quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker


Obviously if they are more difficult to legally obtain, fewer people will be able to own them.
This means fewer sales, weaker demand and fewer guns being manufactured.

Of course, at this point it is futile because decades of GOP/NRA policies have proliferated ridiculous amounts of guns across the US and the world.

quote:

Gun control groups said the bill is an important first step to improving the background check system. And the National Rifle Association applauded efforts to ensure that prohibited individuals' records are entered into NICS, "while providing a relief valve for those who are wrongly included in the system." The legislation requires a false record be removed within 60 days from NICS.

"The NRA will continue to support efforts to make the background check system instant, accurate and fair, while protecting the rights of law-abiding gun owners," said Chris Cox, the NRA's executive director, in a statement.
Source

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

FR

I've been thinking: surely, at least one kind of gun-nut could be eliminated from the equation, so easily, by law. More than a few of the mass-killers of the past ten years have stockpiled ten or more guns of all types. I mean, really, anyone who owns more than five guns has got to be a frothing fruitcake - even by American standards. Why not limit the legal number of guns someone can own to, say, three? At bottom, I get that the 2nd Amendment - which was written by God's own finger, directing lightning bolts at Mount Rushmore to carve out His words - words that can never, ever be changed by mere modern-day humans - implies that everyone should have *a* firearm. But a whole frigging arsenal? It didn't say anything about that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
This is truly, deeply deranged and I am shocked that even you would repost it.
Gun culture isn't just about defending yourself, it's also about creating an environment where guns are easily procured to be used in crimes.

Right. So, how do we prevent the second while allowing for the first?

Huh?

quote:

quote:

So, completely ignore the repeated calls for improving the background check system. That's going to help.

I have not said anything even close to this, and I have no idea why you are saying it.

quote:

quote:

How would you propose we "cut down the number of guns in circulation?"

Obviously if they are more difficult to legally obtain, fewer people will be able to own them.
This means fewer sales, weaker demand and fewer guns being manufactured.
Of course, at this point it is futile because decades of GOP/NRA policies have proliferated ridiculous amounts of guns across the US and the world.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

There are three kinds of guns.
1) Clearly Military weapons (any weapon that can't be reasonably used to kill someone without harming the guy standing next to him.)
2) Dangerous weapons.
3) Scary weapons/accesories

With the exception of bump stocks, most military grade weaponry is either too expensive or illegal in the US. You can't just go and buy a working Howitzer.

That leaves two kinds of guns, the scary and the dangerous. The anti-gun people keep trying to outlaw the scary stuff. Mainly things they show in movies, like silencers, large clips, weapons that can easily be converted to full automatic (which are military weapons and illegal in the US.)

But the dangerous weapons get ignored, despite the fact that they are responsible for over 90% of weapon related deaths.

You want to know how to tell the difference between a dangerous gun and a scary gun? There is a simple rule: Any weapon with a barrel less than 15 inches long is a dangerous gun. Any weapon with a barrel longer than 15 inches is scary - and not dangerous. This is why over 90% of gun related deaths involve pistols rather than long guns.

Consider these situations:
1) Hunting - you want the long barrel for accuracy.
2) Protecting your country from invading communist, criminal mexican fourth Reichers - you want the long gun for it's range, stopping power and of course penetration.
3) Protecting your self from criminals - you want the long gun so they SEE the thing and now not to screw with you. Carrying a pistol means you want to pull it out and go all vigilante on their criminal hide, murdering them like Dirty Harry, rather than running away from that crazy guy that carries a shot gun to work.

4) Suicide - much harder with a long gun (anyone have some string, anyone? anyone? ) Studies show that delaying suicide by even a few seconds is enough to stop people from doing it.
5) Kids accidentally shooting people - kids stay away from the heavier, awkward, 'scary' long guns but pick up the glock pistols that look like a toy.
6) Protecting innocent people walking down the street from lunatic vigilantes. If Zimmerman had to carry rifle instead of a 9 mm pistol, their is no way that poor Treyvon Martin would have got into a fight with the obviously crazy lunatic carrying a rifle. Instead Treyvon would have taken out his phone and called the police on Zimmerman and ran away. He'd be alive today if that arrogant, wanna be Dom Zimmerman had to carry a long gun, rather than the easily hidden pistol.

The honest truth is we need to stop trying out law 'assault' guns and instead ENCOURAGE gun people to carry them. Pistols are what we should be outlawing. As for all the other gun accessories - anything that makes the gun bigger and scarier makes them LESS likely to be used, except in a time of war. I think the world would be a better place if all guns came with built in silencers that extended the gun barrel by six more inches. Same for a scope and a large clip for carrying lots of ammo.

Pistols are suited for two uses only - ambush killings and back up weapons. Cops and security guards need them as back up weapons, almost everyone else would be better off with a long gun. (A few other exceptions do exist, they could get special permission from a judge).

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker


Obviously if they are more difficult to legally obtain, fewer people will be able to own them.
This means fewer sales, weaker demand and fewer guns being manufactured.

Of course, at this point it is futile because decades of GOP/NRA policies have proliferated ridiculous amounts of guns across the US and the world.

You clearly have no clue about economics.

The more scarce the supply the higher the demand.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
This is truly, deeply deranged and I am shocked that even you would repost it.
Gun culture isn't just about defending yourself, it's also about creating an environment where guns are easily procured to be used in crimes.

Right. So, how do we prevent the second while allowing for the first?

Huh?

FFS, read.

You: Gun culture isn't just about defending yourself (the "first" in my question), it's also about creating an environment... (the "Second" in my question).

So, how do we prevent an environment where guns are easily procured to be used in crimes while protecting our ability to defend ourselves?

quote:

You're right. You haven't said anything close to it, but you are ignoring the repeated calls on here for improving the background check. You don't have to call for ignoring repeated calls to improve the system to ignore the repeated calls for improving the system.

quote:

So, we cut down on the number of guns in circulation by making it more difficult to legally obtain them? That would only work if you assume that the reduced sale of guns is lower than the number of guns taken out of service. That is, unless the number of guns that no longer work and are retired from service annually isn't larger than the number of guns sold, you won't be reducing the number of guns in circulation.

Then, you even call your idea futile. How is calling for legislation that would be futile any better than what we have now?

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


Do you know what concealed carry is?
Do you know how awkward it is to carry a long gun around?
Do you realize that if you open carry you do 2 things:
1 You make yourself a target.
2 You disturb innocent people.
In this state business's are allowed to ban open carry.
So you leave the gun in the car making it easier to steal?
The best defensive weapon is the one the bad guy doesn't know
you have.
A scary gun is any gun aimed at you.

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
This is truly, deeply deranged and I am shocked that even you would repost it.
Gun culture isn't just about defending yourself, it's also about creating an environment where guns are easily procured to be used in crimes.

Right. So, how do we prevent the second while allowing for the first?

Huh?

FFS, read.
You: Gun culture isn't just about defending yourself (the "first" in my question), it's also about creating an environment... (the "Second" in my question).
So, how do we prevent an environment where guns are easily procured to be used in crimes while protecting our ability to defend ourselves?

BY DECREASING THE AMOUNT OF GUNS IN THE US.
Where do you think these evil criminals who want to kill you are getting their guns?
You think they're importing them from abroad???

quote:

quote:

You're right. You haven't said anything close to it, but you are ignoring the repeated calls on here for improving the background check. You don't have to call for ignoring repeated calls to improve the system to ignore the repeated calls for improving the system.

No, I am saying a background checks system is never going to prevent gun violence.
It will lead to the mentally ill refusing to seek help.
It will do nothing to stop someone from legally amassing a private arsenal to be used at a future date.

quote:

quote:

So, we cut down on the number of guns in circulation by making it more difficult to legally obtain them? That would only work if you assume that the reduced sale of guns is lower than the number of guns taken out of service. That is, unless the number of guns that no longer work and are retired from service annually isn't larger than the number of guns sold, you won't be reducing the number of guns in circulation.
Then, you even call your idea futile. How is calling for legislation that would be futile any better than what we have now?

Yes, you can cut down on the number of guns in circulation by decreasing the amount of new guns being put INTO circulation.
But since guns are so numerous in the US, it would probably have to be implemented in tandem with some sort of exchange program... which wouldn't work because of all the fucking nutjobs.
Basically, I am saying that because of GOP/NRA gun friendly policies that have oversaturated the country with guns and violence as well as a mentality and a culture that fetishes both (to the point where outsiders view it as a form of derangement), the US is permanently FUCKED... and improving the background checks system isn't going to help that.
That's my point.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
Do you know what concealed carry is?
...
Do you realize that if you open carry you do 2 things:
1 You make yourself a target.
2 You disturb innocent people.
In this state business's are allowed to ban open carry.
So you leave the gun in the car making it easier to steal?
The best defensive weapon is the one the bad guy doesn't know
you have.
A scary gun is any gun aimed at you.

I do know what concealed carry is. It's prevalence in the US is the cause of the far majority of deaths. Australia, where every plant and animal is poisonous and trying to kill you, gets along without any guns. Surely we can get along without concealed carry.
I know how awkward it is to carry a long gun around, I have done so. I don't object to your right to carry a gun, but I do object to you risking all of our lives merely to avoid some awkwardness. We are willing to let you have a gun, you do not have the constitutional right to do so without any consequences.
Carrying a rifle does not make yourself a target. You were always a target. What it does is make you the high priority target, protecting those of us that do not feel the need for a gun. Exercising your rights is not free, it comes at a cost. Pay it and stop complaining about it.
Disturb innocent people is a GOOD THING. Stop trying to make everyone into complacent sheep.

quote:

This system would require changes to state law. Bringing up state laws is not an objection, it is a helpful point about some unintended consequences that need to be dealt with.
Finally, did you read what I wrote? Because when you said defensive weapons are one the bad guys don't know you have is entirely disproven by what I wrote earlier.
When you are trying to have a gun the bad guys don't know you have, you are NOT being defensive, you are trying to be a violent vigilante looking to pull a gun and shoot the criminal. That is not defensive, it is offensive. In all meanings of the word.
Also, a 9 mm glock is not scary at all to most kids. They pick them and play with them.
Your world view is seriously screwed up. Frankly, I feel like I am explaining to someone the benefits of owning a computer, and instead of being afraid of viruses and privacy, he is complaining that the desktop's color doesn't match his furniture, $1.5 in electricity it uses is too much, it weighs 30 whole pounds, and worst of all, mouse pads aren't included.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


Do you know what concealed carry is?
Do you know how awkward it is to carry a long gun around?
Do you realize that if you open carry you do 2 things:
1 You make yourself a target.
2 You disturb innocent people.
In this state business's are allowed to ban open carry.
So you leave the gun in the car making it easier to steal?
The best defensive weapon is the one the bad guy doesn't know
you have.
A scary gun is any gun aimed at you.

I do know what concealed carry is. It's prevalence in the US is the cause of the far majority of deaths. Australia, where every plant and animal is poisonous and trying to kill you, gets along without any guns. Surely we can get along without concealed carry.

I know how awkward it is to carry a long gun around, I have done so. I don't object to your right to carry a gun, but I do object to you risking all of our lives merely to avoid some awkwardness. We are willing to let you have a gun, you do not have the constitutional right to do so without any consequences.

Carrying a rifle does not make yourself a target. You were always a target. What it does is make you the high priority target, protecting those of us that do not feel the need for a gun. Exercising your rights is not free, it comes at a cost. Pay it and stop complaining about it.

Disturb innocent people is a GOOD THING. Stop trying to make everyone into complacent sheep.

This system would require changes to state law. Bringing up state laws is not an objection, it is a helpful point about some unintended consequences that need to be dealt with.


Finally, did you read what I wrote? Because when you said defensive weapons are one the bad guys don't know you have is entirely disproven by what I wrote earlier.

When you are trying to have a gun the bad guys don't know you have, you are NOT being defensive, you are trying to be a violent vigilante looking to pull a gun and shoot the criminal. That is not defensive, it is offensive. In all meanings of the word.

Also, a 9 mm glock is not scary at all to most kids. They pick them and play with them.

Your world view is seriously screwed up. Frankly, I feel like I am explaining to someone the benefits of owning a computer, and instead of being afraid of viruses and privacy, he is complaining that the desktop's color doesn't match his furniture, $1.5 in electricity it uses is too much, it weighs 30 whole pounds, and worst of all, mouse pads aren't included.

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

FR

I've been thinking: surely, at least one kind of gun-nut could be eliminated from the equation, so easily, by law. More than a few of the mass-killers of the past ten years have stockpiled ten or more guns of all types. I mean, really, anyone who owns more than five guns has got to be a frothing fruitcake - even by American standards. Why not limit the legal number of guns someone can own to, say, three? At bottom, I get that the 2nd Amendment - which was written by God's own finger, directing lightning bolts at Mount Rushmore to carve out His words - words that can never, ever be changed by mere modern-day humans - implies that everyone should have *a* firearm. But a whole frigging arsenal? It didn't say anything about that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

There are three kinds of guns.
1) Clearly Military weapons (any weapon that can't be reasonably used to kill someone without harming the guy standing next to him.)
2) Dangerous weapons.
3) Scary weapons/accesories

With the exception of bump stocks, most military grade weaponry is either too expensive or illegal in the US. You can't just go and buy a working Howitzer.

That leaves two kinds of guns, the scary and the dangerous. The anti-gun people keep trying to outlaw the scary stuff. Mainly things they show in movies, like silencers, large clips, weapons that can easily be converted to full automatic (which are military weapons and illegal in the US.)

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

But the dangerous weapons get ignored, despite the fact that they are responsible for over 90% of weapon related deaths.

You want to know how to tell the difference between a dangerous gun and a scary gun? There is a simple rule: Any weapon with a barrel less than 15 inches long is a dangerous gun. Any weapon with a barrel longer than 15 inches is scary - and not dangerous. This is why over 90% of gun related deaths involve pistols rather than long guns.

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit
Consider these situations:
1) Hunting - you want the long barrel for accuracy.
2) Protecting your country from invading communist, criminal mexican fourth Reichers - you want the long gun for it's range, stopping power and of course penetration.
3) Protecting your self from criminals - you want the long gun so they SEE the thing and now not to screw with you. Carrying a pistol means you want to pull it out and go all vigilante on their criminal hide, murdering them like Dirty Harry, rather than running away from that crazy guy that carries a shot gun to work.

4) Suicide - much harder with a long gun (anyone have some string, anyone? anyone? ) Studies show that delaying suicide by even a few seconds is enough to stop people from doing it.
5) Kids accidentally shooting people - kids stay away from the heavier, awkward, 'scary' long guns but pick up the glock pistols that look like a toy.
6) Protecting innocent people walking down the street from lunatic vigilantes. If Zimmerman had to carry rifle instead of a 9 mm pistol, their is no way that poor Treyvon Martin would have got into a fight with the obviously crazy lunatic carrying a rifle. Instead Treyvon would have taken out his phone and called the police on Zimmerman and ran away. He'd be alive today if that arrogant, wanna be Dom Zimmerman had to carry a long gun, rather than the easily hidden pistol.

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit
The honest truth is we need to stop trying out law 'assault' guns and instead ENCOURAGE gun people to carry them. Pistols are what we should be outlawing. As for all the other gun accessories - anything that makes the gun bigger and scarier makes them LESS likely to be used, except in a time of war. I think the world would be a better place if all guns came with built in silencers that extended the gun barrel by six more inches. Same for a scope and a large clip for carrying lots of ammo.

Pistols are suited for two uses only - ambush killings and back up weapons. Cops and security guards need them as back up weapons, almost everyone else would be better off with a long gun. (A few other exceptions do exist, they could get special permission from a judge).

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

FR

I've been thinking: surely, at least one kind of gun-nut could be eliminated from the equation, so easily, by law. More than a few of the mass-killers of the past ten years have stockpiled ten or more guns of all types. I mean, really, anyone who owns more than five guns has got to be a frothing fruitcake - even by American standards. Why not limit the legal number of guns someone can own to, say, three? At bottom, I get that the 2nd Amendment - which was written by God's own finger, directing lightning bolts at Mount Rushmore to carve out His words - words that can never, ever be changed by mere modern-day humans - implies that everyone should have *a* firearm. But a whole frigging arsenal? It didn't say anything about that.

Actually, with the exception of the Las Vegas shooter, mass shooters owned 3 guns or less, so try again.

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

There are three kinds of guns.
1) Clearly Military weapons (any weapon that can't be reasonably used to kill someone without harming the guy standing next to him.)
2) Dangerous weapons.
3) Scary weapons/accesories

With the exception of bump stocks, most military grade weaponry is either too expensive or illegal in the US. You can't just go and buy a working Howitzer.

That leaves two kinds of guns, the scary and the dangerous. The anti-gun people keep trying to outlaw the scary stuff. Mainly things they show in movies, like silencers, large clips, weapons that can easily be converted to full automatic (which are military weapons and illegal in the US.)

No gun can be easily converted to full auto, or even select fire.

And the parts that are required to do so are few and far between, since the parts necessary cannot be bought without a special permit issued by the ATF, and would have to have been manufactured prior to November 1, 1981, and will only fit on semi auto weapons made prior to that date.

And for the record, any gun is dangerous in the wrong hands, including a .22.

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

But the dangerous weapons get ignored, despite the fact that they are responsible for over 90% of weapon related deaths.

You want to know how to tell the difference between a dangerous gun and a scary gun? There is a simple rule: Any weapon with a barrel less than 15 inches long is a dangerous gun. Any weapon with a barrel longer than 15 inches is scary - and not dangerous. This is why over 90% of gun related deaths involve pistols rather than long guns.

Any gun with a barrel less than 15 inches that has a butt (rifle or shotgun) is illegal in the US. Shortest legal barrel length for anything other than a pistol is 18 1/4 inches.

And the number of murders where a pistol is the weapon of choice is less than 60%, not 90%.

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit
Consider these situations:
1) Hunting - you want the long barrel for accuracy.
2) Protecting your country from invading communist, criminal mexican fourth Reichers - you want the long gun for it's range, stopping power and of course penetration.
3) Protecting your self from criminals - you want the long gun so they SEE the thing and now not to screw with you. Carrying a pistol means you want to pull it out and go all vigilante on their criminal hide, murdering them like Dirty Harry, rather than running away from that crazy guy that carries a shot gun to work.

4) Suicide - much harder with a long gun (anyone have some string, anyone? anyone? ) Studies show that delaying suicide by even a few seconds is enough to stop people from doing it.
5) Kids accidentally shooting people - kids stay away from the heavier, awkward, 'scary' long guns but pick up the glock pistols that look like a toy.
6) Protecting innocent people walking down the street from lunatic vigilantes. If Zimmerman had to carry rifle instead of a 9 mm pistol, their is no way that poor Treyvon Martin would have got into a fight with the obviously crazy lunatic carrying a rifle. Instead Treyvon would have taken out his phone and called the police on Zimmerman and ran away. He'd be alive today if that arrogant, wanna be Dom Zimmerman had to carry a long gun, rather than the easily hidden pistol.

Alright smart guy, here's a question for you.

Please explain how you are going to work feeding livestock while keeping a rifle handy on the off hand chance you happen to come across a rattlesnake coiled up in the hay bales in your barn?

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit
The honest truth is we need to stop trying out law 'assault' guns and instead ENCOURAGE gun people to carry them. Pistols are what we should be outlawing. As for all the other gun accessories - anything that makes the gun bigger and scarier makes them LESS likely to be used, except in a time of war. I think the world would be a better place if all guns came with built in silencers that extended the gun barrel by six more inches. Same for a scope and a large clip for carrying lots of ammo.

Pistols are suited for two uses only - ambush killings and back up weapons. Cops and security guards need them as back up weapons, almost everyone else would be better off with a long gun. (A few other exceptions do exist, they could get special permission from a judge).

You seem to think that one can readily swing a rifle into action from a sling.

The only way a rifle of any kind is brought into action is if you are carrying it in your hands, which pretty much means you are not going to be doing anything else with your hands, such as hold the hand of your small child crossing the street.

And of course there is the fact that, with few exceptions, just about any caliber over a 22 is going to punch holes through walls, pistol or rifle so, the idea of Joe Public or a bunch of Joe Publics running around with rifles in case of the lone nutcase, also adds a significant possibility of Doris Public getting hit by a stray shot passing through a car door, standard house door, standard house wall....

In fact this is kind of interesting, if you want the Hollywood myths shot full of holes.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

There are three kinds of guns.
1) Clearly Military weapons (any weapon that can't be reasonably used to kill someone without harming the guy standing next to him.)
2) Dangerous weapons.
3) Scary weapons/accesories

With the exception of bump stocks, most military grade weaponry is either too expensive or illegal in the US. You can't just go and buy a working Howitzer.

That leaves two kinds of guns, the scary and the dangerous. The anti-gun people keep trying to outlaw the scary stuff. Mainly things they show in movies, like silencers, large clips, weapons that can easily be converted to full automatic (which are military weapons and illegal in the US.)

No gun can be easily converted to full auto, or even select fire.

And the parts that are required to do so are few and far between, since the parts necessary cannot be bought without a special permit issued by the ATF, and would have to have been manufactured prior to November 1, 1981, and will only fit on semi auto weapons made prior to that date.

And for the record, any gun is dangerous in the wrong hands, including a .22.

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

But the dangerous weapons get ignored, despite the fact that they are responsible for over 90% of weapon related deaths.

You want to know how to tell the difference between a dangerous gun and a scary gun? There is a simple rule: Any weapon with a barrel less than 15 inches long is a dangerous gun. Any weapon with a barrel longer than 15 inches is scary - and not dangerous. This is why over 90% of gun related deaths involve pistols rather than long guns.

Any gun with a barrel less than 15 inches that has a butt (rifle or shotgun) is illegal in the US. Shortest legal barrel length for anything other than a pistol is 18 1/4 inches.

And the number of murders where a pistol is the weapon of choice is less than 60%, not 90%.

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit
Consider these situations:
1) Hunting - you want the long barrel for accuracy.
2) Protecting your country from invading communist, criminal mexican fourth Reichers - you want the long gun for it's range, stopping power and of course penetration.
3) Protecting your self from criminals - you want the long gun so they SEE the thing and now not to screw with you. Carrying a pistol means you want to pull it out and go all vigilante on their criminal hide, murdering them like Dirty Harry, rather than running away from that crazy guy that carries a shot gun to work.

4) Suicide - much harder with a long gun (anyone have some string, anyone? anyone? ) Studies show that delaying suicide by even a few seconds is enough to stop people from doing it.
5) Kids accidentally shooting people - kids stay away from the heavier, awkward, 'scary' long guns but pick up the glock pistols that look like a toy.
6) Protecting innocent people walking down the street from lunatic vigilantes. If Zimmerman had to carry rifle instead of a 9 mm pistol, their is no way that poor Treyvon Martin would have got into a fight with the obviously crazy lunatic carrying a rifle. Instead Treyvon would have taken out his phone and called the police on Zimmerman and ran away. He'd be alive today if that arrogant, wanna be Dom Zimmerman had to carry a long gun, rather than the easily hidden pistol.

Alright smart guy, here's a question for you.

Please explain how you are going to work feeding livestock while keeping a rifle handy on the off hand chance you happen to come across a rattlesnake coiled up in the hay bales in your barn?

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit
The honest truth is we need to stop trying out law 'assault' guns and instead ENCOURAGE gun people to carry them. Pistols are what we should be outlawing. As for all the other gun accessories - anything that makes the gun bigger and scarier makes them LESS likely to be used, except in a time of war. I think the world would be a better place if all guns came with built in silencers that extended the gun barrel by six more inches. Same for a scope and a large clip for carrying lots of ammo.

Pistols are suited for two uses only - ambush killings and back up weapons. Cops and security guards need them as back up weapons, almost everyone else would be better off with a long gun. (A few other exceptions do exist, they could get special permission from a judge).

You seem to think that one can readily swing a rifle into action from a sling.

The only way a rifle of any kind is brought into action is if you are carrying it in your hands, which pretty much means you are not going to be doing anything else with your hands, such as hold the hand of your small child crossing the street.

And of course there is the fact that, with few exceptions, just about any caliber over a 22 is going to punch holes through walls, pistol or rifle so, the idea of Joe Public or a bunch of Joe Publics running around with rifles in case of the lone nutcase, also adds a significant possibility of Doris Public getting hit by a stray shot passing through a car door, standard house door, standard house wall....

In fact this is kind of interesting, if you want the Hollywood myths shot full of holes.

I am thinking that strongspirit thinks he is being funny. At least I hope so.

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

There are three kinds of guns.
1) Clearly Military weapons (any weapon that can't be reasonably used to kill someone without harming the guy standing next to him.)
2) Dangerous weapons.
3) Scary weapons/accesories

With the exception of bump stocks, most military grade weaponry is either too expensive or illegal in the US. You can't just go and buy a working Howitzer.

That leaves two kinds of guns, the scary and the dangerous. The anti-gun people keep trying to outlaw the scary stuff. Mainly things they show in movies, like silencers, large clips, weapons that can easily be converted to full automatic (which are military weapons and illegal in the US.)

But the dangerous weapons get ignored, despite the fact that they are responsible for over 90% of weapon related deaths.

You want to know how to tell the difference between a dangerous gun and a scary gun? There is a simple rule: Any weapon with a barrel less than 15 inches long is a dangerous gun. Any weapon with a barrel longer than 15 inches is scary - and not dangerous. This is why over 90% of gun related deaths involve pistols rather than long guns.

Consider these situations:
1) Hunting - you want the long barrel for accuracy.
2) Protecting your country from invading communist, criminal mexican fourth Reichers - you want the long gun for it's range, stopping power and of course penetration.
3) Protecting your self from criminals - you want the long gun so they SEE the thing and now not to screw with you. Carrying a pistol means you want to pull it out and go all vigilante on their criminal hide, murdering them like Dirty Harry, rather than running away from that crazy guy that carries a shot gun to work.

4) Suicide - much harder with a long gun (anyone have some string, anyone? anyone? ) Studies show that delaying suicide by even a few seconds is enough to stop people from doing it.
5) Kids accidentally shooting people - kids stay away from the heavier, awkward, 'scary' long guns but pick up the glock pistols that look like a toy.
6) Protecting innocent people walking down the street from lunatic vigilantes. If Zimmerman had to carry rifle instead of a 9 mm pistol, their is no way that poor Treyvon Martin would have got into a fight with the obviously crazy lunatic carrying a rifle. Instead Treyvon would have taken out his phone and called the police on Zimmerman and ran away. He'd be alive today if that arrogant, wanna be Dom Zimmerman had to carry a long gun, rather than the easily hidden pistol.

The honest truth is we need to stop trying out law 'assault' guns and instead ENCOURAGE gun people to carry them. Pistols are what we should be outlawing. As for all the other gun accessories - anything that makes the gun bigger and scarier makes them LESS likely to be used, except in a time of war. I think the world would be a better place if all guns came with built in silencers that extended the gun barrel by six more inches. Same for a scope and a large clip for carrying lots of ammo.

Pistols are suited for two uses only - ambush killings and back up weapons. Cops and security guards need them as back up weapons, almost everyone else would be better off with a long gun. (A few other exceptions do exist, they could get special permission from a judge)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

There are three kinds of guns.
1) Clearly Military weapons (any weapon that can't be reasonably used to kill someone without harming the guy standing next to him.)
2) Dangerous weapons.
3) Scary weapons/accesories

With the exception of bump stocks, most military grade weaponry is either too expensive or illegal in the US. You can't just go and buy a working Howitzer.

That leaves two kinds of guns, the scary and the dangerous. The anti-gun people keep trying to outlaw the scary stuff. Mainly things they show in movies, like silencers, large clips, weapons that can easily be converted to full automatic (which are military weapons and illegal in the US.)

No gun can be easily converted to full auto, or even select fire.

And the parts that are required to do so are few and far between, since the parts necessary cannot be bought without a special permit issued by the ATF, and would have to have been manufactured prior to November 1, 1981, and will only fit on semi auto weapons made prior to that date.

And for the record, any gun is dangerous in the wrong hands, including a .22.

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

But the dangerous weapons get ignored, despite the fact that they are responsible for over 90% of weapon related deaths.

You want to know how to tell the difference between a dangerous gun and a scary gun? There is a simple rule: Any weapon with a barrel less than 15 inches long is a dangerous gun. Any weapon with a barrel longer than 15 inches is scary - and not dangerous. This is why over 90% of gun related deaths involve pistols rather than long guns.

Any gun with a barrel less than 15 inches that has a butt (rifle or shotgun) is illegal in the US. Shortest legal barrel length for anything other than a pistol is 18 1/4 inches.

And the number of murders where a pistol is the weapon of choice is less than 60%, not 90%.

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit
Consider these situations:
1) Hunting - you want the long barrel for accuracy.
2) Protecting your country from invading communist, criminal mexican fourth Reichers - you want the long gun for it's range, stopping power and of course penetration.
3) Protecting your self from criminals - you want the long gun so they SEE the thing and now not to screw with you. Carrying a pistol means you want to pull it out and go all vigilante on their criminal hide, murdering them like Dirty Harry, rather than running away from that crazy guy that carries a shot gun to work.

4) Suicide - much harder with a long gun (anyone have some string, anyone? anyone? ) Studies show that delaying suicide by even a few seconds is enough to stop people from doing it.
5) Kids accidentally shooting people - kids stay away from the heavier, awkward, 'scary' long guns but pick up the glock pistols that look like a toy.
6) Protecting innocent people walking down the street from lunatic vigilantes. If Zimmerman had to carry rifle instead of a 9 mm pistol, their is no way that poor Treyvon Martin would have got into a fight with the obviously crazy lunatic carrying a rifle. Instead Treyvon would have taken out his phone and called the police on Zimmerman and ran away. He'd be alive today if that arrogant, wanna be Dom Zimmerman had to carry a long gun, rather than the easily hidden pistol.

Alright smart guy, here's a question for you.

Please explain how you are going to work feeding livestock while keeping a rifle handy on the off hand chance you happen to come across a rattlesnake coiled up in the hay bales in your barn?

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit
The honest truth is we need to stop trying out law 'assault' guns and instead ENCOURAGE gun people to carry them. Pistols are what we should be outlawing. As for all the other gun accessories - anything that makes the gun bigger and scarier makes them LESS likely to be used, except in a time of war. I think the world would be a better place if all guns came with built in silencers that extended the gun barrel by six more inches. Same for a scope and a large clip for carrying lots of ammo.

Pistols are suited for two uses only - ambush killings and back up weapons. Cops and security guards need them as back up weapons, almost everyone else would be better off with a long gun. (A few other exceptions do exist, they could get special permission from a judge).

You seem to think that one can readily swing a rifle into action from a sling.

The only way a rifle of any kind is brought into action is if you are carrying it in your hands, which pretty much means you are not going to be doing anything else with your hands, such as hold the hand of your small child crossing the street.

And of course there is the fact that, with few exceptions, just about any caliber over a 22 is going to punch holes through walls, pistol or rifle so, the idea of Joe Public or a bunch of Joe Publics running around with rifles in case of the lone nutcase, also adds a significant possibility of Doris Public getting hit by a stray shot passing through a car door, standard house door, standard house wall....

In fact this is kind of interesting, if you want the Hollywood myths shot full of holes.

I am thinking that strongspirit thinks he is being funny. At least I hope so.

Either that or he just watched the "Piece of the Action" episode from the original star trek series.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marini

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrongSpirit

There are three kinds of guns.
1) Clearly Military weapons (any weapon that can't be reasonably used to kill someone without harming the guy standing next to him.)
2) Dangerous weapons.
3) Scary weapons/accesories

With the exception of bump stocks, most military grade weaponry is either too expensive or illegal in the US. You can't just go and buy a working Howitzer.

That leaves two kinds of guns, the scary and the dangerous. The anti-gun people keep trying to outlaw the scary stuff. Mainly things they show in movies, like silencers, large clips, weapons that can easily be converted to full automatic (which are military weapons and illegal in the US.)

But the dangerous weapons get ignored, despite the fact that they are responsible for over 90% of weapon related deaths.

You want to know how to tell the difference between a dangerous gun and a scary gun? There is a simple rule: Any weapon with a barrel less than 15 inches long is a dangerous gun. Any weapon with a barrel longer than 15 inches is scary - and not dangerous. This is why over 90% of gun related deaths involve pistols rather than long guns.

Consider these situations:
1) Hunting - you want the long barrel for accuracy.
2) Protecting your country from invading communist, criminal mexican fourth Reichers - you want the long gun for it's range, stopping power and of course penetration.
3) Protecting your self from criminals - you want the long gun so they SEE the thing and now not to screw with you. Carrying a pistol means you want to pull it out and go all vigilante on their criminal hide, murdering them like Dirty Harry, rather than running away from that crazy guy that carries a shot gun to work.

4) Suicide - much harder with a long gun (anyone have some string, anyone? anyone? ) Studies show that delaying suicide by even a few seconds is enough to stop people from doing it.
5) Kids accidentally shooting people - kids stay away from the heavier, awkward, 'scary' long guns but pick up the glock pistols that look like a toy.
6) Protecting innocent people walking down the street from lunatic vigilantes. If Zimmerman had to carry rifle instead of a 9 mm pistol, their is no way that poor Treyvon Martin would have got into a fight with the obviously crazy lunatic carrying a rifle. Instead Treyvon would have taken out his phone and called the police on Zimmerman and ran away. He'd be alive today if that arrogant, wanna be Dom Zimmerman had to carry a long gun, rather than the easily hidden pistol.

The honest truth is we need to stop trying out law 'assault' guns and instead ENCOURAGE gun people to carry them. Pistols are what we should be outlawing. As for all the other gun accessories - anything that makes the gun bigger and scarier makes them LESS likely to be used, except in a time of war. I think the world would be a better place if all guns came with built in silencers that extended the gun barrel by six more inches. Same for a scope and a large clip for carrying lots of ammo.

Pistols are suited for two uses only - ambush killings and back up weapons. Cops and security guards need them as back up weapons, almost everyone else would be better off with a long gun. (A few other exceptions do exist, they could get special permission from a judge)

Thank you for writing such a well thought out post, from an interesting point of view.
Pistols out-Rifles in.
I agree that the firearm that you see, is better than the firearm you do not see.
BUT
The thought of citizens going around with rifles and long guns, is not exactly comforting.

*Citizens walking down the streets caring rifles, long guns and assault weapons?
Interesting post with a different point of view.