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RE: Question on tribute - 9/23/2006 6:12:35 PM

CherieP

Posts: 25
Joined: 9/15/2006
Status: offline

The point you seem to miss, Noah, is that the VAST majority of these pretendysubs (as a friend of mine calls them) ARE simply trying to get their rocks off at the Lady's expense. They are not her friends, nor do they ever intend to give anything she might possibly value (like the intangible things which I am sure you share with your friends) in return. This makes all the difference, and this is why Frank's point is sound.

(in reply to Noah)

Post #: 61

RE: Question on tribute - 9/23/2006 6:15:21 PM

Frank01

Posts: 270
Joined: 9/7/2006
Status: offline

That's why another nickname for these sorts is "worthless wankers" Cherie.

They are, to pretty much any Female Top.

(in reply to CherieP)

Post #: 62

RE: Question on tribute - 9/23/2006 6:34:33 PM

CherieP

Posts: 25
Joined: 9/15/2006
Status: offline

Yeah, freebie-seeking wankers is what I usually call them myself.

And you can usually spot 'em a mile off by their extravagant claims (I have a large estate...I'm about to inherit a lot of money...etc) or their extravagant praise (You're the most beautiful Goddess I have ever seen...I would give anything to serve you, do anything you ask...I want to be owned by you 24/7...etc).

You can tell right off the bat that a) they're lying and/or b) they have little or no clue what is required in developing an actual, real-life D/s relationship.

And they often have an "oral fixation" or are interested in toilet training too, at least for me. Maybe I just have the sort of ass that appeals to that though.

(in reply to Frank01)

Post #: 63

RE: Question on tribute - 9/23/2006 11:06:52 PM

SirKenin

Posts: 2994
Joined: 10/31/2004
From: Barrie, ON Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Frank01

I still have absolutely no sympathy for cheapskate wankers who want to use people to get thier jollies for free. It's a bit like walking up to a movie theater, and telling the cashier that they are 'fake' for not letting you see the movie for nothing.

Get a life, or bugger off.

And I have no sympathy for the scammers in the lifestyle that want to exploit the lifestyle at other people's expense.

There has to be a middle ground. I do not demand anything from anyone else but My sub. I do not expect you to buy Me off to become My sub.

There is something really wrong with you if you can not seperate the wheat from the chaff without exploiting someone's desire to serve.

For example, I had someone write Me a couple of days ago. I figured ok, what the hell. I will look into this. They insisted I contact them via an email address. I received one email with some dubious pictures of themselves and no personal information. From there I tracked them down to Illinois where I found out that it was a 56 year old grandfather that played bass in some archaic southerners band and taught music in his spare time. It appeared from My search that they named themselves after a 1930's athlete that lived in that region. That may have just been coincidence....but an interesting one nonetheless.

And it did not cost either one of us a dime. Maybe you are just lazy.

< Message edited by SirKenin -- 9/23/2006 11:07:18 PM >

_____________________________

Hi. I don't care. Thanks.

Wicca: Pretending to be an ancient religion since 1956

Catholic Church: Serving up guilt since 107 AD.

(in reply to Frank01)

Post #: 64

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 5:27:13 AM

michaelGA2

Posts: 1533
Joined: 4/26/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jasmyn

quote:

The whole concept of BDSM is based upon the notion of giving of one's own free will.

Can you tell me what page in the manual that is .... I can't find it.

it's a footnote on page 69...

_____________________________

Are we having fun, yet?

(in reply to Jasmyn)

Post #: 65

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 6:27:55 AM

CherieP

Posts: 25
Joined: 9/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirKenin

And I have no sympathy for the scammers in the lifestyle that want to exploit the lifestyle at other people's expense.

There has to be a middle ground. I do not demand anything from anyone else but My sub. I do not expect you to buy Me off to become My sub.

There is something really wrong with you if you can not seperate the wheat from the chaff without exploiting someone's desire to serve.

For example, I had someone write Me a couple of days ago. I figured ok, what the hell. I will look into this. They insisted I contact them via an email address. I received one email with some dubious pictures of themselves and no personal information. From there I tracked them down to Illinois where I found out that it was a 56 year old grandfather that played bass in some archaic southerners band and taught music in his spare time. It appeared from My search that they named themselves after a 1930's athlete that lived in that region. That may have just been coincidence....but an interesting one nonetheless.

And it did not cost either one of us a dime. Maybe you are just lazy.

Excuse me, but how exactly am I scamming anybody if I am completely upfront about what I want and what I expect in my profile, in my messages, in my forum postings, etc? It seems to me that if I've laid it on the line and somebody writes to ME with all kinds of bs about "I'll do anything you desire", then gets upset when I desire $$, that THEY are the ones who are doing (or attempting to do) the scamming.

I DO do my homework...which is how I know which guys are freebie-seeking wankers and which are really interested in serving me in the manner I require. UNLIKE the guys who continue to message me, every single day, asking for things I've clearly stated I won't do. If asking for tribute right up front cuts down the amount of chaff I have to sort through (and it does) why should that bother you so much? I would venture to suggest that I get a lot more messages than you do (not a personal reflection just a function of the fact that there's more men seeking than women), it's my right to deal with that overload any way I choose.

Put it another way, one that you may understand better...in your computer business, don't you have some method of sorting through the real potential clients from those who just want free advice? Wouldn't it bother you if you were constantly besieged with inquiries, to the point of not being able to attend to your *real* work, and 80% or more of them were from people looking to use your services for nothing? Mightn't you, under those circumstances, insist on a consultation fee for even a first meeting? (I'll just bet you do that anyway!) Like it or not, women online in ALL venues - BDSM, vanilla, and everything else - ARE besieged by freebie-seeking wankers to this extent.

I think the difference between you and I as dominants, SirKenin, is that you are ONLY looking for real relationships, wheras I am willing to scene with the do-me wankers, so long as they are willing to pay me. What's so horrid about that? Or do you think that nobody deserves to play unless they're seeking/with their "one true love"?

I also think that if the men who have a clue would spend more time mentoring their fellows in what it takes to have a REAL relationship, and less time bitching about the methods we women use to deal with this situation, then we might all see an improvement in the situation in general.

(in reply to SirKenin)

Post #: 66

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 7:18:29 AM

LadyRose

Posts: 5
Joined: 1/11/2004
Status: offline

A tribute should never be asked for by a Dominant. If a sub/slave wishes to give the Dominant something extra than they should be able to but never demanded. The meaning of tribute is :A gift, payment, declaration, or other acknowledgment of gratitude, respect, or admiration: put up a plaque as a tribute to his generosity.
I have often said your family and life come first if you cant pay the bills or feed the family never offer a monitary tribute. Often just doing something for the dominant that is special can be considered a tribute.
A tribute should come from the heart if a sub can only offer a glass of water than so be it.
These days too much rests on what one has and what one owns.
I also have to ask myself if a Dominant asks for a tribute what is it they are really seeking? A sub needs to feel special, wanted owned and loved. Not a money or gift giver. Of course there are subs that only get gratification through payment.

For me I seek what is in the heart.
"A sub should never kneel before me out of fear but from deisre and need- LadyRose"
Travel on this journey you have found, but always travel safely- LadyRose

**Note If this message comes up vanilla trust me I am not- smiles

(in reply to raiken)

Post #: 67

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 7:36:55 AM

MisPandora

Posts: 2911
Joined: 4/7/2004
From: Philadelphia, PA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: joyinslavery

I agree. It's not just women though (although most 'tribute dominants' seem to be women due to the desperate nature of men) and it's less a judgement and more of a statement.

Btw, I'm not talking about legitimate Pro Dommes. I think real Pro Dommes are great and serve a very useful purpose. Yes you pay a fee but you are paying for their expertise (hopefully) and the overhead so to speak. I view that as a straightforward business transaction and quite legitimate. The trick of course is seperating the real-deals from the overnight Pros such as the post below You that talks about how much fun it is "...raping wallets." Scary.

Thanks for the qualifier. Your original post only addressed "those who demand tribute" which would include both the prodomina as well as the money-grubbers.

Yes, I read that post and it left a bad taste in my mouth. I worked tremendously hard to become one of the premiere pro dominas of the 90s here in Philadelphia, and the money I made went right back into my studio, my gear and my fetishwear. I held a regular vanilla job in addition to running my operation. Some of those clients became my personal friends, and I talk to a number of them to this very day. There was never a moment in those 6 years that I even had the phrase "raping wallets" cross my mind. I worked incredibly hard to get where I was. To even say that phrase implies that you're taking something for doing nothing.

_____________________________

Pandora
Ms World Leather 2004
Ms Philadelphia Leather 2004

"Simply put, if you want a real femdom to love you, give her reasons to love you." Gloria Brame

(in reply to joyinslavery)

Post #: 68

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 7:36:58 AM

CherieP

Posts: 25
Joined: 9/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyRose

A tribute should never be asked for by a Dominant. If a sub/slave wishes to give the Dominant something extra than they should be able to but never demanded. The meaning of tribute is :A gift, payment, declaration, or other acknowledgment of gratitude, respect, or admiration: put up a plaque as a tribute to his generosity.
I have often said your family and life come first if you cant pay the bills or feed the family never offer a monitary tribute. Often just doing something for the dominant that is special can be considered a tribute.
A tribute should come from the heart if a sub can only offer a glass of water than so be it.
These days too much rests on what one has and what one owns.
I also have to ask myself if a Dominant asks for a tribute what is it they are really seeking? A sub needs to feel special, wanted owned and loved. Not a money or gift giver. Of course there are subs that only get gratification through payment.

For me I seek what is in the heart.
"A sub should never kneel before me out of fear but from deisre and need- LadyRose"
Travel on this journey you have found, but always travel safely- LadyRose

**Note If this message comes up vanilla trust me I am not- smiles

LadyRose, I think your words may apply very well to Ladies who are looking for a "one true love" sort of thing, like vanilla dating/marriage but with spanking and bondage included...but not all of us are looking for that. And sometimes, some of us are looking for multiple things simultaneously. In other words, the realms of "lifestyle" and "professional" are not clearly divided, but have large areas of overlap.

When you say "A tribute should NEVER be asked for by a dominant" you are requiring ALL people who engage in BDSM, who are part of this community just as much as you are, to fit into the mold of what YOU are looking for. Which is also, I think, what SirKenin (among others) is doing.

(And besides that, do you *really* think that men, even the kindest and most generous of them, don't sometimes need to be reminded to express their gratitude & affection?)

(in reply to LadyRose)

Post #: 69

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 7:46:38 AM

CherieP

Posts: 25
Joined: 9/15/2006
Status: offline

{going off on a bit of a tangent here...}

MisPandora,

I would not call myself a pro-dom because I *am* such a novice in many things (a fact which I also make very clear in my profile etc). But like you I am not interested in "raping" anybody's wallet...I strive to provide good value for whatever money I am paid, and I certainly don't expect to be paid what a sub might shell out to see a REAL pro-dom.

Which is why it bugs the hell out of me when people make blanket declarations about whether any dominant woman should ever be asking for tribute, or insist that she's a scammer, liar, whore etc based on the simple fact that she does. Does this bother you as well? Or do you find that most people understand that there's not really a clear-cut line between the "pro" and the "lifestyle"?

(in reply to MisPandora)

Post #: 70

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 8:28:10 AM

MisPandora

Posts: 2911
Joined: 4/7/2004
From: Philadelphia, PA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CherieP

{going off on a bit of a tangent here...}

MisPandora,

I would not call myself a pro-dom because I *am* such a novice in many things (a fact which I also make very clear in my profile etc). But like you I am not interested in "raping" anybody's wallet...I strive to provide good value for whatever money I am paid, and I certainly don't expect to be paid what a sub might shell out to see a REAL pro-dom.

Which is why it bugs the hell out of me when people make blanket declarations about whether any dominant woman should ever be asking for tribute, or insist that she's a scammer, liar, whore etc based on the simple fact that she does. Does this bother you as well? Or do you find that most people understand that there's not really a clear-cut line between the "pro" and the "lifestyle"?

I'm confused. It's ok to take money in the name of experimentation? Help me understand that premise? In my mind, it should be you of anyone who is paying the bottoms to LEARN how to make money!

I'm failing to understand why, if you want to go the professional "pay me for my service" way, why you wouldn't be serious about it and work under the tutelage of an established pro dom and invest yourself in becoming a "professional dominant" rather than playing one on the internet and taking money for something you've not yet established your exceptional level or skill in. Perhaps you can shed some light on this so I can better understand.

_____________________________

Pandora
Ms World Leather 2004
Ms Philadelphia Leather 2004

"Simply put, if you want a real femdom to love you, give her reasons to love you." Gloria Brame

(in reply to CherieP)

Post #: 71

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 9:41:44 AM

CherieP

Posts: 25
Joined: 9/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MisPandora

I'm confused. It's ok to take money in the name of experimentation? Help me understand that premise? In my mind, it should be you of anyone who is paying the bottoms to LEARN how to make money!

I'm failing to understand why, if you want to go the professional "pay me for my service" way, why you wouldn't be serious about it and work under the tutelage of an established pro dom and invest yourself in becoming a "professional dominant" rather than playing one on the internet and taking money for something you've not yet established your exceptional level or skill in. Perhaps you can shed some light on this so I can better understand.

Those are quite legitimate questions MisPandora, the sort that I *wish* prospective subs might ask, and I will do my best to answer them.

There are some areas in which I am a complete novice (eg. cropping, CBT) and others in which I am already expert (eg. crossdressing, tease-and-denial). Additionally, I am not at all interested in cyber-playing, but only in-the-flesh play. I am also not at all sure that I would even wish to become a pro-dom, as it requires the sort of total immersion in BDSM that I am not currently looking for - in other words, I still like the vanilla stuff too, and have no intentions at present of giving it up.

Beyond that, my life at present does not allow me the luxury of playing purely for it's own sake. Everything I do must have some practical purpose as well...but I can't be *all* work and *no* play, or I'd go nuts. :-p I could do some "escorting" to make up the cash shortfall, it would be easier and more lucrative, but I enjoy fetish play so much more that I would rather have fetish clients than vanilla ones, even if it means I work harder at it and make less money. My life at present (happily married, therefore not necessarily looking for a relationship, flexible schedule etc) also means I am ok with scening with those who are themselves not looking for a relationship (eg. married, closeted kinksters) and those who either can't afford a proper pro-dom or find the pro-dom trappings (dungeons & black leather etc) scary.

Most of the things the men who contact me are seeking are things I am expert in, so I am trying to "kill two birds (more than two actually) with one stone" by simultaneously honing my skills, making some money, and doing something which I find personally satisfying. Furthermore, if I happen to meet an experienced sub whom I believe can actually help me to learn in a truly substantial way, I AM willing to play without pay...you must admit that prospective subs with that kind of self-knowledge and communication skills are NOT the norm!

Finally, the principle is not so very different from going to a massage or hairstyling student rather than a famous practitioner...you pay less because you know from the start that you are not getting "top-grade" service, but it is still a service which you are willing to pay for.

(in reply to MisPandora)

Post #: 72

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 11:56:11 AM

MistressSassy66

Posts: 1675
Joined: 11/5/2004
Status: offline

I have an open view to the word "tribute"...It could be anything from cash to yardwork.Sometimes it is a great way to weed out some of the 'wankers'(love that word...LOL).

I think more along the lines of the old timers barter system...they get a service I get a chicken.Remember the show Dr.Quinn...something like that....

_____________________________

Mistress Sassy

http://www.mistresssassy.com

In the Immortal Words of Bob....Fuck the dumb shit.

"I love you not only for what you are,But for what I am when I'm with you."- Opening line from a poem by Roy Croft

(in reply to raiken)

Post #: 73

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 12:49:43 PM

CherieP

Posts: 25
Joined: 9/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressSassy66

I have an open view to the word "tribute"...It could be anything from cash to yardwork.Sometimes it is a great way to weed out some of the 'wankers'(love that word...LOL).

I think more along the lines of the old timers barter system...they get a service I get a chicken.Remember the show Dr.Quinn...something like that....

I actually would prefer to work purely on barter too, MistressSassy, but the homeowner's insurance crisis here in FL (our insurance bill just went from $1200/yr to $2400/yr, AND they dropped little things like theft coverage from it) makes me need cash more than anything else at the moment.

Plus there's an awful lot of wankers who think that one lousy (and I mean that literally, as I have yet to meet the man who can do a better job with his tongue than I can with my fingers) orgasm from cunnilingus should be eqivalent to a complete "training" program, including hours of chats & emails, and a lengthy live session. :-p Cash tribute does a much better job of weeding *them* out.

(in reply to MistressSassy66)

Post #: 74

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 1:41:54 PM

joyinslavery

Posts: 955
Joined: 6/21/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CherieP

I actually would prefer to work purely on barter too, MistressSassy, but the homeowner's insurance crisis here in FL (our insurance bill just went from $1200/yr to $2400/yr, AND they dropped little things like theft coverage from it) makes me need cash more than anything else at the moment.

Plus there's an awful lot of wankers who think that one lousy (and I mean that literally, as I have yet to meet the man who can do a better job with his tongue than I can with my fingers) orgasm from cunnilingus should be eqivalent to a complete "training" program, including hours of chats & emails, and a lengthy live session. :-p Cash tribute does a much better job of weeding *them* out.

Well boo-hoo and poor you. If the solution to your cash flow problems is requiring 'tribute', then please refer to post number 41 of this thread.

_____________________________

"...we must learn, each one of us, that the world was not made for us, and that, however beautiful may be the things we crave, Fate may nevertheless forbid them."
-Bertrand Russell

Mainstream...The New Alternative

*Beware of dog*

(in reply to CherieP)

Post #: 75

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 2:16:32 PM

CherieP

Posts: 25
Joined: 9/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: joyinslavery

Well boo-hoo and poor you. If the solution to your cash flow problems is requiring 'tribute', then please refer to post number 41 of this thread.

Ummm...did you think that calling me a whore was going to insult me joyinslavery? Because it's not exactly something I'm unused to hearing, or something I'm likely to get worked up about. I have already said I work in the sex industry, remember? And also that I'm not a pro-dom. Or doesn't your memory hold that much info?

Besides which, I don't see how being a whore makes me any less of a dominant woman, or puts me any less in control...try telling that to the last guy who shelled out half-a-week's pay to bed me. *eyeroll*

(in reply to joyinslavery)

Post #: 76

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 2:36:59 PM

joyinslavery

Posts: 955
Joined: 6/21/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CherieP

Or doesn't your memory hold that much info?

...try telling that to the last guy who shelled out half-a-week's pay to bed me. *eyeroll*

Congratulations.

Now that we have that cleared up...

Edited because I need a spelling tutor.

< Message edited by joyinslavery -- 9/24/2006 3:27:23 PM >

_____________________________

"...we must learn, each one of us, that the world was not made for us, and that, however beautiful may be the things we crave, Fate may nevertheless forbid them."
-Bertrand Russell

Mainstream...The New Alternative

*Beware of dog*

(in reply to CherieP)

Post #: 77

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 3:19:26 PM

DeviantLady

Posts: 38
Joined: 9/12/2006
Status: offline

Why are we all arguing amonst ourselves? Who is to say what is right and what is wrong?

If a Domme wants to ask for a tribute to prove that someone is genuine and generous then what difference does it make to anyone apart from the two of them?

(in reply to joyinslavery)

Post #: 78

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 3:42:48 PM

demistress

Posts: 391
Joined: 4/24/2006
From: Dela-where?
Status: offline

Clearly certain people have so much joy in their own slavery, seeing the world through ladies rose colored glasses that they cannot comprehend that the world according to them isn't the only world.
*rolls eyes*

(in reply to DeviantLady)

Post #: 79

RE: Question on tribute - 9/24/2006 3:48:02 PM

joyinslavery

Posts: 955
Joined: 6/21/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: demistress

Clearly certain people have so much joy in their own slavery, seeing the world through ladies rose colored glasses that they cannot comprehend that the world according to them isn't the only world.
*rolls eyes*

It's called a (strong) opinion. Do you have any of those? Thanks for the giggle. :)

Btw, you really should wear a helmet.

_____________________________

"...we must learn, each one of us, that the world was not made for us, and that, however beautiful may be the things we crave, Fate may nevertheless forbid them."
-Bertrand Russell

Mainstream...The New Alternative

*Beware of dog*

(in reply to demistress)

Post #: 80

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