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A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 10:36:54 AM

Mercnbeth

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The best source of truth and facts about a group of people or a religion are their actions. Those that espouse tolerance and acceptance of the Muslim religion ignore their actions in countries under their control. If woman can't show their head in Iraq, or drive in Saudi Arabia; well it's their country and their 'right' to inhibit freedom. If woman are stoned to death or whipped because they lost their virginity to a rape, its not a big deal. But what happens if a Muslim philosophy came to your neighborhood?

Currently there are two places in the world where Muslim religious beliefs supersede local laws or at least trump them.

quote:

At least 20 dog-aided blind people have lodged discrimination complaints with the Victorian Taxi Directorate. Dozens more have voiced their anger.
And there have been several complaints that drivers refuse to allow passengers to carry sealed bottles of alcohol.
Victorian Taxi Association spokesman Neil Sach said the association had appealed to the mufti of Melbourne to give religious approval for Muslim cabbies to carry guide dogs.

Source: http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,,20544559-661,00.html

Of course you come to expect this in the UK and Europe. Can't happen in the US? At liberal as the state of Minnesota is, I believe it's still a US state. Our taxes are used to pave the roads, the local municipality governs taxi licensing and laws. However, if you have to be picked up at the Minneapolis airport this Christmas make sure you aren't bringing a bottle of wine to your host.

quote:

When flight attendant Eva Buzek returned to Minneapolis from a trip to France, five taxi drivers refused to take her home from the airport. The reason? She had two bottles of wine in her suitcase -- and the drivers were Muslims, who don't drink and refuse to have alcohol in their taxis.

Source: http://www.startribune.com/462/story/709262.html

Do you know it's against the law in NYC to refuse any fare as a taxi driver? I guess the political correctness as it applies to Muslims overrides all other laws and regulations? Discrimination is allowed if the discrimination is being done by Muslims.

A Christmas tree gets the ACLU up in arms. The cross on the LA emblem offends. Why not this issue? Aren't rights being violated?

Or lets apply this same religious perspective universally. Catholic taxi drivers can't take anyone to an abortion clinic. A Christian driver can refuse to accept a homosexual. Democratic drivers can refuse Republicans.

Does this concern anyone?

Post #: 1

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 10:57:44 AM

peterK50

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I've been in numerous restaurants where there is a prominant sign "We Reserve The Right To Refuse Service To Anyone". It doesn't give a reason or rationale. A private company can set their own agenda, so long as it doesn't break any laws. The Constitution/Bill of Rights, sets forth what the government cannot do.

_____________________________

Religion Is About Seeking Knowledge, Not Knowing All The Answers.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 2

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 10:59:11 AM

LadyEllen

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Here in the UK, it is quite legal for a business to refuse to serve LGBT people. Its a civil transaction, and the business owner can deal with whom he/she chooses without giving any reason for not serving someone other than the usual reasons someone might not be served. If pressed on the question as to whether service was refused because of someone's sexuality/gender, even then the law is disinterested. However, the same disinterested law is interested when someone is refused service on account of their ethnicity etc.

But I see your point entirely. There is a debate going on over here about Muslim women wearing the full head covering, which also covers their mouths, leaving only their eyes visible. It started out innocuously enough - Jack Straw (MP and ex Foreign Secretary) is Member of Parliament for a constituency with a large Muslim population, and he said that he would prefer women with those veils to remove them when they came to see him about problems they have etc. Not for any racist reason, merely because he found it a hindrance to communication, not being able to see their faces. He didnt and doesnt insist that they remove these veils, but he asks them to. The reaction was the usual so I wont go into it and its not particularly relevant to the point I want to make.

Also in the UK, all banks have a sign outside which says that motorcycle helmets and balaclavas etc - anything which hides the face basically, be removed if one wants to enter and receive service. Thats fair enough - its a security matter, as anyone entering a bank, with their face hidden could well have an ulterior motive to do so. Presumably, this must also apply to those Muslim women with the black veils? Otherwise, we are seeing definite negative discrimination against the rest of the population, because of positive discrimination in favour of their culture. After all, a biker might not want to remove his helmet - its a part of his culture and identity as much as the burkha is to the strict Muslim women.

In some ways, I hope banks do not require the veils to be removed. I cant wait for the first bunch of enterprising bank robbers to go in and rob the bank, dressed in a black burkha. Once outside, they remove them and get in the getaway car as normal looking males, and evade capture. If that thought has occurred to me, then you can bet that someone else who might act on it has too.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 3

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 11:00:14 AM

popeye1250

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From: New Hampshire
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Mercnbeth, good points.
What would happen in this state (South Carolina) if they tried to pull that shit?
A few things, Smith, Wesson, Glock, Mossberg and something about a 200 pound block chained around the neck as they meet "Ol Charlie" and get entered into the Allegator Races.
I don't think we have any muslims in this state, there's too much smoke wafting around here from pig barbeques.
Of course the people here being neighborly and all would invite 'em to a Pig Pickin!
I remember a few years ago in Portland, Maine (another wussey state) that they set aside rooms for muslim students to pray in.
BUT, if you're Christian or Jewish it's "illegal" to pray in schools!
How F.U. is that?
If I'm ever flying into Minneapolis Airport and require a taxi I'll make a point of bringing some PORK RINDS with me to eat in the Taxi.
"Hey driver, Potato Chips?" "Dig in, help yourself I got plenty!"
I'm like Larry the Cable Guy; "I got nothing against muslims, I think they all should get a wicker basket full of snakes for Christmas!"

< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 10/10/2006 11:05:30 AM >

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 4

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 11:10:18 AM

seeksfemslave

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The OP points to the slippery slope that the we are all about to slide down ,due to the inanities of PC thinking !
More accurately, in the UK, we are being pushed down the hill.

Lady E:
The crime commited wearing a burkha, ie full dress with only eye slits , has already been commited . I think it may have been covered on Crime Watch. Funnily enough no body can identify the criminals faces.
Sikhs are allowed to carry a dagger. They might stab you if you upset their religious sensitivities. They certainly stab one another when in dispute over who really runs the Temple.

Wonder how the US reacts to Sikhs carrying a weapon when on i/c to US flights?

< Message edited by seeksfemslave -- 10/10/2006 11:19:52 AM >

(in reply to popeye1250)

Post #: 5

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 11:31:46 AM

Kirei

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Good points Mercnbeth, and the others. I did not know that you could refuse lbgt people in England, news to me...I'll have to be mroe careful if I ever go there.
The reason is no one sees all this is because it has not effected them personally as a large group yet. Being trans I see this in my own family, which is highly christian and I hear the talks about the stupid homosexual agenda they fear is going to take them over. I ask when they come for me what are you going to do? They choose to ignore it, just like the German people did of the Nazi's before. History repeats itself....you only have to bring it up too your own time.
I saw part of that stock (mad money) show last night on TV...skipping through channels and all. The guy said something really interesting on it. He celebrated the fact that the government caters to big business, and business people who run them. He even stated how it overrides the constitution and he's glad for it, because you can make money off it. Yet people who watch it would not see that as being wrong. As usual I turned to another channel, but it was interesting I caught him saying that. People will do anything to be rich, or to have money these days. Reality shows prove it.

Koneko

(in reply to popeye1250)

Post #: 6

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 11:44:10 AM

Mercnbeth

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quote:

I've been in numerous restaurants where there is a prominent sign "We Reserve The Right To Refuse Service To Anyone". It doesn't give a reason or rationale

peter,
A sign "We Reserve The Right To Refuse Service To Anyone" exempts the establishment from criticism? The logic of your argument is, using the Muslim model, a follower who fundamentally interprets a "Christian" religion by considering blacks inferior and association with them a "sin" can put a sign outside their business that says "No Blacks Served" and you would be out front supporting their position to do so?

Tolerance isn't one sided as much as the ACLU would have you believe otherwise. Intolerance of prejudice must be universal or any action against it is hypocritical, or indicates a hidden agenda. Which is it?

(in reply to peterK50)

Post #: 7

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 11:44:16 AM

mugwump

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From: uk
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My argument is a simple one - in a country with as diverse a population as the UK we either have to have rules that apply to everybody, or no rules at all.

Selective laws increase the current tensions and feed the anger of the lowest common denomenators on either side of the cultural/religious fence that they are 'being wronged' - hence more violence and hatred, hence more activism, hence more violence and hatred.

It's a scary future...

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 8

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 11:47:19 AM

LadyEllen

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From: Stourport-England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirei

Good points Mercnbeth, and the others. I did not know that you could refuse lbgt people in England, news to me...I'll have to be mroe careful if I ever go there.

Hey Kirei - I wouldnt worry over it if you come to the UK. If you pass well enough, no one will even know - and believe me, there's enough natural women over here that dont pass well enough, its not a problem LOL!

The reason is no one sees all this is because it has not effected them personally as a large group yet. Being trans I see this in my own family, which is highly christian and I hear the talks about the stupid homosexual agenda they fear is going to take them over. I ask when they come for me what are you going to do? They choose to ignore it, just like the German people did of the Nazi's before. History repeats itself....you only have to bring it up too your own time.

Yep - this drives me mad too! Like LGBT people want to rule the world? I guess if we could get in on the Jewish Conspiracy, we might play a part!? LOL! What the White, Christian, Hets dont seem to get, is that no one is asking them to give up anything, or to do anything extra. They just have to treat LGBT people the same as they would anyone else. Mind you, that cause is not helped by certain LGBT people who give the impression of wanting special treatment, in the same way that some Muslims et al do. It is this insistence on special treatment which is damaging to LGBT and to ethnic/religious/cultural minority relations with the majority population - and which then breed resentment and dislike. Counterproductive or what?
E

Koneko

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to Kirei)

Post #: 9

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 11:50:16 AM

LadyEllen

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From: Stourport-England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

Lady E:
The crime commited wearing a burkha, ie full dress with only eye slits , has already been commited . I think it may have been covered on Crime Watch. Funnily enough no body can identify the criminals faces.
Sikhs are allowed to carry a dagger. They might stab you if you upset their religious sensitivities. They certainly stab one another when in dispute over who really runs the Temple.

Wonder how the US reacts to Sikhs carrying a weapon when on i/c to US flights?

You know - my religion, Asatru, also says that males should carry a sword and women a knife. Not as offensive weapons, but more like the Sikhs claim, as spiritual symbols. Sadly, my religion is not recognised - even though its the natural religion of England, so I would be arrested. Doesnt stop me from carrying a knife though.....

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to seeksfemslave)

Post #: 10

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 11:54:00 AM

LadyEllen

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From: Stourport-England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mugwump

My argument is a simple one - in a country with as diverse a population as the UK we either have to have rules that apply to everybody, or no rules at all.

Selective laws increase the current tensions and feed the anger of the lowest common denomenators on either side of the cultural/religious fence that they are 'being wronged' - hence more violence and hatred, hence more activism, hence more violence and hatred.

It's a scary future...

Absotively.

Although of course, any problem is only caused by social deprivation - isnt that right seeks!?

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to mugwump)

Post #: 11

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 11:54:05 AM

seeksfemslave

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I am fairly certain I am right that in the UK any business can refuse to serve anyone at any time. The trick is NOT to give a reason. Just refuse.

Mugwump accurately points to a major legal/social problem currently facing the UK ie special treatment for different groups.

Mugwump ?.....Really romantic name.
Call me Swampbreath

Lady E: surely only Napolitano Gentio knows about social deprivation and its consequences. He wants that we should all experience it ! What can be fairer than that !

< Message edited by seeksfemslave -- 10/10/2006 11:58:00 AM >

(in reply to mugwump)

Post #: 12

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 12:02:26 PM

mugwump

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From: uk
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no probs Swampy

i loathe the current cultural/political swing that has young, white, English men (and i used english deliberately as the same phenomenon isn't yet apparent in Wales or Scotland where you can be proud of your roots) being made to feel ashamed of their heritage.
Same thing again though... either we should all be allowed to feel pride in who we are, or we should all be made to hang our heads..

(in reply to seeksfemslave)

Post #: 13

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 2:05:07 PM

LotusSong

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http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8481731926256956057

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I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 14

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 2:24:56 PM

peterK50

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Discrimination based on race, creed or national origin is illegal, as I clearly stated in my argument. Do you bother to read them? I would not be outside defending their right to refuse to serve African- Americans, that is ILLEGAL. I'll let the Klan do that.

_____________________________

Religion Is About Seeking Knowledge, Not Knowing All The Answers.

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Post #: 15

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 2:41:31 PM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
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quote:

ORIGINAL: peterK50

Discrimination based on race, creed or national origin is illegal, as I clearly stated in my argument. Do you bother to read them? I would not be outside defending their right to refuse to serve African- Americans, that is ILLEGAL. I'll let the Klan do that.

ILLEGAL? I thought religion superseded legal. In the hypothetical example I qualified it by saying it was a religious belief. There were many Christians back in the day who used just that belief to justify the enslavement of Africans. The taxi medallion requires you to not refuse any fare, therefore it is illegal to refuse a fare carrying alcohol or requiring a guide dog. So it is just as illegal in this case to refuse fares in taxis, or didn't you comprehend that?

I want to understand your distinction, or where your personal tolerance ends.

Would support a business that didn't want to serve anyone wearing a towel on their head?

Wouldn't it be easier to refuse to serve those in wheelchairs instead of building a ramp? That situation isn't addressed by "race, creed, or national origin".

It seems you have conditions were discrimination or intolerance is okay. Please define in your world where it's okay to discriminate or exclude to accommodate religious or personal belief? Where would you selectively protest such discriminatory practices or at least find them reprehensible? Would it require you be blind in the UK or left in the snow carrying a wine bottle at the airport? Or is this just a case of selective hypocrisy?

(in reply to peterK50)

Post #: 16

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 2:49:52 PM

LadyEllen

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Mercnbeth - interesting situation that one, about "handicapped" people. The UK passed a law recently which requires shops to provide disabled access where possible (the shop has to show why it cant - ie dont want to, is not a valid reason)

Thus people in wheelchairs can now gain access to a lot of shops which they formerly couldnt. My understanding though, is that the shopkeeper is still free to decide not to serve them, which if it is so, would make fxxk all sense LOL!

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 17

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 3:18:30 PM

popeye1250

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And they told us that "Diversity" would be a good thing.
If it's so good why don't muslim countries engage in it?
Or China or India or Japan?
How's about a homosexual mayor of Damascus?

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 18

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 3:21:23 PM

LadyEllen

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From: Stourport-England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

And they told us that "Diversity" would be a good thing.
If it's so good why don't muslim countries engage in it?
Or China or India or Japan?
How's about a homosexual mayor of Damascus?

Diversity is a good thing Popeye.

As long as its respected on all sides, by all sides, and no special exceptions are made. Equitable treatment, opportunity and choice for all.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to popeye1250)

Post #: 19

RE: A Peek at a the future Muslim world... - 10/10/2006 3:24:38 PM

JerseyKrissi72

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From: Reed City, Michigan
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I never understood...why should we care about the sexual orientation of political people? I honestly could care less..so long as they are lowering MY TAXES lol

(in reply to LadyEllen)

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