RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward

RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (Full Version)

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vincentML -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/27/2016 7:17:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Edwird quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML The dash cam video shows that Kieth Scott was backing up toward the cop who shot him. That's what I see. What do you see? Do you see Scott posing a threat to anyone? I don't think so. Also strange I do not see him getting out of the truck. He just appears at the left. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXe3zAANry4 I see the guy get out from the *vehicle on the left* and start walking backwards, then get shot from the front/left. You were looking at the truck on the right (facing in) where two of the cops were at the passenger side, so you were expecting his exit from there. Watch again and look at the driver's door of vehicle to the left (facing out). The shooter seems to have been to his left or front left, in any case. Here's a video which has the same dash cam recording followed by a body cam recording from one of the officers (the one who exited the dash cam car) at passenger side of Scott's vehicle, then around the back to the driver side, facing Scott from the front. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXe3zAANry4 Thanks, Ed, you are correct. I thought he was in the truck on the right and that's where I was looking to see him emerge. I still do not see where he was being aggressive, however.

Edwird -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/27/2016 11:34:13 PM)
Not even the police are saying he was being 'aggressive', but they claim he had a gun (somewhere) on his person as he was backstepping. It is not clear from any of the videos thus far that he was holding anything in his hand. There is suspicion from some corners that police may have put the gun nearby after the fact. That's not clear by the videos either. The police chief says that there is more video evidence, but it's being used by the (SBI) investigators at this time. That's fine with me. They released enough video to keep the public situation from getting worse, though it doesn't clear up the matter of his threat or not to police. I hope the SBI has good video forensic software and other methods to enhance the detail a bit. I think they are also questioning all involved very carefully and determining how well their stories mach up with each other, with the original police report, and with all of the video evidence. Whether Scott was holding a gun or not, the police made no effort to de-escalate, in fact the opposite. Many of these shootings involve the victim having no weapon. What's sad is that there are more than a few on this forum and many others who think that simple failure to obey a police order is grounds for on-the-spot execution, their being belligerently oblivious to the fact that there is not a law on any books in the US that places such offense as a capital crime in the first place. Whether they admit it or not, I think they just get a thrill out of no-trial executions.

WhoreMods -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 8:24:02 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Edwird There is suspicion from some corners that police may have put the gun nearby after the fact... "If they don't have a gun when you shoot them, make sure that they've got one to hand by the time anybody else arrives."

BamaD -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 9:55:13 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Edwird Not even the police are saying he was being 'aggressive', but they claim he had a gun (somewhere) on his person as he was backstepping. It is not clear from any of the videos thus far that he was holding anything in his hand. There is suspicion from some corners that police may have put the gun nearby after the fact. That's not clear by the videos either. The police chief says that there is more video evidence, but it's being used by the (SBI) investigators at this time. That's fine with me. They released enough video to keep the public situation from getting worse, though it doesn't clear up the matter of his threat or not to police. I hope the SBI has good video forensic software and other methods to enhance the detail a bit. I think they are also questioning all involved very carefully and determining how well their stories mach up with each other, with the original police report, and with all of the video evidence. Whether Scott was holding a gun or not, the police made no effort to de-escalate, in fact the opposite. Many of these shootings involve the victim having no weapon. What's sad is that there are more than a few on this forum and many others who think that simple failure to obey a police order is grounds for on-the-spot execution, their being belligerently oblivious to the fact that there is not a law on any books in the US that places such offense as a capital crime in the first place. Whether they admit it or not, I think they just get a thrill out of no-trial executions. When it comes to refusing to drop a weapon what are the cops supposed to do wait till he shoots someone?

kdsub -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 10:36:25 AM)
The man you are all fawning over as a victim turns out to be an abuser that had a restraining order against him for hitting an 8 year old in the head three times with his fist... Then threatened his family with death with a GUN... Imagine that.... he did not hit the little boy in the head with a book... and he at least had access to a gun so this gives credence to the police version of events. The guy was another punk... just like Ferguson. Butch

vincentML -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 11:09:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kdsub The man you are all fawning over as a victim turns out to be an abuser that had a restraining order against him for hitting an 8 year old in the head three times with his fist... Then threatened his family with death with a GUN... Imagine that.... he did not hit the little boy in the head with a book... and he at least had access to a gun so this gives credence to the police version of events. The guy was another punk... just like Ferguson. Butch Past events lend credence to his wife's claim that he had a mental problem. The police method for curing mental illness is just too gruesome. Although, I suppose it is quicker than burning at the stake.

BamaD -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 11:23:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kdsub The man you are all fawning over as a victim turns out to be an abuser that had a restraining order against him for hitting an 8 year old in the head three times with his fist... Then threatened his family with death with a GUN... Imagine that.... he did not hit the little boy in the head with a book... and he at least had access to a gun so this gives credence to the police version of events. The guy was another punk... just like Ferguson. Butch His wife filed a restraining order against him. In it she said he had a gun. Now she says that to the best of her knowlege he didn't. She clearly either lied to the police (a crime) or committed perjury on the complaint, and this is the saint who's word is gosple.

BamaD -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 11:25:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML quote: ORIGINAL: kdsub The man you are all fawning over as a victim turns out to be an abuser that had a restraining order against him for hitting an 8 year old in the head three times with his fist... Then threatened his family with death with a GUN... Imagine that.... he did not hit the little boy in the head with a book... and he at least had access to a gun so this gives credence to the police version of events. The guy was another punk... just like Ferguson. Butch Past events lend credence to his wife's claim that he had a mental problem. The police method for curing mental illness is just too gruesome. Although, I suppose it is quicker than burning at the stake. And better than letting him shoot people. Of course it wouldn't be a big deal if he shot a cop, but there were black people in the area who could have been shot.

vincentML -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 11:38:24 AM)
quote: Whether Scott was holding a gun or not, the police made no effort to de-escalate, in fact the opposite. Many of these shootings involve the victim having no weapon. What's sad is that there are more than a few on this forum and many others who think that simple failure to obey a police order is grounds for on-the-spot execution, their being belligerently oblivious to the fact that there is not a law on any books in the US that places such offense as a capital crime in the first place. Whether they admit it or not, I think they just get a thrill out of no-trial executions. So true! There are some on here who really suck up to Authority. And for their part police are trained to hit center of mass. De-escalate, not so much.

vincentML -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 11:44:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML quote: ORIGINAL: kdsub The man you are all fawning over as a victim turns out to be an abuser that had a restraining order against him for hitting an 8 year old in the head three times with his fist... Then threatened his family with death with a GUN... Imagine that.... he did not hit the little boy in the head with a book... and he at least had access to a gun so this gives credence to the police version of events. The guy was another punk... just like Ferguson. Butch Past events lend credence to his wife's claim that he had a mental problem. The police method for curing mental illness is just too gruesome. Although, I suppose it is quicker than burning at the stake. And better than letting him shoot people. Of course it wouldn't be a big deal if he shot a cop, but there were black people in the area who could have been shot. Here is what I understand from the New York Times report. The cops were parked and chilling, waiting for another guy. Scott parked next to them. They claim they saw him roll a joint and that he had a gun in his truck/car. They even claim he got our of the car and waved his gun. When he got back into his car they left the scene, donned their vests, came back and accosted him. None of that is on video of course.

CreativeDominant -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 11:46:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WhoreMods quote: ORIGINAL: Edwird There is suspicion from some corners that police may have put the gun nearby after the fact... "If they don't have a gun when you shoot them, make sure that they've got one to hand by the time anybody else arrives." Would that idea that come from the 'video evidence' that's already been debunked due to enhancement techniques that showed it was a glove (or gloves) that the cops 'planted'?

altoonamaster -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 12:10:05 PM)
if someone is pointing a gun at you try de-esclating him and see if you live

Edwird -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 12:32:45 PM)
quote: Would that idea that come from the 'video evidence' that's already been debunked due to enhancement techniques that showed it was a glove (or gloves) that the cops 'planted'? 'Debunked' by whom? Internet politico forums self-styled youtube forensic experts? If one of the cops indeed tossed a glove to the ground, it would mean only that. The gun could have been placed by any other method, that one factoid (if true) would not settle the matter. Neither side has proven anything, and those suspecting possible foul play are not proclaiming it as fact just yet. There is also another cell phone cam video from a resident of the complex from a balcony 1 floor above, and a close up from that view matched to other videos shows there not being a gun on the ground in a certain spot at one point, but a gun being at that spot at another point. As to what threat Scott might have posed to the officers, even if he had a gun in his hand, holding it down (not proven, but just for sake of argument), he would even then only be a 'threat' if the police were complete dumbasses. They were all well shielded behind his or other vehicles, and could have spent at least 40 seconds or so trying to calm him down. The NYC/New Jersey bomber was woken up by a policeman and started shooting immediately, hitting the officer in the leg. The difference is that the police wanted him alive for questioning, so instead of four close range execution shots, they aimed for his leg and found target, disabling him thereby. So there goes the claim that execution is necessary or even called for at all for simply disobeying a police order. The NJ guy was absolutely an immediate threat, but he lived. Who was inarguably the greater threat to the police and surrounding area? Scott slowly walking backwards with hands at his side, or the NYC bomber who was blasting away directly at the police, having already shot one? Which one lived, which one died?

WhoreMods -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 1:23:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant quote: ORIGINAL: WhoreMods quote: ORIGINAL: Edwird There is suspicion from some corners that police may have put the gun nearby after the fact... "If they don't have a gun when you shoot them, make sure that they've got one to hand by the time anybody else arrives." Would that idea that come from the 'video evidence' that's already been debunked due to enhancement techniques that showed it was a glove (or gloves) that the cops 'planted'? No, that idea comes from the conduct of the security forces in Northern Ireland.

kdsub -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 1:56:49 PM)
Police should not be expected to be mental health experts... They want to go home to their families as well. If he was so nuts... why did the family allow him to be in that situation... with a gun. Who has the more responsibility with the mentally ill... the police are the family? I do understand that it is almost impossible to control the mentally ill without having them committed... but if this is the case then why blame the police who were just protecting their lives? Butch

CreativeDominant -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 3:56:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kdsub Police should not be expected to be mental health experts... They want to go home to their families as well. If he was so nuts... why did the family allow him to be in that situation... with a gun. Who has the more responsibility with the mentally ill... the police are the family? I do understand that it is almost impossible to control the mentally ill without having them committed... but if this is the case then why blame the police who were just protecting their lives? Butch Don't you know, Butch? It doesn't matter how many times the cops told Scott to put the gun down...they should have told him one more time...or said 'please'...or used their 'indoor voice'...or called Dr. Phil...or got Obama on the line...or called a trained mediator or negotiator...or switched their cartridges out for rubber bullets...or...

vincentML -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 5:24:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kdsub Police should not be expected to be mental health experts... They want to go home to their families as well. If he was so nuts... why did the family allow him to be in that situation... with a gun. Who has the more responsibility with the mentally ill... the police are the family? I do understand that it is almost impossible to control the mentally ill without having them committed... but if this is the case then why blame the police who were just protecting their lives? Butch Butch, the police claim they saw a gun in the car or were notified that Scott had a gun. North Carolina is an open carry state. No permit is required to openly carry a gun in NC. So, why did the police accost Scott? Police behavior seems somewhat bizarre in this situation.

Lucylastic -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 6:11:07 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kdsub Police should not be expected to be mental health experts... They want to go home to their families as well. If he was so nuts... why did the family allow him to be in that situation... with a gun. Who has the more responsibility with the mentally ill... the police are the family? I do understand that it is almost impossible to control the mentally ill without having them committed... but if this is the case then why blame the police who were just protecting their lives? Butch He had a traumatic brain injury, he was injured in a motorbike accident. His wife had a restraining order out on him, until she REMOVED it last year, in October of last year. He did time, he DID time, he supposedly paid for his crime. He was on medication. He didnt stop taking it. He was sitting in his car. in your terminology another punk Now, the cops didnt know him, or his history, they werent looking for him, in plain clothes in an unmarked car. He didnt die for being a thug, he died because the police can fear for their lives and kill a man, but a man with a traumatic brain injury, who has paid for his crime can now be shot willy nilly cos cops dont have the training to deal with a sick person. YAY justice. you are an imbecile. he didnt deserve to die, due process, what a fucking joke

BamaD -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 6:42:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Edwird quote: Would that idea that come from the 'video evidence' that's already been debunked due to enhancement techniques that showed it was a glove (or gloves) that the cops 'planted'? 'Debunked' by whom? Internet politico forums self-styled youtube forensic experts? If one of the cops indeed tossed a glove to the ground, it would mean only that. The gun could have been placed by any other method, that one factoid (if true) would not settle the matter. Neither side has proven anything, and those suspecting possible foul play are not proclaiming it as fact just yet. There is also another cell phone cam video from a resident of the complex from a balcony 1 floor above, and a close up from that view matched to other videos shows there not being a gun on the ground in a certain spot at one point, but a gun being at that spot at another point. As to what threat Scott might have posed to the officers, even if he had a gun in his hand, holding it down (not proven, but just for sake of argument), he would even then only be a 'threat' if the police were complete dumbasses. They were all well shielded behind his or other vehicles, and could have spent at least 40 seconds or so trying to calm him down. The NYC/New Jersey bomber was woken up by a policeman and started shooting immediately, hitting the officer in the leg. The difference is that the police wanted him alive for questioning, so instead of four close range execution shots, they aimed for his leg and found target, disabling him thereby. So there goes the claim that execution is necessary or even called for at all for simply disobeying a police order. The NJ guy was absolutely an immediate threat, but he lived. Who was inarguably the greater threat to the police and surrounding area? Scott slowly walking backwards with hands at his side, or the NYC bomber who was blasting away directly at the police, having already shot one? Which one lived, which one died? Charlotte cops are better shots, and btw the idea that cops in general get a thrill out of killing people, they get a thrill out of not being kill. Yes there have been psycho cops, but the people they deal with are more likely to meet that discription.

kdsub -> RE: Arrogant, Entitled, Cry-Baby, and Coward (9/28/2016 9:08:54 PM)
How about if your child decided to serve his community as a police officer... when he approaches a man who has a gun in his hands and refuses to put it down and starts to bring it to bear... would you want him to ask one more time and perhaps get his head blown off. Everyone has rights... police too... they have the right to defend themselves and go home and kiss their children. They owe no one a chance to kill them. It makes no difference the reasons that led up to the instant he was shot... when an officer tells you over and over to drop the gun and you don't... YOU DESERVE to be shot. If you cannot see that then you are being blind to reality. You should not expect a police officer to forfeit his life simply because someone is black... I would have dropped the gun...bama would have dropped the gun...any law abiding citizen would have dropped the gun... yes he got exactly what he deserved. Butch

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