RE: Brexit Vote Results

RE: Brexit Vote Results (Full Version)

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MariaB -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 7:57:31 AM)
It may seem strange but there are still plenty of working class Tories here in Britain and no amount of Tory inflicted victimization will have them voting Labour. They unwittingly vote for less hope, more instability and more hardship because it was the Thatcher’s Tory government who allowed them or their parents to become home owners which made them at least feel more inclusive with the middle class system. Many working class Brits are brought up to believe they can, if they only work hard enough, financially better themselves and for them its the Tories that represent those values. They look up to the posh people living in nice houses with two new cars sitting in the drive and they are impressed. Working class Tories know their place and will happily defend anyone with a sense of entitlement. They play the Lotto twice a week and look up to people like David Beckham and Sir Alan Sugar because they represent hope. They vote for the Tory party because the middle and upper class vote for the Tories. Try and tell these people they are being fucked over by the establishment and they will go into immediate denial about their own personal struggle because as long as they can still buy their shiny trinkets and order a grand frappe latte in Costa Coffe then things can’t be so bad. I wouldn’t call this type of working class conservative; they’re just sleep walking in the matrix.

Edwird -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 8:36:37 AM)
I appreciated your earlier post with the youtube link. I've been yelling the same thing for years, but the media drowns us out. In the econ classes, increased productivity translating to increased wages only works in a "closed economy", which might have existed about 5,000 years ago. To be fair, they have to teach things in more simplified fashion to begin with, but in any case, it's clearly not working that way in today's world. Productivity and wages have taken such a steep departure from each other as not seen in many decades. And if anyone doesn't understand that as the entire purpose of neoliberal economics, then we've got a world of hurt coming upon us as they venture further into the fray.

NorthernGent1 -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 9:27:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MariaB It may seem strange but there are still plenty of working class Tories here in Britain and no amount of Tory inflicted victimization will have them voting Labour. They unwittingly vote for less hope, more instability and more hardship because it was the Thatcher’s Tory government who allowed them or their parents to become home owners which made them at least feel more inclusive with the middle class system. Many working class Brits are brought up to believe they can, if they only work hard enough, financially better themselves and for them its the Tories that represent those values. They look up to the posh people living in nice houses with two new cars sitting in the drive and they are impressed. Working class Tories know their place and will happily defend anyone with a sense of entitlement. They play the Lotto twice a week and look up to people like David Beckham and Sir Alan Sugar because they represent hope. They vote for the Tory party because the middle and upper class vote for the Tories. Try and tell these people they are being fucked over by the establishment and they will go into immediate denial about their own personal struggle because as long as they can still buy their shiny trinkets and order a grand frappe latte in Costa Coffe then things can’t be so bad. I wouldn’t call this type of working class conservative; they’re just sleep walking in the matrix. What would you know about the working class? My credentials: I was brought up on a council estate in a mining village in County Durham, where during the '80s the unemployment rate was 50% due to the closure of the pits. I moved away to go to university, but I couldn't wait to move back, which I did. Couldn't think of a better place to live. Couldn't think of a worse place to live than middle class suburbia. I can tell you now, I have absolutely no ambitions to be middle class. None whatsoever. My salary would put me in that bracket, but my mind-set is certainly working class. From someone whose family were miners, and I lived among miners during my youth, they are not Tories you fool. Have a think about the difference between holding a conservative disposition and being a Tory. You will find they're worlds apart, and when you've arrived at that point come back to the thread.

Edwird -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 9:44:12 AM)
What's your issue, bruv? Can you not see that those who look out for interests of people who actually get it done are in your corner? If you take that as some imaginary 'condescension', that's on you and nobody else.

vincentML -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 10:02:34 AM)
quote: And what's more, Germany, for example, trains their lower and medium skilled workers such that the 50% below median income earners are conspicuously more well off than their counterparts in the UK or the US. While at it, Germany exports to the world about as much as the US does, with just a bit over 1/4th the population. Nothing the least bit 'pie in the sky' notions about it. Two things the neoliberal dogma has given us in the US: 1. Tens of thousands of manufacturing plants gone away. 2. Less need and therefore less money to train the high school drops outs. So, drug dealing becomes a rational enterprise.

NorthernGent1 -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 10:04:03 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Edwird What's your issue, bruv? Can you not see that those who look out for interests of people who actually get it done are in your corner? If you take that as some imaginary 'condescension', that's on you and nobody else. You serious? Read her post again. It amounts to: "the working class are stupid and are being duped by the Tories". What's it got to do with you anyway?

vincentML -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 10:13:58 AM)
quote: Many working class Brits are brought up to believe they can, if they only work hard enough, financially better themselves and for them its the Tories that represent those values. They look up to the posh people living in nice houses with two new cars sitting in the drive and they are impressed. Working class Tories know their place and will happily defend anyone with a sense of entitlement. They play the Lotto twice a week and look up to people like David Beckham and Sir Alan Sugar because they represent hope. They vote for the Tory party because the middle and upper class vote for the Tories. Try and tell these people they are being fucked over by the establishment and they will go into immediate denial about their own personal struggle because as long as they can still buy their shiny trinkets and order a grand frappe latte in Costa Coffe then things can’t be so bad. Agreed, unless you have a skill with a ball on a playing field or court or with a musical instrument or your voice it is unlikely you will rise from the working class here in the States. Even those privileged with 'smarts' are burdened with debt coming out of university. For the average Joe Worker upward mobility seems a distant myth, imo.

vincentML -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 10:15:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Edwird What's your issue, bruv? Can you not see that those who look out for interests of people who actually get it done are in your corner? If you take that as some imaginary 'condescension', that's on you and nobody else. Really, just being ironic, I hope.

MariaB -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 10:18:36 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NorthernGent1 quote: ORIGINAL: Edwird What's your issue, bruv? Can you not see that those who look out for interests of people who actually get it done are in your corner? If you take that as some imaginary 'condescension', that's on you and nobody else. You serious? Read her post again. It amounts to: "the working class are stupid and are being duped by the Tories". What's it got to do with you anyway? If that’s what you get from my post then I pity you. I’m a working class Corbyn supporter. I was a foster kid who grew up with a stepdad who worked himself to death in the steel industry and a step-mum who scrubbed floors to put a meal on the table. We lived in a back to back terrace and barely had a pot to piss in. I’ve always pondered about working class folk voting for the Tories but let’s face it, lots of them don’t, me being one of them. I take from your overly offended attitude that you are a working class Tory supporter.

vincentML -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 10:29:23 AM)
quote: To be fair, they have to teach things in more simplified fashion to begin with, but in any case, it's clearly not working that way in today's world. At the least Brexit gave the Brits a chance to leave. Our only votes in the States are for Pols who are for the most part dependent upon the Corporation$$$ Labor unions have been bashed. Many or most states have "right to work laws" which hamper union organization. The only power centers remaining are in the street. And that's not nice, ya know. Protesting, picketing will bring down the might and wrath of the government. The propaganda in favor of neoliberalism ideology is unrelenting.

MariaB -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 10:32:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML quote: To be fair, they have to teach things in more simplified fashion to begin with, but in any case, it's clearly not working that way in today's world. At the least Brexit gave the Brits a chance to leave. Our only votes in the States are for Pols who are for the most part dependent upon the Corporation$$$ Labor unions have been bashed. Many or most states have "right to work laws" which hamper union organization. The only power centers remaining are in the street. And that's not nice, ya know. Protesting, picketing will bring down the might and wrath of the government. The propaganda in favor of neoliberalism ideology is unrelenting. Depressing isn't it. Sounds like you and I live in a parallel universe. Hopefully things will improve now we are out of the EU but its going to take a while.

NorthernGent1 -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 10:56:31 AM)
in Britain and no amount of Tory inflicted victimization will have them voting Labour. They unwittingly vote for less hope They look up to the posh people living in nice houses with two new cars sitting in the drive and they are impressed. Working class Tories know their place and will happily defend anyone with a sense of entitlement. They play the Lotto twice a week and look up to people like David Beckham and Sir Alan Sugar because they represent hope. . I wouldn’t call this type of working class conservative; they’re just sleep walking in the matrix. All of the above are your words so own the fuckers, arsehole. I don't know what working class part of England you think you understand, but none of the above would apply to where I come from.

MariaB -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 11:30:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NorthernGent1 in Britain and no amount of Tory inflicted victimization will have them voting Labour. They unwittingly vote for less hope They look up to the posh people living in nice houses with two new cars sitting in the drive and they are impressed. Working class Tories know their place and will happily defend anyone with a sense of entitlement. They play the Lotto twice a week and look up to people like David Beckham and Sir Alan Sugar because they represent hope. . I wouldn’t call this type of working class conservative; they’re just sleep walking in the matrix. All of the above are your words so own the fuckers, arsehole. I don't know what working class part of England you think you understand, but none of the above would apply to where I come from. Me, I'm a northern lass born and bred. You’re working class but you vote conservative. Well you've either done rather well for yourself (maybe you even bought your council house) or your living in the matrix. Either way, you don't hold the intelligence to get the irony of my former post [8\|]

MariaB -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 11:32:06 AM)
and calm down dear...you’ll give yourself a hernia! [;)]

Edwird -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 11:42:05 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML quote: ORIGINAL: Edwird What's your issue, bruv? Can you not see that those who look out for interests of people who actually get it done are in your corner? If you take that as some imaginary 'condescension', that's on you and nobody else. Don't expect me to waste that effort on fuckwits. Really, just being ironic, I hope. If you think that I was being 'ironic,' then you are lost. Read my posts elsewhere on this site to get a clue where I'm coming from. I only took classes at the uni out of very begrudging regard for what the fuckwits in the world want. I already knew how things worked long before that. And here's the latest; I don't give a flying fuck what you or Northern Gent say, but thank goodness neither of you ever had anything to do with my thinking. I went to the uni, far too late in life, to try to figure out what I wish I had figured out 20-30 years before. Don't expect me to waste that effort on fuckwits.

Edwird -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 12:23:16 PM)
Look, I seriously have no intention to demean anyone here (even though I might have done that). I'm not here because I have a uni degree. I'm here because I am completely pissed off.

WickedsDesire -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 12:28:49 PM)
LordMuffinofthenorth There is no Britain, never has been never will and the sooner this is formalised, in finest red crayon, the better. There has always been I, muffin man, or is it this - a vast disparity in how the Scottish, and English savages have voted. For we are their intellectual superiors and invented everything useful, and them, complete dullards, who invented lead paint on thir best day, or was it lead cans? No matter – the big breated finer looking ladies I will keep (better not do the spunk sentence eh!) ah you would have wet yourself at that dear readers We annexed America 60 millions years ago and we will eennglish sooneth

MariaB -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 12:41:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Edwird Look, I seriously have no intention to demean anyone here (even though I might have done that). I'm not here because I have a uni degree. I'm here because I am completely pissed off. [:D]

thompsonx -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 12:51:29 PM)
ORIGINAL: MariaB ORIGINAL: Edwird I'm here because I am completely pissed off. [:D] I am from not there so I am unsure if he means he has been drinking or is he is upset about something?

WickedsDesire -> RE: Brexit Vote Results (7/9/2016 1:19:29 PM)
you will find that is the bloke element talking edwird the women element is most likely at work or in bed show me the muffins cake and wenches i remember....sure I would move the border back to where it should be

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