RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (Full Version)

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Lucylastic -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 9:00:23 AM)

as I thought, nothing to do with the topic...
typical.


you should read the papadopoulos statement...raises eyebrows, more than the manafort thang




heavyblinker -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 9:13:17 AM)

Yes, I was looking at that... there's just so much to keep track of.

And here's an article about Rick Gates, who stayed with Trump long after Manafort left:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/manafort-is-gone-but-his-business-associate-remains-a-key-part-of-trumps-operation/2017/03/22/6ecbaa96-0f0f-11e7-9b0d-d27c98455440_story.html?tid=ss_mail&utm_term=.1a225a8afdb7

Maybe Roger Stone will be next?
Even if Manafort and Gates don't give up Trump, they might end up giving up someone who will.

But really, I can't imagine that two professional scumbags would care about Trump, the presidency, anything.

This part was interesting, about their work with the Russian oligarch Oleg Deripaska:

quote:

Gates and Manafort were sued by Deripaska, who accused them in a Cayman Islands court of taking nearly $19 million intended for investments, then failing to account for the funds, return them or respond to numerous inquiries about exactly how the money was used.

At one point, attorneys for Deripaska claimed that they could not locate Manafort or Gates. The Russian tycoon hired a private investigator to track them down, according to a 2014 petition that Deripaska’s attorneys filed in a Cayman Islands court seeking recovery of the money.

“It appears that Paul Manafort and Rick Gates have simply disappeared,” the petition stated.


So does this mean they were embezzling money from a Russian oligarch?
How insane do you have to be to do something like that?




Lucylastic -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 9:35:50 AM)

The deripaska thing was gone into a while ago on MSNBC, and its seems he thinks manafort owed him money, but manafort says he was owed...
I cant remember the details, Ill see if I can find the reporting on it.




jawsh -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 9:56:05 AM)

*snicker* its just a matter of the order in the lineup now.




MasterJaguar01 -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 10:24:15 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

Of course, those of us who see the bigger picture know, that the Manafort indictment is a means to an end.


In your almost cartoonish fantasies

Compared to Manafort's dealings with the Democrats, Manafort did virtually nothing with the Trump campaign. I have proven that above, and you refuse to see it



Is that going to be your continued mantra???

B-b-b-but Hillary and the DNC?




WhoreMods -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 10:36:16 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01


quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

Of course, those of us who see the bigger picture know, that the Manafort indictment is a means to an end.


In your almost cartoonish fantasies

Compared to Manafort's dealings with the Democrats, Manafort did virtually nothing with the Trump campaign. I have proven that above, and you refuse to see it



Is that going to be your continued mantra???

B-b-b-but Hillary and the DNC?


It has been since the orange fuckwit announced he was standing for the republican ticket in 2015, so why should syrup boy or any of the other supporters of the special needs presidency change their tune about that now?




JVoV -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 10:37:17 AM)

But... I don't understand...

What the holy fuck do Manafort and Gates have to do with Clinton and Obama?? Uraniumone!! Benghazi!!




Lucylastic -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 10:53:02 AM)

interesting side bar, concerning trumps tweets
Oh no, The Wa Po....
https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2017/10/30/trumps-meltdown-in-anticipation-of-indictments-is-telling/

Trump’s meltdown in anticipation of indictments is telling
Jennifer Rubin.

President Trump and his surrogates — most especially the Fox News lineup (which includes a fleet of conservative pundits who disgrace themselves by facilitating a political distraction game for Trump), obsequious Republicans in Congress, old allies such as Roger Stone (who wound up getting banned by Twitter) and the talk radio crowd — have been frantically fanning Hillary Clinton non-scandals about Uranium One (it was baseless before and baseless now) and the dossier’s funder. (Fusion GPS initially was hired by the conservative Free Beacon, which at one time claimed not to know the identity of the Republican outfit that first hired Fusion.) The unhinged rants from Trump’s defenders demanding Clinton be locked up for one or both of these reveal how tightly Trump and the right-wing ecosystem that supports him rely on Clinton as an all-purpose distraction.

Upon a moment’s reflection, the non-scandals make no sense (Clinton was colluding with Russia to beat herself in the election?), have been debunked before and in no way affect the liability, if any, of current or ex-Trump administration figures. This is “whataboutism” run amok. It does expose the degree to which Fox News has given up the pretense of a real news organization, preferring the role of state propagandist. (And it’s not just the evening hosts; the non-scandals now monopolize the rest of the schedule.)

The intensity of Trump’s frenzy underscores the peril in which the president now finds himself. Beyond the indictments unsealed this morning, Trump does not know what special counsel Robert S. Mueller III has uncovered; which witnesses are flippable; what financial documents have revealed about the Trump business empire; and whether, for example, Mueller finds support for an obstruction of justice charge from Trump’s own public dissembling (e.g., hinting at non-existent tapes of former FBI director James B. Comey). For someone who insists on holding all the cards and intimidating others, Trump finds himself in a uniquely powerless position.


Then-FBI Director Robert Mueller is sworn in to testify before the Senate Judiciary Committee in 2008. (Molly Riley/Reuters)
As I have argued, Republicans should be saying publicly that efforts to fire Mueller and/or pardon indicted figures will commence impeachment proceedings. Those moves would set off a constitutional crisis in which the president is using his powers to protect himself from the Justice Department. Even former senator Rick Santorum concedes that it would be “very perilous” for Trump to fire Mueller.

Right now that is a theoretical question, but given how rattled Trump seems to be we shouldn’t rule out the possibility. It is incumbent on media interviewers to ask Republicans if that is their position and if not to justify giving a green light to what would be an unprecedented scheme to protect himself from investigation. Appearing on ABC’s “This Week,” the ranking Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee, Adam Schiff (D-Calif.), argued:

Now, I don’t think the president’s power is all that absolute, as people have been suggesting. The president cannot pardon people if it’s an effort to obstruct justice, if it’s an effort to prevent Bob Mueller and others from learning about the president’s own conduct. So, there are limitations. If it were truly unlimited, it would have the effect of nullifying vast portions of the constitution. The president could tell Justice Department officials and other law enforcement to violate the law and that if they did, and it was ever brought up, they were brought up on charges, he would pardon them.

And one principle of constitutional interpretation is you don’t interpret one power as nullifying all of the others.

So, I don’t think it’s unlimited. And I think it would be highly problematic for the president if it’s part of an effort to obstruct justice.

It should surprise no one that congressional Republicans, who have demonstrated their spinelessness again and again, are silent. They’ve got themselves fixated on tax reform, which they irrationally conclude will be imperiled if they try to head off Trump from doing something catastrophic with regard to Mueller or pardons. (Trump needs tax reform as much as they do so he’s not going to block it, for goodness sake, if they speak up to prevent a constitutional crisis.) We will see what else Mueller has in store for us, but if Trump is this hysterical now, one wonders what he’ll be like if a stream of indictments relating to the campaign and/or obstruction of justice begins.




jlf1961 -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 11:39:50 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

SO now we know it is Manafort (we all suspected) and Rick Gates.

They will have Manafort on money laundering and a few other things.


Drip, drip, drip, will become gush, gush, gush...

This will be a tough November for this administration. One of them is probably going to give them enough info to get Carter Page.

Once they get Carter Page and turn him...


Game over.


You're not real bright [:D]

quote:

Manafort, 68, joined the Trump campaign in March 2016 as the campaign’s convention manager and was promoted to campaign chairman two months later. He stepped away from the campaign in August 2016 amid questions about his foreign business ties.

Gates, 45, worked for Manafort’s international firm, Davis Manafort Partners, between 2006 and 2007.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/paul-manafort-trump-campaign-manager-surrender-feds-connection/story?id=50807954



And

quote:

Manafort’s suspicious financial transactions were flagged as far back as 2012 and forwarded to the FBI’s International Corruption Unit and the Department of Justice, a former Treasury official told reporters. Law enforcement officials said they found red flags in his banking records going back to 2004.

Four of the transfers originated with Manafort’s political consulting firm Global Endeavour, which was hired by Yanukovych to consult and lobby on his behalf. Manafort was working with the former Ukrainian president to lobby the U.S. and other Western countries to support for Ukraine’s entry into the European Union.

Tony Podesta and the Podesta Group’s involvement in Ukrainian politics is also complicating the situation. Mueller expanded the investigation to focus on Podesta and his Democratic-leaning lobbying firm with connections to Clinton, sources told NBC in an Oct. 24 report.

Manafort organized a public relations campaign for a group called European Centre for a Modern Ukraine (ECMU), which lobbied the U.S. to support Ukraine’s EU push. Podesta’s company was one of many firms that worked on the campaign.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/29/fbis-focus-on-manafort-doesnt-have-anything-to-do-with-russian-collusion-in-the-election/


The leftist media is trying to make a big deal of Manafort's extremely short time working with president Trump while doing it's best to ignore Manafort's dealings with the Democrats

But any trials here in the real world will not be judged by your propaganda feeds



Uh, but according to the president, this was all fake news from even before he fired Comey, that there was no 'Russia' thing, that no one in his campaign had any links to Russia, and again it was all:

FAKE NEWS.

Well, a grand jury doesnt think it was fake news, one of his staffers copped a plea deal, and this:

"Sorry, but this is years ago, before Paul Manafort was part of the Trump campaign. But why aren't Crooked Hillary & the Dems the focus?????"

Still sounds like a child caught doing something wrong to shift blame or at least cut the amount of trouble he is in down a bit.


And of course, Manafort was there for the meeting between Trump jr. and the Russian lawyer with connections to the Kremlin.

And lets face it, with one throwing his fellows under the bus, do you really think that no one else is going to feel those tires on their ass?




Lucylastic -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 11:53:01 AM)

Papadopulos is the BIG story....
manafort is the trimming.
[image]https://i.imgur.com/skkIXrB.jpg[/image]




WhoreMods -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 11:56:24 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

Papadopulos is the BIG story....
manafort is the trimming.
[image]https://i.imgur.com/skkIXrB.jpg[/image]

Fake news!




MasterJaguar01 -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 12:24:11 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

Papadopulos is the BIG story....
manafort is the trimming.
[image]https://i.imgur.com/skkIXrB.jpg[/image]


I don't normally read and post during business hours, but this is interesting stuff.

Yes. I was going to say the same thing.

Papadopoulos is the glue between the Russians and Trump. He is young with a lot to lose by not cooperating.

My prediction is...

He will fold like a cheap card table and give up the lot of them.




WhoreMods -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 12:26:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

Papadopulos is the BIG story....
manafort is the trimming.
[image]https://i.imgur.com/skkIXrB.jpg[/image]


I don't normally read and post during business hours, but this is interesting stuff.

Yes. I was going to say the same thing.

Papadopoulos is the glue between the Russians and Trump. He is young with a lot to lose by not cooperating.

My prediction is...

He will fold like a cheap card table and give up the lot of them.

Or get shot* because it looks like he might...
*(or poisoned, dismembered with a chainsaw and his head posted to him mum, or something 'accidental" looking: if I was him, I wouldn't even think about helicopters from now on...)




ThatDizzyChick -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 12:43:01 PM)

quote:

How much of that do you know for a fact occurred in the two months that Manafort was with the Trump campaign, before Trump fired him?

How much do you know for a fact did not occur in that time?




kdsub -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 12:47:43 PM)

I just wonder if Trump's Presidency will survive pardoning his son when he is indicted.

Butch





Danemora -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 1:03:22 PM)

~FRing it~

A Papadopolous timeline...

New details about an early Trump adviser completely change the timeline of Russia's election interference

quote:

George Papadopoulos, an early foreign policy adviser and aide to President Donald Trump's campaign team, was told that Moscow had dirt on Hillary Clinton in April 2016, newly unsealed court documents show.

The revelation alters the timeline of Russia's efforts to interfere in the US presidential election. The offering on Clinton, in this case, was in the form of "thousands of emails," disclosed to Papadopoulos by a person identified as an "overseas professor."

The professor was later identified by the Washington Post as Joseph Mifsud, director of the London Academy of Diplomacy.

The court document was filed by special counsel Robert Mueller's office in early October. It alleges that Papadopoulos lied to the FBI about the nature and extent of his contacts with foreign nationals and says he knew they had ties to senior Russian government officials.

On October 5, Papadopoulos pleaded guilty to making false statements to federal agents. He now appears to be a cooperating witness in Mueller's investigation of potential collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia. But the revelation that a foreign national tied to Russia offered the campaign dirt on Clinton in the form of emails in April 2016 seems to move up the known timeline of Moscow's election interference.

"On or about April 26, 2016, defendant Papadopoulos met the professor for breakfast at a London hotel," says the special counsel's court filing.

"During this meeting, the Professor told defendant that he had just returned from a trip to Moscow where he had met with high-level Russian government officials. The professor told defendant that on that trip he (the professor) learned that the Russians had obtained "dirt" on then-candidate Clinton. The professor told defendant Papadopoulos, as Papadopoulos later described to the FBI, that 'they [the Russians] have dirt on her'; 'the Russians had emails on Clinton'; 'they have thousands of emails.'"

The document suggests Papadopoulos had known that Russia was actively trying to undermine Clinton before virtually anyone else.

Hackers believed to be Russian breached Hillary Clinton's campaign chairman John Podesta's email server in March, but those emails were not published by WikiLeaks until October.News that the Democratic National Committee had been breached by Russia-linked hackers in late 2015 did not break until June 14, 2016.

The revelation sheds new light on claims made by both the campaign and WikiLeaks, which published the stolen DNC emails on July 22, in the weeks and months leading up to the election.

According to the special counsel's office, Papadopoulos kept trying to organize a meeting between the campaign and Russian government officials even after learning from the professor that Russia was trying to compromise Clinton. He thanked the professor for his "critical help," according to the filing, saying that it would be "history making" if a meeting took place.

Papadopoulos emailed top Trump advisers several times after learning of the emails, but he never said exactly - not in emails, anyway - what the Russian officials wanted to discuss with the campaign.

In an April email to then-campaign manager Corey Lewandowski, Papadopoulos said he had gotten "a lot of calls over the past month" about how "Putin wants to host the Trump team when the time is right," according to The Washington Post.

On May 4, he told Lewandowski and campaign cochairman Sam Clovis thatIvan Timofeev, a senior official at the Russian International Affairs Council, wanted them to know that Russian officials were open to Trump visiting Moscow.

Clovis replied that "there are legal issues we need to mitigate, meeting with foreign officials as a private citizen."

But Papadopoulos was not deterred: he sent the same email to Paul Manafort - listed as a "high-ranking campaign official" in the government filing, but identified previously in a Washington Post report - on May 21, just after Manafort was named campaign chairman, telling him that "Russia has been eager to meet with Mr. Trump for some time and have been reaching out to me to discuss."

The special counsel's filing indicates that the official forwarded Papadopoulos' email to another campaign official and wrote: "Let's discuss. We need someone to communicate that DT is not doing these trips. It should be someone low level in the campaign so as not to send any signal."

It is unclear whether Papadopoulos had told anyone in the campaign, at this point, about the Russian "dirt" on Hillary Clinton. On June 1, 2016, Papadopoulos again emailed an unidentified "high-ranking campaign official" and asked about Russia, according to the special counsel's office.

The official referred Papadopoulos to the "campaign supervisor," who Papadopoulos emailed with the subject line "Re: Messages from Russia."

"I have the Russian MFA asking me if Mr. Trump is interested in visiting Russia at some point. Wanted to pass this info along to you for you to decide what's best to do with it and what message I should sent (or to ignore)," he wrote.

On June 3, 2016, music publicist Rob Goldstone emailed Donald Trump Jr. and said "The Crown prosecutor of Russia … offered to provide the Trump campaign with some official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia and would be very useful to your father."

The information, Goldstone said, was "part of Russia and its government's support for Mr. Trump."

"If it's what you say I love it especially later in the summer," Trump Jr. replied.

Six days later, Trump Jr., Paul Manafort, and Trump's son-in-law and top campaign adviser Jared Kushner met with Russian lawyer Natalia Veselnitskaya - identified as a "Russian government attorney" in Goldstone's emails - on the promise of dirt on Hillary Clinton.

The Washington Post reported on June 14 that Russia-linked hackers had breached the DNC. Five days later,Papadopoulos again emailed the unidentified "high-ranking" Trump campaign official telling him that he would be willing to travel to Moscow to meet with Russian government officials "if it's in the interest of Mr. Trump and the campaign to meet specific people."

That month, the CEO of the data firm that would soon be hired by Trump's campaign, Cambridge Analytica, reached out to WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange offering to help release the 33,000 emails Clinton said she deleted from her private email server.

It is unclear why the CEO, Alexander Nix, thought that Assange had those emails at the time - there is still no evidence that anyone had obtained them, and WikiLeaks did not publish the first batch of stolen DNC emails until late July.

The trip to Moscow that Papadopouloswas planning, meanwhile, never took place. But Russian sources cited in a dossier compiled by former British spy Christopher Steele say that by late July 2016, there was "a well-developed conspiracy of co-operation between [the campaign] and the Russian leadership," both of which had an interest in defeating Clinton.

On July 7, Manafort offered to exchange briefings about the campaignfor debt repayment or cancellation from his contacts in Ukraine and Russia, according to emails reviewed by The Washington Post. Manafort had been a top adviser to Ukraine's pro-Russia Party of Regions from 2004 to 2014.

Asked by ABC's George Stephanopoulos on July 24 whether there were any connections between the Trump campaign and Russia, Manafort replied: "No, there are not. And you know, there's no basis to it."

Julian Assange has insisted that Russia was not the source of the DNC emails it published on July 22, between the end of the Republican National Convention and the beginning of the Democratic National Convention.

By that point, however, Russia-linked entities had already offered the campaign "dirt" on Clinton twice, once explicitly in the form of "thousands of emails." On July 27, Trump said:"Russia, if you're listening, I hope you're able to find the 30,000 [Clinton] emails that are missing."

The Steele dossier also said that the campaign agreed to sideline the issue of Russia's invasion of Crimea and interference in eastern Ukraine in exchange for WikiLeaks releasing the stolen emails.

The Trump campaign's national-security policy representative for the Republican National Conventionacknowledged in an interview with Business Insider in September that he had given his campaign colleagues the opportunity to "intervene" when an amendment to the GOP's draft policy on Ukraine was introduced in Cleveland last July.

The original amendment, which proposed that the GOP commit to sending "lethal weapons" to the Ukrainian army to fend off Russian aggression, was ultimately altered to say "provide appropriate assistance" before it was included in the party's official platform.

Papadopoulos was still pursuing a Trump campaign-Russia meeting as late as August 15, 2016, when a campaign supervisor told him that he would "encourage" him and another foreign policy adviser "to make the trip" to Moscow "if feasible."

The trip never took place, and Manafort was forced to step down as campaign chairman four days later amid revelations about his lobbying work for pro-Russia entities in Ukraine.


All I can say is yikes




vincentML -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 2:01:57 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

SO now we know it is Manafort (we all suspected) and Rick Gates.

They will have Manafort on money laundering and a few other things.


Drip, drip, drip, will become gush, gush, gush...

This will be a tough November for this administration. One of them is probably going to give them enough info to get Carter Page.

Once they get Carter Page and turn him...


Game over.


You're not real bright [:D]

quote:

Manafort, 68, joined the Trump campaign in March 2016 as the campaign’s convention manager and was promoted to campaign chairman two months later. He stepped away from the campaign in August 2016 amid questions about his foreign business ties.

Gates, 45, worked for Manafort’s international firm, Davis Manafort Partners, between 2006 and 2007.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/paul-manafort-trump-campaign-manager-surrender-feds-connection/story?id=50807954



And

quote:

Manafort’s suspicious financial transactions were flagged as far back as 2012 and forwarded to the FBI’s International Corruption Unit and the Department of Justice, a former Treasury official told reporters. Law enforcement officials said they found red flags in his banking records going back to 2004.

Four of the transfers originated with Manafort’s political consulting firm Global Endeavour, which was hired by Yanukovych to consult and lobby on his behalf. Manafort was working with the former Ukrainian president to lobby the U.S. and other Western countries to support for Ukraine’s entry into the European Union.

Tony Podesta and the Podesta Group’s involvement in Ukrainian politics is also complicating the situation. Mueller expanded the investigation to focus on Podesta and his Democratic-leaning lobbying firm with connections to Clinton, sources told NBC in an Oct. 24 report.

Manafort organized a public relations campaign for a group called European Centre for a Modern Ukraine (ECMU), which lobbied the U.S. to support Ukraine’s EU push. Podesta’s company was one of many firms that worked on the campaign.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/29/fbis-focus-on-manafort-doesnt-have-anything-to-do-with-russian-collusion-in-the-election/


The leftist media is trying to make a big deal of Manafort's extremely short time working with president Trump while doing it's best to ignore Manafort's dealings with the Democrats

But any trials here in the real world will not be judged by your propaganda feeds



Uh, but according to the president, this was all fake news from even before he fired Comey, that there was no 'Russia' thing, that no one in his campaign had any links to Russia, and again it was all:

FAKE NEWS.

Well, a grand jury doesnt think it was fake news, one of his staffers copped a plea deal, and this:

"Sorry, but this is years ago, before Paul Manafort was part of the Trump campaign. But why aren't Crooked Hillary & the Dems the focus?????"

Still sounds like a child caught doing something wrong to shift blame or at least cut the amount of trouble he is in down a bit.


And of course, Manafort was there for the meeting between Trump jr. and the Russian lawyer with connections to the Kremlin.

And lets face it, with one throwing his fellows under the bus, do you really think that no one else is going to feel those tires on their ass?

The Jaguar beat me to it . . . .

DRIP . . . . DRIP . . . . DRIP . . . . DRIP . . . ..GLUB, GLUB . . .




Nnanji -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 2:08:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Danemora

~FRing it~

A Papadopolous timeline...

New details about an early Trump adviser completely change the timeline of Russia's election interference

quote:

George Papadopoulos, an early foreign policy adviser and aide to President Donald Trump's campaign team, was told that Moscow had dirt on Hillary Clinton in April 2016, newly unsealed court documents show.
ction interference.





All I can say is yikes


Sounds like Papadopoulos tried very hard to get the Trump campaign to talk to Russians and was ignored despite the persistence.




Danemora -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 2:10:26 PM)

Tip of the iceberg, Ninja.




Nnanji -> RE: First charges filed in Mueller investigation (10/30/2017 2:16:19 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Danemora

Tip of the iceberg, Ninja.

Still, according to your article, the campaign ignored the bait despite persistent attempts. So what iceberg are we looking at according to your article?




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