quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

quote:

But I heard Smith repeatedly threaten Orr with harm. That is no excuse for Malcolm Orr to turn around and fire off eight shots at Smith. I am not contesting the jury verdict. But, I do believe Smith's actions were reckless and Smith endangered himself, tragically.

It amazes me how two fairly logical people can see the same evidence and arrive at opposite conclusions.

The police officer politely asked him to stop and talk with him a minute... even though this man was pointed out by a witness and there was no doubt he was the perpetrator. The man kept walking...at that time there was no threat by the police officer... the officer did not seem to have his taser out. After multiple commands to stop...he did threaten him with the taser... Now around here there would have been no threat... he would have already been tased and both would have been safe. But this officer showed restraint and paid the price. HOW can you find any fault with the police officer is beyond me. If he had stopped the officer would have questioned him about the incident. HE had NO CHOICE but to threaten with the taser and I'll bet next time he has his weapon out not a taser.


Butch

You can't seem to make up your mind, Butch. Did he threaten Orr or did he not? Was Orr a threat, was the cop scared for his life, or what?

Exactly, he should have had his gun out. He could have called for back up. He had an ID. What was his rush?

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

My mind is made up... there was no threat until he refused to talk after a polite request and multiple requests to stop. He had no choice but to pursue... he did inform the dispatcher of his intentions... Yea right he should have pulled a gun... then you would have been saying he pulled a gun on an unarmed suspect... which he could have been... Remember the guy with a knife in St Louis that two offices shot when he came at them... people like you were saying... why didn't they use a taser?... yea right... then when someone dies from a taser you say.... why didn't you get back up and overwhelm him... yea right... then when a police officer is wrestling a perp to the ground and he has a heart attack you say... well he was only selling cigarettes there was no need to wrestle him even if he did refuse to follow orders.... yea right

Now who wants things both ways?

I guess you would have wanted the officer to follow him through the area while waiting for backup... letting a perhaps armed and dangerous man walk among people he could hurt or take hostage... come on Vince... this guy did right and was felled by the inherent danger of the job... which you often fail to appreciate

Butch

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

My mind is made up... there was no threat until he refused to talk after a polite request and multiple requests to stop. He had no choice but to pursue... he did inform the dispatcher of his intentions... Yea right he should have pulled a gun... then you would have been saying he pulled a gun on an unarmed suspect... which he could have been... Remember the guy with a knife in St Louis that two offices shot when he came at them... people like you were saying... why didn't they use a taser?... yea right... then when someone dies from a taser you say.... why didn't you get back up and overwhelm him... yea right... then when a police officer is wrestling a perp to the ground and he has a heart attack you say... well he was only selling cigarettes there was no need to wrestle him even if he did refuse to follow orders.... yea right

Now who wants things both ways?

I guess you would have wanted the officer to follow him through the area while waiting for backup... letting a perhaps armed and dangerous man walk among people he could hurt or take hostage... come on Vince... this guy did right and was felled by the inherent danger of the job... which you often fail to appreciate

Butch

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


Suspect had his hand in his pocket, wouldn't obey commands to stop... Turned out, the cop brought a tazer to a gunfight

Guessing here - was the cop hesitant to use the proper force, because of the suspect's skin color? Had the dude been white I bet he would have been tazed before he could have shot the cop

http://nypost.com/2017/08/10/shocking-video-shows-moment-cop-is-shot-at-point-blank-range/?ref=yfp

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ORIGINAL: WickedsDesire

Have you considered the possibility that many of your coppers don't shoot people to death because they have their hands in a pocket?

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ORIGINAL: kdsub

So let me understand your position....do you believe this man was justified in shooting the officer because of what you believe was past wrongs by police?

Or are you just wanting to interject past threads that have nothing to do with this thread?

Butch

quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwird

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

So let me understand your position....do you believe this man was justified in shooting the officer because of what you believe was past wrongs by police?

Or are you just wanting to interject past threads that have nothing to do with this thread?

Butch

I'm not proposing that anything about this was 'good,' nor 'correct.'

What I did was to point out what it's like to be the recipient of lethal force. It was awful, from what I saw.

But I'm just wondering why every excuse in the world is brought forth when the police do what this guy did.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub
So let me understand your position....do you believe this man was justified in shooting the officer because of what you believe was past wrongs by police?

Or are you just wanting to interject past threads that have nothing to do with this thread?

Butch

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
Or are you just wanting to interject past threads that have nothing to do with this thread?


Because the police have a responsibility to stop situations like this. Orr didn't.

Are you to dense to

A Realize that this situation shows why the police need to take control.

quote:

B Criminals do not have that responsibility.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marini

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX
Suspect had his hand in his pocket, wouldn't obey commands to stop... Turned out, the cop brought a tazer to a gunfight
Guessing here - was the cop hesitant to use the proper force, because of the suspect's skin color? Had the dude been white I bet he would have been tazed before he could have shot the cop
http://nypost.com/2017/08/10/shocking-video-shows-moment-cop-is-shot-at-point-blank-range/?ref=yfp

Why are you such a race baiter in this day and age?
Why not say, MAN shoots cop for no reason?

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwird
What this guy did to the policeman was truly despicable, no argument here. From what I can hear, this policeman was actually a decent sort. I hope the guy who shot him rots and dies a miserable death.
But if I were to say that "I hope he rots and dies" about another policeman shooting an un-narmed tax-paying citizen, as they have done on numerous occasions, there'd be hell to pay.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwird

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

So let me understand your position....do you believe this man was justified in shooting the officer because of what you believe was past wrongs by police?

Or are you just wanting to interject past threads that have nothing to do with this thread?

Butch

I'm not proposing that anything about this was 'good,' nor 'correct.'

What I did was to point out what it's like to be the recipient of lethal force. It was awful, from what I saw.

But I'm just wondering why every excuse in the world is brought forth when the police do what this guy did.

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ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwird
What this guy did to the policeman was truly despicable, no argument here. From what I can hear, this policeman was actually a decent sort. I hope the guy who shot him rots and dies a miserable death.
But if I were to say that "I hope he rots and dies" about another policeman shooting an un-narmed tax-paying citizen, as they have done on numerous occasions, there'd be hell to pay.

That's not necessarily true. There are instances when a cop is in the wrong when shooting someone. There are dirty cops. You can lay out a blanket assertion if you want (don't need anyone's permission for that), but you will be called out when it doesn't apply.

Determinations have to be done a case-by-case basis. Should this cop have had his gun out, instead of his taser? I don't think so. If he had thought the guy was armed, then, yes, he should have had his gun out instead of his taser. If this guy wasn't armed with a gun, the cop would likely have subdued him with the taser. The cop, imo, did what he should have done, and drew his taser. Had he known the suspect had a gun, I'm of the opinion he should have had his gun out.

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ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
You missed two points, one of which is incredibly vital, Greta. Jeff referenced someone who LEGALLY owns a gun being very unlikely to get involved in a gun fight with the police.

Your question to that statement demonstrates that you don't understand that "incredibly unlikely" does not mean "never." Thus, just because someone is incredibly unlikely to do a thing, that doesn't mean that person will never do that thing. And, your question also demonstrates that you don't understand the difference between someone who legally owns a gun and someone who does not legally own a gun.

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ORIGINAL: Edwird
So to be more specific; any country that would allow someone with your mind to have a gun would be gone in the next five years. There's a reason why guns are verboten in Singapore. It's called national self preservation, considering the mindset of people like you within their borders.