Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

RE: Saddam Hussein executed


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> RE: Saddam Hussein executed Page: <<   < prev  3 4 [5] 6 7   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 11:49:05 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Evidently there are people who think Mass Murderers shouldn't be punished.
Life in prison is too good for some people.
Mark Twain  wrote that he saw his "first public hanging" at the age of 12.
I think executions should be public. If my Taxdollars are paying for it I should have the right to watch it if I so choose.
If you don't want to watch things like that then don't.
If you believe in Censorship then remember that it can extend into other areas of your life as well.
I don't believe in Censorship by *my* govt.


That is a straw man attempt to defend the way you posted your views. It is one thing to agree with executing someone, it is another to be distasteful about it in a way to upset those who do not agree with killing people..

Description of a straw man so you can see how you painted my position on punishing murderers falsely to bolster your views

quote:

The Straw Man fallacy is committed when a person simply ignores a person's actual position and substitutes a distorted, exaggerated or misrepresented version of that position. This sort of "reasoning" has the following pattern:
  1. Person A has position X.
  2. Person B presents position Y (which is a distorted version of X).
  3. Person B attacks position Y.
  4. Therefore X is false/incorrect/flawed.

This sort of "reasoning" is fallacious because attacking a distorted version of a position simply does not constitute an attack on the position itself. One might as well expect an attack on a poor drawing of a person to hurt the person.
http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/straw-man.html

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 81
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 12:44:11 PM   
WyrdRich


Posts: 1733
Joined: 1/3/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: justheather


quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

I'm just dissapointed that they didn't show him dropping.

Wow, popeye. That makes me feel sad.


       The cell phone video that was leaked shows the drop.  I slept just fine after watching it and so did my wife. The third post in the 'Saddam End' thread has the link for those who are strong enough to face the reality.

       I don't know of any links to his collection of death videos and I imagine the details of the mass graves of his victims are 'sanitized' for our protection. 

(in reply to justheather)
Profile   Post #: 82
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 1:02:51 PM   
WyrdRich


Posts: 1733
Joined: 1/3/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

I do not know what the point of this is other than to revolt people that do not share your sense of fun and entertainment. I really do not understand it. You know we are revolted by it, yet you get a thrill out of pushing your virilent bloodlust in our face... I just will never get some people



         The easy answer to this is;  Hello....  Sadist.... but I think we can do better than that.

       This is the reality.  This is putting the worm on your own hook.  Those of us who support such an ultimate sanction need to look it right in the face.  Can you look at the photos of Saddam's victims and never waver in your belief that the death penalty is wrong?

    

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 83
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 1:03:44 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

quote:

ORIGINAL: justheather


quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

I'm just dissapointed that they didn't show him dropping.

Wow, popeye. That makes me feel sad.


      The cell phone video that was leaked shows the drop.  I slept just fine after watching it and so did my wife. The third post in the 'Saddam End' thread has the link for those who are strong enough to face the reality.

      I don't know of any links to his collection of death videos and I imagine the details of the mass graves of his victims are 'sanitized' for our protection. 


Not going to defend the brutality of Saddam, but what happened in Fallujah was just as nasty as whatever Saddam did, and I do not see you screaming for justice over that

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to WyrdRich)
Profile   Post #: 84
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 1:08:35 PM   
james66


Posts: 28
Joined: 12/10/2004
Status: offline 		where did i say I support the US in taking out Saddam and not other tyrants?


I'm waiting.....

come on..... 

< Message edited by james66 -- 12/31/2006 1:18:58 PM >

(in reply to meatcleaver)
Profile   Post #: 85
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 1:13:14 PM   
WyrdRich


Posts: 1733
Joined: 1/3/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Not going to defend the brutality of Saddam, but what happened in Fallujah was just as nasty as whatever Saddam did, and I do not see you screaming for justice over that



        Not sure which specific incident you're referring to but I guess it involves awful misconduct by our troops, currently being prosecuted by the military.  Apples and oranges.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 86
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 1:14:40 PM   
james66


Posts: 28
Joined: 12/10/2004
Status: offline 		fair enough...and you may well be right...or wrong.....but try injecting some original thoughts or even an opinion into this....

I beieve this all has to do with a moral stance...nothing more or less....that coupled with the number of people who have to sacrifice their lives......there are just innocent people here really....you're not telling me the 100.000 iraqi soldiers who died in the first war chose the position they were in...or those who faced iran in the 80s.....

the fact is it was all so little too late......as always.....

and the only 'perfect' action...the one that always seems to work in our comfortable lives is just turning away....

ps. lets have a go at the allies that needlessly bombed..what was it 40.000 in Dresden...I've heard 70.000....somewhere in between.....

thank God for america...thats all I say

< Message edited by james66 -- 12/31/2006 1:23:01 PM >

(in reply to ScooterTrash)
Profile   Post #: 87
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 1:22:06 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Julia, everyone's entitled to their own opinion.
I am not in favor of any type of Censorship.
Why should some faceless beaurocrat in the govt. or a Network Executive somewhere decide what (I) or anyone else can or should watch?
Once you start going down that Censorship road it gets to be a very slippery slope.
As for your "Strawman" argument I'm no more "bloodthirsty" than anyone else.
I just want to see a monster like Saddam get his just desserts.
Something like that (should) be made public as a warning to any potential future monsters like Saddam.
If you don't want to watch it then no-one's forcing you to are they?
I knew a U.S. Army Colonal who just after WW2 was stationed in Japan and was on "Hanging Duty" hanging Jap War Criminals.
He said it was "good duty" as they'd start early in the morning and be finished up by noontime and would head over to the Officer's Club every afternoon and get drunk.
He said it lasted for 4 months.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 88
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 1:25:24 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Not going to defend the brutality of Saddam, but what happened in Fallujah was just as nasty as whatever Saddam did, and I do not see you screaming for justice over that



      Not sure which specific incident you're referring to but I guess it involves awful misconduct by our troops, currently being prosecuted by the military.  Apples and oranges.


No, it involves the use of napalm type substances on the city of Fallujah while civilians were there, including children

http://www.sundaymirror.co.uk/news/tm_objectid=14920109&method=full&siteid=106694&headline=fallujah-napalmed-name_page.html

Here is a link to google images using the search term "fallujah napalm"
http://images.google.com/images?q=fallujah+napalm&hl=en&lr=&rls=HPIC,HPIC:2005-25,HPIC:en&sourceid=tipimg

Saddam had his troops kill people with outlawed weapons because they were rebelling and siding with Iran and a security risk, I do not agree with that brutality whatsoever, whatever the motivation.... just like to do not agree with imprisoning people and torturing them.

The US used outlawed weapons on a civilian population (Fallujah), this is just as bad as what Saddam did to the Kurds. We also have detained and systematically tortured people. That makes our leaders no better than Saddam

< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 12/31/2006 1:27:31 PM >

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to WyrdRich)
Profile   Post #: 89
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 1:34:08 PM   
WyrdRich


Posts: 1733
Joined: 1/3/2005
Status: offline 		       Did you notice where the article said the US never signed that treaty?

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 90
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 1:36:59 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		Did Iraq sign a treaty before it used those weapons on the Kurds?

Just because a treaty was not signed does it make it moral to use a substance like this on civilians?

Under that logic it is ok for Saddam to use whatever he wanted on civilians as long as he had not specifically agreed not to... what utter horse shit.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to WyrdRich)
Profile   Post #: 91
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 1:48:59 PM   
james66


Posts: 28
Joined: 12/10/2004
Status: offline 		"The US used outlawed weapons on a civilian population (Fallujah), this is just as bad as what Saddam did to the Kurds. We also have detained and systematically tortured people. That makes our leaders no better than Saddam"

the difference is, our leaders are democratically elected. its no excuse, and in some sick way, a sad thing. but it happens daily. and why? beacuse we beleive our leaders actually want the best for all and sundry. just take a look at the reports amnesty have on their site. saddam's hanging should be a footnote and not a headline. there are other things to talk about....other people who need the magnifying glass pointed at them.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 92
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 2:30:52 PM   
WyrdRich


Posts: 1733
Joined: 1/3/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Did Iraq sign a treaty before it used those weapons on the Kurds?

Just because a treaty was not signed does it make it moral to use a substance like this on civilians?

Under that logic it is ok for Saddam to use whatever he wanted on civilians as long as he had not specifically agreed not to... what utter horse shit.


   No, Julia, it was a snarky comment.  I'd expect you to be as expert in those as you are in the Straw Man (or are those tactics perfectly acceptable when you use them?)

      Napalm is a nasty weapon.  Even nastier when it needs to be used against enemies who hide among civilians.  They were not the primary target.  War really is Hell.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 93
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 2:38:18 PM   
justheather


Posts: 1532
Joined: 10/4/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

quote:

ORIGINAL: justheather


quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

I'm just dissapointed that they didn't show him dropping.

Wow, popeye. That makes me feel sad.


       The cell phone video that was leaked shows the drop.  I slept just fine after watching it and so did my wife.

That's great for you and your wife.
I said it made me feel sad, and it still does make me feel sad, whether or not you slept well after watching it.

quote:

The third post in the 'Saddam End' thread has the link for those who are strong enough to face the reality.

(Emphasis mine)

That's one way to put it.
quote:


       I don't know of any links to his collection of death videos and I imagine the details of the mass graves of his victims are 'sanitized' for our protection. 


I dont understand what this has to do with whether or not a person wants to watch another person's execution. Was it said to point out that Saddam was a ruthless killer who watched others die? Those of us who do not rejoice at his killing were already aware of that fact, and we still didnt have a desire to watch.

_____________________________

I want the scissors to be sharp
And the table perfectly level
When you cut me out of my life
And paste me in that book you always carry.
-Billy Collins

(in reply to WyrdRich)
Profile   Post #: 94
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 3:18:50 PM   
adaddysgirl


Posts: 1093
Joined: 3/2/2004
From: Syracuse, NY
Status: offline 		This is a clip from an article from Insight Online, as reported by John Powers:

"There was no end to the gruesome creativity of Saddam's henchmen. As reported by Insight's Timothy W. Meier, Saddam's methods included using hammers to break bones, ripping out fingernails, amputating limbs with a chain saw, crucifixion, throwing live victims in acid baths and ovens, cutting loose wild dogs to attack victims, raping women in the presence of their children and husbands, cutting off a penis or a breast, and stripping children naked and forcing their parents to watch as they were stung by hornets and scorpions. The graves contain evidence of these and other sadistic crimes.

Some of Saddam's victims escaped to tell their tales on the day his statue was torn down in Baghdad. The USAID report contains three survivor accounts from mass executions outside Mahawil in the south of Iraq.

The survivors all describe being taken into custody without a reason being given. They describe seeing women and children also in custody, all of them haphazardly blindfolded. Once they were herded into holding areas they could see a pile of tires set on fire and were ordered to run past these.

Some of the women, children and elderly men were tripped or fell near the fire and were unceremoniously beaten to death with pipes or thrown into the blazing tires to burn alive. All of the survivors who escaped their would-be executioners had been shot and partially buried, crawling away to their homes under cover of dark and living thereafter in hiding."

In my opinion, Saddam was a monster with no regard at all for human life.  i rejoiced when he was captured and i rejoice at his execution.  And to be honest, i could give a hoot of what others think of me for it....those who don't agree, who don't like it, nor those who don't respect me for it.
 
And to all the 'mourners'...God forbid if anything like the above should happen to you or your loved ones.  i really hope you have the open mind to feel sorrow for their perpetrator as well.  Some may feel a little different if their kids or family members endured such torture and torment.  i only hope that these victims' survivors can feel some degree of justice through all of this atrocity.
 
And as far as Bush....well, i'm sure he was well aware of what could be exposed when he caught the guy.  If unethical practices come out, so be it.  He will be dealt with accordingly when the time comes.

So excuse me all if i don't share your compassion for such a barbarian.  i would have had no problem with his execution being televised.  Others would not have had to watch it if they didn't want to. 
 
And i hope that if i ever go on a spree and throw some bombs in a place that kills a couple of thousand innocent adults and children, that while i'm on death row, you peeps will be trying to get me off of there.  i'd really appreciate the support.  Afterall, i don't deserve to die for that, do i?
 
DG

(in reply to WyrdRich)
Profile   Post #: 95
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 4:26:23 PM   
FirmhandKY


Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline 		Give em hell, girl!  

Ya ain't alone:

    Percentage of respondents in favor of executing Saddam Hussein:

    USA: 82%
    Great Britain: 69%
    France: 58%
    Germany: 53%
    Spain: 51%
    Italy: 46%

FirmKY


_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to adaddysgirl)
Profile   Post #: 96
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 5:10:32 PM   
adaddysgirl


Posts: 1093
Joined: 3/2/2004
From: Syracuse, NY
Status: offline 		Thanks Firm.....and for the stats.  i had not seen them yet. 
 
DG

(in reply to FirmhandKY)
Profile   Post #: 97
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 5:22:25 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		LOL, well, just call me "Bloodlust Popeye."

(in reply to adaddysgirl)
Profile   Post #: 98
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 9:53:34 PM   
sissifytoserve


Posts: 1016
Joined: 8/30/2006
Status: offline 		This sums up the WHOLE Saddam Saga.....long before these FALSE PATRIOTS who
scream "rah rah" Saddam is dead" Hoooray!!" ever would even begin to THINK for themselves.

God forbid!! FOX NEWS can do the THINKING FOR US!!

Saddam Hussein: The real story

http://www.bushflash.com/thanks.html



< Message edited by sissifytoserve -- 12/31/2006 10:02:23 PM >

_____________________________

A great mind must be androgynous
Samuel Coleridge

The uniting of the feminine and the masculine is the highest form of human development Carl Jung

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 99
RE: Saddam Hussein executed - 12/31/2006 9:58:28 PM   
sissifytoserve


Posts: 1016
Joined: 8/30/2006
Status: offline 		The war was always MEANT to cause a MASSIVE civil war and to destabilize the region.

This image sums up everything when it comes to sleeping, dumbed down, brainwashed Americans...


http://www.rense.com/1.imagesH/saddaexxx.jpg





< Message edited by sissifytoserve -- 12/31/2006 10:00:32 PM >

_____________________________

A great mind must be androgynous
Samuel Coleridge

The uniting of the feminine and the masculine is the highest form of human development Carl Jung

(in reply to sissifytoserve)
Profile   Post #: 100
Page:   <<   < prev  3 4 [5] 6 7   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> RE: Saddam Hussein executed Page: <<   < prev  3 4 [5] 6 7   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.093