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Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 8:22:38 AM

WhipTheHip

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Professor Gary Kildall had a Ph.D. in computer science. He was
a genius who wrote the first truly successful operating system for
micro-computers. Bill Gates stole his OS, and called it MS-DOS.
Gates then leased it to IBM, then leased it to the public.

When Gary Kildall came out with his own Intel 8088 compatible
OS, DR-DOS, Bill Gates instructed his employees to spread a
false rumor that it was not compatible with software written
MS-DOS. Bill Gates put all his effort into addiing all kinds of
quirks and ineffeciencies into MS-DOS so programs written
for it would not work with DR-DOS.

Bill Gates in clear violation of the Sherman Antitrust act told
all computer manufacturers that he would not sell them any
product including MS-DOS, if they offered any computer
with DR-DOS or any rival operating system.

Bill Gates then bought up second-rate computer applications
and ordered computer manufactures to give them away
free with their new computers. He used his clout as sole
manufacturer of MS-DOS and latter Windows, to position
his second-rate computer applications as the de facto
business standard.    Word Perfect was better than Word,
Oracle and other spread sheet programs were better than
the one Bill Gates made the de facto standard. And
Apple has always been a better computer than PCs.

People think Bill Gates is a smart guy, when it was
mostly his lack of ethics that made him what he is.

Gary Kildall did not initially sue Bill Gates and IBM
because he feared the suit would be costly, and
every attorney told him he would pay more in
attorney fees, than he would collect from Bill Gates
and IBM even if he won. No one at the time knew
how much MS-DOS would be worth, and that
includes Bill Gates. It was not sweat off Bill Gate's
brow because whatever he made was sheer
profit, since he was licensing a program he didn't
own.

Even though the US court system found that Bill
Gates blantantly violated the Sherman Anti-trust
act for ten years, all they did was give him a slap
on the wrist. The judge who actually heard the
case wanted to do a lot more, but higher judges
wouldn't let him do anything but slap Microsoft
on the wrist.

< Message edited by WhipTheHip -- 10/7/2006 8:57:26 AM >

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 8:40:12 AM

pinkee

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TY for that, WhiptheHip. i used an Apple PC in my Masters in Tax Law program, and was totally computer-illerate at the time. i remember well how user-friendly that computer and its software were. i very much doubt i could have written my thesis on a Microsoft PC with its software, as it existed then.

When it was time for a new pc, i bit the bullet and bought a Dell, with Internet Explorer and Word, etc. At the time, i was working for a law professor, whose PC was of course networked, and also Windows based. It was not possible to "translate" from Apple to Microsoft, as far as i knew then, so i felt i had no choice.

Now i have Windows XP and am routinely dragged to the Microsoft site for downloads meant to "fix" little "bugs" in XP. This has been going for five years. For the life of me, i cannot understand why Microsoft released XP at all if it was so damned defective.

BTW, i also agree with You about the results of the Anti-Trust case against Microsoft. i am somewhat familiar with that area of law, and IMO, the proper remedy was, among other things, the disassemblage of the Microsoft Corp into baby corps, unrelated to one another.

The Microsoft case only tended to show what i had come to believe from the insurance company fraud cases i had handled: if the violation of the law is egregious enough -- and i mean really flagrant -- and the defendant is wealthy, the penalty is inversely proportionate to the harm done.

pinkee

< Message edited by pinkee -- 10/7/2006 8:43:39 AM >

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 8:46:48 AM

Arpig

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From: Increasingly further from reality
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And your point???
This old news, I mean really, really old news.

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 9:05:09 AM

SirKenin

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I was just going to say the same thing as Arpig. This was common knowledge in the late 80's. What on earth made you bring it up now?

Incidentally, Gates DID do something for PCs. If it was not for him there would not be a computer and internet in virtually every home in America. The Windows GUI, while originally stolen from Xerox, has revolutionized the desktop as we know it. He is a brilliant man. A crooked one, maybe, but brilliant nonetheless.

By the way, your diatribe is inaccurate in that Word kicks the shit out of WordPerfect.

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 9:06:16 AM

WhipTheHip

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Joined: 7/31/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig And your point??? This old news, I
mean really, really old news.

It may be old news to you, but new news to just about everyone else.
Go to the Wikipedia entrees under Bill Gates and Gary Kildall, and
see how lopsided the entrees are in favor of Bill Gates. Most people
think Bill Gates is a genius. Bill Gates is the one who made software
piracy what it is today, when he is the biggest software pirate of all
times. The original software writers had more concern for the
average person, all Bill Gates ever cared about was money.

How many people have heard of Philo Farnsworth? I feel really
bad for all the inventors who were cheated out of fame and
fortune by conniving thiefs and a system that fails to protect them.

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 9:06:36 AM

sissifytoserve

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Apple.

All the way.

Using them since 1987.

I call Gates...the great software imitator.

< Message edited by sissifytoserve -- 10/7/2006 9:07:45 AM >

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 9:27:06 AM

Arpig

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From: Increasingly further from reality
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Sorry Whip, I just can't imagine having been alive during the 80s and 90s without knowing this, they made 3-4 movies about it all.

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 9:28:22 AM

WhipTheHip

Posts: 1004
Joined: 7/31/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pinkee
BTW, i also agree with You about the results of the Anti-Trust case against Microsoft. i am somewhat
familiar with that area of law, and IMO, the proper remedy was, among other things, the disassemblage
of the Microsoft Corp into baby corps, unrelated to one another.

This was the best remedy recommended to the judge, and this is what the judge in the case wanted to do.
I personally think the best remedy would have been to split Microsoft into 10 equal companies, just like
Standard Oil breakup. If this had been done, we all would have benefitted, because competition between
the companies would have yielded much better products.

The reason Microsoft has been able to get away selling schlock is because they are a monopoly with
no real competition.   I have never owned an Apple or McIntosh computer even though I knew they
were better because most software is written for Microsoft's demented OS.

Bill Gates is an engineer. Steve Jobs is a designer.   Engineers make things that are easiest and
cheapest to produce, but are hard to use. Designers make things that are hard and expensive to
make, but are easy to use.   In most companies engineers call the shots.   Sony is an exception.
So is Apple. So is Lamborghini.

> The Microsoft case only tended to show what i had come to believe from the insurance
> company fraud cases i had handled: if the violation of the law is egregious enough -- and
> i mean really flagrant -- and the defendant is wealthy, the penalty is inversely proportionate
> to the harm done.   pinkee

The American legal system, (civil and criminal), the American medical system, and the
American political system favor the rich. We don't live in a democracy. We live in a
plutocracy.    Our legal system sickens me. Our prison system gives me nightmares.
The Republican social agenda sickens me. The Democratic foreign policy agenda
sickens me.

If only the general public knew the truth, but even then I don't know.

Cheeers,
Michael from N. Miami Beach

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 9:41:40 AM

WhipTheHip

Posts: 1004
Joined: 7/31/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig
Sorry Whip, I just can't imagine having been alive during the 80s and 90s without knowing this, they made 3-4 movies about it all.

I posted this to twenty websites, and not a single person agreed with me. They all
blasted me for trying to tarnish Bill Gate's reputation.   I say, "Look at the Wikipedia
entree for Bill Gates and Gary Kildall."   Do it. Then tell me this is widely
known.   Look at the discussion page for these articles. Even after I
provided proof, other Wikipedia "editors" and administrators would not
allow me to make corrections or make corrections themselves.

How many Americans ever heard of Gary Kildall?

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 9:47:55 AM

pinkee

Posts: 487
Status: offline

Well, yea, the US Court systems, Federal, state and local, do kinda suck, but people are working very hard to address some of the problems, such as the filing of frivilous lawsuits. IMHO, a great deal of the fault lies with the ABA and the 50 state Bar Associations, which never seem to punish attorney misconduct unless it involves malpractice or embezzlement. If subornation of perjury could get an attorney disbarrred, You'd see one hell of a clock cleaning at Domestic Relations Courts.

pinkee

(in reply to WhipTheHip)

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 9:55:07 AM

WhipTheHip

Posts: 1004
Joined: 7/31/2006
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You see what I mean!

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirKenin

I was just going to say the same thing as Arpig. This was common knowledge in the late 80's. What on earth made you bring it up now?

Incidentally, Gates DID do something for PCs. If it was not for him there would not be a computer and internet in virtually every home in America. The Windows GUI, while originally stolen from Xerox, has revolutionized the desktop as we know it. He is a brilliant man. A crooked one, maybe, but brilliant nonetheless.

By the way, your diatribe is inaccurate in that Word kicks the shit out of WordPerfect.

This is about the most ignorant post I have ever read. It ranks up there with Benji's claim that you can rent a hotel room in India for 25 US cents, and some other outrageous claim I can't remember.

Bill Gates did nothing for computers. There would be more many more computers and more Internet connections if not for him. Xerox created the GUI interface. Apple used it and improved it. Xerox never complained. Apple did not steal it from Xerox. Xerox abandoned it, and never made claim for it. This is not at all analagous to how Bill Gates stole CP/M from Gary Kildall. Bill Gates stole Apple's version of GUI from Apple Computer. Gates is not a brilliant man. He did not revolutionize anything. Over 80% of those who are equally familiar with both Word and Wordperfect prefer Wordperfect for one major reason. Word Perfect allows you to see the embedded codes, and this is a great help. It is easier to do hanging paragraphs in Word Perfect. Word Perfect allows you easier access to edit how page numbers appear on each page. I can't think of a single advantage Word has over Wordperfect. I can think of twenty advantages Word Perfect has over Word. And Word Perfect had excellent support when it was still owned by its Mormon creators.

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 9:56:20 AM

Lordandmaster

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He has said this like ten times already. It's obviously one of his pet topics (along with how he used to manage the worst hotel in the universe).

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirKenin

What on earth made you bring it up now?

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 10:03:59 AM

SirKenin

Posts: 2994
Joined: 10/31/2004
From: Barrie, ON Canada
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quote:

ORIGINAL: WhipTheHip Bill Gates stole Apple's version of GUI from Apple Computer.

See, I do not mind you arguing... Once you have your facts straight. Bill did not steal shit from that pussy Jobs. He stole it from Xerox. If I wanted to argue ancient history with you I would drag up the evidence.

While we are at it, did you know that Pharoah refused to let the Israelites go??? I know eh? I just heard about it for the first time a couple of days ago. I thought those triangle things were casinos, but your friend just posted they were pyramids. Damn, I am out of touch.

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 10:08:29 AM

KenDckey

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I have used lots of different systems from Main frames, mini computers, micro computers, desk tops, lap tops with different operating systems. I Even used Wang. I have always prefered DOS/Windows based programs except for the Wang word processor which I loved.

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 10:19:42 AM

WhipTheHip

Posts: 1004
Joined: 7/31/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pinkee
Well, yea, the US Court systems, Federal, state and local, do kinda suck, but people are working very hard to address some of the problems, such as the filing of frivilous lawsuits. IMHO, a great deal of the fault lies with the ABA and the 50 state Bar Associations, which never seem to punish attorney misconduct unless it involves malpractice or embezzlement. If subornation of perjury could get an attorney disbarrred, You'd see one hell of a clock cleaning at Domestic Relations Courts. pinkee

If subornation of perjury could get an attorney disbarrred, there would be no Prosecutors, State Attorneys or defense attorneys. I've been a victim of many crimes. Each time the prosecutor asked me what happened. When I told them, they said, "If you say it happened that way the defendant will walk. You'd have to testify to x, y, z to get a conviction. Now, tell me again what happened?" This is called "coaching." Police routinely exaggerate, lie, and claim statements were made that were not made to get the bad guys off the streets. They do this because otherwise they claim they could never get a conviction because defendants have too many rights. Police resent judges and the legal system, and think they should have the last word.

Whenever I needed an attorney to represent me, I could never find one. When my front tooth was knocked out by a hotel employee, every attorney I spoke to said even if I won my case, the damages awarded would not cover my attorney fees. Meanwhile, I have had three crowns fail on that tooth. I have spent $20,000 in dentist fees. Now, I need to have a tooth implant. I have had to endure the humiliation of having to walk around with a missing front tooth for the longest time because the temporary crown kept falling off. I sufferred considerable physical pain during all the dental work. And I have lost a considerable amount of time.

The only compliment I ever used to receive was how nice my natural teeth looked. Strangers used to tell me this out of the blue in public. Don't talk to me about frivilous lawsuits, because I could never find an attorney to represent me when I had legitmate case.

My grandfather passed away in 1994. I was a legal beneficiary, but am just now getting what I am due. In fact, I am settleing for less than I am due, because it would cost $40,000 in attorney fees to get the last $20,000 I am owed. And I just don't have faith in the legal system to do what is right.

Cheers,
Michael from N. Miami Beach

< Message edited by WhipTheHip -- 10/7/2006 10:24:00 AM >

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 10:26:22 AM

WhipTheHip

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Joined: 7/31/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey
I have used lots of different systems from Main frames, mini computers, micro computers, desk tops, lap tops with different operating systems. I Even used Wang. I have always prefered DOS/Windows based programs except for the Wang word processor which I loved.

Wang made a top of the line word procssor. You don't say how much experience, if any, you have with Apple or McIntosh

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 11:12:22 AM

gooddogbenji

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HOLY SHIT! NO WAY! If it were not coming from such a reliable source, I would doubt all of this.

Seriously though, Gates may not be a brilliant software engineer, but it does take a shitload of brains to build up an empire on stolen software.

I admire anyone who can make the world depend on their shitty software, just as I admire a megalomaniacal psycho that actually starts taking over the world. Support, no. Respect for pulling it off, yes.

Yours,

benji

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 11:20:35 AM

KenDckey

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quote:

ORIGINAL: WhipTheHip

quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey
I have used lots of different systems from Main frames, mini computers, micro computers, desk tops, lap tops with different operating systems. I Even used Wang. I have always prefered DOS/Windows based programs except for the Wang word processor which I loved.

Wang made a top of the line word procssor. You don't say how much experience, if any, you have with Apple or McIntosh

I had an apple for a while (2 years). Just didn't like it. Can't explain it, just didn't. It was like when I was wiring boards to do things back around 1969 and 70. Didn't like that either. LOL

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 11:22:25 AM

KenDckey

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oh my preferrence now is WordPerfect over word I have both office suites windows based

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RE: Bill Gates did nothing for PCs - 10/7/2006 12:25:19 PM

pinkee

Posts: 487
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WhiptheHip, i am sorry You have had such bad experiences with lawyers. i don't really understand why a personal injury lawyer would not take the case involving Your teeth on a contingent fee basis. As for the probate issue, no, i do not think the ethics rules permit lawyers from taking contested will cases or other probate matters on a contingent fee basis.

It is not the first, nor the last, time s'one could not recover damages due him because the cost of litigation was too high. i am not too sure what could be done about that. Many private practice lawyers i know who bill hourly are now charging $300 an hour or more -- but this is a capitalistic society, and if they can get clients willing to pay such high fees i suppose it's a supply and demand kinda thing.

There is one other problem with the legal system You have not touched on (nor i). There are waaaaayyyyy too many lawyers. i once heard that law school graduation classes annually outnumber members of the bar. It seems pretty obvious that many law schools should be closed, and that non-attorneys should be able to access positions as arbitrators, guardians ad liteum, mediators, etc. However, people are self-interested and no Dean is going to propose closing his or her law school, nor are any law professors going to support such an idea. Most people employed by law schools make very high salaries and can also add to their income by writing textbooks, etc.

Frankly, it was no different than when i was in college. i graduated with a degree in Sociology....a very big department with many professors, students, assistant deans, etc. Only after being sent out into the real world did i realise i did not have any marketable skills....nor did any other Sociology major. However, the university profitted plently from our tuition, fees, etc. Apparently, there is very little consideration given to the future of students at schools of all stripes.

pinkee

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Post #: 20

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