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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:32:24 AM

Estring

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressLorelei
I cannot, for the life of me, understand the mentality of any human being who would want to intentionally explode a bunch of innocent people.

I can't understand the mentality of a people that would invade a country, cause 100,000 deaths of mostly innocents, have the temerity to call the defenders of the land they invaded "insurgents" and then bitch about the blowback.

Well, if we didn't have organized radical Muslims back in the day, we have them now most likely. Still, we had to move the goal posts - I see they dropped the "Al-Qaeda" label. Now any kind of Islamist terrorists will do.

"Thank you, Moses! Loved your book by the way..."

Repeat a lie long enough and it becomes the truth? The number of civilians killed is not 100,000. That number was discredited already. But hell, who needs facts, right?

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:33:25 AM

Mercnbeth

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quote:

I can't understand the mentality of a people that would invade a country, cause 100,000 deaths of mostly innocents, have the temerity to call the defenders of the land they invaded "insurgents" and then bitch about the blowback.

Well, if we didn't have organized radical Muslims back in the day, we have them now.

Agree, we should have let the Saddam continue to kill on a much faster pace. And when are you going to abandon the 100,000 killed? Even "Air America" has backed off that number.

Since our attack on the Muslims initiated and created, "organized radical Muslims" why shouldn't today's events and the other attacks on Britain, Spain, France, the US generate "organized radical western zealots"? Shouldn't the west be allowed the same logical excuse for eradication of a religion sworn to our destruction? Come to think of it, I've never seen a western leader, political or religious, announce eradication of all Muslims, yet that is the charge of the Iranian President and all publicly speaking Muslim leaders. Therefore it's justified, based on your logic, for the west to be even more barbaric than the created "organized radical Muslims". Their actions spawned and justified any and all response. Right?

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:38:37 AM

Chaingang

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Hey, I was quoting a semi-rightwing source: CNN. I am open to other suggestions as I am not there counting the dead myself. An alternative URL please? I am talking to you alternative counters.

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:43:56 AM

popeye1250

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Rule, no-one is saying that illegal aliens are not "nice people."
The thing is they don't need to be in the U.S. to be "nice people"
Illegal immigration is against our laws and the reason this is a great country is because we are a country of laws.
Illegal immigration is now becomming a *dangerous* activity.
All it takes is for just "21" to get into this country to do a lot of damage. Or "3".
As for "cheap labor" I never wanted it.
No such thing as "cheap labor" when you factor in all the costs of medical, schooling, prisons and law enforcement, social services, illegals causing accidents and driving up rates for everyone, illegals committing crimes at a much higher rate than citizens.

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:44:42 AM

Estring

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang

Hey, I was quoting a semi-rightwing source: CNN. I am open to other suggestions as I am not there counting the dead myself. An alternative URL please? I am talking to you alternative counters.

Well, that was your first mistake. and if CNN is semi-right wing, you are so far to the left, you slapped yourself.

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:45:13 AM

Chaingang

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
Since our attack on the Muslims initiated and created, "organized radical Muslims" why shouldn't today's events and the other attacks on Britain, Spain, France, the US generate "organized radical western zealots"?

Perhaps it would if we didn't have them already - they are called "Neocons." Haven't you heard?

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:46:17 AM

Rule

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

Rule - I cant believe you really think that the murder of hundreds (possibly thousands) is a drop in the Sahara Desert and insignificant?

Mathematicians usually regard anything less than between 2.5 % or 5 % insignificant. Let us suppose that there are three thousand deaths due to a 'terrorist' attack. If I calculate correctly, that is one hundred thousandth of one per cent.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen
Surely then, the murder of 20-30 million would just be a larger drop in the desert and just slightly less insignificant?

That would be ten thousand to one hundred thousand more 'drops'. Still insignificant, yes. However, the deaths of several dozen, hundreds or a few thousand people due to a 'terrorist' attack does not justify state sponsored genocide upon tens of millions of people.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen
We might be being manipulated by news services and government, but we are all in this together so is it any wonder we feel for others who are murdered or might be?
E

Feel all you like, but do not direct your anger at the perceived perpetrators nor anybody that you associate with them. Instead pray for their misguided souls and forgive them. Be compassionate and loving instead of revengeful and hating. It costs less, you will feel happier and you will not commit genocide upon tens of millions of innocent people that you blame for the 'terrorist' attack.

< Message edited by Rule -- 8/10/2006 10:59:15 AM >

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:47:03 AM

Chaingang

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Gee, I hope you right-wingers *ARE* actually living in fear. It would be the only justification for your attitudes.

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:47:25 AM

Mercnbeth

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang

Hey, I was quoting a semi-rightwing source: CNN.

Chain,
CNN, the Communist News Network "semi rightwing"!

Yesterday I found out I was "Liberal" today this!

Thanks for bringing levity into the discussion!

Here's a pragmatic link for you: http://icasualties.org/oif/

You know hundred's of people die in the US every day. Technically you can be accurate and honest and report; "250,000 died in the US today under the regime of President Bush". That's about as representative as the 100,000 dead in Iraq. The numbers in the link are the direct result of US military action. Muslim versus Muslim and the numbers get into the millions in Iraq, according toe Iraqi reports.

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:52:01 AM

SirKenin

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang

Hey, I was quoting a semi-rightwing source: CNN. I am open to other suggestions as I am not there counting the dead myself. An alternative URL please? I am talking to you alternative counters.

RIGHTWING?!?!?!?!?! HAHAHAHA. CNN is about as far to the left as you can get.

EDIT: Ooops. Merc beat Me to it.

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:55:03 AM

popeye1250

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LMAO! Chaingang, "CNN RIGHTWING???"
Do you live in Bezerkley, Ca.?
Man, that's what they call "Cambridge Stupid" in Boston! lolol

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:56:03 AM

SirKenin

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I can not understand why people are so opposed to immigration. It is there for a reason. It builds up the population, increases the tax base, provides cheap labour, they do jobs we would not even think of doing (do YOU want to drive a taxi or run a convenience store for instance? Or do you want to earn $50.00 an hour?). Immigration is healthy for the economy. I would not count on closed borders any time soon.

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:57:22 AM

Estring

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

Rule - I cant believe you really think that the murder of hundreds (possibly thousands) is a drop in the Sahara Desert and insignificant?

Mathematicians usually regard anything less than between 2.5 % or 5 % insignificant. Let us suppose that there are three thousand deaths due to a 'terrorist' attack. If I calculate correctly, that is one hundred thousandth of one per cent.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen
Surely then, the murder of 20-30 million would just be a larger drop in the desert and just slightly less insignificant?

That would be one ten thousand to one hundred thousand more 'drops'. Still insignificant, yes. However, the deaths of several dozen, hundreds or a few thousand people due to a 'terrorist' attack does not justify state sponsored genocide upon tens of millions of people.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen
We might be being manipulated by news services and government, but we are all in this together so is it any wonder we feel for others who are murdered or might be?
E

Feel all you like, but do not direct your anger at the perceived perpetrators nor anybody that you associate with them. Instead pray for their misguided souls and forgive them. Be compassionate and loving instead of revengeful and hating. It costs less, you will feel happier and you will not commit genocide upon tens of millions of innocent people that you blame for the 'terrorist' attack.

Rule, how is the weather there in Fantasyland? I thought it was the Muslim fanatics who want to commit genocide on Israel? Or does that not count?

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 10:57:24 AM

Rule

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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
Illegal immigration is against our laws and the reason this is a great country is because we are a country of laws.

Ehm, aren't you yourself decended from immigrants? Now you object to other people doing the same thing?

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
Illegal immigration is now becoming a *dangerous* activity.
All it takes is for just "21" to get into this country to do a lot of damage. Or "3".

My gosh! You are being invaded by a humongous army of three (THREE) people and you are shitting your pants.

Now stop watching the news and instead go out and buy an ice cream. You will feel happier.

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 11:03:05 AM

Mercnbeth

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Kenin,

quote:

I can not understand why people are so opposed to immigration.

Speaking for myself the opposition is against ILLEGAL immigration, including overstaying visas, be they tourist or student.

quote:

Immigration is healthy for the economy.

LEGAL immigration is healthy.

quote:

I would not count on closed borders any time soon.

They don't need to be closed. Enforcement of current laws against EMPLOYERS will end the exploitation of a poor people and take away the incentive for them to come to the US illegally. With that gone, the focus can be on dangerous illegal entry.

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 11:05:01 AM

Chaingang

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
CNN, the Communist News Network "semi rightwing"!

This is the stupidest thing I have heard you state. CNN has a clear pro-war bias - at the moment I'd say that makes them right-wing. At worst, they are the center perhaps. There is no way they are representing the left. If you think that then you don't know what left actually means.

As to the numbers of the Iraqi dead, I offer two alternatives of my own:

Min: 40,069
http://www.iraqbodycount.net/

On the March 18 [edit: 2005] CBS Evening News, reporter Byron Pitts gave these figures: "Today, U.S. deaths number more than 1,500. There are no exact figures for Iraqi fatalities, but estimates are for every American killed, 11 Iraqis died." In other words, more than 16,500 Iraqi deaths.
http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=2472

That's more than a year ago for the latter source. CBS is a rather well respected source in the U.S.

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 11:08:16 AM

SirKenin

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Chaingang, Chaingang... They have supported the Liberal left for as long as I can remember. They are the epitomy of sold out left-wing journalism.

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 11:21:02 AM

popeye1250

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Rule, pay attention!
My grandparents were "Immigrants" who came here *LEGALLY* from Ireland.
The 20-30 million ILLEGAL ALIENS in this country did *NOT* come here legally.
Apples and oranges!

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 11:21:50 AM

Chaingang

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SirKenin:

I have generally found that you haven't the slightest idea of what you are talking about. I once thought one thing you said extremely insightful (and I credited you), but it's been downhill - all the way - ever since. Sorry. I wouldn't let you touch my security systems nor my computer based on the advice you so "expertly" dispense here from time to time. I don't think you can tell your GUI from your command line. Again, sorry. But there it is.

Your opinion of CNN doesn't really matter to me. At best it's laughable. I consider myself marginally to the left on some issues, and with the possible exception of reports by Christiane Amanpour I find CNN utterly worthless. I cited them merely because I thought others would consider the source at least fair. That doesn't mean I am prepared to concede any fool numbers others care to toss out. Having seen the devastation being caused by the U.S. in Iraq from many, many sources I have my own sense of what has to be true.

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RE: British foil bomb plot? - 8/10/2006 11:22:47 AM

EnglishDomNW

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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

They just said on the news that Britain has "2 million Islamic Fundamentalists who are *openly hostile* to authorities and British society."

I think you either heard this wrong or the news channel was really badly informed

There are barely 2 million Muslims in Britain, let alone openly hostile fundamentalist fanatical ones.

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