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RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 2:12:01 PM   
ToGiveDivine


Posts: 650
Status: offline 		My point is that both parties do things to give breaks to the rich (especially since a lot of people in Washington are rich)

I'm annoyed with people saying everything the Republicans do is bad and everything the Democrats do is good (or visa versa).

The zealots are making the whole political process irrelevant and are too stuck in their notion that they are absolutely right and regurgitate everything "their" party says in attack of the other party that there is no way for intelligent discourse on what the problems are and how to solve them.

My favorites are the ones that have simple bulleted lists to solve very complex problems.  Yet, they thing the propose to "fix" impacts something else, which in turn impacts something else, which also impacts something else, and so on.

I voted for GW, I honestly feel he was trying to do what he thought was best, I also think he's screwed up several things and some things he really screwed up.  The Congress instilled him with some far reaching powers (that they were too short sighted to see at the time because heaven knows that no one would want to commit political suicide by saying, "now wait a minute" to giving him those powers so shortly after 9/11) and now people are wanting to impeach him on exercising those powers.  Right or wrong, it was Congress (both parties) that butchered the Constitution and GW said, "well damn, why not"; all the while, the Supreme Court sat back and watched it happen.

So, all 3 branches of our Government screwed up, but everyone is so busy pointing fingers and getting their base worked up and no one is seriously looking into ways to make things better.

The Democrats may gain control of both Houses of Congress in a couple of weeks and they will do things that will make their base happy (gotta think about 2008 early), but in the process they are going to screw up in other ways because they don't have the will to think what impacts to impacts to impacts that those decisions will have in the future.

On the otherhand, if the Republicans retain control, they aren't going to change anything because that would be an admission that mistakes were made (gotta think about 2008 as well) and the impacts on impacts on impacts of the current direction are going to cause us trouble.

So, the zealots can keep spouting their rhetoric all day every day, but they're about as useless as the rest of us - only more annoying.

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 2:19:14 PM   
MasterGentry


Posts: 14
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Crappy Dom said;
"I don't mind Gore but his wife is a nutcase"
Yeah, but, I like complex women, especially if they're wealthy enough to install walls full of new tools, and having a fairly fine set of buttcheeks makes her hokay-dokey with Me. ehheheeee
Gentry

(in reply to CrappyDom)
Profile   Post #: 62
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 2:21:20 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterGentry

Crappy Dom said;
"I don't mind Gore but his wife is a nutcase"
Yeah, but, I like complex women, especially if they're wealthy enough to install walls full of new tools, and having a fairly fine set of buttcheeks makes her hokay-dokey with Me. ehheheeee
Gentry


So you want to fuck Tipper.... she's not bad looking.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to MasterGentry)
Profile   Post #: 63
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 2:22:24 PM   
ToGiveDivine


Posts: 650
Status: offline 		Hey,

I just agreed she was a nutcase, I never said she didn't have a nice ass ROFL

(in reply to MasterGentry)
Profile   Post #: 64
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 2:32:44 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Oh sure, the Repubs and Dems are so "different" from each other.
Clinton told the State Dept to legalize more illegals without background checks to get them to vote as Democrats.
Clinton did nothing to secure the Mexican border.

Bush looks the other way as millions of illegals sneak into the country to work cheap for companies who donated to his campaign and want to break our laws by using cheap illegal labor.
Bush does nothing to secure the Mexican border.

Gee, that doesn't sound too "different" to me!

(in reply to ToGiveDivine)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 2:37:44 PM   
ToGiveDivine


Posts: 650
Status: offline 		Popeye,

The conversation has moved on to Tipper's fine ass - let's get with the program - ROFL

Okay, I wouldn't kick Hillary or Condi outta bed unless they wanted to do it on the floor

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 3:26:47 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ToGiveDivine

Popeye,

The conversation has moved on to Tipper's fine ass - let's get with the program - ROFL

Okay, I wouldn't kick Hillary or Condi outta bed unless they wanted to do it on the floor


A choice of doing Hillary, Condi, or Tipper?
You know,... there's a lot to be said for Masturbation!

(in reply to ToGiveDivine)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 3:41:49 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		Now let's see...

http://clinton4.nara.gov/WH/New/html/20000112_2.html

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

When was the last time the Democrats proposed tax breaks designed to benefit the top 1%


You could have ended that question at the underlined/bold section and gotten the same answer.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 3:50:08 PM   
LTRsubNW


Posts: 1604
Joined: 5/6/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ToGiveDivine

During GW's tenure in Texas, violent crime rates dropped, the economy was good, job growth was good, and he didn't screw anything up real bad.

For ANY politician, that's a reasonably good job.


Just remember, Bushes term in Texas, was Clintons term in DC.

(And THAT from a 48 year Republicrat).

(in reply to ToGiveDivine)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 3:54:41 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: ToGiveDivine

Popeye,

The conversation has moved on to Tipper's fine ass - let's get with the program - ROFL

Okay, I wouldn't kick Hillary or Condi outta bed unless they wanted to do it on the floor


A choice of doing Hillary, Condi, or Tipper?
You know,... there's a lot to be said for Masturbation!


LOL

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 3:55:03 PM   
LTRsubNW


Posts: 1604
Joined: 5/6/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: ToGiveDivine

Popeye,

The conversation has moved on to Tipper's fine ass - let's get with the program - ROFL

Okay, I wouldn't kick Hillary or Condi outta bed unless they wanted to do it on the floor


A choice of doing Hillary, Condi, or Tipper?
You know,... there's a lot to be said for Masturbation!


(And an equal amount for being blind)

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 4:18:02 PM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline 		Ah, the attempt to reconcile with his constituency for his programs directed to; "Eliminating Welfare as we know it". I'm sure all those families of 4 making less than $14k / year welcomed the ability to invest in a 401k program. Walmart workers unite!

I applauded at the time and still provide accolades for President Clinton's attempts at taking back all the benefits provided by prior Democratic administrations. He was the first to recognize the failure of these programs and the disincentive for personal industry they created.

As much as President Bush and the Republicans are in denial about the failure of Iraq, the same point of failure is not recognized by the Democrats regarding US social programs. Some have worked in the micro in the macro they are all failures.

Thank you for having me re-visit this paper concerning the topic of EITC. http://ntj.tax.org/wwtax/ntjrec.nsf/BA3F257ED45D0F4C85256AFC007F3615/$FILE/v53n4p2983.pdf

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
Profile   Post #: 72
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/23/2006 7:22:08 PM   
CrappyDom


Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline
quote:

I voted for GW, I honestly feel he was trying to do what he thought was best, I also think he's screwed up several things and some things he really screwed up.  The Congress instilled him with some far reaching powers (that they were too short sighted to see at the time because heaven knows that no one would want to commit political suicide by saying, "now wait a minute" to giving him those powers so shortly after 9/11) and now people are wanting to impeach him on exercising those powers.  Right or wrong, it was Congress (both parties) that butchered the Constitution and GW said, "well damn, why not"; all the while, the Supreme Court sat back and watched it happen.

So, all 3 branches of our Government screwed up, but everyone is so busy pointing fingers and getting their base worked up and no one is seriously looking into ways to make things better.


Let's see, it was a Republican congress that approved of a Republican Presidents choice of Republican judges, but somehow you want to lay half the blame on Democrats?

quote:

and now people are wanting to impeach him on exercising those powers.


No, I want to impeach him for maliciously manipulating intelligence to convince America to go to war against one of the only arab countries NOT involved in 9/11.

I want him impeached for not only failing to plan but failing to see reality at any point in the last three years about Iraq.  I was firmly against going into Iraq and saw this mess comming but I also believe there was a chance it COULD work but they have consistently made bad decisions and then compounded them by a refusal to deal with reality. 



(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/24/2006 7:19:32 AM   
ToGiveDivine


Posts: 650
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CrappyDom

quote:

I voted for GW, I honestly feel he was trying to do what he thought was best, I also think he's screwed up several things and some things he really screwed up.  The Congress instilled him with some far reaching powers (that they were too short sighted to see at the time because heaven knows that no one would want to commit political suicide by saying, "now wait a minute" to giving him those powers so shortly after 9/11) and now people are wanting to impeach him on exercising those powers.  Right or wrong, it was Congress (both parties) that butchered the Constitution and GW said, "well damn, why not"; all the while, the Supreme Court sat back and watched it happen.

So, all 3 branches of our Government screwed up, but everyone is so busy pointing fingers and getting their base worked up and no one is seriously looking into ways to make things better.


Let's see, it was a Republican congress that approved of a Republican Presidents choice of Republican judges, but somehow you want to lay half the blame on Democrats?

quote:

and now people are wanting to impeach him on exercising those powers.


No, I want to impeach him for maliciously manipulating intelligence to convince America to go to war against one of the only arab countries NOT involved in 9/11.

I want him impeached for not only failing to plan but failing to see reality at any point in the last three years about Iraq.  I was firmly against going into Iraq and saw this mess comming but I also believe there was a chance it COULD work but they have consistently made bad decisions and then compounded them by a refusal to deal with reality. 






My God you are one of the most politically zealous persons I've met - I bet you think Liberal Democrats walk on water.  You haven't said one thing that isn't a political talking point for extreme liberalism.  (FYI, I don't like talking points from extreme conservatism either)

You are of no help, no use, and no purpose in solving any problems this country face.  So, you just keep on licking your Democratic Master's feet and keep out of the way of those of us with the fortitude to attempt to pick and choose the better candidates regardless of party affiliation.

At least if we get it wrong, we at least have tried to make an intelligent guess as to who may better serve us.  How can you consider yourself a Dom when you have enslaved yourself to a Political Party.

I've been on both sides and I prefer the middle.  I was a staunch liberal in College, I swung to staunch Conservative once I got a real job, responsibilities, taxes, mortgage, etc.

Now I'm blessed to see that neither end of the spectrum is productive and that being in the middle, trying to choose between the few decent politicians from any party is the best course of action.

The 60's and 70's are over people - marching and chanting slogans just gets your face on the news for a short while - your 15 minutes of fame are over; get back to work and try having original thoughts to solve the problems we face.

(in reply to CrappyDom)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/24/2006 8:16:36 AM   
CrappyDom


Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline 		So your only response is to call me an "extreme liberal" eh?  No counter to anything I say, no facts, just insults.

And you call ME partisan?

When was the last time you heard a liberal call someone a traitor for daring to question whether invading a country without a plan might be a bad idea?  This country would be better off if us "left wing" liberals HAD been listened to.  We might actually see Osama's head on a pike and Afghanistan on its way to becoming a functioning nation.

So, lets try this again, you come up with well reasoned factual responses to me and we can have a discussion or you can prance around like a child and call me names, the choice is yours.

(in reply to ToGiveDivine)
Profile   Post #: 75
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/24/2006 8:24:54 AM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline 		 
Hello A/all,

Matt Taibbi's article on Congress in Rolling Stone made a good point.  When Congress fails to allocate money to support a program, when the new year rolls around the same money allocated the year previously is allocated automatically.  The acronym for this is a CR, but I cannot for the life of me remember what that stands for and the article is in my dock bag in the car.

So while Bush did sign the "No Child Left Behind" and a plethora of other bills, he failed to provide them with much money to actually do anything.  Then the year ends, Congress fails to provide a budget, the same small amount of money is given to the bill, it fails to produce any noticeable result.

Yet Republican supporters think that because he signed the bill into law it meant he actually cared whether children got left behind.

The problem is not that President Bush signs bills or not, it is that he either issues signing statements or ensures that no money is allocated to make the bill a workable reality.

Just me, etc.

Sinergy


_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to CrappyDom)
Profile   Post #: 76
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/24/2006 8:47:43 AM   
ToGiveDivine


Posts: 650
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CrappyDom

So your only response is to call me an "extreme liberal" eh?  No counter to anything I say, no facts, just insults.

And you call ME partisan?

When was the last time you heard a liberal call someone a traitor for daring to question whether invading a country without a plan might be a bad idea?  This country would be better off if us "left wing" liberals HAD been listened to.  We might actually see Osama's head on a pike and Afghanistan on its way to becoming a functioning nation.

So, lets try this again, you come up with well reasoned factual responses to me and we can have a discussion or you can prance around like a child and call me names, the choice is yours.


What about the Vietnam Vets that were DRAFTED, sent for a year to a place they didn't want to go and the extreme liberals spit on them, called them baby killers, etc.

There is ugly on all sides of the extreme spectrum, but you only want to spot the ugly from one side.

You have never specifically answered any of my questions, you started the personal attacks on me and you've spouted rhetoric from your high horse.  You're just mad because I called you out for what you are and it pisses you off.

Trust me, I won't lose one second of sleep caring if you like me or not; but if you are going to blab all your extreme left-wing gobbledygook (I don't like right-wing gobbledygook either); don't get all pissy when I don't think it isn't helpful, important, or necessary.

One thing I've notice, and several other posters also, is that anytime someone states an opinion contrary to your own, you attack them.  That makes you small and pathetic in my book - the fact that you have the word "crappy" in your screen name is quite appropriate.

Do us all a favor, grow up already - embrace other ideas as that is the only way to find all aspects of a problem as well as all aspects for a solution.


< Message edited by ToGiveDivine -- 10/24/2006 8:48:42 AM >

(in reply to CrappyDom)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/24/2006 8:51:43 AM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ToGiveDivine

One thing I've notice, and several other posters also, is that anytime someone states an opinion contrary to your own, you attack them. 



"Methinks she doth protest too much."  William Shakespeare

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to ToGiveDivine)
Profile   Post #: 78
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/24/2006 8:52:31 AM   
ToGiveDivine


Posts: 650
Status: offline 		Dude,

That's a tactic that politicans have been using for decades and it's quite effective - all the benefits of looking good with none of the troubles of having to accomplish something you don't want to.

Those politicians that can't get re-elected after their first term never learned to apply this technique to their advantage.

(in reply to Sinergy)
Profile   Post #: 79
RE: Defeat looms for Bush and the Neo-cons - 10/24/2006 8:55:32 AM   
ToGiveDivine


Posts: 650
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

quote:

ORIGINAL: ToGiveDivine

One thing I've notice, and several other posters also, is that anytime someone states an opinion contrary to your own, you attack them. 



"Methinks she doth protest too much."  William Shakespeare

Sinergy


She?!?!?  (Think you need glasses - ROFL)

Not really, but after several forum posts of CrappyDom getting shitty with me for no reason you just get fed up and want to see how he likes having shit thrown back at him.

Not to mention there is some entertainment value for everyone else - I can just picture the vein in his forehead throbbing - LOL

(in reply to Sinergy)
Profile   Post #: 80
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