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'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 3:35:30 AM

LordODiscipline

Posts: 995
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

In a recent posting, someone quoted a philisophical treatise developed for bar room bouncers - stating that "If you are not in control of yourself, someone else is".

While this perspective is assuredly aimed at stress situations (where there is an immediacy to the situation - as people could potentially be 'thumped on') - it was applied to all situations including minor annoyances considered "controling of the dominant"

The question:

Do you think that a dominant must be in complete control of themselves at all times in order to be a "good" dominant?

If so, why?

If not, why not?

Please, provide concrete examples to back up your opinion.

Pick up your number 2 pencil, break the seal - you may begin.

~J

_____________________________

"Anyone who thinks they're important is usually just a pompous moron who can't deal with his or her own pathetic insignificance and the fact that what they do is meaningless and inconsequential."
William Thomas

Post #: 1

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 3:46:25 AM

MasterC46910

Posts: 108
Joined: 4/17/2006
Status: offline

Complete control at all times is a very hard place to find, much less stay there.

Control is mostly an objective word. Depending on what you would define as Control.

I feel you should, more or less, be able to guide your way as it careens down the path of life. I really don't believe anyone is able to have complete control all the time.

Examples would be having control of your finances, your bad habits(which we all have), your household, your temper, your temptations and your relationships. But sometimes things do come into play that would take control away from you or cause you to lose control for short times. The important thing is can you regain control and how quickly can you do it.

< Message edited by MasterC46910 -- 9/28/2006 4:28:00 AM >

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

Post #: 2

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 3:47:58 AM

bandit25

Posts: 3029
Joined: 6/18/2005
Status: offline

I think everyone loses control of him or herself at times, thus, I believe the answer is no. With that said, however, I do think a "good" dominant must be able to admit when s/he has lost control (I am talking in a D/s context here). Just a simple, "Gee, that wasn't supposed to happen" or "Now THAT'S going to leave a mark", said in a light or playful tone goes a long way in letting me know that the situation is back under control. Of course, this only pertains to play.

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

Post #: 3

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 3:48:46 AM

FangsNfeet

Posts: 3758
Joined: 12/3/2004
Status: offline

You can't be a dominant if you can't dominate yourself.

_____________________________

I'm Godzilla and you're Japan

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

Post #: 4

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 3:50:51 AM

ShiftedJewel

Posts: 2492
Joined: 12/2/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LordODiscipline

In a recent posting, someone quoted a philisophical treatise developed for bar room bouncers - stating that "If you are not in control of yourself, someone else is".

While this perspective is assuredly aimed at stress situations (where there is an immediacy to the situation - as people could potentially be 'thumped on') - it was applied to all situations including minor annoyances considered "controling of the dominant"

The question:

Do you think that a dominant must be in complete control of themselves at all times in order to be a "good" dominant?

If so, why?

If not, why not?

Please, provide concrete examples to back up your opinion.

Pick up your number 2 pencil, break the seal - you may begin.

~J

I don't think anyone is capable of being in control of themselves all the time. A shrink my nephew went to years ago said that telling someone that they have to keep their shit together every moment of every day is like arming a bomb.

But I do think that everyone should be able to keep their heads when dealing with volatile emotions. Was it Socrates or Aristotle that said "To become angry is easy but to become angry for the right reason and to the right degree is not easy"? Ok, I probably crucified that quote but you get my meaning, right?

Concrete examples huh? Ok, I rarely become angry and it's generally toward beaucratic bullshit (building inspections, dealing with utility companies, that sort of thing) and I know going in that they are going to piss me off so I make it a point to temper my anger (no pun intended) because when dealing with people like that if I were to go off on a screaming rampage I would accomplish nothing... or worse.

In my relationship with our slave... I can honestly sa that I have not kept total and complete control over my emotions and reactions, neither of us have. And to me that's ok, I'm a human being and never want to be perceived any other way. The few disaggreements that we have had has served to make our relationship stronger and our bond tighter. Even if I could stay in total control of my emotions and reactions I wouldn't want to... it's to exhausting and to have what we have as a group we all have to be available emotionally as well as physically.

Hope this answered your questions.

Jewel

_____________________________

Don't ask, trust me, you won't like the answer... no one ever does.

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

Post #: 5

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 3:55:06 AM

LordODiscipline

Posts: 995
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

quote:

You can't be a dominant if you can't dominate yourself.

_____________________________

I'm Godzilla and you're Japan

OK - this is a great sound bite if you were a politican or played on on TV

- but -

Are you in control of yourself at all times in all ways to the extent that you never get annoyed, upset, or frazzled?

Is you world so orderly that you are capable of contolling all aspects of it and therefore are never surprised or distracted?

Have you never (since donning the holy mantle of dominant when you were a wee boi and all was rosy) lost your temper, said something out of annoyance, honked your horn (no euphamism here) at a driver who was being a butt hole, or cried because your puppy was smashed by a 16 wheeler at the rest stop when you were playing frisbee with it (<sob>! I swore I would not cry about that any more!!)

Sound bites are good - but, you cannot pass this examination without answering the entire question!

And, the fact is - sound bites are cheap and do ot require any cognitive ability....

Forrest Gump was outstanding with those.

~J

_____________________________

"Anyone who thinks they're important is usually just a pompous moron who can't deal with his or her own pathetic insignificance and the fact that what they do is meaningless and inconsequential."
William Thomas

(in reply to FangsNfeet)

Post #: 6

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 3:55:47 AM

bignipples2share

Posts: 611
Joined: 4/19/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LordODiscipline

The question:

Do you think that a dominant must be in complete control of themselves at all times in order to be a "good" dominant?

If not, why not?

Please, provide concrete examples to back up your opinion.

Pick up your number 2 pencil, break the seal - you may begin.

~J

No
I am human. Errors will be made. I am not god.
I need to rest on the 6th day.

~Big

< Message edited by bignipples2share -- 9/28/2006 3:57:20 AM >

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

Post #: 7

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 4:12:13 AM

pqwinny

Posts: 117
Joined: 6/23/2006
Status: offline

Control is an illusion.
Mortals don't control things, we only plan and act or react to what is.
Those who 'think' they can control things manage to make gigantic messes, the consequences of which we all must live with and manage our response to or allow someone to manage it for us....which leads me to...

Dominance. i do not believe it is really about control but about management; management of oneself and the one who submits.
In the context of D/s it's a willing exchange with mutual benefit and in the best circumstances includes loving decisions mutually agreed upon even when the parties are not 'in love.'

_____________________________

I have no special talent. I am only passionately curious.
-Albert Einstein

(in reply to bignipples2share)

Post #: 8

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 4:37:30 AM

kyraofMists

Posts: 3292
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LordODiscipline

The question:

Do you think that a dominant must be in complete control of themselves at all times in order to be a "good" dominant?

If so, why?

If not, why not?

No, because I rarely agree with absolute statements. The words "complete" and "at all times" requires perfection and life is not perfect.

I do think this is a worthy ideal to aspire to, but not just for dominants. I think it is a worthy ideal for people in general no matter what type of relationship they like to be in.

Knight's kyra

_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

Post #: 9

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 4:49:08 AM

OhReallyNow

Posts: 249
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline

quote:

Do you think that a dominant must be in complete control of themselves at all times in order to be a "good" dominant?

this slave does not think so. No one is ever in COMPLETE control of themselves; however, this slave believes that it is HOW one controls the little inconsisites in their personality that is what makes the difference. ( by inconsisties this slave means bursts of anger, depression, stress, worry, etc )

_____________________________

~ When anger rises, think of the consequences
CONFUCIUS ~

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

Post #: 10

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 4:53:29 AM

SirLordTrainer

Posts: 820
Joined: 5/6/2004
From: Indy
Status: offline

I agree with your statement as well as MasterC's.. adding further that I like to think one is in control of their own mind thus the body follows.. with exception to when one isnt 'playing' and may be drinkin on weekends lol

_____________________________

Accepting one's own imperfections eliminates a roadblock to progress.

(in reply to kyraofMists)

Post #: 11

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 4:55:55 AM

marieToo

Posts: 3595
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
Status: offline

Fast Reply:

I think dominants are human and are not always in control of every emotion, just like anyone else.

However, I will not involve myself with someone who seems like they are typically out of control of their behavior or anger.

_____________________________

marie.

I give good agita.

(in reply to OhReallyNow)

Post #: 12

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 6:15:51 AM

zenfull2

Posts: 62
Joined: 12/4/2005
Status: offline

I believe that in order to be a good Dominant one must be able to be the Dominant of themselves. However, does this mean that they need to be in complete control of themselves at ALL times? No.. that is a very difficult thing to maintain. I follow many zen teachings and being in control of oneself is an importiance but so is being able to release control and allow oneself to "float with no predetermined destinations or goals".

_____________________________

"I aim to misbehave!" -Serenity

(in reply to marieToo)

Post #: 13

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 6:26:04 AM

pleazuredpain

Posts: 29
Joined: 9/27/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LordODiscipline

In a recent posting, someone quoted a philisophical treatise developed for bar room bouncers - stating that "If you are not in control of yourself, someone else is".

While this perspective is assuredly aimed at stress situations (where there is an immediacy to the situation - as people could potentially be 'thumped on') - it was applied to all situations including minor annoyances considered "controling of the dominant"

The question:

Do you think that a dominant must be in complete control of themselves at all times in order to be a "good" dominant?

If so, why?

If not, why not?

Please, provide concrete examples to back up your opinion.

Pick up your number 2 pencil, break the seal - you may begin.

~J

No, I do not believe a "good" Dominant has to be in control of himself all the time. I don't believe anyone can be in control of themselves all the time.

Concrete reasons, geeeze... If a person never loses control, never releases what they need to release......won't it come out somewhere down the road? We all need to be able to control ourselves or the world would not be a great place to live, it is in how we lose control that we have to manage.

_____________________________

"You're going to do WHAT!!!!!!!!!"

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

Post #: 14

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 7:02:48 AM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

Someone who is in too much control of himself is probably working on developing serious health problems related to stress just as someone who is never in control of himself is probably doing all sort of things to harm his health.

The best place is to be healthy, to know what is good for you and to be honest with how well you are following through in pursuit of better health. I think honesty and consistant as well as a solid state of self-knowledge equals a better human being than merely one that is in control or not in control.

Let me use myself as an example. For years and years I bottled up, surpressed, and used my alts to "control" my feelings. What I was really doing was letting my feelings frighten me and control me but I did survive this way and do pretty darned good by academic and mundane standards. But I was not happy a surely unhealthy condition.

I had to learn to let myself go and feel the feelings so that I could deal with them and be in control of the choices I made and how could chose whether or not each feeling or situation was really worth my time and energy instead of just working on automatic. Has it made me a better dominant? Fox has seen some of the changes though the foundation work was done before he arrived. Tom has seen all of the changes. They say I am a much happier person now, I'm still intense but at least now they know that intensity generally comes after feeling things and thinking about them.

Hard to undo 22 years of "self-control" though. The point is that I work on it.

So in short my answer would be that a good dominant is one who is aware of her limits, weaknesses, and strengths and who doesn't expect more from her submissive than should could from herself if their roles were reversed.

In my case this means I have a rule that anyone with any issue that causes problems in his/her life must be either working with a professional on it or have worked with a professional and being currently dealing with things in an honest manner. This can be drugs, alcohol, financial problems, abuse, or other things. But someone who isn't willing to do the work on themselves like I do, isn't someone I need around. I can be supportive but I'm not your mother or your priest or your deity.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

Post #: 15

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 7:15:11 AM

Dnomyar

Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline

Total Control = without variables

Life is all about variables. So there is no such thing as total control.

(in reply to thetammyjo)

Post #: 16

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 7:17:14 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

quote:

Do you think that a dominant must be in complete control of themselves at all times in order to be a "good" dominant?

LoD,
Striving for "complete" control is a good ambition, just as striving for "perfection". The caveat being that a person needs to know that pragmatically both goals are impossible to obtain. The same applies to the other side. Striving for "complete" surrender is ambitious, may never be achieved; but is, none the less, a worthy goal. I believe striving for perfection or being in complete control has merit due to the alternative. If you have mediocrity as your goal you just may obtain it. If success is defined as being in control or surrendering some of the time, your partner will need to be a mind reader to determine exactly when those times occur.

Golf is a good example of striving for perfections with no chance of achieving it. Nobody has ever taken only 18 strokes for 18 holes, not even in the cyber equivalent - 'miniature golf'.

Part of the initial and onoing self assessment is knowing your weakness, knowing where you have the potential to loss control or not be perfect. It's an ongoing process. Not necessarily a struggle, but at minimum a conscience effort.

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

Post #: 17

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 7:19:58 AM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

Do you think that a dominant must be in complete control of themselves at all times in order to be a "good" dominant?

LoD,
Striving for "complete" control is a good ambition, just as striving for "perfection". The caveat being that a person needs to know that pragmatically both goals are impossible to obtain. The same applies to the other side. Striving for "complete" surrender is ambitious, may never be achieved; but is, none the less, a worthy goal. I believe striving for perfection or being in complete control has merit due to the alternative. If you have mediocrity as your goal you just may obtain it. If success is defined as being in control or surrendering some of the time, your partner will need to be a mind reader to determine exactly when those times occur.

Golf is a good example of striving for perfections with no chance of achieving it. Nobody has ever taken only 18 strokes for 18 holes, not even in the cyber equivalent - 'miniature golf'.

Part of the initial and onoing self assessment is knowing your weakness, knowing where you have the potential to loss control or not be perfect. It's an ongoing process. Not necessarily a struggle, but at minimum a conscience effort.

Thank you so much for writing this. It says exactly what I was trying to type, only way better.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 18

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 7:39:44 AM

mistoferin

Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline

I choose to have my relationships with human beings. Human beings are by nature, fallible. But that's ok. I want to share my world with someone whose feelings and emotions can be impacted by the joys and trials of life. I have no desire to be with a perfect being who is in control every moment, for to me, that would be suggestive of an individual who was incapable of feeling or expression of emotion. Cold.

I think that far more important than being in constant control of oneself would be a demonstrated pattern of positive response. If the Dominant I was with were to lose a family member, have his health compromised in some way or even lose a position in the workforce for example, I would expect any of these events to cause a great deal of emotional turmoil that may, at least temporarily, "derail" his "control". What would be more important to me at those times is not the temporary loss of control or overwhelming emotion, but the manner in which he responds in the long term to regain it or move forward from it.

I think that in order to be a good Dominant, one must have a "good handle" on their own life. Perfection though?.....Pfffftttt....

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

Post #: 19

RE: 'In Control of Oneself' to Be a "Dominant" - 9/28/2006 7:44:47 AM

CreativeDominant

Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LordODiscipline

In a recent posting, someone quoted a philisophical treatise developed for bar room bouncers - stating that "If you are not in control of yourself, someone else is".

While this perspective is assuredly aimed at stress situations (where there is an immediacy to the situation - as people could potentially be 'thumped on') - it was applied to all situations including minor annoyances considered "controling of the dominant"

The question:

Do you think that a dominant must be in complete control of themselves at all times in order to be a "good" dominant?

If so, why?

If not, why not?

Please, provide concrete examples to back up your opinion.

Pick up your number 2 pencil, break the seal - you may begin.

~J

Good question. I do not believe a dominant, or anyone for that matter, needs to be "in complete control" of themselves at all times. I don't think that anyone can or should be. There are so many things that pound at us...unmentionables, finances, running a business, family ups and downs, friends' problems and joys, world situations, etc... that it is not only possible that something will break through our barriers, it is likely. It is how we manage the situation that makes the difference, as someone else has noted.

In my case, crying because your mother has died after suffering through strokes and then breast cancer and the loss of a breast and partial loss of a leg is me definitely being overwhelmed and letting go of your emotions rather than 'controlling' them. Realizing that it was probably the best thing for her and coming to terms with her loss and easing the grief by talking to others or by seeking out information on how to do so and not blaming God and not going out and getting "revenge" on the doctors/staff who "killed" her is "controlled" management of those "out - of - control" overwhelming feelings of grief.

As another example, becoming angry when your unmentionable has wronged you or deliberately hurt you and yet, refraining from abusing him/her physically or mentally is something that almost all parents go through. It is not easy...no matter what some might say...to maintain your cool when your unmentionable tells you that they "hate you and wish that you weren't in their life". It makes you angry and it hurts. At that point , turning around and striking them either physically or emotionally would be a definite loss of control of yourself. Letting them know that they have hurt and/or angered you and that you need to go somewhere and deal with the emotions and then doing so...either by walking or listening to music or pounding nails into a board, talking to your therapist while you allow your inner self to come to terms with what has been said, processing it and examining it from an ever-calmer perspective, is regaining fuller control of your emotions through management of them.

Recognition of my own issues and hot buttons has led me to the realization that, while I might want to be seen as a lighthouse on your journey through the sea of life, I don't want to be...as thetammyjo said...your priest, your therapist, your constant 'fixer' . If you have issues that need those professionals and you are not using them when and as needed, you aren't for me.

(in reply to LordODiscipline)

Post #: 20

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