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Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 11:03:51 AM

TreSwank

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http://hometown.aol.com/thejman99/dpen.html

Jeff Rassoul is the publisher of an indepedent zine called "The J-Man Times", and manages to put a hard-core evangelical spin on everything, while still sounding credible. Imagine that!!

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 12:03:49 PM

Alumbrado

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Credible? Mmmmm... maybe.
I am very much opposed to the death penalty, but that doesn't mean that I will have to find every argument against it plausible.

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 1:47:02 PM

Kedikat

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I'm against the death penalty and for actual life sentances in prison. At least there is some chance to undo possible mistakes.

As far as the trauma on the ones doing the executions. Well that is just not the right person for the job. That's changing though. The government is starting to weed out people with conscience to do the dirty work. A chilling example is the relaxation of the rules for military recruits. White power freaks with nazi tats are now inducted. People with poor records.

This is a good thing though, if the government wants a military, police force, legal system etc that is there to control the masses, not protect them.

Whatever the reason you have to do it. Killing should cause you nightmares. The act or the need to do it. I'm glad that even the people who's job it is, can still be shaken by it. When it becomes routine, it is the death of the person doing it as well.

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 3:52:05 PM

MmakeMme

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That article made me sad.

It seems to me that the death penalty isn't much of a deterrent to many of those who would commit the sorts of crimes that would warrant the sentence. As a punishment it is quite ineffective.

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 5:27:21 PM

SirKenin

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Well, you could always throw them in a big pot of water over a bonfire.

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 5:35:43 PM

Aileen68

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I wonder what the reaction was of the 76 year old woman's family was when they found out what happened to her. Bet they were a little more upset. I have no sympathy for anyone who can harm another person.

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 5:40:49 PM

Homestead

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They want to kill people because it's a revenge system, not a rehabilitation one.

I think it was Ghandi who said, "An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind."

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 6:04:23 PM

NeedToUseYou

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Homestead

They want to kill people because it's a revenge system, not a rehabilitation one.

I think it was Ghandi who said, "An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind."

It also has the side-effect of making people think twice about gouging your eye in the first place. The cold war would be a prime example. Nuke us, we Nuke you. No one walked away blind, because people value there vision or life in the case of nukes. So don't poke in the first place.

Mutually assured destruction (eye for an eye) works pretty good really. The problem with the death penalty is that no one sees the thing. There is no "reality" attached to the concept. So, it plays little in ones decision processes. Thus making it's impact meaningless.

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 7:01:33 PM

WyrdRich

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MmakeMme
As a punishment it is quite ineffective.

Are you kidding??? It is the only absolute guarantee against repeat offenses and 100% effective.

I don't have much patience with people who want to treat violent criminals like victims. I find them incredibly naive.

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 8:46:34 PM

Aileen68

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quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

quote:

ORIGINAL: MmakeMme
As a punishment it is quite ineffective.

Are you kidding??? It is the only absolute guarantee against repeat offenses and 100% effective.

I don't have much patience with people who want to treat violent criminals like victims. I find them incredibly naive.

Thank you. Ditto.

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 8:55:36 PM

TreSwank

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen68

I wonder what the reaction was of the 76 year old woman's family was when they found out what happened to her. Bet they were a little more upset. I have no sympathy for anyone who can harm another person.

"Mercy is a theological matter of self-interest. . .but most people think of themselves as *good*. . .they arrive at this conclusion through the process of relative righteousness. . .they look around for a pedophile or a serial killer or a Hitler, and then compare themselves to the beast. . .presto!. .
. "I'm good!". . .hence they think they will never need mercy. . .they believe they are justified by their own Potemkin *goodness*. . .and they feel no qualms about denying mercy to others who they judge as *evil.* "

I swear, I'd like to shake Jeff's hand in person.

< Message edited by TreSwank -- 8/4/2006 8:59:27 PM >

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 8:58:47 PM

Aileen68

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TreSwank

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen68

I wonder what the reaction was of the 76 year old woman's family was when they found out what happened to her. Bet they were a little more upset. I have no sympathy for anyone who can harm another person.

"Mercy is a theological matter of self-interest. . .but most people think of themselves as *good*. . .they arrive at this conclusion through the process of relative righteousness. . .they look around for a pedophile or a serial killer or a Hitler, and then compare themselves to the beast. . .presto!. .
. "I'm good!". . .hence they think they will never need mercy. . .they believe they are justified by their own Potemkin *goodness*. . .and they feel no qualms about denying mercy to others who they judge as *evil.* "

Let's just say that I know that I will never take a gun, walk into a liquor store, rob it, shoot the owner to death and leave. I don't have to worry about needing that kind of mercy.

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 9:17:27 PM

TreSwank

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I think that the main problem with the mindset of pro-death penalty advocates is the attitude that "a person who takes another life automatically negates his own". Don't get me wrong....................I don't believe in any sort of innate human goodness, but looking at the death penalty's sorry track record as a deterrent, and the decent number of folks who have been let off of death row after DNA evidence has proved their innocence, it should be obvious to EVERYONE that the practical thing to do would be to find some new solutions. Perhaps the system should take a new approach as opposed to showing that it can only be as merciful as society's most abject elements.

I'm sure that Aileen would be thrown into a moral temper-tantrum if a member of her family had been murdered by gang-members. But, I'm not so sure, that if one of her own children, despite an upright and wholesome upbringing, ended up on death row, she would be so adamant about her Hammurabi Code sense of justice. I don't think that she would be so complacent and satisfied with the system's decision if her own son was being strapped onto the lethal injection gurney.

< Message edited by TreSwank -- 8/4/2006 9:20:28 PM >

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 9:22:34 PM

Aileen68

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TreSwank

I think that the main problem with the mindset of pro-death penalty advocates is the attitude that "a person who takes another life automatically negates his own". Don't get me wrong....................I don't believe in any sort of innate human goodness, but looking at the death penalty's sorry track record as a deterrent, and the decent number of folks who have been let off of death row after DNA evidence has proved their innocence, it should be obvious to EVERYONE that the practical thing to do would be to find some new solutions. Perhaps the system should take a new approach as opposed to showing that it can only be as merciful as society's most abject elements.

I'm sure that Aileen would be thrown into a moral temper-tantrum if a member of her family had been murdered by gang-members. But, I'm not so sure, that if one of her own children, despite an upright and wholesome upbringing, ended up on death row, would be so adamant about her Hammurabi Code sense of justice. I don't think that she would be so complacent and satisfied with the system's decision if her own son was being strapped onto the lethal injection gurney.

You know...I don't know how I'd feel in these situations. I hope to God that I never find out. But I know how I feel now and that's what I base my convictions on. How would you feel if someone that you truly loved was murdered? Would you be so merciful?

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 9:23:22 PM

TreSwank

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Yes

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 9:25:11 PM

Aileen68

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Hopefully you'll never have to find out if that's right or wrong.

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 9:25:45 PM

TreSwank

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Same to you.

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 9:40:21 PM

FangsNfeet

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We need the death penalty. It cuts down on having to build so many prisons/institutions. For some reason, some if not most have always shuttered when driving by a prison. Some have even moved to a different town after a prison has been built in the area. Does anyone like the idea of a cold blooded killer living less than a few miles away from them? Sure, they are locked up but it's a well known fact that escape is possible.

A cheap and sanatized way to exicute someone would be a 22 in the head followed by cremation. For some, I think the 22 would be to kind.

For many, exicution is not revenge. It's a way of putting a tragedy behind. How often do you want to hear the person who killed your love one keep screaming "I'm innocent!" and keep hearing how his appeals and probation hearings are right around the corner?

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 9:44:24 PM

Homestead

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NeedToUseYou

quote:

ORIGINAL: Homestead

They want to kill people because it's a revenge system, not a rehabilitation one.

I think it was Ghandi who said, "An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind."

It also has the side-effect of making people think twice about gouging your eye in the first place. The cold war would be a prime example. Nuke us, we Nuke you. No one walked away blind, because people value there vision or life in the case of nukes. So don't poke in the first place.

Mutually assured destruction (eye for an eye) works pretty good really. The problem with the death penalty is that no one sees the thing. There is no "reality" attached to the concept. So, it plays little in ones decision processes. Thus making it's impact meaningless.

Indeed, we really do need to bring back more draconian execution methods. Just like the good old days. load them into a cart, dressed in filthy torn rags, gaunt from months of starvation in gaol. Let the populace have a go at punching and spitting on them as they trundle by....

Then we get to the good part. Some torture with lead weighted floggers, maybe a heavy caning. Then strip them and manacle thier hands behind, and slow hang them over fire, but not enough to kill them. Watch them choking, while thier kicking feet blacken and blister....

Then the piece de resistance, take them down and slice out thier gentials. Rip them up the middle and disembowel them..... and chop off the head, just before they bleed unconcsious......Justice is served, and potential criminals, horrified!

So much so,that they refuse to be taken alive. And would rather die taking out a law enforcment officer-than face such harsh justice.

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RE: Sanitized Execution - 8/4/2006 9:46:38 PM

TreSwank

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FangsNfeet

We need the death penalty. It cuts down on having to build so many prisons/institutions.

Cool............and maybe then the U.S. can start it's own selective breeding, low-income sterilization, and eugenics program to cut down on low-income housing and welfare!!!!!!!

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