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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 12:33:52 PM   
Wayward5oul


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


quote:


But on topic, I remember reading that in some places, kids bringing their own lunch to school was against the rules. Who the fuck are they to make a rule like that ?

WHAT?? That's also ridiculous!!!!

What if the kid got special diet? Vegan kids at my school always bring their own food.

I seriously doubt that there is any truth to this. Seriously Greta, not everything that is in print is automatically true. God gave you a brain, would you stop for just a second and use it before naively believing everything everyone tells you? If you think something sounds outrageous and ridiculous, maybe you should look into it or ask for some proof before you start venting about it.

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 12:43:36 PM   
Wayward5oul


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul

As a teacher who has helped to make sure kids don't go without, along with many others at my school, and as a parent who has had the occasional day where my kid has come home with the lunch money stamp, I agree that what makes the news should be taken with more than a few grains of salt.


How can this news be taken with a grain of salt, when your kid came back with a "I owe Lunch Money" stamp?

That's seriously public shaming of your kid and horrendous!

Parents may have genuine financial problems for some of these kids! And it's not the kid's fault.

First of all, there are programs for kids that come from lower income homes, where they are provided free or reduced lunches. Its just a matter of filling out the paperwork at the beginning of the year.


Secondly, a lot of schools use online payment programs so that I can add money to my kids account electronically. By the time that my child's account has gotten down to a zero balance, I have already received 2-3 emails warning me that the account balance is low. All I have to do to put money in his account is click on a link in the email and transfer money. With me, its a matter of being so busy that when I see those emails coming in I say 'oh yeah, I'll take care of that later', and then I forget about it. Lots of people do. Its a human thing. The kids who can't afford it already don't have to pay. So anytime a kid has a stamp on their hand, most people automatically think that a parent just forgot. No one really thinks much of it.

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 12:49:19 PM   
Wayward5oul


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sloguy02246


quote:

ORIGINAL: kiwisub22

You are taking one internet article and making a federal case out of it. You are talking about an issue that you know very little about, and getting morally indignant about a country that's half a world away from you. Seems like a massive waste of time on your part, when really, i'm quite sure there is something going on in your neck of the woods that you could actually make a difference in. OK, bad grammar, but you get the point.



Just noting that you could take that last paragraph and legitimately apply it to quite a few of the threads on the P & R forum.

This is Greta's favorite pastime. She knows zilch about the US, only what she hears secondhand or reads from incomplete sources, but she loves to come on here and tell us what is wrong with our country and who we should listen to and how we should fix our problems. There are others that do it, but no one as obsessively nor as ignorantly as she does.

The way she obsesses over US issues almost makes one believe she actually lives here and has a personal stake in everything that happens. I have seen her slip up and and use the phrasing "we" when talking about the US population a couple of times. I don't believe she does, I believe she is in Singapore as she says, but her interest does seem almost pathological.

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 1:15:18 PM   
Kaliko


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


quote:


But on topic, I remember reading that in some places, kids bringing their own lunch to school was against the rules. Who the fuck are they to make a rule like that ?

WHAT?? That's also ridiculous!!!!

What if the kid got special diet? Vegan kids at my school always bring their own food.

I seriously doubt that there is any truth to this. Seriously Greta, not everything that is in print is automatically true. God gave you a brain, would you stop for just a second and use it before naively believing everything everyone tells you? If you think something sounds outrageous and ridiculous, maybe you should look into it or ask for some proof before you start venting about it.


There is actually some truth to this - that some schools have told parents that children can't bring their own lunch to school. It is outrageous and ridiculous, I don't disagree. But it happens, and the only way around it is to bring a doctor's note in. My hazy recollection is that this type of thing was happening mostly at daycare institutions, where they have to carefully monitor food intake and allergies. However, I do believe at least one public school attempted it in the face of the new school meal regulations a few years ago. I'm not sure what the outcome was.

ETA: Chicago school bans some lunches brought from home

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 1:20:11 PM   
Wayward5oul


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kaliko

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


quote:


But on topic, I remember reading that in some places, kids bringing their own lunch to school was against the rules. Who the fuck are they to make a rule like that ?

WHAT?? That's also ridiculous!!!!

What if the kid got special diet? Vegan kids at my school always bring their own food.

I seriously doubt that there is any truth to this. Seriously Greta, not everything that is in print is automatically true. God gave you a brain, would you stop for just a second and use it before naively believing everything everyone tells you? If you think something sounds outrageous and ridiculous, maybe you should look into it or ask for some proof before you start venting about it.


There is actually some truth to this - that some schools have told parents that children can't bring their own lunch to school. It is outrageous and ridiculous, I don't disagree. But it happens, and the only way around it is to bring a doctor's note in. My hazy recollection is that this type of thing was happening mostly at daycare institutions, where they have to carefully monitor food intake and allergies. However, I do believe at least one public school attempted it in the face of the new school meal regulations a few years ago. I'm not sure what the outcome was.


Daycare institutions are a whole different ballgame, and I can see that happening there. That's a different conversation. A thorny issue still, but different one. Public schools, I can't see it happening. I would need to see the sources for that.

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 1:21:34 PM   
Kaliko


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul

Daycare institutions are a whole different ballgame, and I can see that happening there. That's a different conversation. A thorny issue still, but different one. Public schools, I can't see it happening. I would need to see the sources for that.


Just added it to my post. :)

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 1:27:03 PM   
Wayward5oul


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kaliko


quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul

Daycare institutions are a whole different ballgame, and I can see that happening there. That's a different conversation. A thorny issue still, but different one. Public schools, I can't see it happening. I would need to see the sources for that.


Just added it to my post. :)


OK, now my mind is really blown. I have been teaching in public schools for over 20 years, and I have never heard of anything like that, and I cannot imagine any person that I have ever worked with trying to institute any such policy, much less enforce it. No educational philosophy that I am aware of would encourage taking such basic rights away from a parent. Unfathomable.

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 1:58:44 PM   
Kaliko


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kaliko


quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul

Daycare institutions are a whole different ballgame, and I can see that happening there. That's a different conversation. A thorny issue still, but different one. Public schools, I can't see it happening. I would need to see the sources for that.


Just added it to my post. :)


OK, now my mind is really blown. I have been teaching in public schools for over 20 years, and I have never heard of anything like that, and I cannot imagine any person that I have ever worked with trying to institute any such policy, much less enforce it. No educational philosophy that I am aware of would encourage taking such basic rights away from a parent. Unfathomable.


Well, as I said, I don't know the outcome of it. It might not have lasted long.


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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 5:51:58 PM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul
So anytime a kid has a stamp on their hand, most people automatically think that a parent just forgot. No one really thinks much of it.

I cannot imagine, that as a kid, it's okay to walk around with a stamp that literally says, "I owe Lunch Money", just because of my parent's fuck up for not paying for my lunch.

It's humiliation.

If the parents forget to top up the account, and emails were sent as reminders and they still have not top it up. Maybe instead of humiliating the kid, how about just ring the parents up? I don't understand how is it okay to publicly humiliate the kid for the parent's mistake?

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 6:05:44 PM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kiwisub22
Perhaps you could share how you would ensure this?

It comes from the management at the top. Whatever they enforce, will happen. Right now, this "I owe Lunch stamp" idea is coming from the top too. And it's just absolutely ridiculous!

quote:

And for that matter, exactly what do you perceive the role of teachers in what children eat is? I was under the impression that their job was to educate to a curriculum, not supervise food intake.

If a teacher cares about educating a child, then they should know that, a well fed child will be able to concentrate and absorb better in class, than a starving child. So if they saw a child constantly denied food because their parents are tardy with payments. And if they care about the educating this child properly, then they should ring up the parents and find out what's up?

quote:

If you are so concerned about American children in public schools eating appropriately, perhaps you could move there, use all your fucking experience to reproduce, put said child into the system and overhaul everything, starting with school lunches and how they are funded. I'm sure it will be an easy fix, because EVERY parent wants what's best for their child - right?

So why is this specific topic so touchy for you? Hard truth about an ugly aspect of American education system that you feel embarrassed and ashamed about? IF people point out anything negative in my country, I simply say it is our culture and I explain why our system works for us.

For you, you think child shaming is okay and it's not even something that is the child's fault! So does Wayward, that's amazing. This is a political forum that involves discussion political issues of any country in the world. I brought up the issues in Malaysia, Indonesia, Australia, UK, and US and some middle eastern countries equally. So why are you taking it so personally? Do you even understand what a political forum is for? It's for open discussion on political affairs. And for people to voice their opinions on ANY political issues.

quote:

Child neglect or abuse never happens in your happy country and parents would never not pay for food for their precious little sprouts.

Seriously, in my country, teachers are responsible for more than education. They spot children with financial issues too and contact their parents to link them up with help, so that their kid won't suffer. Usually if the kid has no lunch money in Singapore, it's definitely because the parents has financial issues. As from as young as 5 yr old, the kid gets pocket money and deals with physical money to buy food at school. So most parents know how to give kids allowance for school for food. It is also very typical of Asian parents to already teach the kids about the importance of saving and not spending 100% of their allowance, so they start learning money management skills very early. This is because, every Chinese New Year, it is culture for every married adult in the kid's sphere to give them money in red packets, so every kid will suddenly get a whole lot of money during Chinese New Year regardless what age. And it's the kid's money. The parents gotta start teaching them the value of saving it rather than spending it.

quote:

You are taking one internet article and making a federal case out of it. You are talking about an issue that you know very little about, and getting morally indignant about a country that's half a world away from you. Seems like a massive waste of time on your part, when really, i'm quite sure there is something going on in your neck of the woods that you could actually make a difference in. OK, bad grammar, but you get the point.

A whole state in the US is taking this issue seriously enough to ban it from happening to protect their kids. That is also another solution, that New Mexico did. My thread was simply about, every state should follow New Mexico decision to ban child shaming for lunch money, agree or disagree, is up to you!



< Message edited by Greta75 -- 5/7/2017 6:14:02 PM >

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 6:23:33 PM   
Wayward5oul


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quote:


For you, you think child shaming is okay and it's not even something that is the child's fault! So does Wayward, that's amazing.


Oh FFS Greta, I never said that and I do not think that. What did do is point out that it is not the issue that you are making it to be. You are talking to people who are intimately familiar with the topic at hand, deal with it personally on a daily basis. You are thousands of miles away, completely detached from it, know nothing about the nuances of our society and 'the rest of the story' bits and pieces that always go along with actually being a part of the story, yet you seem to think you have a better grasp of what the situation really is. You are ignorant, naive, and your lack of education and ability to think critically is glaringly obvious. Please just stop talking now.





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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 6:42:52 PM   
Wayward5oul


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kaliko


quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kaliko


quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul

Daycare institutions are a whole different ballgame, and I can see that happening there. That's a different conversation. A thorny issue still, but different one. Public schools, I can't see it happening. I would need to see the sources for that.


Just added it to my post. :)


OK, now my mind is really blown. I have been teaching in public schools for over 20 years, and I have never heard of anything like that, and I cannot imagine any person that I have ever worked with trying to institute any such policy, much less enforce it. No educational philosophy that I am aware of would encourage taking such basic rights away from a parent. Unfathomable.


Well, as I said, I don't know the outcome of it. It might not have lasted long.



I did some looking around about it. Apparently this was the only school that did it. There were mentions in the article that other schools were doing it, but no other schools were ever cited, and no other schools were ever reported elsewhere. A Snopes search of the topic only brought this one school up. I don't know when they stopped doing it, but I went to the school's website, and there is currently no mention of a rule stating that lunches can't be brought from home. The only reference I could find that might address the topic was free lunch paperwork that each student was required to fill out at the beginning of each year, even if they did not intend to eat the school's lunch. And that is standard practice, I believe.

Unimaginable to me.

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 6:49:00 PM   
JstAnotherSub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul
So anytime a kid has a stamp on their hand, most people automatically think that a parent just forgot. No one really thinks much of it.

I cannot imagine, that as a kid, it's okay to walk around with a stamp that literally says, "I owe Lunch Money", just because of my parent's fuck up for not paying for my lunch.

It's humiliation.

If the parents forget to top up the account, and emails were sent as reminders and they still have not top it up. Maybe instead of humiliating the kid, how about just ring the parents up? I don't understand how is it okay to publicly humiliate the kid for the parent's mistake?


I tell ya what, you send me a blank check to pay off all the charges that parents will not pay, and to cover the bounced checks and I will never give an alternate meal again after trying for days to get the parent to actually do what they should do.

It is not humiliating to communicate with a parent about their childs lunch account.

Oh you are not sending me a blank check? Then how about you stfu because you have no fucking clue what you are talking about.


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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 7:58:09 PM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JstAnotherSub
It is not humiliating to communicate with a parent about their childs lunch account.

Communicate with a parent through humiliating their child by stamping the message on the child's physical skin? For the world to see?

WTF?

Is that the only way you know how to communicate with parents?

Fortunately, I assume most US kids either have their parents send them and pick them up from school, or have a school bus do that. As public transportation is not that great in most areas.

In Singapore, most kids take public transportation. And if THAT was implemented here, this kid is not only gonna suffer public humiliation in school, but all the way home, everywhere. In the train stations, in the malls, and all the public areas they gotta walk pass.

It's not uncommon for kids as young as 8 yrs old to be taking public transport on their own here already. Can't imagine them walking around with "I owe Lunch Money" stamp on them.

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 5/7/2017 8:04:40 PM >

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 8:00:47 PM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul
You are thousands of miles away, completely detached from it, know nothing about the nuances of our society and 'the rest of the story' bits and pieces that always go along with actually being a part of the story,

No, actually, you justified that stamping on your child was perfectly okay for lunch money collection reminders because you feel that people feel it's no big deal in your area. But think about how this child will look to other children? Will they get bullied because of it?

What nuances are there to that? How is that okay at all?

IF this was instructions by the boss of the employee who did that to the child. THEN nothing to do with the employee. Those who are employees can stay out of this because it was not what they would want if they had a choice.

But if they are an employee who personally AGREES with this way of dealing with the parents tardiness of not paying the lunch money, then, I am referring to them too.

But who-ever runs that show and allows this to carry on, I am condemning that person!

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 5/7/2017 8:06:27 PM >

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 8:07:53 PM   
tamaka


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul


quote:


For you, you think child shaming is okay and it's not even something that is the child's fault! So does Wayward, that's amazing.


Oh FFS Greta, I never said that and I do not think that. What did do is point out that it is not the issue that you are making it to be. You are talking to people who are intimately familiar with the topic at hand, deal with it personally on a daily basis. You are thousands of miles away, completely detached from it, know nothing about the nuances of our society and 'the rest of the story' bits and pieces that always go along with actually being a part of the story, yet you seem to think you have a better grasp of what the situation really is. You are ignorant, naive, and your lack of education and ability to think critically is glaringly obvious. Please just stop talking now.




Lol... too funny coming from you.


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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 8:15:49 PM   
Aylee


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


quote:

ORIGINAL: JstAnotherSub
It is not humiliating to communicate with a parent about their childs lunch account.

Communicate with a parent through humiliating their child by stamping the message on the child's physical skin? For the world to see?

WTF?

Is that the only way you know how to communicate with parents?


As a mother of three children, I am shocked that anyone would consider a need lunch money stamp on the arm to be humiliating. I, personally, think it sounds like a wonderful idea. Children cannot loose a stamp on the arm like they can a note.

I can also say that MY children would not be shamed by a stamp on the arm. For one, I would not freak out about it. I would just deal with the issue. I would also say something like, "Oh, sorry about that, let's take care of that now." No negative emotion is being expressed so there is no reason my children would associate a lunch money stamp with bad things happening.

I also do not freak about things being spilled, the occasional piece of glassware being broken, getting dirty outside, or interesting sartorial choices.

I do, however, communicate with the school. That is less than common in the town I live in. If the teachers get a 30% "showing up" for parent-teacher conferences, they count that as a "win." It is a county that is depressed economically and it seriously impacts the students at the schools.


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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 8:21:11 PM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee
As a mother of three children, I am shocked that anyone would consider a need lunch money stamp on the arm to be humiliating. I, personally, think it sounds like a wonderful idea. Children cannot loose a stamp on the arm like they can a note.

I can also say that MY children would not be shamed by a stamp on the arm.


I am shock that you don't think it's humiliating. I think if I were the child, I would never be able to show my face at school the next day again.

It is so humiliating. And it is so invasive!

In today's technology, the teacher can send a text message to the parent, instead of stamping it on the child!

The idea of stamping is with the intention to humiliate. I mean, how is not a text message better?

Because there is shaming involve in stamping the child. So it would make the parents think twice, before forgetting to pay again.

Otherwise, why not text message?

I mean this is like getting a removable tattoo against your will!

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 8:22:29 PM   
tamaka


Posts: 5079
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


quote:

ORIGINAL: JstAnotherSub
It is not humiliating to communicate with a parent about their childs lunch account.

Communicate with a parent through humiliating their child by stamping the message on the child's physical skin? For the world to see?

WTF?

Is that the only way you know how to communicate with parents?


As a mother of three children, I am shocked that anyone would consider a need lunch money stamp on the arm to be humiliating. I, personally, think it sounds like a wonderful idea. Children cannot loose a stamp on the arm like they can a note.

I can also say that MY children would not be shamed by a stamp on the arm. For one, I would not freak out about it. I would just deal with the issue. I would also say something like, "Oh, sorry about that, let's take care of that now." No negative emotion is being expressed so there is no reason my children would associate a lunch money stamp with bad things happening.

I also do not freak about things being spilled, the occasional piece of glassware being broken, getting dirty outside, or interesting sartorial choices.

I do, however, communicate with the school. That is less than common in the town I live in. If the teachers get a 30% "showing up" for parent-teacher conferences, they count that as a "win." It is a county that is depressed economically and it seriously impacts the students at the schools.



I disagree. It is ridicculous to stamp a kid. They are a human being not a bulletin board. In a world of text, email, etc, there is no excuse for something like that.

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RE: Lunch Shaming - 5/7/2017 8:37:45 PM   
Greta75


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Joined: 2/6/2011
Status: offline 		And it's cowardly. Instead of being brave enough to call the parents and demand for the money.

They bully the child by stamping on them.

On top of that! They would rather throw away the food than feed the child who didn't pay. So just because the child didn't pay, they rather the food goes into the bin than just don't waste it since it's already there.

All these practices are ridiculous.

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 5/7/2017 8:41:24 PM >

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