out on that one at all. But in any case, those who don't get into the Gymnasium and then the Hochschule (die Universität) are still ensured to be well trained, and having enough employers ready to hire them, at good pay. Unlike the US, where employers are trained to think that they are being cheated if they have to pay high school grads more than 7 dollars an hour. Hence all the Mexicans. Hence all the bitching (from everybody) concomitant thereby.
Germany, the second or third largest total exporters in the world (depending on the year), at ~27% population of the US. Maybe they know what they're doing, but who knows ...
Who pays for this ? If the people holding the purse strings decide who goes to what school, fine. Go make some money and go to a different school layer.
You have it wrong about bricklayers and plumbers though. They make serious good money here. But the government does not teach them their trade, they must be sponsored into a union and go through an apprenticeship. I've seen the book work a bricklayer, there is alot more to it than most people think. Same with electricians, but they all make a mistake which is if you want to be licensed to change an electric panel in a house (I have done dozens of those jobs) they want you to be able to wire a nuclear power plant, or a high tech shop with CNC machines. Plumbing isn't as bad, like to do a bathroom remodel you don't have to do high pressure gas pipe welding. With bricklaying, before you're a journeyman you have to know all kinds of shit you'll never use. But the expectation on the job is that if the ask, you CAN. And do it right.
There is a big difference between trad unions and labor unions. Labor unions are largely for minimal skill jobs, and mainly exist to negotiate for better pay and benefits. Trade unions provide education, and once one is certifies by them you can trust them to do the job right.
The one thing that gets me about the US is how long primary education takes. They are wasting a hell of alot of time - or... someone mentioned academically something, unacceptable ? Something like that ?
On my first day of school, I already knew how to read and write, and basic math. That year I was called to the blackboard to make an "A". I did so and the teacher said it was backwards, to which I replied "It can't be backwards it is symmetrical". And then another day was "Count as high as you can". I could already count to infinity, I said "Are you sure ?". I got up to like 150 or so and the teacher said "OK, that's enough". And then I asked to be shown how to do long division and got "We aren't on that yet".
And then we got Lewin A. R. W. Edwards. From Australia. I had his OLD resume'. He quit college at 16 to go to work and said that now his education has been on an ad hoc basis. He writes driver software for computer hardware, or at least he did back then. Had been around, something about writing software for the phone company in some South American country. When I come across him he was working in NYC on an H1B visa. (had no intentions of staying either, once the job is done he is gone) Makes me wonder how old you have to be to get an H1B visa in the US. He must have been 18, because here, before then you can't even have your own bank account, which I think is fucked up.
Anyway, I have been long aware that other countries have better schools. In fact if I had kids they would be going to school, maybe in Germany or Japan, or something. Or private schools, which are a cut above here, seems the Catholic and Jewish schools are about the best. At least you don't need a passport to get to them so they are a pretty good option.
The schools in this country, I believe are a major part of the problem. Twelve years and they can't read their diploma. Can't balance a checkbook. Don't realize they cannot have a $250,000 house for $500 a month. Don't know what to eat or drink. Don't know how to drive a car.
T^T
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RE: Why Finland has the best schools. - 
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