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RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 3:07:19 AM

zero69u2

Posts: 107
Joined: 7/12/2004
Status: offline

Aids isn't the only thing you might catch out in the wild..
You could get veneral warts, genital herpes, any number of STD's..
they used to show us horror movies in the army. of guys who went to Jureaz Mexico and came back with nasty STD's.
sorta as a preventive measure to keep the troops from going across border without condoms.
might wind up with yeast infection.. especially if your doing kinky stuff with feet in the bathtub..
you could get a bad rash reaction to the lubercation on some condoms...
some people have reactions to nonoxynl-9 laytex condoms.. although they are best for keeping you from not getting pregnant.

Best to know your partners and test yourself every 6 months or so. more if your a porn star.
these diseases don't care if your gay or straight. they just send you right to the doctor for your pennicilin treatments or worse.

(in reply to addisonclarkgirl)

Post #: 41

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 6:57:31 AM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

There are some times when you have to take risks in life in order to live it. I would rather get HIV then live in suspicion of my mate. In my current relationship we were both tested before we had sex without a condom and we protected one another until those tests were known. We started our relationship with a clean slate. I am not going to wear condoms with my exclusive partner. If it ends up he gives me HIV I will have to get treatment for it and hope for a cure (looks pretty close these days). I refuse to live my life without intimacy and trust in my mate.. I might as well stay alone

I think men are a bit freer and looser about their DL partners. PLEEESE, someone correct me if I'm wrong!!!! I hope I am.

I would not know now, would I?

If a man acts all homophobic I will not date them.... That is a sure fired way for me to start second guessing their sexuality. My former dom was the first one that presented the information of how in the closet homosexuals are the most dangerous of sex partners. By virtue of being in the closet they have to take risks to fullfull their sexuality that an out gay man would not take.

The point is, do I live in fear of this as a straight female in a monogamous relationship?....Nope, I do not. I do date educated men, that helps. Are you aware it is not only straight sexual partners that are unmarried that face this risk, but also married ones, so I would wonder, do you wear a condom after you marry someone? How does a marriage vow protect someone from HIV?

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 42

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 7:27:29 AM

Kahri

Posts: 70
Joined: 8/30/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

How does a marriage vow protect someone from HIV?

It doesn't, obviously, which is why I say everyone should use a condom. It's not perfect protection, obviously, but it's far better than just hoping your partner is honest with you.

I'm married. I have absolutely no doubts that my husband is not engaging in unsafe sex with anyone, male or female. We still use a condom every time. We do it because we love one another and want to protect each other. It's not living in suspicion of my husband, it's expressing my love for him.

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 43

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 7:36:53 AM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kahri

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

How does a marriage vow protect someone from HIV?

It doesn't, obviously, which is why I say everyone should use a condom. It's not perfect protection, obviously, but it's far better than just hoping your partner is honest with you.

I'm married. I have absolutely no doubts that my husband is not engaging in unsafe sex with anyone, male or female. We still use a condom every time. We do it because we love one another and want to protect each other. It's not living in suspicion of my husband, it's expressing my love for him.

And if you wanted to have unmentionables, how does one go about that?

That works for you, it is not going to work for everyone. To me it is a trust issue. I trust my Dominant to slap me around, beat me, tie me up, and blindfold me as a part of our dynamic. I am going to trust that he has enough discipline to keep his penis protected. He is a safe sex advocate anyways, just not to the extreme you are. Once we established our clean slate we decided to trust one another.

It may not be a trust issue for you, but for many people it is. I could not imagine having to wear a condom before having sex with my husband... might as well not get married in my mind, and that is how I feel about that.

I could get in a car accident tomorrow, get hit by lightening, have a heart attack, get breast cancer... My mate could give me HIV, I would have to live with that and be on meds the rest of my life.. intimacy is the trade off for such a risk and I am willing to accept that personally.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to Kahri)

Post #: 44

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 7:44:47 AM

Sunshine119

Posts: 611
Joined: 8/8/2005
Status: offline

Often there is no protection between the men or between the men and the women that don't know that their man has been "messing around" with other men. How do I know this? I used to be in charge of hospice and home care at an agency for HIV+ people.

I even had a wife of a wall street banker get AIDS because her husband was involved in unprotected sex on his lunch hours....of course, in this instance, it was prostitutes.

The message for any dumb ass out there, if they haven't gotten it by now is: Always Use Protection! That is unless you are in a monagamous relationship and have had two sets of blood test done several months apart (6 is nice).

It really is up to the man in these cases to take enough responsibility, if he is in a monagamous relationship, to take care of his woman.

Sunshine

_____________________________

Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away.

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 45

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 8:28:45 AM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

After some of these responses (thank you all who have shared in this thread, BTW) I think I see a new threat. PC-ness might be more dangerous an attitude than facing situations that need to be brought to light.

By this I mean, the "it's whatever works for you" doesn't cut it. It's not the same as going to a club and getting flogged or cut or whatever.. then having your spouse/girlfriend wake up the next morning and wondering where SHE got the bruises. She didn't go, she didn't ask for it but she'd suffer the consequences of your activity right along with you. This is what I mean.

Consider this thread a PSA for those who did NOT know of this practice. It's right up there with "Bug Chasing".

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 46

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 8:56:20 AM

Kahri

Posts: 70
Joined: 8/30/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

And if you wanted to have unmentionables, how does one go about that?

That works for you, it is not going to work for everyone. To me it is a trust issue. I trust my Dominant to slap me around, beat me, tie me up, and blindfold me as a part of our dynamic. I am going to trust that he has enough discipline to keep his penis protected. He is a safe sex advocate anyways, just not to the extreme you are. Once we established our clean slate we decided to trust one another.

It may not be a trust issue for you, but for many people it is. I could not imagine having to wear a condom before having sex with my husband... might as well not get married in my mind, and that is how I feel about that.

I could get in a car accident tomorrow, get hit by lightening, have a heart attack, get breast cancer... My mate could give me HIV, I would have to live with that and be on meds the rest of my life.. intimacy is the trade off for such a risk and I am willing to accept that personally.

If you want unmentionables, you do what Sunshine119 said and get blood tests, 6 months apart. And if you aren't using protection I'd still get the test every 6 months.

I don't see wearing a condom as "extreme" in any way. It is a very small sacrifice for a man to make to tell his partner he loves her/him.

I don't get why you think it's such a big deal to do something that takes less than 10 seconds to accomplish and could protect you from a devestating illness, but I don't have to. If you'd rather take the chance than take 10 seconds to apply a piece of latex, do it. It's your life. Do what you want.

But I do stand by my opinion that it is the best practice for everyone who loves themselves and their partner. Doesn't hurt. Could save your life. Seems like an easy choice to me.

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 47

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 9:03:13 AM

ExSteelAgain

Posts: 1803
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong
On one of those Discovy Channel programs.. they were show casing the AIDS epidemic in Africa. The educaiton is/was so poor about AIDS at the time, the men blamed the WOMEN for giving them AIDS.

Couldn't blame that on drug IV use and transfusion. Nope, probably one of thier "touch buddies" :) ( love that term)

If most of the women in the country do have AIDS why couldn't they be giving it to the men? Women can transmit AIDS to men or to other women. Dang, what a depressing thread, though. You have to trust some fucking body some of the time.

_____________________________

You can paint a cinder block bright pastel pink, but it's still a cinder block. (By Me.)

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 48

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 9:56:37 AM

LRODANDMASTER

Posts: 161
Joined: 7/13/2005
Status: offline

YEA AND DO'NT FORGET DIAHHREA

quote:

ORIGINAL: zero69u2

Aids isn't the only thing you might catch out in the wild..
You could get veneral warts, genital herpes, any number of STD's..

(in reply to zero69u2)

Post #: 49

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 10:01:31 AM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

I said not as extreme, that does not mean you are extreme. I am more extreme in many ways compared to others, it was not an insult nor was I calling you an extremist...

On edit, it seems reasonable to you, and I am sure to some others, but I doubt highly most people practice safe sex with their spouses.

Generally if you look at the transmission of who gets HIV/AIDs it is socio-economic and cultural variables. In the closet homosexuals tend to give it to women. Black women have higher rates than White.. this is because in the African American community there is a stigma against homosexuality more so than in mainstream White culture. Because of this African American men are more likely to have a female partner to disguise their homosexuality.

If you want to fight AIDs transmission to women from men a good way to accomplish this is by gay acceptance so people do not hide in closets and they do not have to keep secrets

< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 9/10/2006 10:06:37 AM >

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to Kahri)

Post #: 50

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 11:38:47 AM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ExSteelAgain

Dang, what a depressing thread, though. You have to trust some fucking body some of the time.

And if subs think that their heterosexual masters don't enjoy a bit of the sausage now and then.. think again. (not all... and ESPECIALLY not THEIR'S) But it is practiced.

(in reply to ExSteelAgain)

Post #: 51

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 11:47:55 AM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

If you want to fight AIDs transmission to women from men a good way to accomplish this is by gay acceptance so people do not hide in closets and they do not have to keep secrets

If it were that easy. There are cultures in which men will always declare how MACHO they are, yet have these DL's.

I would get upset with my bother for his tittering at this practice. He just loved chalking up how many "ha-he heterosexuals" that came to him.

Men are men.. and cock is easier to get than pussy..so hey (shrug).

Maybe it's our fault (the women) to begin with, eh? But give it up and you are called a whore, slut etc. If you choose to keep it safe for "the one" you are a prude/frigid/his mother.

I can see it now.."Cock.. the convince food of the Millennium" - I'm gonna be rich...$$$$$$$$!

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 52

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 12:49:03 PM

Hotch

Posts: 267
Joined: 5/13/2004
Status: offline

The answer will very with each person on the DL. They have already shown themselves to be egocentric by the nature of their activity. The only constant is the answer will not be based on the best interest of the woman, but rather the primary objective of the man. Maybe the woman will benefit from their partner making a rational decision to avoid detection, but that benefit is inconsequential to the decision.

< Message edited by Hotch -- 9/10/2006 12:51:41 PM >

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 53

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 1:30:30 PM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

quote:

ORIGINAL: ExSteelAgain

Dang, what a depressing thread, though. You have to trust some fucking body some of the time.

And if subs think that their heterosexual masters don't enjoy a bit of the sausage now and then.. think again. (not all... and ESPECIALLY not THEIR'S) But it is practiced.

Orientation has nothing to do with honesty. Submissive, dominant, male or female... BTW women are catching up with men in regard to screwing around on each other. Almost as many women have affairs as men...

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 54

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 1:32:11 PM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

If you want to fight AIDs transmission to women from men a good way to accomplish this is by gay acceptance so people do not hide in closets and they do not have to keep secrets

If it were that easy. There are cultures in which men will always declare how MACHO they are, yet have these DL's.

I would get upset with my bother for his tittering at this practice. He just loved chalking up how many "ha-he heterosexuals" that came to him.

Men are men.. and cock is easier to get than pussy..so hey (shrug).

Maybe it's our fault (the women) to begin with, eh? But give it up and you are called a whore, slut etc. If you choose to keep it safe for "the one" you are a prude/frigid/his mother.

I can see it now.."Cock.. the convince food of the Millennium" - I'm gonna be rich...$$$$$$$$!

Machismo has nothing to do with homosexuality. In fact the more shame and blame the more they feel the need to hide.There are many macho gay men.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 55

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 1:55:58 PM

Kahri

Posts: 70
Joined: 8/30/2006
Status: offline

I'm all in favor equal rights and acceptance for people of all sexual orientations. But I'm not naive enough to believe that every man who is interested in sex with other men feels comfortable enough with those desires to be open about it, nor that every woman would be accepting if her husband told her about them.

You're probably right about the habits of most married couples. I imagine very few of them use condoms. And a few of them may be sorry that they didn't.

To me, it's no different than a seat belt. When I get in the car, I put it on automatically. I've never needed it and I don't think I will this time. But if I do, I'm going to be really glad that I used it.

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 56

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 2:19:32 PM

MistressTheaZ

Posts: 155
Joined: 7/17/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kahri

I'm all in favor equal rights and acceptance for people of all sexual orientations. But I'm not naive enough to believe that every man who is interested in sex with other men feels comfortable enough with those desires to be open about it, nor that every woman would be accepting if her husband told her about them.

You're probably right about the habits of most married couples. I imagine very few of them use condoms. And a few of them may be sorry that they didn't.

To me, it's no different than a seat belt. When I get in the car, I put it on automatically. I've never needed it and I don't think I will this time. But if I do, I'm going to be really glad that I used it.

It's a preventative measure, yes - but isn't it really just insurance against one person eventually screwing around on the other and lying about it?

I have known plenty of cheating spouses - men and women. From one-night stands to swinging to long-term affairs. I would think it's an everpresent reality that for someone with an active sexuality outside the realm of their relationship may eventually bring something home, intentionally or unintentionally. The more chances they take, the higher the risk, definitely...

but I don't see a constructive solution presenting itself, other than never completely trusting your partner and protecting yourself due to the ever-present reality that one day, they could cheat and lie to you. I personally think it seems like less 'showing love and concern' and more 'protecting #1' to continue to use condoms and whatnot within long-term 'monogamous' relationships and/or marriages.

JMO, of course.

~Thea

(in reply to Kahri)

Post #: 57

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 2:51:57 PM

ExSteelAgain

Posts: 1803
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong
Men are men.. and cock is easier to get than pussy..so hey (shrug).

LotusSong, I understand that you are trying to do a public service by saying everyone should be careful about passing AIDS, but if you are a man and not gay oriented, I don't think you would just go after cock because you couldn't get any pussy. I mean, it is like "damn, no women around tonight, getting late, beer is gone, think I'll get some cock." LOL, I don't think it works that way. I think homosexuality is a far more complex matter.

My point is that if you are playing around, you need to be careful no matter what your sexual orientation unless you trust your partner. However, to think I would use a condom for anything other than birth control if I trust my partner, is a stretch to me, but that is just me.

Your eariler post where you thought the men of the African country were foolish to think women gave them AIDS was misleading. The men could have easily caught AIDS from their women. Women can pass AIDS to men as well as to other women. If you are promoting safety why forget that women can have and transmit AIDS? Vaginal fluids can contain the AIDS virus.

_____________________________

You can paint a cinder block bright pastel pink, but it's still a cinder block. (By Me.)

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 58

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 3:30:52 PM

onestandingstill

Posts: 1335
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline

What I did to protect myself as much as possible in my one big contact scene was have all the men required to wash themselves with soap and water in front of someone, then put a condom on before penetration.
As soon as the gang bang was over I showered immediately.
When I got home I rinsed out with warm water.
This in no means left me safe from the herpes, lice, hepatitis, HPV, crabs or myriad of other things large exposures leaves you open to. I must say I was a nervous wreck for 6 months behind it and have tested every three months since as aids can go undetected a long time.
I would ideally like to be in closed cell of tested play friends but as you really can't be sure all would stay within the group going without condoms would still seem a risk in the back of my mind.
Suzanne

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 59

RE: On the DL - 9/10/2006 3:53:25 PM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ExSteelAgain

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong
Men are men.. and cock is easier to get than pussy..so hey (shrug).

LotusSong, I understand that you are trying to do a public service by saying everyone should be careful about passing AIDS, but if you are a man and not gay oriented, I don't think you would just go after cock because you couldn't get any pussy. I mean, it is like "damn, no women around tonight, getting late, beer is gone, think I'll get some cock." LOL, I don't think it works that way. I think homosexuality is a far more complex matter.

My point is that if you are playing around, you need to be careful no matter what your sexual orientation unless you trust your partner. However, to think I would use a condom for anything other than birth control if I trust my partner, is a stretch to me, but that is just me.

Your eariler post where you thought the men of the African country were foolish to think women gave them AIDS was misleading. The men could have easily caught AIDS from their women. Women can pass AIDS to men as well as to other women. If you are promoting safety why forget that women can have and transmit AIDS? Vaginal fluids can contain the AIDS virus.

Yes, we have to take a leap of faith sometime in our life. The alternative is wrapping ourselves in bubble wrap and putting on a hazmat suit. There are many things out there that can kill you that a person is much more likely to get kiled by. Surely people that lie about their sexuality are a problem, but like you said, not all men are looking for just any hole to poke.... some are, but not all.

People are more likely to die from a prescribed or over the counter medication than they are to get AIDS as long as they are not in a high risk group.

people are more likely to get in a fatal accident.

People are more likely to get heart disease, and die from it, and if they really care about their longevity they should go exercise and not worry about their mate giving them AIDs. It does happen, it is not nearly as common as the number one killers like diabetes.

people should talk to their mate about things like these.. I surely talked to mine.... repeatedly. I tested negative for all STDs, as did he, in May. I am all for being cautious about any disease I may encounter. I also know that I should worry about heart disease and breast cancer more.

All this being said, AIDs is fast becoming a manageable disease that one can live many years with. Scientists are hopeful to have a cure before someone infected wit the disease today could be treated long enough for the eventual cure.. It is not necessarily a death sentence in a country like the USA where one has access to medication.

< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 9/10/2006 3:54:51 PM >

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to ExSteelAgain)

Post #: 60

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