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RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 5:02:01 AM   
RandomGAGirl


Posts: 57
Joined: 3/16/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline 		For the past few years I've been lucky enough to be self-employed and able to support myself and my household so I can take care of the home while working taking care of the possible "who will keep the house" question.  I've met and talked to some who are financial provided for by their Dom while they keep house, continue education, and make themselves useful.  But I've also know situations where the sub was out working so that their owner could stay home.

I personally prefer situations where my potential owner was financial stable before I entered the picture.  It isn't that I mind helping out where money is concerned it is just that, in my opinion, I could end in the hospital for a month and if my work was the only source of income we would be in a mess. 

(in reply to Tikkiee)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 5:05:24 AM   
BrutalAntipathy


Posts: 412
Joined: 7/8/2005
Status: offline 		I would go absolutely insane were I not to work. What I do doesn't need to be overly productive, or even generate all that much income, just so long as I am doing something. I begin getting jittery on day 3 of vacation, and by the 6th day am ready to pull my hair out.
 
 I don't require that mine hold occupations, and my southern upbringing causes chauvanism to nag at me about it, but mine both express a desire to further their educations and work. I consider the pursuit of higher education one of the greatest virtues, and see no reason not to allow them to work so long as it does not interfere with their service.

(in reply to Tikkiee)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 5:08:34 AM   
Tikkiee


Posts: 1099
Joined: 4/6/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

I know many women on CM will say they don't mind who does the earning but I have yet to meet a woman that would make such sacrifices for men. In my experience most women see men who don't work as shiftless. I obviously meet the wrong women. However, staying home and doing the chores would drive me crazy. I prefer how I live now, single and paying for a cleaner and taking my clothes to the local laundry and no woman to get under my feet....hmm unless she naked and begging for mercy.

From the way things stand now with me, I would never give up my work. Not for anyone; I enjoy the stimulation too much.

_____________________________

~~@ cass @~~

(in reply to meatcleaver)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 5:08:59 AM   
heartfeltsub


Posts: 1641
Joined: 11/5/2004
Status: offline 		i should have mentioned earlier that i have been the only bread winner in the past when my ex-husband was unemployed, and that was fine, and if either of us had been independently wealthy, again it would not be an issue. However being the type of person that i am, even if i won the lottery tomorrow, which of course would have to entail actually playing the lottery, but even if i won, i would still work some because i like being productive, i enjoy working.

(in reply to BrutalAntipathy)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 5:38:34 AM   
twicehappy


Posts: 2706
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bills944

Everyone over 18 and less than 65 should work unless they're disabled or watching children period.......................................................


Any body who thinks that running a home, caring for the grounds, doing repairs and maintaining vehicles and toys is not work should have to be a housewife for a year; they would be glad to go back to work!

_____________________________

Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations.

The human heart is not a finite container but an ever expanding universe with all the stars contained there in.

(in reply to bills944)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 5:59:39 AM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bills944

Everyone over 18 and less than 65 should work unless they're disabled or watching children period.......................................................

OK... but why?
Peace and Rapture


_____________________________
.dark.



...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to bills944)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 6:16:10 AM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline 		Fast Reply:

I'll always "work", but the types of "work" I do allows me to stay at home full time, if I wish (and I often do).

My views about providing, as the dom, are the mirror image of the views I have about my sub working.  Classic male views, I think, although I don't have any qualms about it being the other way around, if the circumstances are "honorable".

FHky


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to darkinshadows)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 6:20:23 AM   
Rule


Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline 		I am a ratio dominant. I was made such a dominant by a mind and physiology altering trauma. I "died" and yet I "lived on". I am dead and yet I live. This is symbolized by my avatar. Others may think "hey, that is a pretty picture of a nice couple of trees in a forest", but to me a forest does not only represent life, but the cycle of life and death. To me a forest represents resurrection.
 
The transformation made me apathic, took away my courage and impaired my immune system and more. Apathic people do not work well. My place is extremely untidy. I have been beleagered daily by the herpes simplex virus for more than thirty years - and would undoubtedly have died from it had I not managed to slow its advance.
 
I am not in control of my life.
 
For these past couple of years I have not had an income, but lived on my small savings from an earlier job. Of course I would like to have an income, but to work seems not to be the way for me and I will not accept charity. I have been writing, but it has not paid as yet. Nevertheless I do consider myself to be extremely important, essential and useful to humanity as a whole.
 
I suspect it is possible to mend my immune system and to end my apathy by hormonal means; a one time reset. There are several problems with that, though: I am not quite sure how to do it, but suspect that epinephrine injections might do the trick. I would need to convince a physician that I do have a problem, that my idea makes sense and that I am not some crazy guy (well, I happily am ). My mended immune system would probably kill me within weeks, as I suspect that my heart and other important organs are infected by the herpes virus, and a mended immune system would demolish those infected organs. The greatest sacrifice, though, is that ending my apathy would make me "normal" and end my ratio dominance.
 
My lack of courage makes it nearly impossible to show interest in a woman. Jumping into a lions den would be easier. The virus and fear - and certainty - of infecting a love is an even greater barrier.
 
A bad deal? In many ways, yes. There is one upside that makes it all worthwile, though - but I will not elaborate.
 
I have been considering for the past months to inquire whether a sub that I dumped - out of fear of infecting her - with a cowardly dear Jane letter many years ago after an extremely short relation, might be interested in taking up the relationship again. I suspect that she will, though I have rarely communicated with her since. I require little and she is wealthy. It has only been recently that I realized her sub nature. I understand her abrasive loudness and her nature now and can deal with that.
 
The down side is that for my purposes I would like many females to serve me and to work with me. She might not agree to that.
 
Some things are certain: I am a dominant in my own peculiar way, I am male, I do have purposes, and also in my own particular way I am the best.

< Message edited by Rule -- 8/22/2006 6:45:27 AM >

(in reply to Tikkiee)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 6:27:07 AM   
Iamagoodgirl


Posts: 9
Joined: 10/23/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bills944

Everyone over 18 and less than 65 should work unless they're disabled or watching children period.......................................................


Work is what we do that allows us to have the resources to do the things we truly wish to be doing. If we, by virtue of circumstance or hard work, manage to be in a position where we don't have to do that and can go back to school, volunteer, travel, etc... then why should we continue to just blindly work until we're 65?

goodgirl

(in reply to bills944)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 6:29:35 AM   
MrrPete


Posts: 614
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SusanofO
, btw - people feel about it however they feel. Opinions are not "debatable" as some may seem to think (or maybe they are, but are still opinions, not facts).

- Susan


Here, Here if only more people realized that.

Now to the question? I'm old school vanilla on this dep down inside. But times and situations change how we
do things.

I'm retired and have enough income to support myself. I would like more income but I also have a bad knee that eliminates most jobs available to me. Any sub would be wise to continue her owm employment for her own retirememnt.
Unless of course she is retired herself. then we both can stay home.


_____________________________

Awrabest,

Mr. Pete

Boycott Citgo

(in reply to SusanofO)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 6:36:01 AM   
Padriag


Posts: 2633
Joined: 3/30/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SusanofO

In the name of equality, I am starting this thread - just to see what will happen (really). It is a fair question. This topic has already been covered in threads where it applies to FemDoms, and also to submissives and slaves, so - here we go...and, for anyone who is wondering, I am completely serious in posting this thread topic.

I find "equality" generally has very little to do with such things.  But then this lifestyle is about deliberate inequality, and in that, it at least has a slightly greater measure of honesty.

quote:

I know there exist Dominants that do feel the slave or submissive should be the one providing the income, and also there exist Dominants that feel this is almost solely "their" domain (breadwinner).

So - maybe people can expound on the reasons they feel the way they do about this?

I am curious to see how other people think about this topic. I am not (I repeat, Not) trying to start a flame war. I honestly want to know what people think, and am urging folks to be as respectful in their comments as possible.

Thanks for any replies.

- Susan

I'm one of those dominants who falls into the "breadwinner" camp.  There are a number of reasons for that.  One is stability.  Virtually every submissive I've ever known was looking for this in a relationship, they expected the dominant to be stable and have a stable life.  A large part of that is financial stability (which doesn't mean being wealthy, but it does mean the bills are regularly paid).  One of the leading causes of divorce in the US are financial problems, there's a lesson to be learned from that.  To quote from an old song,"its hard to be king of the world, when you're a slave to the grind."  Likewise I find it is much harder to exert genuine dominance and control (as opposed to someone desparately grasping for it because much of their life is out of control), when your finances are out of control.

Add to that my preference that the slaves remain at home and there's a double emphasis on me to be financially stable and able to provide for all.  Something I've been working very diligently towards for the last three years of my life.

I also find that many submissives expect it.  Tikkiee summed up exactly the attitude most men run into when she said this, "I could not have a relationship with a man who did not put forth the effort to support himself. (let me stress that there are only a few exceptions to this; disabilities which prohibit a person from working are one of them )"  There are a lot of reasons why this attitude is so prevalent, most of them cultural.  For thousands of years women have typically achieved success in life by attaching themself to a successful man, which is why wealth is often still an aphrodisiac even today (old habits die hard).  Unsuprisingly it is still a standard by which men are generally judged today, and conversely men rarely care how much the woman makes (except for an insecure group who are threatened if she makes more than him).  Is that fair, no; is it sexist, absolutely; and it is also the way things are.  Its a reality that men have to deal with, and what is fair has nothing to do with that.  Whether we wish to be or not, women generally expect us to be breadwinners.  The only consession at this point is that some women are now willing to also be breadwinners (and a few insist on it).

Its funny how often people judge self worth on the basis of a job, whether it be their own self worth or another's.  How often people assume that to have value as a person, one must labor as a slave to the grind.  But what I find troubling is how often those judgements are levelled in the absence or even when contrary to other facts.

_____________________________

Padriag

A stern discipline pervades all nature, which is a little cruel so that it may be very kind - Edmund Spencer

(in reply to SusanofO)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 6:59:39 AM   
Tikkiee


Posts: 1099
Joined: 4/6/2006
Status: offline
quote:

The only consession at this point is that some women are now willing to also be breadwinners (and a few insist on it).

Pretty much where I stand at. I work hard at what I do, and I am sucessfull at it. I would expect the same from a partner. It does not matter to me what the job is; or how much money they make. As long as they put some effort into something, outside the home; that's what matters to me.

_____________________________

~~@ cass @~~

(in reply to Padriag)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 7:10:15 AM   
SusanofO


Posts: 5672
Joined: 12/19/2005
Status: offline 		Thanks to all so far, for the replies.  

Rule: Wow, that is so sad. Really, my heart goes out to you, bud.
I know you're not seeking sympathy, but my heart does go out to you.
Take care of yourself, man.

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 8/22/2006 7:12:41 AM >

_____________________________

"Hope is the thing with feathers,
That perches in the soul,
And sings the tune without the words,
And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

(in reply to Rule)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 7:18:44 AM   
TheDiva


Posts: 129
Joined: 6/21/2006
From: Tallahassee, FL
Status: offline 		I work to support myself and to have what I want and need. I'm of the opinion that no able-bodied person who's over 18 and not a senior citizen has the right to expect that they should be taken care of. If you're not working and you're 35, I really don't care...as long as you're not looking for me to take up your slack.

But I'm with goodgirl...I like what I do, but it's a means to an end. If the money were there already, I would find more enjoyable (albeit probably less productive) ways to spend my time.

(in reply to Iamagoodgirl)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 7:21:11 AM   
MrDiscipline44


Posts: 1776
Joined: 1/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: twicehappy

quote:

ORIGINAL: bills944

Everyone over 18 and less than 65 should work unless they're disabled or watching children period.......................................................


Any body who thinks that running a home, caring for the grounds, doing repairs and maintaining vehicles and toys is not work should have to be a housewife for a year; they would be glad to go back to work!
Housewives don't maintain the vehicles or repair the home. Maybe you do but if you do, you are the sever minority. Most housewives take the vehicles to a mechanic and call someone when something breaks around the house. Other then that, maintaining the house is not a full time job. It takes a few hours at best. You can only scrub that floor or countertop so much but you begin to wear it away. How many times aday is that toilet being cleaned if its not in use during the day? So lets not make sweeping statements that don't really fit the general population.

As for the OP: If I had a submissive that wanted me to stop working so she could prove her "submission" I don't think I could do it. I would back it off to part time, but not stop it all together. Part of my reason for this would be my own mental health, part of it would be my knowledge of finacial security. Just me I suppose.

_____________________________

If you love somebody, you have to be willing to break them.

Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach.

Have you slapped your slave today?

(in reply to twicehappy)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 7:22:51 AM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SusanofO

In the name of equality, I am starting this thread - just to see what will happen (really). It is a fair question. This topic has already been covered in threads where it applies to FemDoms, and also to submissives and slaves, so - here we go...and, for anyone who is wondering, I am completely serious in posting this thread topic.

Personally, I couldn't care less who is doing the working, as long as the folks involved have enough money to support themselves.

I myself have been fond of staying at home, and maintaining and keeping a home, and love the idea of caring for a Dominant by being at home, so for me, the answer to this would hinge on whether current income(s) would be sufficient for two if neither person was working, and whether anyone's self-esteem would be damaged by this arrangement, if both people were involved in it, instead of just one, so am sure some discussion about that would be necessary.

I am sure that personally, if this arrangement were to take place, I would really need to know that a Domiant cared for me, and would be protective of me and my welfare if they weren't working, which I am sure they could be - just in one less "traditional" way, I guess.

I know there exist Dominants that do feel the slave or submissive should be the one providing the income, and also there exist Dominants that feel this is almost solely "their" domain (breadwinner).

So - maybe people can expound on the reasons they feel the way they do about this?

I am curious to see how other people think about this topic. I am not (I repeat, Not) trying to start a flame war. I honestly want to know what people think, and am urging folks to be as respectful in their comments as possible.

Thanks for any replies.

- Susan


I've been working since I was 13.  Started out doing a paper route.  I haven't been unemployed for any length of time since.  Even while going to college and then chiropractic college, I worked.  It was the way I was brought up within my home and within the culture of the time.

Most women I've met would not have cared to have been involved with a man that did not work.  I have women patients now whose husbands do not work for various reasons and, with few exceptions, these women patients do not like that.  For many of them, this is where part of the stress that they and I are dealing with in trying to get them better.  It seems to be the natural order of things...men work outside the home. 

I want to be financially secure.  The divorce opened my eyes to how quickly everything you've built can disappear into someone else's pocket and I will not go there again.  Even if I won the lottery, most likely I would use it to 'fall back on' and continue to work.  Maybe not as many hours at my career now as there is something else I'd like to have the time to do but I would be working outside the home.

Though I can see the point of not defining your self-worth by what type of work you do, I also can see...at least with myself...where part of my self-worth comes from my want/need/desire to work at something I am good at and enjoy.

(in reply to SusanofO)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 7:27:24 AM   
SusanofO


Posts: 5672
Joined: 12/19/2005
Status: offline 		I had my first job at thirteen, and kept right on working until I about six years after I was married. I've worked two jobs, I've worked three jobs (two part-time, one full-time). I've had terrible jobs, and great jobs, I've had lousy pay and great pay.

I know some people have, but I've never, ever had a paying job I was in completely in love with.

The same cannot be said of my volunteer work though - I love that. I don't care if it doesn't pay. So, am hoping volunteer work counts for something in some people's eyes.

- Susan   

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 8/22/2006 7:29:18 AM >

_____________________________

"Hope is the thing with feathers,
That perches in the soul,
And sings the tune without the words,
And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

(in reply to CreativeDominant)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 8:06:45 AM   
QuietDom


Posts: 255
Joined: 7/10/2004
Status: offline 		I know that I have internalized the traditional male role to the extent that my sense of self-worth (when I have one) derives almost entirely from the importance of my work.  I'm on disability just now, and hating it.

Still, if some independently wealthy sub wanted to turn over herself and her assets so that I could practice BDSM as a full-time occupation... I suppose I'd be willing to give it a try. 

(in reply to SusanofO)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 8:08:41 AM   
SusanofO


Posts: 5672
Joined: 12/19/2005
Status: offline 		There are reasons I am really glad I am not a man - and the feeling you describe is one of those reasons....being a female has many upsides, and some downsides, too. But you guys do have this societal expectation to contend with...and it never seems to go away.

- Susan 

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 8/22/2006 8:12:18 AM >

_____________________________

"Hope is the thing with feathers,
That perches in the soul,
And sings the tune without the words,
And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

(in reply to QuietDom)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Male Doms should not have to work for a living. Dis... - 8/22/2006 8:13:38 AM   
Chaingang


Posts: 1727
Joined: 10/24/2005
Status: offline 		Um...???!!!

_____________________________

"Everything flows, nothing stands still." (Πάντα ῥεῖ καὶ οὐδὲν μένει) - Heraclitus

(in reply to SusanofO)
Profile   Post #: 40
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