RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (Full Version)

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[Poll]

Is trump a "genius" or crook


Behold our lord of utter splendor
  21% (5)
He is a crooked bastard & cash vortex
  78% (18)


Total Votes : 23
(last vote on : 10/12/2016 8:13:03 AM)
(Poll will run till: -- )


Message


mnottertail -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/4/2016 9:24:47 AM)

Uh, technically nothing. Not unlawful at all.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/7213

and

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/6103

That then, says government employees or fudiciaries (accountants and whatnot)

The rest is allie allie in free.





sloguy02246 -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/4/2016 9:43:07 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

Eichenwald estimates that due to Trump's choice of going with Chinese steel in Chicago, American companies lost out on more than $350 million dollars.



Of course, this assumes that Trump would have actually paid those American companies for the steel - not necessarily a sure thing given his sketchy track record for paying suppliers in full - or at all.




Lucylastic -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/4/2016 10:07:54 AM)

I like the news considering what he told steel workers in PA recently

Then, as secretary of state, Hillary Clinton stood by idly while China cheated on its currency, added another trillion dollars to our trade deficits, and stole hundreds of billions of dollars in our intellectual property.

And I've been talking about China for many years. And you know what? Nobody listened. But they're listening now, that I can tell you.

The city of Pittsburgh, and the state of Pennsylvania, have lost one-third of their manufacturing jobs since the Clintons put China into the WTO. Fifty thousand factories across America have shut their doors in that time. And this factory, because of your great owners Gabe and Gloria, it's hanging in. Hanging in. But they just told me, it's not easy.

Almost half of our entire manufacturing trade deficit in goods with the world and it's the result of trade with China.
It was also Hillary Clinton, as secretary of state, who shoved us into a job-killing deal with South Korea.
<snip>
No. 6: I am going to instruct the U.S. Trade Representative to bring trade cases against China, both in this country and at the WTO. China's unfair subsidy behavior is prohibited by the terms of its entrance to the WTO, and I intend to enforce those rules and regulations and basically, I intend to enforce the agreements for all countries, including China.

[No.] 7: If China does not stop its illegal activities, including its theft of American trade secrets, I will use every lawful presidential — hey look this is very easy, this is so easy. I love saying this — I will use every lawful presidential power to remedy trade disputes, including the application of tariffs consistent with Section 201 and 301 of the Trade Act of 1974 and Section 232 of the Trade Expansion Act of 1962.

And when they say trade expansion, they're talking about other countries, they're not talking about us, because there is no expansion. They get the expansion, we get the joblessness. That's the way it works. Not going to happen anymore.


http://www.npr.org/2016/06/28/483883321/fact-check-trumps-speech-on-the-economy-annotated




Hillwilliam -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/4/2016 2:42:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: RottenJohnny

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam
Out of the millions of businesses, you found 10. Thanks for proving my point[:D]

Try getting some facts before you take your victory lap, Billy. As of 2013, Forbes put the number of businesses valued over a billion dollars at around 2000. Inc Magazine put that number at 5000. That's a long way from "millions". And considering I gave you a one-year sample list of 20 companies (not 10) that lost over a billion dollars, I think it's safe to say the value of Trumps' losses are no anomaly.

I said millions of businesses.

Are you THAT fucking dense or just playing stoopid?

I said that losing a Billion is RARE for a business.

You found less than a THOUSANDTH of a percent of businesses that had lost that much.

I call that RARE.
Are you so enamored of the Trump/Putin ticket that you lost your brains?

Once again. thanks for proving my point.
By the way, Hilliary is an utter sleazebag but Trump is an utter incompetent who was lucky enough to be born with a Platinum spoon in his mouth.
Otherwise, he would be lucky to be driving a forklift for a living at just above minimum wage.




RottenJohnny -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/4/2016 4:56:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam
I said millions of businesses.

Are you THAT fucking dense or just playing stoopid?

I said that losing a Billion is RARE for a business.

You found less than a THOUSANDTH of a percent of businesses that had lost that much.

I call that RARE.
Are you so enamored of the Trump/Putin ticket that you lost your brains?

Once again. thanks for proving my point.
By the way, Hilliary is an utter sleazebag but Trump is an utter incompetent who was lucky enough to be born with a Platinum spoon in his mouth.
Otherwise, he would be lucky to be driving a forklift for a living at just above minimum wage.

Wrong again. Joe's Bait Shop isn't ever going to lose a billion dollars because it doesn't have that kind of cashflow to begin with. It's not even in the same ballpark. Businesses at that level can't be compared so trying to include "millions" of irrelevant companies to make your point is pretty much bullshit.

Now, if you want to remove the billion dollar amount that you imposed and just talk about companies in general that lose money then we're right back to my point anyway, which is that it's not uncommon and Trumps' losses are meaningless to the debate.

P.S. I'm glad you at least recognize Hillary's a sleazebag. For the record, my support for Trump is tepid at best. My beef is with the Washington D.C. establishment and the fact that everything they do only seems to fuck the middle class more and more. I'm going poor paying for the poor and I don't believe that's what the founding fathers had in mind when they said "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness". In fact, I'm so pissed off that I'm willing to take a chance on a less-than-stellar outsider in the hopes he might actually break the cycle in some way.




bounty44 -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/4/2016 6:17:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

His base hate the poor



That's a huge sweeping generalization.



its worse than that. its an entirely self-serving and embarrassing hyper-partisan delusion.


How about this one?
His base is comprised of people of below average intelligence who believe every word he says.


you have absolutely no way of knowing that, so, much like you want to say "REEAAAD," im going to say "THINNNNNNNK."




tweakabelle -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 12:22:38 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

How about this one?
His base is comprised of people of below average intelligence who believe every word he says.


you have absolutely no way of knowing that, so, much like you want to say "REEAAAD," im going to say "THINNNNNNNK."

How anyone can maintain any faith in Trump after the revelations of the last week or two defies rational explanation. Trump seems to operate in a fact free zone and his supporters seem to be 100% fact proofed. The man is nothing more than a cheap con artist, a raging hypocrite and pathological liar whose integrity level might reach that of the infamous Dr Mengele on a good day.

Trump once boasted that he could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and no lose any of his support. It seems that Trump has got the chumps who support him figured out to a 'T'. Sadly we cannot say that his supporters have figured the charlatan out yet.




Lucylastic -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 1:04:26 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: RottenJohnny

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam
A large business losing money is frequent, as you said.

A BILLION?? not so much.

Not true.

Fortune 500 companies that lost over $1 billion dollars in 2015:

Freeport-McMoRan Inc. - $12.2 billion
General Electric Co. - $6.1 billion
Energy Future Holdings Corp. - $5.3 billion
Baker Hughes Inc. - $2 billion
United States Steel Corp. - $2 billion
First Data Corporation - $1.5 billion
Icahn Enterprises L.P. - $1.2 billion
Avon Products, Inc. - $1.1 billion
Sears Holdings Corporation - $1.1 billion

Pay attention to the fact that these companies are in a variety of different sectors of business. There are also 11 businesses in the energy sector alone that have lost billions of dollars each.

http://fortune.com/2016/06/08/fortune-500-ten-billion-losers/

quote:


An individual losing near a BILLION????

As I understand it, all or most of his companies are privately held (supposedly 500+ at this time). I expect that means a majority of the financial burden is on him as an individual but I don't really know how he actually structures everything.


WHy are you focussing on business, when DJT personal tax loss was almost a billion. NOT his company
The forms are for RESIDENT INCOME TAX
Not part of his Business taxes. Personal.
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/10/01/us/politics/donald-trump-taxes.html




Verity32 -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 6:37:33 AM)

He's not just a crook. He's an ignorant bully, braggart and highly dangerous to our Democracy




RottenJohnny -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 11:46:48 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic
WHy are you focussing on business, when DJT personal tax loss was almost a billion. NOT his company
The forms are for RESIDENT INCOME TAX
Not part of his Business taxes. Personal.

With all due respect, Lucy, I think you're really missing my point. Business or personal doesn't matter. The amount doesn't matter. The fact that the guy even has a billion dollars to lose points to some level of success even if nobody wants to admit it. Everyone is freaking out because the guy took a long-term write off over a huge loss. My point is that in the grand scheme, it's meaningless. Look around you. It's happening everywhere all the time. Like I said, I've done the very same thing. There's absolutely nothing unique about it except the fact that it happened 20 years ago to a wealthy guy who's now running for president.

BUT...if you really want to focus on the fact that it was personal instead of business finances, then frankly, I don't see where it's really anyone's business how much he lost. It wouldn't have affected anyone but him anyway. Have you ever made a bad financial decision before...large or small? Do you think it made you a bad person because of it? Is it something you would repeat?




WhoreMods -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 11:53:55 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: RottenJohnny
With all due respect, Lucy, I think you're really missing my point. Business or personal doesn't matter. The amount doesn't matter. The fact that the guy even has a billion dollars to lose points to some level of success even if nobody wants to admit it.

What, people have never lost more than they've invested in a business?




Lucylastic -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 11:59:12 AM)

im not running for president of the USA.
You think his actions are acceptable thats your judgement, but no I didnt miss your point at all.




PeonForHer -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 12:03:17 PM)

quote:

The fact that the guy even has a billion dollars to lose points to some level of success even if nobody wants to admit it.


I'm unconvinced, RJ.

"Forbes reports Donald Trump is worth $4.1 billion; Trump says $10 billion. Either way, he’d be worth a lot more if he simply retired 30 years ago and put his money in an unmanaged stock fund. "

http://www.moneytalksnews.com/why-youre-probably-better-investing-than-donald-trump/




RottenJohnny -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 12:06:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods
What, people have never lost more than they've invested in a business?

It's certainly possible. But if you do things properly, you shouldn't ever have to lose more than the value of the business itself. One of the advantages to incorporating a business is the ability to separate your personal finances from the business finances.




WhoreMods -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 12:13:06 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: RottenJohnny

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods
What, people have never lost more than they've invested in a business?

It's certainly possible. But if you do things properly, you shouldn't ever have to lose more than the value of the business itself. One of the advantages to incorporating a business is the ability to separate your personal finances from the business finances.

Well, that's why the tiny fingered Cheeto-faced ferret wearing shitgibbon has spent the bulk of his career declaring himself bankrupt every eighteen months, isn't it?




epiphiny43 -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 12:21:09 PM)

The despicable part is not the sharp business practices (We'll ignore the blatant theft from workers and businesses he just doesn't pay because his lawyers can tie them up in court till they go bankrupt) as far as taxes, it's the ten times BBC and others (so far) have documented Wee Paws' Tax Shaming others for less egregious (or even fanciful/ 'possible') tax dodges. If it disqualified them from public life, sauce for the gander?

Any bets on how much of a sweat his lawyers work up keeping him out of prison in NY and Federal court once the tax returns come out and people who were there start pointing out fraud?




WhoreMods -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 12:24:52 PM)

Apparently that is too smart business practice if your name's not Clinton.
Let's be honest here: that's all most of the excuses the Republicans and Denialicans* are making for the tiny handed shitweasel boil down to.

*(Somebody who claims to be a libertarian but always votes Republican)




RottenJohnny -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 12:28:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer
I'm unconvinced, RJ.

"Forbes reports Donald Trump is worth $4.1 billion; Trump says $10 billion. Either way, he’d be worth a lot more if he simply retired 30 years ago and put his money in an unmanaged stock fund. "

Maybe so, but apparently he decided he wanted to dabble in business. That doesn't come risk free. Everyone wants to point to his handful of bankruptcies but do they pay attention to how many other companies he's involved with? Some say it's over 500. If that were you, would you consider yourself a failure?

Have you ever played the game "Monopoly"? Did everything always go the way you planned?




WickedsDesire -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 12:32:01 PM)

17 votes I hank you all I hate all who did not click one grrrr- do your own threads
3 v 14 I forgot to add in which country are you from as the polls have it aboy 49v45

all that aside and why he said people should pay taxes and made his vice candidate publish his tax returns and how he declares himself a genius...a man bereft of an atom of brain

His business history is a web of lies, Mafia tie in and glorious Russians, he suckles from their cock - he actually thinks fort knox contains gold or there is money left in the treasury

What is to stop me to declaring my hovel and 3 cats business and wreaking up 900 million debt in a singular year. Do you believe this genius on wrecked up 900 million of debts in one year? or was creature piggy bank short other years and to the tune off?





WhoreMods -> RE: Is trump a "genius" or crook (10/5/2016 12:35:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer
Forbes reports Donald Trump is worth $4.1 billion...

How long ago did Forbes report that? Isn't that figure at least a couple of years out of date now?




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