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RE: Ownership and love - 10/1/2006 8:08:38 AM   
Noah


Posts: 1660
Joined: 7/5/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: KnightofMists
...

I really like how Noah turned the phrase to "I wish to offer all that I have to give" and the Master will take what he should desire. This is why it is important to understand what your Master desires. If as a person you have personal need to have a loving interaction with your Master.. then ensure you have a Master first that desires such an interaction.

...



Thanks Knight.

I don't ever claim originality of thought though I do credit myself with well cultivated taste in ideas. Anyway, acknowledging my intellectual unoriginality I'd like to give credit where it is due here.

Yes, that phrase you refer to--the string of words itself--is from me. The message embodied in it however should be attributed elsewhere. She has never said that sentence to me but she has made its content manifest for me, unmistakeably, every day for some time now. Whatever beauty or light is in it flows from justheather, not me.

(in reply to KnightofMists)
Profile   Post #: 81
RE: Ownership and love - 10/1/2006 8:29:07 AM   
KnightofMists


Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Noah

Whatever beauty or light is in it flows from justheather, not me.


Well she is indeed a person of wonderful thought and beauty... I expect many would be inspired by her.

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to Noah)
Profile   Post #: 82
RE: Ownership and love - 10/1/2006 9:40:33 AM   
KatyLied


Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline
quote:

Well she is indeed a person of wonderful thought and beauty... I expect many would be inspired by her.


Indeed.


_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to KnightofMists)
Profile   Post #: 83
RE: Ownership and love - 10/1/2006 2:06:20 PM   
justheather


Posts: 1532
Joined: 10/4/2005
Status: offline 		Aw!
Group hug!

Thank you Knight, thank you katy and most of all thank you, Daddy.

_____________________________

I want the scissors to be sharp
And the table perfectly level
When you cut me out of my life
And paste me in that book you always carry.
-Billy Collins

(in reply to KatyLied)
Profile   Post #: 84
RE: Ownership and love - 10/1/2006 3:07:06 PM   
ImpGrrl


Posts: 575
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		There is a difference between "love" and "in love".

I don't think "in love" is necessary at all.

For *me*, "love" is necessary in order to be in any intimate relationship - whether it's physically intimate or not.



quote:

ORIGINAL: yaqeta

Yes, another spin-off *ducks to avoid flying shoe*

I know this general topic has been discussed to death, but I have a very specific question: for a Dom/me to own a slave completely, is it a fair expectation that the slave love him/her if they are able to?

I'm trying to be really clear here - I'm not asking about whether anyone in particular would/would not have an M/s relationship if they were/were not in love.  Another way to put my question is, if a slave is to give themselves completely to a Dom/me, should they also strive to "give their heart" by loving their owner?

(in reply to yaqeta)
Profile   Post #: 85
RE: Ownership and love - 10/1/2006 3:22:45 PM   
ImpGrrl


Posts: 575
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		It's important for all parties in the relationship to be secure in their place in the relationship.  That means that the owner will know that what his property wants from them, from the relationship, is that they both uphold the structure of the relationship.

An owner who is confident in the relationship will understand that, and will accordingly not slack on their sadism or discipline or whatever else might strike fear of loss into a less secure owner's heart.

By the way - most people aren't born with that confidence - most have to learn it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: happypervert

I think love can interfere with owning a slave "completely". It introduces emotions that can make people do crazy things, and that irrational behavior reduces discipline. Furthermore, it links the motive for service to the emotion instead of service simply or the sake of dominant's desire.

I also think love can interfere with a dominant's behavior too. It isn't unusual to hear tales of unhappy masochists whose doms don't beat the shit out of them any more after they get all lovey dovey. I know I wouldn't challenge my girl so much if love was involved for fear she could stop loving me for being so rough on her.

Don't get me wrong, love is great to have in relationships, but I also think it impacts power dynamics and that impact isn't always a good thing.

(in reply to happypervert)
Profile   Post #: 86
RE: Ownership and love - 10/1/2006 3:59:50 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Noah


quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

I think that some people confuse "presence" with "dominance"..one can have a forceful "presence" and not be a "dominant".


What a wonderful distinction to draw, and draw so clearly. Thanks.

Now I wonder if this is symmetrical. By this I mean to ask whether, if we replaced the words "dominance" and "dominant" in your sentence with "submissiveness" and "submissive" is there some word word which could take the place of "presence" to help us notice a comparable distinction--or even whether a certain sense of the word "presence" itself would do the trick.

Thoughts?



It is hard to word this in a way that reflects my thoughts on the matter. I think that all of us have a certain energy about us. Some of us are shy and meek, some of us forceful and assertive, some of us are domineering bullies, some of us are mild, some of us are gregarious and enthusiastic... or we can have moments when we are all these things and more....

You know that energy that fills a room? That charisma energy....well I think that a lot of people think of this energy as a dominant one. When people think of submissive, they think of shy, demure, retiring, maybe even a wallflower. It is the "stereotype" that I think people sometimes cannot get over...."The quiet eyes downcast submissive that can only be sensed when needed" myth. There is nothing wrong with this as a model for  a submissive if this suits a dominant, but that is not the presense that all submissives have. It was this that I was referring to when I posted that to ownedgirlie and pennylane.  The reason "a dominant" did not find them "submissive enough" was perhaps because of this stereotype? I do not know as I was not there....smiles

I know better than to think that presense equates dominance. Power exchange is something we are motivated to do, but it does not define our presense. Some people are bigger than life, but these people can be submissives too.



_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to Noah)
Profile   Post #: 87
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