RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one"

RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (Full Version)

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Lucius -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 11:10:51 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross But speaking in third person doesn't take away a sense of self, it just redefines "self." Speaking in third person doesn't take away ego, it just restructures it. You're absolutely right - it restructures it. You're also absolutely right in your later implication that HOW this practice restructures the ego and how it effects the way the ego fits into the world is a variable matter. Consider the "Royal We" usage, in which using third person plural for Oneself conveys something like the Sun King's statement, "The Sate - It is I." It is a tool, and a tool that can be used in more than one way. As for its use in slave training, I think it may go back to the Gor novels. Note that in the books, it is a seldom-used tool; far from universal even among slaves in intensive training, although it seems to be among the things slaves are taught shortly after enslavement. I have not read all the books, but I don't recall any slave after initial training being required to speak that way as a matter of course. I would not be surprised, however, if someone could demonstrate that it predates Gor. I have a vague recollection that there might have been something similar referenced in de Sade, but I would probably be wrong; French and other European languages after all have other means to express Dominance and submission in speech and writing that are not available in English, and would have less need for such a convention. It has long worked for Me and Mine. In intensive training or intense scenes I sometimes eliminate not only 1st and 2nd person speech from the slave's vocabulary, but 2nd person (or even 1st person) speech from My own vocabulary. The idea is that the slave is beneath being directly addressed (a form of objectification, or at least abjectification) and in return would never presume to directly address the Master. Five paragraphs is plenty, especially when one is basically a confession of ignorance. We will cease pontificating now, lest We appear to be insufferably boring, pedantic, and long-winded. Lucius Alexander The House of the Palindromedary - it is We! Oui? Whee!

littleone35 -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 12:33:49 PM)
Like some others said in Gor all slaves refer to themdelves in 3rd preson ( i don't remember how many times i messed that up before i got the hang of it) Some Masters just like the way it sounds. I am glad Master does not require it because after i left Gor i got out of the habit i would hat eto have to relean it. Matt's littleone

slavekara -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 12:55:12 PM)
Greetings All, Some Goreans see it as a necessity for their slaves to refer to themselfs in third person, and it is each to their own. Everone is different and this girl is still learning to do it. Master prefers this girl to speak in third person and this girl will do what ever she can to please her Master. Some slaves like it and others don't. For some using third person speech is to remind the slave's of their place, that they are simply property. It is a very hard things to learn, as this girl is learning and hasn't quite got the hang of it. slave kara (A)

Arastella -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:01:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Devilslilsister <wicked grin> Why do you think i used to refer to you as "girl" Thats horrible!!

Devilslilsister -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:09:14 PM)
lololololololololololololololololol

Arastella -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:11:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross http://www.collarchat.com/m_178943/mpage_4/key_third/tm.htm#181442 Y/you, A/all, U/us A dom's got a penchant for it? That I get. He wants you to think before you speak? That I get. He wants you to view yourself as an object? That I get. But speaking in third person doesn't take away a sense of self, it just redefines "self." Speaking in third person doesn't take away ego, it just restructures it. You're still being possessive by saying "She" and "her." Those are still possessive words. SOMEONE is still doing those things, and that SOMEONE is you. Oddly enough I have randomly spoken in third person for as long as I can remember. Usually it's in a humorous way, or an arrogant way (again, all third person does is REDEFINE possession, it can be used to ENHANCE one's position), and as I got older, people around me thought it was weird when I suddenly burst into a sentence that used third person. Imagine my surprise when I discovered the "scene" and found out that talking in third person was a big deal and some symbol of ego or lack thereof. I know SOME people who can speak in third person and do it gracefully and communicate in a very fluid way and you don't even notice. I also see some people who speak in third person and they might as well be a blinking neon sign saying "LOOK HOW AWESOMELY SUBMISSIVE I AM TALKING LIKE THIS, ISN'T THIS COOL?" For whatever reason you use it for, talking in third person can accomplish a lot of things, but the idea that you're losing ego or losing self or not being possessive anymore, just doesn't hold water IMO. That's very very true. I have seen you post in many many different topics on here and I've always admired your intelligence in every different topic. You have seemed to make sense of things that make no sense at all to you. Just thought you should know you have been noticed and admired for your wisdom, as well as how you can explain a point without being judgemental or criticising the person who put up the topic and/or their opinions.

Arastella -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:13:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Devilslilsister lololololololololololololololololol Ya know I never actually caught that. I always just thought you were weird or something!

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:21:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arastella You have seemed to make sense of things that make no sense at all to you. Just thought you should know you have been noticed and admired for your wisdom, as well as how you can explain a point without being judgemental or criticising the person who put up the topic and/or their opinions. Oh I can be incredibly judgemental and critical, but I'm glad you are enjoying your time here and can continue to do so.

MagiksSlave -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:24:18 PM)
LOL Master only ever uses slave speak thrid person speach as a punishment because he knows I hate it.. he dont like it eather so to save both of us head achs he doesnt make me do it and I behave as to not forse his hand in punishing me with it.. Magik's slave

topcat -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:50:43 PM)
It's been, to the best of my knowledge, a part of the culture of Marine Corps boot camp since sometime prior to WWII... What bugs me more than people who are doing it, is people who are getting it wrong- it shouldn't be "this girl thanks her master", it should be "the girl thanks it's master"- the point is depersonalisation.

Devilslilsister -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:51:37 PM)
but i am wierd and there was a reason. Edited to Add - Ooooh i've spotted TopCat in two threads now! He's got great advice Arastella. P.S. makes good sense about the "this" and the "the"

Arastella -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:53:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Devilslilsister but i am wierd and there was a reason. ok and what reason is that?

Arastella -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:54:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: topcat It's been, to the best of my knowledge, a part of the culture of Marine Corps boot camp since sometime prior to WWII... What bugs me more than people who are doing it, is people who are getting it wrong- it shouldn't be "this girl thanks her master", it should be "the girl thanks it's master"- the point is depersonalisation. Well I respect it even less now. I am always and have always been against making a slave so low, unless it is to punish them. Why depersonalize them? Just because they submit doesn't mean they always agree to no longer even being human. It??? Ouch, tre-harsh. Once again, just my opinion.

Devilslilsister -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:55:50 PM)
now thats just something i am not willing to share. Especially here.

LaTigresse -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:57:07 PM)
I just assumed it was a net thing and try to ignore it because it annoys me to read it. I usually don't read the posts that are written like that except for a select few that I am convinced are not just living in some weird fantasy land. Merc and beth would be in that group. Basically it is the Master/Mistress's choice and I am not the one to tell anyone else how to run their relationship......unless of course they ask[;)]

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 2:59:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arastella Well I respect it even less now. I am always and have always been against making a slave so low, unless it is to punish them. Why depersonalize them? Just because they submit doesn't mean they always agree to no longer even being human. It??? Ouch, tre-harsh. Once again, just my opinion. Well again a) third person does not NECESSARILY equate to lowering status. b) As someone who DOES get off on being objectified/humliated/degraded I can completely understand the thrill of being placed in a position such at that c) I agree that the lack of consistency and graceful usage of third person form is one of the main problems within it

topcat -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 3:02:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arastella quote: ORIGINAL: topcat It's been, to the best of my knowledge, a part of the culture of Marine Corps boot camp since sometime prior to WWII... What bugs me more than people who are doing it, is people who are getting it wrong- it shouldn't be "this girl thanks her master", it should be "the girl thanks it's master"- the point is depersonalisation. Well I respect it even less now. I am always and have always been against making a slave so low, unless it is to punish them. Why depersonalize them? Just because they submit doesn't mean they always agree to no longer even being human. It??? Ouch, tre-harsh. Once again, just my opinion. Dear Arastella- I tend to agree, but for many, the removal of the burden of self, the freedom from ego, is what draws them to this stuff, what draws them to seek to serve, to surrender. We who submit to our role as dominants are well advised to see and honor these inner keys to their pysche- even if we are going to drive it like we stole it<g>. Welcome to the boards- any friend of K. is a friend of mine. Stay warm, Lawrence

Arastella -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 3:13:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: topcat quote: ORIGINAL: Arastella quote: ORIGINAL: topcat It's been, to the best of my knowledge, a part of the culture of Marine Corps boot camp since sometime prior to WWII... What bugs me more than people who are doing it, is people who are getting it wrong- it shouldn't be "this girl thanks her master", it should be "the girl thanks it's master"- the point is depersonalisation. Well I respect it even less now. I am always and have always been against making a slave so low, unless it is to punish them. Why depersonalize them? Just because they submit doesn't mean they always agree to no longer even being human. It??? Ouch, tre-harsh. Once again, just my opinion. Dear Arastella- I tend to agree, but for many, the removal of the burden of self, the freedom from ego, is what draws them to this stuff, what draws them to seek to serve, to surrender. We who submit to our role as dominants are well advised to see and honor these inner keys to their pysche- even if we are going to drive it like we stole it<g>. Welcome to the boards- any friend of K. is a friend of mine. Stay warm, Lawrence Awww thanks. Yah "K" and I have had our....... share of experiences. (no not sexual, for anyone who wants to warp what I just said and make it vulgar) You stay warm too. Blankets, fire, and hot cocoa work nicely! :-)

ladychatterley -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 10:05:22 PM)
Why is it that when politicians refer to themselves in the third person I find it unbearably pretentious? Barak Obama just started--I know his wife said he had to quit smoking if he was going to run for president but I doubt it is a BDSM thing. Seems to this one that it is an indication that someone might have jumped the shark.... However, my master wants me to do it around him for a trial period and I hate it!!! He says it is about accepting the fact that I'm property and I don't have needs when I'm serving him--I need to focus on his needs. I'm doing it more or less (OK less) successfully, but don't think I can handle it forever. It just makes it that much harder to communicate. (And the whole property thing is something we are still trying to figure out.)

obey1 -> RE: Slaves referring to themselves as "this one" (2/14/2007 10:25:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave LOL Master only ever uses slave speak thrid person speach as a punishment because he knows I hate it.. he dont like it eather so to save both of us head achs he doesnt make me do it and I behave as to not forse his hand in punishing me with it.. Magik's slave Magik's slave is third person. Why do you sign like that then?

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