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Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 9:42:18 PM

sleazybutterfly

Posts: 2801
Joined: 5/15/2006
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I have a friend that is a Dom and some things he and I have talked about, have really made me think.

I just wonder... Do any of you feel like you are expected to be the "knight in shining armor" for potential sub/slaves? I know that so many of us, myself included in the beginning, want someone to make things all better. I thought by having a Dom, they would be. He would automatically protect, care for, love, rescue, and guide me. I know from what this Dom has said, he is running into that now. He has met a lot of "troubled" sub/slaves, who expect him to do the above, to just make the hurt go away, and make it all better.

Like I said, I admit at first to sort of thinking this. I got the impression from things I had read and people I had talked to that this was the way it sort of worked. Now, I know that isn't true. I know that until I had my chit together, I had no right to try and pair with someone else. This was not bright on my part, but I have learned a lot over the past year. My feet are firmly planted in the "real world" of bdsm.

Do very many of you run into this? How do you deal with it? Do you find yourself trying to be the "rescuer"? Do you think they have their expectations way too high as far as what "magic" you can work?

This isn't meant to put sub/slaves down, heck.. I am one... so please don't take any offense.. it's not meant that way.

Thanks for your answers.

Respectfully, Andrea

_____________________________

~Flutterby
~Curvylicious
Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, she became a butterfly.
Life is not a popularity contest, it's better to be hated for what you believe, than loved for a lie.

Post #: 1

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 9:47:15 PM

Homestead

Posts: 1005
Status: offline

What does it say, about someone I need to rescue?

(in reply to sleazybutterfly)

Post #: 2

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 9:52:11 PM

StrongButKind

Posts: 136
Joined: 10/15/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sleazybutterfly

I have a friend that is a Dom and some things he and I have talked about, have really made me think.

I just wonder... Do any of you feel like you are expected to be the "knight in shining armor" for potential sub/slaves? I know that so many of us, myself included in the beginning, want someone to make things all better. I thought by having a Dom, they would be. He would automatically protect, care for, love, rescue, and guide me. I know from what this Dom has said, he is running into that now. He has met a lot of "troubled" sub/slaves, who expect him to do the above, to just make the hurt go away, and make it all better.

Like I said, I admit at first to sort of thinking this. I got the impression from things I had read and people I had talked to that this was the way it sort of worked. Now, I know that isn't true. I know that until I had my chit together, I had no right to try and pair with someone else. This was not bright on my part, but I have learned a lot over the past year. My feet are firmly planted in the "real world" of bdsm.

Do very many of you run into this? How do you deal with it? Do you find yourself trying to be the "rescuer"? Do you think they have their expectations way too high as far as what "magic" you can work?

This isn't meant to put sub/slaves down, heck.. I am one... so please don't take any offense.. it's not meant that way.

Thanks for your answers.

Respectfully, Andrea

I consider it abuse to Dom a sub who is looking to a BDSM relationship to deal with personal issues, as a sort of "therapy" that is in actuality a substitute behavior. So I get very tired of all the subs needing rescue from a history of abuse or abandonment, from self-esteem issues, or the like. BDSM can be a healthy and wonderful part of life, but if it is an escape from problems, I am unwilling to engage. So, yes, it comes up all the time; I don't blame the people in that category, though, they need care and therapy, not judgment.

(in reply to sleazybutterfly)

Post #: 3

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 9:55:02 PM

Homestead

Posts: 1005
Status: offline

The Knight often ends up being the one needing rescue.

(in reply to StrongButKind)

Post #: 4

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 9:55:57 PM

sleazybutterfly

Posts: 2801
Joined: 5/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Homestead

What does it say, about someone I need to rescue?

Some I guess have a "stray puppy" complex.. though I don't know how common it is.

I am sure what might be considered weakness to one, might be called opportunity to another.

_____________________________

~Flutterby
~Curvylicious
Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, she became a butterfly.
Life is not a popularity contest, it's better to be hated for what you believe, than loved for a lie.

(in reply to Homestead)

Post #: 5

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:00:56 PM

sleazybutterfly

Posts: 2801
Joined: 5/15/2006
Status: offline

I agree not to judge. I know that it's very hard to find a way to ease the pain and you grasp at any thread of hope you can find.

This is what I told him tonite though, because I see him sort of down on himself about the fact he can't do or be everything to everyone that wants him.

This is not therapy.. you are not a therapist, nor superman.. you are human..and can only do so much.

_____________________________

~Flutterby
~Curvylicious
Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, she became a butterfly.
Life is not a popularity contest, it's better to be hated for what you believe, than loved for a lie.

(in reply to StrongButKind)

Post #: 6

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:01:15 PM

Homestead

Posts: 1005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sleazybutterfly

quote:

ORIGINAL: Homestead

What does it say, about someone I need to rescue?

Some I guess have a "stray puppy" complex.. though I don't know how common it is.

I am sure what might be considered weakness to one, might be called opportunity to another.

Yes, the opportunites for the knight to be vampirized are great.

Best the vampire seek professional help by itself, rather than send two to therapy.

The problem is the fantasy of denial.

(in reply to sleazybutterfly)

Post #: 7

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:04:56 PM

SusanofO

Posts: 5672
Joined: 12/19/2005
Status: offline

I am hopelessly out of date. Forgive me my delusions... I'd prefer to see someone that way - even if they're not sometimes, or perhaps don't think they are. Sometimes, people have a sneaky way of living up to your hopes, provided they're not ridiculously over the top. This goes for "either side" of the D/s equation (at least for me).

I am not a "romantic die-hard" either. I really am not. I just think there is nothing wrong with seeing someone in their best light. Isn't that what it's all about? I know there are people who really love the "challenge" of continual relationship dysfunction - but I am not one of those people. I know people have flaws - I think if they're serious - then talk it out, work on it, or leave - something. But I think it pays to have a grip on what is worth ending a relationship over - and what is just not. That way, some stuff that potentially could, might not end up killing off good feelings.

Of course, I am the person who practically had a stalker come into my house last week-end because I couldn't manage to tell him to get lost - so there you go. Still, I think continually cynical can maybe be a very disappointing way to live.

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 8/14/2006 10:41:18 PM >

_____________________________

"Hope is the thing with feathers,
That perches in the soul,
And sings the tune without the words,
And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

(in reply to sleazybutterfly)

Post #: 8

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:13:02 PM

sleazybutterfly

Posts: 2801
Joined: 5/15/2006
Status: offline

Oh, me too in a lot of ways. I still look for the Prince and all of that. I think we all have that "dream" in a way (not all, but some), and I doubt it will ever leave; not as long as there is hope that the "One" does exist.

I am not talking about not seeing him in a certain light, or as a good and strong person...just not expecting him to make things "all better". I want mine to be the "knight" in a lot of ways. I don't however, expect him to cure my ills and rescue me from my woes in life.

I just don't think that is fair to put on anyone.

_____________________________

~Flutterby
~Curvylicious
Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, she became a butterfly.
Life is not a popularity contest, it's better to be hated for what you believe, than loved for a lie.

(in reply to SusanofO)

Post #: 9

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:14:36 PM

desertdancer

Posts: 1095
Joined: 5/12/2006
Status: offline

I know I am going to be flammed for this, but, I think it's common for a girl or woman to long for the Knight in Shinning Armour. We have it shoved in our faces from a very young age with Disney and fairy stories. The idea that at the very worst point in a girl's life, a handsome young man will come riding in to the rescue, he will thus pluck us up out of our troubles and whisk us away to a castle made of glass where no-one ever throws stones, where sex is always perfect and he will never ever let you down, not even once.

I think this is an issue that all men, vanilla or Domly will have to deal with a few times in h is life. Is it fair? No way. Is it truthful of a real relationship? Again, no way. But yet with each fairy story, which each rhyme and nursery tale, it's the same old theme.

I was shopping for wedding dresses yesterday, and I felt like a princess in a gown (which I can not list the color incase a certian someone see's this thread * smiles* )but reading this thread has me thinking that the traditional wedding dress with it's frillyness or beaded glory does set the tone again for our "knight' to take us from our parents and whisk us off to a new life.

Sad thing is that sometimes, when the dress comes off, and the knight jumps from his horse or rather BMW and strips down, he may have a wart and that wart may lead to another and another, or he may have any list of things that the poor girl wasnt expecting and now instead of loving or wanting him warts and all, she can't cope. She calls him a lier, tells him he was untruthful, and only showed her what she wanted to see.

Poor knights don't have a chance really, if they happen to find themselves with a damsel in distress for a mate.

The truth is, a man is what he is, simply that, no more no less. As females, I find it unfair to place other things, fairy story things on a man's shoulder...what a task to live up to. What a burden for shoulders who may already be carrying a load of crap from his own childhood or what have you.

And in the end what a mess one is left with, for me, I happen to find a few warts charming, a few troubles on one's shoulders thruthful and well the horse right now is an old car that's seen better days and life could'nt be better....

< Message edited by desertdancer -- 8/14/2006 10:16:20 PM >

_____________________________

* Shimmy Shimmy *

(in reply to sleazybutterfly)

Post #: 10

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:21:29 PM

WindOWillow

Posts: 18
Joined: 8/12/2006
Status: offline

I can understand your gentleman friend's frustration Andrea. Especially if he has a history of being with women who are in continual crisis and need rescuing. No one should be treated as a life raft.

Some people are just prone to one crisis after another and really don't know how to stop the pattern. So they hope that someone will take on a protective parent role and stop all of the hurt. Make life better.

On some level I think we all seek that trait in potential partners. Some one to make things better. I must admit that I can't submit to an "equal". I have a very dominating personality and need to feel that my partner is stronger than myself. It's just my thing. If I enjoyed D/s simply for what someone can do to me physically, life would be easier. The emotional high for me comes from being with someone capable. Smart. Caring. I'm highly organized, I take care of people, I place others before myself. I don't wish for anything of another that I can't give back ten fold.

Wishing for a Knight with armor I'd love to polish isn't such a bad thing if a submissive is willing to be his loyal hand maiden and adoring princess. Romance is not a bad thing. Taking advantage of people is.

< Message edited by WindOWillow -- 8/14/2006 10:24:44 PM >

(in reply to sleazybutterfly)

Post #: 11

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:24:31 PM

sleazybutterfly

Posts: 2801
Joined: 5/15/2006
Status: offline

I totally agree DesertDancer.. I was actually thinking of Cinderella when I wrote some of the above. We are shown this time and time again as we are growing up. It's a wonderful thought and it would be nice, but it's not going to happen.

If you put a human on a pedestal, eventually they fall off, you are then left hurt (again), and needing the pieces picked up.

PS.. your dress sounds beautiful..and I must say..I think you WILL be a Princess in it... with your Prince.

_____________________________

~Flutterby
~Curvylicious
Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, she became a butterfly.
Life is not a popularity contest, it's better to be hated for what you believe, than loved for a lie.

(in reply to desertdancer)

Post #: 12

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:29:51 PM

desertdancer

Posts: 1095
Joined: 5/12/2006
Status: offline

* beams* Thanking you, Andrea. I'm excited about it. * bounces*

I just find it completely unfair to set anyone up for failure, and if we are going into a relationship thinking our guy is a Knight in Shinning armor, well then, what chance does he have? What if his armor gets a few spots or stains or dings and dents and it's no longer shinny?

What if Cinderella had to be the one to make the marriage bed daily or scrub the toilets? Do you tink she would still have been so happy in her ever after? I think maybe it's brat like and whingful to expect a man to be the end all answer to things...god they sure can help with things, no doubt, but to place all that, all the crap we feel about our pasts onto someone elese shoulders.. I just see so unfair.

~shimmy

_____________________________

* Shimmy Shimmy *

(in reply to sleazybutterfly)

Post #: 13

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:30:29 PM

sleazybutterfly

Posts: 2801
Joined: 5/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: WindOWillow

I can understand your gentleman friend's frustration Andrea. Especially if he has a history of being with women who are in continual crisis and need rescuing. No one should be treated as a life raft.

Some people are just prone to one crisis after another and really don't know how to stop the pattern. So they hope that someone will take on a protective parent role and stop all of the hurt. Make life better.

On some level I think we all seek that trait in potential partners. Some one to make things better. I must admit that I can't submit to an "equal". I have a very dominating personality and need to feel that my partner is stronger than myself. It's just my thing. If I enjoyed D/s simply for what someone can do to me physically, life would be easier. The emotional high for me comes from being with someone capable. Smart. Caring. I'm highly organized, I take care of people, I place others before myself. I don't wish for anything of another that I can't give back ten fold.

Wishing for a Knight with armor I'd love to polish isn't such a bad thing if a submissive is willing to be his loyal hand maiden and adoring princess. Romance is not a bad thing. Taking advantage of people is.

Totally agree, there is nothing wrong with romance. I hope that I have not given the impression that I think there is. I am as romantic and mushy as the next woman, pehaps more.

I just don't think it's right to expect a man (or anyone for that matter) to make our lives better, it has to be something we do ourselves.

_____________________________

~Flutterby
~Curvylicious
Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, she became a butterfly.
Life is not a popularity contest, it's better to be hated for what you believe, than loved for a lie.

(in reply to WindOWillow)

Post #: 14

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:36:41 PM

desertdancer

Posts: 1095
Joined: 5/12/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sleazybutterfly

quote:

ORIGINAL: WindOWillow

I can understand your gentleman friend's frustration Andrea. Especially if he has a history of being with women who are in continual crisis and need rescuing. No one should be treated as a life raft.

Some people are just prone to one crisis after another and really don't know how to stop the pattern. So they hope that someone will take on a protective parent role and stop all of the hurt. Make life better.

On some level I think we all seek that trait in potential partners. Some one to make things better. I must admit that I can't submit to an "equal". I have a very dominating personality and need to feel that my partner is stronger than myself. It's just my thing. If I enjoyed D/s simply for what someone can do to me physically, life would be easier. The emotional high for me comes from being with someone capable. Smart. Caring. I'm highly organized, I take care of people, I place others before myself. I don't wish for anything of another that I can't give back ten fold.

Wishing for a Knight with armor I'd love to polish isn't such a bad thing if a submissive is willing to be his loyal hand maiden and adoring princess. Romance is not a bad thing. Taking advantage of people is.

Totally agree, there is nothing wrong with romance. I hope that I have not given the impression that I think there is. I am as romantic and mushy as the next woman, pehaps more.

I just don't think it's right to expect a man (or anyone for that matter) to make our lives better, it has to be something we do ourselves.

I totally agree with romance as well, heck I am actually living a very close life to a fairy story, the only difference for me and Cinderella is that I KNOW I have to work hard in my relationship to keep my happy ever after. I understand that real love is and can be hard hard work, and worth every effort.

The thing is that I've found that sometimes our prince is in need of rescuing once and a while, and that there can be true beauty to be found in helping the one who is in the triditional roll of being the 'helper'.

_____________________________

* Shimmy Shimmy *

(in reply to sleazybutterfly)

Post #: 15

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:38:46 PM

WindOWillow

Posts: 18
Joined: 8/12/2006
Status: offline

That's very true. But having a loving partner makes an already full and rich life better. Or else none of us would bother with relationships if we didn't get some sort of uplift from being with someone else. Everything is better with someone you care about.

But it's true that to attract someone special, you have to be special unto yourself.

(in reply to sleazybutterfly)

Post #: 16

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:40:53 PM

sleazybutterfly

Posts: 2801
Joined: 5/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: desertdancer

I just find it completely unfair to set anyone up for failure, and if we are going into a relationship thinking our guy is a Knight in Shinning armor, well then, what chance does he have? What if his armor gets a few spots or stains or dings and dents and it's no longer shinny?

What if Cinderella had to be the one to make the marriage bed daily or scrub the toilets? Do you tink she would still have been so happy in her ever after? I think maybe it's brat like and whingful to expect a man to be the end all answer to things...god they sure can help with things, no doubt, but to place all that, all the crap we feel about our pasts onto someone elese shoulders.. I just see so unfair.

~shimmy

I wonder if this is why a lot of D/s relationships fail. That maybe we expect too much from our Doms..and they can't live up to the perfect and flawless picture that we have drawn(or that was drawn for us).

Not just pointing the finger at sub/slaves here, by any means. They put themselves there sometimes also, by making outragious promises that are far above anything they can actually do. They get sort of the "superman complex" and think they can "do it all" just because they have the title of Dom.

It goes both ways, so no one is getting slammed. I think that naturally we all want to make someone else happy, to take away their pain, and if the chance comes up..even farfetched as it is.. I can't see either side not grabbing at it.

_____________________________

~Flutterby
~Curvylicious
Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, she became a butterfly.
Life is not a popularity contest, it's better to be hated for what you believe, than loved for a lie.

(in reply to desertdancer)

Post #: 17

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:43:02 PM

WindOWillow

Posts: 18
Joined: 8/12/2006
Status: offline

You're spot on Dancer! There is nothing more endearing for me than a man who needs me. Who turns to me when he's hurting. What an honor! I love being a sub in shining armour when needed!

(in reply to desertdancer)

Post #: 18

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 10:43:20 PM

sleazybutterfly

Posts: 2801
Joined: 5/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: WindOWillow

That's very true. But having a loving partner makes an already full and rich life better. Or else none of us would bother with relationships if we didn't get some sort of uplift from being with someone else. Everything is better with someone you care about.

But it's true that to attract someone special, you have to be special unto yourself.

Totally life is much better if you are with someone that lifts you up, that makes you happy.

It's just expecting them to come along and solve all of ones problems I have issue with.

_____________________________

~Flutterby
~Curvylicious
Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, she became a butterfly.
Life is not a popularity contest, it's better to be hated for what you believe, than loved for a lie.

(in reply to WindOWillow)

Post #: 19

RE: Knight in Shining Armor - 8/14/2006 11:07:30 PM

porcelaine

Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sleazybutterfly

I just wonder... Do any of you feel like you are expected to be the "knight in shining armor" for potential sub/slaves? I know that so many of us, myself included in the beginning, want someone to make things all better. I thought by having a Dom, they would be. He would automatically protect, care for, love, rescue, and guide me. I know from what this Dom has said, he is running into that now. He has met a lot of "troubled" sub/slaves, who expect him to do the above, to just make the hurt go away, and make it all better.

I have no desire to find a knight, king, or any other royal subject. I look at the person first and foremost and expect that he walks into the relationship balanced and capable of functioning as a free standing adult. I would hope that he holds me to the same standard. Unlike some I was never raised with that mentality and I saw my fair share of fairy tales. But at the end of the day I realized that is precisely what they were and I didn't base my hopes, dreams, or future mate upon them. The very things you've listed that a dominant should do are the exact same traits I would hope the submissive would give in return. Life and love are reciprocal.

If this person has a pattern of finding troubled submissives I would turn the glare of the mirror where it belongs. These women simply cannot have a shoulder, voice, or companion if some part of him wasn't willing to play the very part he now expresses concern about. I have noticed that some men actually prefer the damsel in distress. It is an easy way to place the focus on someone else's issues and away from their own. Persons of this character are typically quite insecure and shouldn't be in a dominant role anyway.

Rest assured there are many of us who are self assured independent women fully capable of functioning well whether we are partnered or single. We solve our own problems and aren't seeking a cure all from a dominant or prescription. We have a sense of self and a clear understanding of what we desire and bring to the love table. No one can be your anchor. We are always our own safe harbors.

porcelaine

_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to sleazybutterfly)

Post #: 20

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