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RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 1/29/2007 10:58:40 PM

CalliopePurple

Posts: 2539
Joined: 11/29/2004
From: SeaTac area
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DigitBox

Not all MtF transsexuals are feminine. Some are butch, some are more neutral. The reason is that gender identity does not dictate behaviour. If it did then my mother should be a man.

And not all FtMs are masculine. Myself being case in point.

_____________________________

Kimi ni aitakute dare yori mo aitakute
hajimete kimi ni atta hoshizora no shita de.
Kimi ni tsutaetai todokanai omoi demo
boku no kokoro wa mada kimi o sagashiteiru.

Gackt - Kimi ni Aitakute

(in reply to DigitBox)

Post #: 21

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 1/30/2007 1:39:11 PM

Slipstreme

Posts: 817
Joined: 1/1/2006
Status: offline

My slave is a MTF. I am most likely an FTM, right now, just really, really gender confused. :P

I have no gender preference, but I have found my family for life.

_____________________________

Living the Dichotomy

Painslut? How about "Endorphin Junkie"?

For information about "the furry thing" please check out my profile journal entry for: 1/17/2006

Alpha of a leather family of four. Master to the slave z.

(in reply to DigitBox)

Post #: 22

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 1/30/2007 2:55:09 PM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

Just for illustrative purposes, this was what happened last night; I’m not naming profile IDs though some might be able to work it out. This sub guy joined quite recently, and seemed ideal to me. Good looking, interesting, not going on about sexual proclivities all the while, similar interests etc – you get the idea. So, we arranged to meet last night, as I was down in his part of the country for work anyway. We met up as arranged – (yes ladies, he showed up! – big plus point) – with the plan as far as I was concerned to go out for a meal and a chat, nothing more.

We drank a coffee, as we’d each just arrived in the place – a four hours drive for me, an hour or so for him, and talked for ten minutes or so as we drank. Halfway through this conversation he asked, “are you female or TS?” at which I was a bit taken back as its mentioned in my profile, (obliquely perhaps, but plenty have worked it out so its not that difficult!), and had mentioned my status several times in threads since he’d joined.

Its not a problem for me though, so I confirmed that yes, I’m TS. We carried on talking and finished our coffee. He then said he had to go and move his car as it wasn’t parked in the best place. That was that. I waited for a half hour then sent him a text along the lines of “I guess you’re not coming back then?” No answer. Well, I waited a while longer and then went and ate alone, as usual. When I got back to the hotel, I sent another text asking for at least an explanation, if he thought I deserved one? Nothing.

My opinion, despite the short “incompatible sorry” mail waiting for when I got home tonight, is that yet again here we have the usual thing going on. TS means “bloke in a dress” whatever one looks like, whatever one does, however one behaves etc. And furthermore, that being TS means that one can be treated like shit, and deserves to be treated like shit.

Thus endeth the lesson

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to Slipstreme)

Post #: 23

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 1/30/2007 6:10:28 PM

mellian

Posts: 211
Joined: 9/6/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: demistress
I generally dislike sissys, and gender archetypes. My dislike I am sure springs from a general resentment of fighting my whole life as a dominant, outdoorsy, and rough and tumble female. From the games and toys as a kid, sports as a teenager, and a career in IT, I have had my gender held against me my whole life, but I am and will always be a woman, even when I strap on a dick. LOL

I have had and still occasionally have my gender used against for various of reasons. It is quite annoying and those that do such can just frak themselves, and they usually do by acting that way like my ex who use my gender when she tried to get people against me or certaint jobs who drop like a rock without explaining why at all due to probation laws.

quote:

Just as an FYI if someone with a dick identifies themselves as female on a profile, I consider that a lie.

That is just one of the stupid bullshit nonsense transsexuals have to deal with. The human mind and brain is up here, not down there between the legs. :rolleyes:

-mellian

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Since my pic link doesn't work, here is my profile:

http://www.collarme.com/bdsm/v/50276/details.htm

(in reply to demistress)

Post #: 24

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 1/30/2007 6:16:20 PM

mellian

Posts: 211
Joined: 9/6/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MissyRane

The problem I have with the ts gender whatever people I have met (they aint many here) are that they're so TRYING and they're so fake that it pisses me off, M to F are just so feminine and fake that it makes you want to throw up..but if they're able to act normal then I'm cool with it

Tell me about it, drives me to the wall when I see other trans individuals going to the extremes and following stereotypes. I can maybe understand it soon after coming it, still getting use it and developing their own sense of style and personality, but after a few years...hmmm no. I tend to just avoid them like I avoid anyone who seem fake, unreal, and not being themselves. Best way for a trans person to "pass" is to just be themselves as well not caring if they "pass" or care what others think.

-mellian

_____________________________

Since my pic link doesn't work, here is my profile:

http://www.collarme.com/bdsm/v/50276/details.htm

(in reply to MissyRane)

Post #: 25

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 1/30/2007 6:19:27 PM

mellian

Posts: 211
Joined: 9/6/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sting516

i find this thread very interesting, as i've been speaking with one who wishes to feminize me to the point of implants...and probably beyond at some point...still got a way to go before we get to that point, as she wants me to lose weight first...hopefully i can do that...it's not something i've ever been good at.

That is a good example of person who is not a transsexual and should be kept away by any surgeries. Sorry my dear, implants, hormones and SRS are not for the fetishist.

-mellian

_____________________________

Since my pic link doesn't work, here is my profile:

http://www.collarme.com/bdsm/v/50276/details.htm

(in reply to sting516)

Post #: 26

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 1/30/2007 10:07:08 PM

DigitBox

Posts: 154
Joined: 3/18/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

My opinion, despite the short “incompatible sorry” mail waiting for when I got home tonight, is that yet again here we have the usual thing going on. TS means “bloke in a dress” whatever one looks like, whatever one does, however one behaves etc. And furthermore, that being TS means that one can be treated like shit, and deserves to be treated like shit.

Thus endeth the lesson

E

Sorry to hear that things didn't work out.

I think I've become really jaded with being trans and meeting with potential partners. For me I'm at the point where they are going to have to prove their sincere. Because otherwise I'm going to assume that they are going to inevitably have issues.

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 27

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/1/2007 12:06:45 PM

ToGiveDivine

Posts: 650
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

Just for illustrative purposes, this was what happened last night; I’m not naming profile IDs though some might be able to work it out. This sub guy joined quite recently, and seemed ideal to me. Good looking, interesting, not going on about sexual proclivities all the while, similar interests etc – you get the idea. So, we arranged to meet last night, as I was down in his part of the country for work anyway. We met up as arranged – (yes ladies, he showed up! – big plus point) – with the plan as far as I was concerned to go out for a meal and a chat, nothing more.

We drank a coffee, as we’d each just arrived in the place – a four hours drive for me, an hour or so for him, and talked for ten minutes or so as we drank. Halfway through this conversation he asked, “are you female or TS?” at which I was a bit taken back as its mentioned in my profile, (obliquely perhaps, but plenty have worked it out so its not that difficult!), and had mentioned my status several times in threads since he’d joined.

Its not a problem for me though, so I confirmed that yes, I’m TS. We carried on talking and finished our coffee. He then said he had to go and move his car as it wasn’t parked in the best place. That was that. I waited for a half hour then sent him a text along the lines of “I guess you’re not coming back then?” No answer. Well, I waited a while longer and then went and ate alone, as usual. When I got back to the hotel, I sent another text asking for at least an explanation, if he thought I deserved one? Nothing.

My opinion, despite the short “incompatible sorry” mail waiting for when I got home tonight, is that yet again here we have the usual thing going on. TS means “bloke in a dress” whatever one looks like, whatever one does, however one behaves etc. And furthermore, that being TS means that one can be treated like shit, and deserves to be treated like shit.

Thus endeth the lesson

E

I made comments before of the subset of TS people that go on shows like Jerry Springer to get their 15 minutes of fame and they are just so campy and over the top that alot of people have a tendency to stereotype the entire group. Alexis Arquette is a perfect example - talk about wanting attention - any kind of attention.

People get a preconceived notion of a group based on what people see off the Television.

I have really only conversed with one TS that I know of (actually, I'm replying to her now) and she's just a really nice person; regardless of what she was, or what she is, or this-that-or-the-other.

It doesn't matter who you are; finding the right match is just very difficult. I've read alot of posts of people who thought they'd found the one, and then ...

I think if you polled alot of women, you'd see that what the guy did to Lady Ellen (or some variation) isn't all the uncommon.

Bottom line, he's a jerk - she didn't deserve to be treated that way, no matter the reason. He was probably some wanker that just wanted to meet a TS because he would have had to know beforehand - she's not shy about who she is and makes regular references.

I had read through a couple of dozen of LadyEllen's posts before I came across one where she talked about being a TS. Before that, I didn't know and now, I don't care. She's a human being like all the rest of us, with just a more interesting story to tell.

It's like the person with 6 fingers on one hand, the big purple birth mark on their face, or something like that - it's something you have to see through in order to really get to know the other person - some people can do it and others can't.

_____________________________

These are my opinions - which may differ from your opinions. They may be right and just as equally wrong.

Beware, author is often sarcastic in his replies - most often, no sincere offense is intended.

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 28

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/1/2007 4:16:34 PM

NikkiAnn

Posts: 64
Joined: 5/7/2006
From: Redford, MI (near Detroit)
Status: offline

LadyEllen and ToGiveDevine and all the rest too,

I am sure that there are many men, out there who treat others poorly. Please don't think that that is the majority. Most are pretty thoughtful (I hope, anyway). I have been reading all the threads to my original question and it seems more people that I first thought care more about the person more than where they came from or their journey. This has been very encouraging to me and I appreciate all the positive comments. One thing I am Not, is exaggerated, too much or flamboyant. I am very self-aware of how I present myself. One of my biggest hopes is to just be myself and not stand out in a crowd as far as appearance and behavior goes. I think I am doing OK in that regard. I seem to be accepted everywhere I go now and that is a plus, as I get closer to my May date of beginning to live my life 24/7. I just want to thank all who have been so nice and taken the time to reply to this post.

Nikki Anne

_____________________________

DANCE as though no one is watching,
LOVE as though you have never been hurt before,
SING as though no one can hear you,
LIVE as though heaven is on earth.--Souza

(in reply to ToGiveDivine)

Post #: 29

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/1/2007 4:48:54 PM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

Hi NA

Sounds like youre going to do well.

The best of luck with it all, and dont hesitate to ask advice if you need anything more, or just need someone to talk to OK? Even with all the advantages you have in terms of appearance and blending in, there will bad days as well as good; life goes on.

One thought; I take it you have done some voice training to achieve a female voice? Have you also given thought to those little ouches, sneezes and so on that come out involuntarily?

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to NikkiAnn)

Post #: 30

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/1/2007 4:52:15 PM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

TGD - as ever, thank you.

Ladies, if youre ever up in Illinois or live there, then please check out TGD OK? He's a wonderful, wonderful guy. Not just because of his post here, but because of so many instances when he's shown that he's intelligent, educated, well mannered, sensitive and sensible. Well worth the time!

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to ToGiveDivine)

Post #: 31

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/1/2007 7:45:56 PM

sting516

Posts: 505
Joined: 9/4/2004
From: long island, ny
Status: offline

so the next time you feel someone put you down for what you feel you are, refer to this post for it's compassion

quote:

ORIGINAL: mellian

quote:

ORIGINAL: sting516

i find this thread very interesting, as i've been speaking with one who wishes to feminize me to the point of implants...and probably beyond at some point...still got a way to go before we get to that point, as she wants me to lose weight first...hopefully i can do that...it's not something i've ever been good at.

That is a good example of person who is not a transsexual and should be kept away by any surgeries. Sorry my dear, implants, hormones and SRS are not for the fetishist.

-mellian

(in reply to mellian)

Post #: 32

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/1/2007 8:28:25 PM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

Sorry Sting, but so far I'm in agreement with Mellian - you seem more interested in the sexual side of it all, and if thats the case then you will likely count yourself amongst many fetishists who have worked their way through the system to achieve some sort of transition, only to regret it later. Regret it deeply.

Transition is little to do with sexuality, if anything. Its to do with rectifying a psychosocial mismatch with physical gender in the main. No medical or psychological professional worth his/her salt will enable what you are talking about, although of course with some less reputable providers, money always talks.

But, giving you the benefit of the doubt in what is a safe, anonymous setting, perhaps you could correct us on our misunderstanding of your motives?

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to sting516)

Post #: 33

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/1/2007 9:27:46 PM

mellian

Posts: 211
Joined: 9/6/2004
Status: offline

While I apologize for sounding like a bitch, but what I said still true and I feel strongly about it along with many transsexuals who have delt with the stress, frustrations, discrimination, bullshit, and so on from rest of the world because the some of the first things that comes to their mind when the word transsexual is mentioned is a crossdresser, transvestite, jerry springer, deceiver, sissies, pervert, mentally deranged, wolf in sheep clothing, fetish, "forced" feminization, and list goes on, along with other things depending on individuals insecurities and ignorance. That would just get worse if they are allowed to take hormones, implants, SRS and so on, and even more so again when many of those face life post-SRS. There is some known cases of crossdressers who thought they were a transsexual, someone that wanted to be a transsexual for some weird reason, and doing it for sexual reasons, many seek to transistion back, some commit suicide realizing how they frak their lives up, and some few have been using poster child by the transphobic to show why SRS should be banned and trans people in general hospitalized because they are sick and deranged.

Of course, this view is only in regards to the medical stuff, but legal rights wise gender identity and gender expression which would cover all trans individuals as everyone should have the right to be themselves and do what they like as long doesn't actually negatively affecting and harming others.

-mellian

< Message edited by mellian -- 2/1/2007 9:28:04 PM >

_____________________________

Since my pic link doesn't work, here is my profile:

http://www.collarme.com/bdsm/v/50276/details.htm

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 34

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/1/2007 11:29:11 PM

DigitBox

Posts: 154
Joined: 3/18/2006
Status: offline

Sting.

You fit the description of an Autogynophile.

Given that, the medical community will really be hesitant to help you, and will make you wait longer to get what you want.

Without reputable medical support who are keeping your health as primary concern you could end up really messing your self up and/or having regrets.

(in reply to sting516)

Post #: 35

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/1/2007 11:49:00 PM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

Autogynophile - what a word that is! Almost makes me wish I was one, so I could use it more in conversation!

Thing is, for me, the whole SRS thing was never that important. What was important is that I could be who I am, be seen as who I am and be treated for who I am, socially and professionally.

I dont know what others' ideas are? Personally I'm always a bit wary of people who are straight off the bat, hell bent on SRS, you know? The ones like this I have come across, seem to think that surgery down there will automatically make others regard them as female, and I find that a strange idea.

Until recently, the whole SRS thing was still not that important to me. Now it seems like, not so much a next logical step, but something to finish the job properly? I'm not bothered about whats down there particularly for myself, but its rather like the social transition, that its important to pass, and even more important for any hope of a relationship really.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to DigitBox)

Post #: 36

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/2/2007 1:09:18 AM

DigitBox

Posts: 154
Joined: 3/18/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

Autogynophile - what a word that is! Almost makes me wish I was one, so I could use it more in conversation!

Thing is, for me, the whole SRS thing was never that important. What was important is that I could be who I am, be seen as who I am and be treated for who I am, socially and professionally.

I dont know what others' ideas are? Personally I'm always a bit wary of people who are straight off the bat, hell bent on SRS, you know? The ones like this I have come across, seem to think that surgery down there will automatically make others regard them as female, and I find that a strange idea.

Until recently, the whole SRS thing was still not that important to me. Now it seems like, not so much a next logical step, but something to finish the job properly? I'm not bothered about whats down there particularly for myself, but its rather like the social transition, that its important to pass, and even more important for any hope of a relationship really.

E

Yeah Blanchard's little pet theory is quite a mouthful to pronounce. I've met him and he is really defensive of his research. He's a very prickly guy personality wise.

When I take the transsexual purity tests on Anne Lawrence's website I come up as an 'androphile' which isn't suprising. But I actually don't believe the research is valid, and relies to heavily on linking gender transition with sexual orientation. Still the gender fetishists who want to seek erotic thrills through body modifications to femminize themselves do fit the profile of an autogynophile. Just the autogynophile is seeking SRS. There are trans women who do identify themselves as AG. Some are very militant about it too.

Sadly too many legit TS women get stamped as AG in the gender clinics and so their treatment timeline is delayed or even denied.

I know what you mean about being abivilent about the anatomy down below the wasteline. In my early 20's I felt that I could make do without surgery even though in my early teens I had wanted it. But eventually I decided I needed it to feel complete. And to be able to do things like have a regular boyfriend, as well as being able to use the change rooms at the local swimming pool.

Ultimately though my goal since my late teens and early twenties, when I finally sorted out what I was feeling was to live full time as a woman. That was driven by my sense of self not by an erotic impulse. Being a trans teen is hell, especially prior to the availability of the internet and with phobic and controlling family, and a school full of hatefull sexually paranoid kids.

Anyhow part of my gender journey was to sort out if what I felt was merely a sexual fetish or if it was something else. In the end I concluded, with the help of a psychiatrist, that I wasn't fetishizing. Although for me I knew fetish was something I did like, but it just didn't seem related since the fetish I did for kicks when I wasn't preoccupied, and the gender issue was always with me in every social situation. I concluded that I was a (trans) woman who happened to enjoy fetish (and eventually BDSM). I really didn't see myself as any different than any other woman who would participate in fet+BDSM activities.

I dunno but to me I think it's important for those with erotic motivations for wanting surgery and other forms of femminization to be really careful what they wish for since the reality is so different from what the fet+BDSM portrayals can be. Thankfully some things can be reversed if one regrets it. Other procedures and treatments, not so much. And also it can take a psychological toll as well.

Ugg. I must sleep now. I loosing both coherence and conciousness.

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 37

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/2/2007 5:13:33 AM

openmindedslave

Posts: 470
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline

I am going to say please, please don't believe I agree with any of this, but I will tell you of my conversations with people who consider themselves ts?

First, i find most that I have spoken on the internet simply get used more than rewarded for their efforts. I mean as examples, It seems most end up having to be a sub or slave or bottom to get to beable to explore their life with others. With many men, they want the kink of being with a TS for purely sex and not to develop a long term relationship. In a sense the lowest common denomator of being a slut . The ownership possiablities never really come into it , since many of the encounters involved sex in a car or somewhere for imediate servicing.

I think what makes this even worst is the fact that most people have little resources to help to develop real realtionships. I know the internet is a great resource for information, but its not not the same as having a friend that you can socialize with and share a friendship with.

If you look on eros.com for example, you can see that the TS escorts have exploded in popularity.Many travel the country haveing upscale men pay for their services.Their in a postion of power as they can pick and choose who they will see and what services will be renendered.

I can't imagine what it is life to make the emotional transformation to being a TS. For those who deserve to be or at least understand what it is embedded in them, I wish you all the best. To those who feel that their alone or there is a lot more that is just not going their way yet, keep striving to talk to those who are otu here who can help. As a sub, there are Mistresses that can help you evolve and nuture theor submissive side you keep secret to the world.

(in reply to DigitBox)

Post #: 38

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/2/2007 5:23:54 AM

sting516

Posts: 505
Joined: 9/4/2004
From: long island, ny
Status: offline

one thing i've noticed about the TS community, is that as much as it preaches tolerance, it is also quick to judge...you don't know me at all, nor does the other person...yet you both jump to snap judgments...so i wish the same for you as you wish for me...that you be judged before getting to know a person.

At no point did i say i felt like a woman trapped in a mans body...no, i was just giving a slightly different perspective on the issue...my point with Mellian, and now with you is that if you wish to preach tolerance, you should also practice it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

Sorry Sting, but so far I'm in agreement with Mellian - you seem more interested in the sexual side of it all, and if thats the case then you will likely count yourself amongst many fetishists who have worked their way through the system to achieve some sort of transition, only to regret it later. Regret it deeply.

Transition is little to do with sexuality, if anything. Its to do with rectifying a psychosocial mismatch with physical gender in the main. No medical or psychological professional worth his/her salt will enable what you are talking about, although of course with some less reputable providers, money always talks.

But, giving you the benefit of the doubt in what is a safe, anonymous setting, perhaps you could correct us on our misunderstanding of your motives?

E

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 39

RE: Is there a place for TS MTF subs? - 2/2/2007 5:25:10 AM

boytoyroy

Posts: 40
Joined: 12/6/2006
Status: offline

all respect ladyellen , but i have read your profile several times ( and agian now) THERE IS NO INDICATION of you being a transexual at all.. perhaps if you were a bit more forthcoming , perhaps you might get a differemt reaction from potential suitors!

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 40

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