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RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/17/2006 11:12:23 PM   
roomateSought


Posts: 1
Joined: 9/27/2006
Status: offline 		Where does one find themselves?  I know your hunger.  Your need.  Yet you nibble at the fringe of it, yet you do not allow the light to shine full on you.  There is no changing him, or her, or them, there is only changing you and that is damn hard.  The beginning is to see yourself, full light, head on, without flinching, every wrinkle, every flaw and every beauty.  Look full in your face.  Who are you? 

Then, can he do the same?  Not will he, he will of course try to do whatever it is that will please his beloved, the question is, can he? 

Finally once you have seen yourself, not who you want to be, or who you think others make you be, but just who you are, then you have to take an accounting, what price are you willing to pay?  You get what you pay for.  It is a very simple principle, but it is unyeilding.  How much are you willing to pay, emotionally, physically, spiritually?  To the degree you are willing to pay, to that degree you will be able to take the basic building blocks of you, once you know what they are, and form them into what makes you the best you, you can be.  Is that a dom or a sub or a slave or an Owner?  Each carries its price.

This journey does not start with your partner, it starts with you. 


(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 3:43:21 AM   
subartist4dom


Posts: 40
Status: offline 		dunno how much this will help.  I have a dom that is a nice guy and well I happen to be naturally dominant due to my past growing up and being in the military, yet around him I'm usually submissive.  At first there was some issues as to the whole bdsm thing since I strayed from it while in the army.  One of the issues we had was the fact I bite.  My master hated it since past experience taught him that biting was painful.  I knew that it was in my nature to bite and that I wouldn't be able to break that.  Once I figured out the right amount of pressure to use in my bite, my master started to come around and started to bite back.  To be truthful we are still exploring different things in and out of the life. 

A few tips that might help... first conveying feeling effectively...i know that sounds a little corny and i thought the same thing too when I heard that...but frustration can lead to a negative conveyance of feeling and basically in effect cause the other person to shy away from you.  solution...the words "I feel" can make quite a difference.  I thought that was a load of bull too until I tried it.  essentially taking a postive approach to the problem caused my master to respond in meeting my needs.  Nothing is overnight...it takes time...months in fact.   second...lead by example.  telling a guy what you like dosen't always get through.  Sometimes you have to take them and lead them in meeting your needs...sometimes more than once.  Usually the message gets across.  third...masters need to be trained too like subs.  The other tips are just to help in that.  Like all things it takes time and if givin the chance to grow the relationship will get better.  Its like a diamond in a way...when found its rough, surrounded in dirt and well dull.  Its through alot of work that it becomes the nice, shiny, polished you jewel you buy.  take your time, explore and well have fun.  this is your chance to get to know him and ultimatly yourself.

LIFE IS A JOURNEY SO HAVE FUN

(in reply to roomateSought)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 4:49:00 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		To the part where men are incapable of backing down when challenged. BS.  Same about the male ego. What world are you people living in. To the poster. There is no quick fix. Either you have tons of patience or get divorced. For some peole change comes easy for others never.

(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 5:16:52 AM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WickedlyDevine

Quick note...he does read this.....this is a mutual endeavor.  I am not trying to reprogram, I am trying to aleviate the bs he has been fed.  He desires what I do, therefore there is hope.


I have got thusfar and wanted to reply to this statement.  What is the bullshit?  That women need gentleness?  'Coddled'? - some people, some women enjoy these sensations, so they are hardly bullshit.  However they are obviously not what you desire.
 
Now your description of yourself in the beginning of your posting -

quote:

Now as time has progressed, a few relationships later, I find that although I am a dominant person in  general, in the bedroom my desire is to submit. 


Now my thought is you are getting way too caught up in how other people define words.  If it is really important that you need define what you are, concentrate on that rather than the label itself.  Define on what you are, not the name.  Now, you say you are dominant in life, and even know what you want in bed, yet you have submissive desires.  Possibly you are a dominant who enjoy bottoming in sexual desires?  You would still control the scene and behaviours, but in a submissive role.
 
Your relationship that you have is obviously very important to you.  I can understand you getting angry occasionally and thats healthy to an extent.  Frustration causes anger... nothing to be ashamed of.  But as important as your relationship is, you need to step back and decide what makes you happy and what makes you comfortable with being you.  You are obviously frustrated and in a sense, disappointed in yourself (in your own words you felt you should have been more specific in my asking of what he was into, for now I find he wants the same exact things done to him that I desire)... so now you have to remedy that.  You have to understand that as much as you may be in love with each other, people change and you may not be compatable.  Its got nothing to do with how long you have been togehter or when you got married... its a change or discovery of your relationship and its the decision you both need to make to either work on which desires are important and which ones you can do without.  And only you two can make that decision.  He hasnt the right to force you to do what you do not like and visa versa, just because of something as complicated as love.  As hard as it is... sometimes its more productive to just seperate and move on with each others own needs and not worry about the other.  Divorce is an ugly word, but it has to be done sometimes.
 
Simple thoughts
Peace and Rapture

_____________________________
.dark.



...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 6:57:35 AM   
Chatt22nooga


Posts: 44
Joined: 9/25/2006
Status: offline 		The best advice yet,Oceanna....She has no clue of what he is about other than his sissyness,If he were mine i would dress him up in your clothes and put him on the corner to make some money

(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 9:04:43 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WickedlyDevine

Quick note...he does read this.....this is a mutual endeavor.  I am not trying to reprogram, I am trying to aleviate the bs he has been fed.  He desires what I do, therefore there is hope.


I did not mean to offend you with my words. I was trying to give my own experiences with such things. I do not know you, I do not know your partner, and I do not have all the answers in the world.

I believe there are many valuable responses on this thread for you to at least consider and think about. I hope that thinking about it is not so threatening to you that you dismiss all of it out of hand. Even if it does not seem to apply many of the things said here can give you a base to launch into some type of problem solving

Take what you need and leave the rest

Good luck

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 5:05:04 PM   
WickedlyDevine


Posts: 63
Joined: 10/17/2006
Status: offline 		I find it interesting how many offers I have received for someone to come and Dom both of us, although the idea is entertaining, it is not what I seek.  Further, it concerns me that there is no respect to OUR choice of not adding another partner. I am feeling a little violated and stepped upon here, good thing I am not a BDSM virgin, otherwise that idea might have just taken me over.  I pray for those who know no better.  

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 5:10:34 PM   
MASTERRocker


Posts: 277
Joined: 9/19/2006
From: Kitchener-Waterloo, ON
Status: offline 		Sometimes it is all, in the understanding Hon - not intentional. I have no 'real' comment to make on this particular matter - as I Am complete Dom  and Mine are complete subs.

(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 5:35:50 PM   
LAMPedge


Posts: 24
Joined: 10/3/2006
Status: offline 		ok, as long as it's something you both want and are putting effort into, then more power to you and I wish you much luck and success.



(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 5:54:21 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WickedlyDevine

I find it interesting how many offers I have received for someone to come and Dom both of us, although the idea is entertaining, it is not what I seek.  Further, it concerns me that there is no respect to OUR choice of not adding another partner. I am feeling a little violated and stepped upon here, good thing I am not a BDSM virgin, otherwise that idea might have just taken me over.  I pray for those who know no better.  


I never suggested this for one

number two, if people take every piece of advice given over the internet at face value without any application or thought about what such would do to their own life... well they have larger problems than any forum could solve

People should really take responsibility for themselves

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 6:02:28 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WickedlyDevine

I find it interesting how many offers I have received for someone to come and Dom both of us, although the idea is entertaining, it is not what I seek.  Further, it concerns me that there is no respect to OUR choice of not adding another partner. I am feeling a little violated and stepped upon here, good thing I am not a BDSM virgin, otherwise that idea might have just taken me over.  I pray for those who know no better.  


Hello WickedlyDevine,

I apologize if my posts in response to yours seemed to indicate I lack respect for you or your partner, or that anything I have written makes you feel violated or stepped on.  I endeavored merely to share my opinion.

Peace out.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 6:24:34 PM   
WickedlyDevine


Posts: 63
Joined: 10/17/2006
Status: offline 		This was not directed at you, I have heard more times than not though of how I should divorce it or bring another in, here and in private mail.  I am sorry this went as directed to you, I am still gaining grasp of how to respond to certain posts.  Getting there!  I still need to figure out how to make an overall statement not directed at anyone but rather an add-on as I have been attempting, grrr.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 6:25:43 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		Ok..smiles... you can hit reply to the post that you would like to in the upper right hand corner.. and even quote a post....

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 6:30:52 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WickedlyDevine

This was not directed at you, I have heard more times than not though of how I should divorce it or bring another in, here and in private mail.  I am sorry this went as directed to you, I am still gaining grasp of how to respond to certain posts.  Getting there!  I still need to figure out how to make an overall statement not directed at anyone but rather an add-on as I have been attempting, grrr.


Fair enough, WickedlyDevine.

One approach that works for me is to use "I" more than I use "you." 

For example:

"I cannot believe how many emails I get from people insisting I should divorce him, have sex with other people, bring another Dom into the dynamic, etc.  All I wanted was some advice on how to build a D/s relationship in our marraige with my husband."

The sentence is not directed at me.  I did not do any of those negative things.  I can feel a sense of compassion for what you are going through.  I can offer my thoughts or advice or whatever.

But it also clarifies the situation you are in.

Just me, could be wrong, but there you go.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 6:46:08 PM   
angelic


Posts: 1807
Joined: 1/24/2005
Status: offline 		i have not read through the entire thread, so if this question has already been asked, forgive me, please? 

Did you not know before you got married he was this way?

_____________________________

~....and once you have tasted flight, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you long to return.~ -- Leonardo de Vinci


(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 6:51:17 PM   
Kalira


Posts: 954
Joined: 10/9/2006
From: Fort Wayne Indiana
Status: offline
quote:

He has never had a BDSM relationship, my prior relationship was a sub who had Dom tendacies, so it was pretty easy to convert him to my whims.

This is what concerns me, what you said right here. That in your previous relationship, it was easy to convert your partner to your whims.

Several others mentioned that trying to change him, to your specifications, is not a good thing. If it is not within his nature to do so, then forcing him to become something that he is not is going to destroy your relationship. ( Use this example: you are a woman. He wants to convert you to a man. You can not stop being who you are just because another wants you to be something else )
quote:

  He knows my buttons but refuses to implement them, sexually he is so submisive, he doesnt even get a clue unless I outright get mad and tell him I am bitchy because lack of intimacy.

Again. You are attempting to change something that can not be changed.
I also wanted to ask, why is it a lack of intimacy? What exactly do you define in your relationship as being intimate? Just the sex? Just the D/s?
quote:

  His problems stem deep

I hate to be harsh, but are you sure that it's all HIS problems? From what you are saying, you want it YOUR way only, and are not willing to consider his feelings in this matter.
quote:

  I am seeking information on reprogramming what he was plugged up with from the get go. 

Hmm, is he a robot? Does he have a programmable chipset? Again, it sounds like you are saying that it's your way only. I don't see a quest for information here. I see a means of discovering a way to force him to comply with what YOU want.
quote:

  Yes I do have feelings, and yes I get upset, mad, whatever, and I am entitled to those, it is not as if I brow beat the guy.


Really? You could have fooled me.
quote:

however somehow I am not getting the response I desire patiently waiting and talking until I am blue in the face 

Hm, I guess you are finding that humans are not as programmable as you thought? You think?
quote:

  it is his job and mine to meet each others needs, or at least make great attempt. 

I would agree totally. However, from the sounds of it, the only needs you are concerned about are yours.
quote:

  He desires what I do, therefore there is hope

Yes, from what you have said, he DOES DESIRE what YOU want. He's submissive in the bedroom. So are you.

Personally, I think you ...notice I said YOU, need to stop for a second and think about his position and feelings in this. If you force him to change into something that he is not, I can almost guarantee that he will harbor resentment; and in the end, it will destroy your relationship.

_____________________________

Facilius Per Partes In Cognitionem Totius Adducimur
We are more easily led part by part to an understanding of the whole.
Seneca

Damnant Quod Non Intellegunt

(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 7:29:49 PM   
WickedlyDevine


Posts: 63
Joined: 10/17/2006
Status: offline 		The bs so to speak is previous counseling he has had which specifically states women are to be treated one way and one way only.  I am opening a door to a world of which he has never entered but always desired.  I agree women and men need tlc, in the gentle form, however care taking of another involves other care, hence why we are all here.  I have no desire to force him to do anything he is uncomfortable with, however if he is educated, and open minded, he has an opportunity to try new things, finding out if they do excite and entice him.  Thus far the ideas entice him, but theory is much greater than practice at this point. 

He has been raised in a very retributive way, so much so he has been sissified to a large degree. So how do I get him past this fear?  I know he trusts me, but he does not trust himself and his own fears of receiving backlash, e3ither by me, others or in his own mind.  I know I went through something similar coming into my own when I realized I liked pain, craved it, needed it.  It took a few good Doms to get me to understand it is ok to feel and want like I do.  He has not had that benefit, so here I am, and we are.

Lets face it, we all have had bs shoved down our throats at one time or another in our lifetimes, as we get older, we are not as easy to sucuumb to it.  However, childhood can and has left ingrained processees which he is now struggling with.   My desire is for him to understand why I desire like I do, and how he can best approach this if he so chooses without fear of retribution. 

He was raised Catholic which is a  huge key, damning to hell for looking crosseyed.  His conflicts are very internal, I only hope to show that they need not be and it is ok to feel and think outside the box.

(in reply to darkinshadows)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/18/2006 9:17:53 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WickedlyDevine

He has been raised in a very retributive way, so much so he has been sissified to a
large degree. So how do I get him past this fear?  I know he trusts me, but he does not trust himself and his own fears of receiving backlash, e3ither by me, others or in his own mind. 



Hello WckedlyDevine,

You have posted a lot about what you want in your relationship with him, but I am still not understanding what he wants in his relationship with you.

I would initially state that your comments about him not wanting to hurt women, being raised catholic, etc., might be things he is using to detract from the idea you are trying to convince him of.  I personally see those sorts of comments as excuses to avoid facing an uncomfortable truth.

If it were me, I would say "sure, fine, you are a Catholic" and then continue to state my own needs and ask if the person could help me with them.

But that is just me, and I could be wrong.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/19/2006 12:34:13 AM   
WickedlyDevine


Posts: 63
Joined: 10/17/2006
Status: offline 		Ok, this is HIS perspective.......from his very own fingers...

I would like to say that I am deeply in love with "WickedlyDevine" (my wife), and because I love her so much, I want to do anything and everything I can do to fulfill her needs sexually.  BDSM is the area of her interest.  Although I know very little about BDSM I am willing to explore the realm of being her "Dom" in order to make her happy.   Granted, I am new to this and very naive concerning her needs in this aspect but it is important for me to meet her every need.  Some may say that my wife is only thinking about her needs but as her husband, part of my needs are to make her happy, and by doing so I am making myself happy.  Divorce is not an option nor is having multiple partners.  If there is anyone out there that is willing to give us any kind of good advice we are open to just about anything to get us on the right track. 



(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: HELP Please!!!! - 10/19/2006 1:56:29 AM   
canupleaseme


Posts: 775
Joined: 7/9/2006
Status: offline 		i agree with the points made that you cant change someone he could be feelin exactly the same way as you about what he wants i think the suggestion of poly sounds about the easiest solution and i have to say its always worked for me i need my other interest as i call it to keepme happy with my bdsm lifestyle different horses for different courses  

_____________________________

Proud mistress

(in reply to WickedlyDevine)
Profile   Post #: 40
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